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Old Mar 7, 2013, 10:50 AM   #851
michael_aos
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I tried swapping out several different displays. Different video cables. Different connections (HDMI -vs- mini-displayport, and thunderbolt). No joy.

I left the Mini with the geniuses at the Apple Store for a week. Pretty sure the bastards never even looked at it.

It wasn't until I was on my way to the Apple Store to drop-off the Mini that it occurred to me that it might be the RAM. So I wound up waiting that week before I could start testing that theory.

When I contacted OWC with my findings, they initially offered to try and reproduce the problem in their lab. After 3wks of nothing heard, I contacted them and found that they had been unable to even ATTEMPT to replicate my configuration because they couldn't locate either current-generation Apple Display...(neither a Thunderbolt Display nor the LED Cinema Display w/mini-displayport). Pretty hard to believe...

They finally offered to let me return the incompatible RAM, minus a 15% restocking fee.

This Late 2012 Mini replaced a 2006 Mac Pro 1,1 w/16GB of RAM. The Mini just wasn't very usable ("random" irrecoverable black screen at always the worst possible time) with that incompatible 16GB (8+8) OWC RAM, so I had been limping along with 4GB (2+2), 6GB (4+2), 10GB (8+2).

It's just sooooo nice to have the Mini actually stable with 16GB of RAM after nearly 3-months!

FYI -- no black screens with the OEM 2+2GB RAM, nor 2GB OEM + 4GB laptop RAM I had laying around, or when I paired an OEM 2GB with one of the OWC 8GB sticks. The OWC 8G didn't play nice with the 4GB though, so I couldn't do 12GB. And of course the problem would immediately show up with 2x 8GB OWC sticks.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 04:24 PM   #852
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Michael, You are running the late-2012 Mac Mini i7 2.6Ghz right?

I am using the 2011 base Mini model (Intel HD3000 graphics) right now with 16GB Crucial RAM added that I bought in early 2012 and have had no issues at all. I am considering also getting the late-2012 i7 2.3Ghz model. I would probably get the same 16GB of HyperX RAM you purchased or I would buy from Crucial directly.

It seems your problem with random black screens has been solved with this RAM change. I was wondering if you have experienced any other problems with your 2012 Mini that have not been solved after doing all the updates...especially relating to the other display issues that have been discussed in this forum... Any crushed whites, flickering, resume from sleep problems, blocky fonts on certain monitors and HDTV displays, etc.?

Last edited by SoCalReviews; Mar 7, 2013 at 04:34 PM.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 04:36 PM   #853
michael_aos
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I haven't really seen any of the other issues.

Since so many issues seemed to be associated with HDMI, I took that out of the equation pretty early on. I've been running an Apple Thunderbolt Display and an HP Compaq LA2405wg via minidisplayport --> displayport cable.

I did have the HP monitor connected via HDMI --> DVI a few times though, and it was fine.

I was able to CONSISTENTLY demonstrate an irrecoverable black-screen by playing a (Flash) video in full-screen on either the Apple Thunderbolt Display or Apple LED Cinema Display at 2560 x 1440. It wouldn't do it on the 1920 x 1200 HP LA2405wg whether the HP monitor was connected via HDMI or Displayport.

I did encounter the irrecoverable black-screen several times when the Mini would wake-from-sleep. I wound up just turning-off the Power Saving features.

When I say "irrecoverable", I mean I had to reboot to clear it. If the display were simply going black for a second or two and coming back to life it wouldn't be such a big deal.

I had no idea OWC RAM wasn't considered "premium". I've long been a big fan of their products. I've used their RAM in LOTS of previous Mac's and never had a problem. I'd like to think that's part of why it took me so long to realize the RAM wasn't compatible.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 04:48 PM   #854
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I guess while I'm at it, I'd like to say again how thoroughly disgusted I am with Apple support.

I spent hours on the phone with various levels of tech-support and they all insisted the problem MUST be with my display, even though I reiterated that I get the same behavior with TWO DIFFERENT DISPLAYS -- the Apple Thunderbolt Display and the Apple LED Cinema Display. Same behavior. And either display works fine on my wife's 2011 Macbook Air, and the LED Cinema Display works fine on my 2006 Mac Pro 1,1 w/5770.

They finally set up an appointment for me with a genius bar at the local Apple Store. I'm not sure what the value was of having an appointment, as I had to wait 15-minutes AFTER my appointment for them to even acknowledge me. Then I had to explain everything all over again, as absolutely NOTHING I had previously explained on the phone had been captured.

Then very little of what I explained was captured on the trouble-ticket for the techs.

I was also told possibly same-day or maybe overnight to resolve the issue. After 2 days I called and they hadn't looked at it yet. They said it was "next" and the night-crew would look at it. Another 2 days, they STILL hadn't looked at it and said 3-5 business days was their typical turn-around. Completely different story from each person I got on the phone.

They NEVER called me at any point. Finally at 7-days I called and they said they ran diagnostics -- no trouble found -- wanted me to bring my Display down and demonstrate the problem for them. Again insisting the problem must be with my display. They had NEVER heard of any display issues with the Mini...

I picked it up and never looked back. Absolutely worthless.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 05:15 PM   #855
michael_aos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SoCalReviews View Post
I was wondering if you have experienced any other problems with your 2012 Mini that have not been solved after doing all the updates...especially relating to the other display issues that have been discussed in this forum... Any crushed whites, flickering, resume from sleep problems, blocky fonts on certain monitors and HDTV displays, etc.?
I did see this (attached) at one point on an Apple Display when I had the OWC 16GB kit installed.

Everything is fine now that I've replaced the OWC RAM with the HyperX Plug n Play 16GB (2x8GB) Kit of 2 1600MHz PC3-12800 DDR3 Non-ECC CL9 SODIMM Notebook Memory KHX16S9P1K2/16.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 05:16 PM   #856
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Michael, Thanks for your diligent effort to try to resolve this issue and post your information in this forum so that other users experiencing similar display problems have another possible solution as a reference. Apple is responsible for their products but it seems this is a general Intel HD4000 graphics issue. Apple support should have bulletin updates so they are aware that there have been problems with Intel HD4000 graphics in their equipment. Because the black screen issue occurs randomly it would be a more difficult issue to identify. I consider OWC as a premium vendor but the problem you experienced with your RAM on your machine could have been identified and dealt with better (offered a full refund) once you had identified for sure that the RAM was the problem. It might be a case where Apple support and OWC have been dealing with so many different display issues that they aren't separating them out as separate support tickets but instead have bundled them in with the rest of the general display problems.

I have noticed that the quality of technical support has really dropped off for many companies (ISPs, computer systems, peripherals, etc.) in recent years. There simply aren't enough truly qualified support techs with real knowledge and experience that the companies are willing to pay for and put on the front lines. They mostly go through the motions and read supplied scripts instead of doing real diagnosis. Because of the high volume tech support provided today is a hit and miss. You can get two or three different answers depending on the tech that is helping you at the time. You used to be able to talk your way up to higher levels of support but recently even that has gone away. I can understand your feeling of uselessness from the Apple' support you received. Few companies are going to be perfect but at least with Apple you get some kind of support if you are under warranty and if they can't solve the problem they often will replace the product.

Once again nice work and because of the months of persistence you showed others can hopefully benefit from the knowledge you posted.

Last edited by SoCalReviews; Mar 7, 2013 at 05:44 PM.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 05:33 PM   #857
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michael_aos View Post
I did see this (attached) at one point on an Apple Display when I had the OWC 16GB kit installed.

Everything is fine now that I've replaced the OWC RAM with the HyperX Plug n Play 16GB (2x8GB) Kit of 2 1600MHz PC3-12800 DDR3 Non-ECC CL9 SODIMM Notebook Memory KHX16S9P1K2/16.
That image of your display doesn't look good. As long as the memory change has solved that issue you should be good from now on.

You have to wonder if the continuous changing of the HDMI standard (in video graphics chips and drivers) for securing protected display and sound content is creating havoc with backward and forward compatibility for old and new TVs, HDTVs and monitors.

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Old Mar 7, 2013, 05:55 PM   #858
michael_aos
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Trying to recreate the timeline...

Ordered the Mini on 11/16/12
Mini shipped 11/20/12
11/23 - Ordered 16GB RAM kit from OWC for $97.50 (free shipping)
Mini delivery scheduled 11/28, arrived 11/26/12
Smoke-test Mini, but didn't use it - pending RAM upgrade
OWC RAM arrived 11/28 - installed immediately

I just don't recall when I first started seeing issues. I poked around on the forums and saw lots of other people having issues, so I just assumed I had the same problem as everyone else and it would be resolved with a firmware update.

I was traveling from 12/15 - 12/31. The Mini was powered-off. I read about a firmware update during this time.

I installed the firmware update around 1/1. No change. Lots of people were saying the firmware update resolved their issues, so I started to get nervous and contacted Apple.

They held the Mini hostage at the Apple Store from 1/18 to 1/24.

I contacted OWC on 1/25 to get the RAM (lifetime warranty) replaced.

They cross-shipped me another set of RAM on 1/30. It arrived 2/1.

Had the exact same problem with the replacement RAM, so I contacted OWC via e-mail on 2/1. They (OWC Rebecca) responded on 2/1. It wasn't a particularly great response, so I called around 2/2 and spoke with OWC Cynthia. She was very pleasant and spent a bunch of time troubleshooting with me. She initially offered me a refund, but then after consulting with a manager asked that we do nothing at this time while they try to duplicate the problem in their lab.

I never heard anything back, so I e-mailed them on 2/20, asking for an update.

2/22 -- charged $114.99 for the cross-shipped RAM.

On 2/25, OWC Cynthia replied that they were unable to attempt to duplicate the problem because they don't have any Apple Displays in their lab.

On 3/2, OWC Cynthia replied that there was a firmware update available (despite my having explained that the firmware update was installed when I spoke to her around 2/2) and that the RAM was no longer eligible for a refund.

On 3/2 I called and spoke with OWC Jennifer. She wasn't particularly pleasant at all, but she did begrudgingly eventually offer a refund on the original RAM, minus a 15% restocking fee. Just to make me go away. The same RAM kit currently sells for $129.99 on their website.

We never spoke about the cross-shipped RAM. I sent it back with the original RAM, and I'm expecting a full refund on it.
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Old Mar 7, 2013, 07:18 PM   #859
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You could almost turn your experience with your Mini's random black screens, trying to free your machine from being held hostage by Apple support, OWC RAM exchanges and your search to find a solution into a movie. Call it " Zero Dark Mini " or " Black Screen OS X Down ".


Last edited by SoCalReviews; Mar 7, 2013 at 07:38 PM.
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Old Mar 8, 2013, 08:24 AM   #860
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michael - I would write apple customer relations with your tale of woe and lack of service from the local apple store staff....you've pretty much got it all summarized in your post here. Least they can do is send you an iTunes card for the amount of your 15% restocking fee (be sure to ask for it - nicely)
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Old Mar 8, 2013, 11:22 AM   #861
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I was seeing this a few times day. Since the firmware update a couple months ago I have not seen the problem even once.
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Old Jun 27, 2013, 09:37 PM   #862
Ancaster
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2012 MacMini losing HDMI sync

Anyone still having this problem?

I bought a miniDP to DP cable to bypass HDMI altogether (and enable 2560x1440).

I have talked to Apple support at length and they are giving me a miniDP to HDMI adapter on my next store visit. This will only give me 1920x1080 I believe. Moreover, it doesn't solve my problem should I decide to utilize both ports out (miniDP and HDMI) so I don't think I even want it.

Are some of these 2012 MacMini's maintaining HDMI sync?
I don't want to take my unit in to replace hardware parts only to have the problem persist.
From the Apple Discussion forum, I have read it is possibly a HD4000/Intel problem.

Not sure if I should ask for another unit.
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Old Jun 29, 2013, 02:38 AM   #863
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I was afraid of something like Michael's experience after buying a 2012 Mini in Dec12 and experiencing random HDMI blackouts. Returned it and never looked back. Buyer beware!
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Old Jun 29, 2013, 04:36 PM   #864
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ancaster View Post
Anyone still having this problem?

I bought a miniDP to DP cable to bypass HDMI altogether (and enable 2560x1440).

I have talked to Apple support at length and they are giving me a miniDP to HDMI adapter on my next store visit. This will only give me 1920x1080 I believe. Moreover, it doesn't solve my problem should I decide to utilize both ports out (miniDP and HDMI) so I don't think I even want it.

Are some of these 2012 MacMini's maintaining HDMI sync?
I don't want to take my unit in to replace hardware parts only to have the problem persist.
From the Apple Discussion forum, I have read it is possibly a HD4000/Intel problem.

Not sure if I should ask for another unit.
My 2012 Mac Mini works perfectly fine through both ports and I AM using two monitors at the same time.
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Old Oct 28, 2013, 01:50 PM   #865
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I have the late 2012 mac mini (3 actually) and we are still having issues with random black screens with the base configured model.
Just really now bothering to read up on it, they have been used by my kids and not me, they have only recently been screaming about it. Went away for a short period after recent a recent rash of updates I finally did for them, but its back. Coming up on the 1 year deadline, this thread is hard to follow.

What's the latest post firmware updates possible fix?
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Old Nov 7, 2013, 09:09 PM   #866
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Its been over a year and apple still hasnt fixed this issue yet. There is a huge thread on apples support forums still going strong. Honestly if they havent figured a way how to fix it in a year then chances are it wont be fixed. they are simply ignoring the fact its probably a hardware fault and hoping people will just keep on doing nothing about it like they have been. Apple will not own up to a true fix they will just keep shrugging it off until a new model is released. Then they will deal with whatever they can for that model. rinse repeat.
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Old Nov 8, 2013, 03:34 PM   #867
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I'm not sure it's fixed anymore with Mavericks. I had it black out the other day for a second like it used to do. It has only done it once since the upgrade (at least while I've been watching), but if it can do it once....

Wake on Network activity for sleep works GREAT now (never worked before in Mountain Lion for me), but sadly my Microsoft Intellimouse (yeah I know but it's my favorite mouse for my big hand) doesn't wake properly on my Mac Mini (same model wakes just fine on my MBP with Mavericks) so it's a PITA (I have to unplug/plug it to get it working right again; the light comes on and the buttons work but the mouse won't move). It just seems like whenever they improve or fix one thing, they break something else and it's not obvious sometimes since it doesn't happen on all models. I mean why is my mouse doing that ONLY on my late 2012 Mac Mini and not my 2008 Macbook Pro? Even a USB 3.0 add-on card for the MBP works fine in Mavericks and the mouse wakes fine with both that card and the built-in 2.0 ports. It's just bizarre. I tried resetting the pram, deleting my old sleep configuration file, repairing permissions, etc. etc. but nothing has solved it so I'm still having to leave the Mini on 24/7 (only the monitor goes to sleep).

But at least dual-monitors are a lot more useful now (although I wish there were a dock on both monitors since I use a side dock and they don't migrate/move to the other monitor so it's still a PITA to start a new program on the 2nd monitor, particularly if the main monitor is showing a movie/tv show full screen and so the dock is not available. I think Apple still needs to do some tweaking.
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Old Nov 8, 2013, 10:31 PM   #868
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Its been over a year and apple still hasnt fixed this issue yet. There is a huge thread on apples support forums still going strong. Honestly if they havent figured a way how to fix it in a year then chances are it wont be fixed. they are simply ignoring the fact its probably a hardware fault and hoping people will just keep on doing nothing about it like they have been. Apple will not own up to a true fix they will just keep shrugging it off until a new model is released. Then they will deal with whatever they can for that model. rinse repeat.
This is true folks… anytime you see huge multi-page forum discussions about these sort of issues like this 2012 Mini blank screen issue (Intel HD4000), the 2010 MBP mobo issue (FXCN as sub-to-Apple), the 2013 MBAir Wifi issue (Broadcom), don't expect a resolution because it is a hardware fault, and it won't be fixed till next version of the silicon/board. Best advice is to punt, and come back the next year.

I returned for cash all of the above models, and am using a 2010 13 MBAir and 2011 Mini with NO issues.
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Old Nov 9, 2013, 10:42 PM   #869
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This is true folks… anytime you see huge multi-page forum discussions about these sort of issues like this 2012 Mini blank screen issue (Intel HD4000), the 2010 MBP mobo issue (FXCN as sub-to-Apple), the 2013 MBAir Wifi issue (Broadcom), don't expect a resolution because it is a hardware fault, and it won't be fixed till next version of the silicon/board. Best advice is to punt, and come back the next year.

I returned for cash all of the above models, and am using a 2010 13 MBAir and 2011 Mini with NO issues.
Punt? Buy old used slow computers instead? Man, if I believed what you do about current Macs I'd just dump Apple and get a Windows machine instead. Fortunately, what you're saying has little basis in reality (i.e. the firmware fixed the problem for the vast majority of all people). Other than that one odd blink the other day for reasons unknown, although I'm sure it has something to do with Mavericks which is still 10.9.0, I haven't had a single issue since I got the machine a year ago. 10.8.5 was 100% stable here.
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Old Nov 11, 2013, 09:22 AM   #870
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So is there a list somewhere of which models have what size problem topics? I'm wondering what there is out there from Apple that might be reliable over more than a year or three.

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Old Mar 9, 2014, 01:23 AM   #871
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So I'm not Crazy...

http://www.lockergnome.com/osx/2012/...-new-mac-minis

There is something wrong with my 3 day old Mac Mini.

Set up an appointment at the Apple Store tomorrow, don't know if it will help though. Maybe they can give me credit towards the next iteration of the Mac Mini.
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Old Mar 9, 2014, 07:29 AM   #872
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If it's 14 or less days since purchased you can bring it back to Apple for a refund no questions asked.
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Old Mar 10, 2014, 04:15 PM   #873
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So I'm not Crazy...

http://www.lockergnome.com/osx/2012/...-new-mac-minis

There is something wrong with my 3 day old Mac Mini.

Set up an appointment at the Apple Store tomorrow, don't know if it will help though. Maybe they can give me credit towards the next iteration of the Mac Mini.
That's a pretty old thread. What version of OS X came with the Mini? The firmware update over a year ago got rid of the problem for most people. My quad-core i7 Mini hasn't had a blanking issue in over a year with either output.
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Old Mar 11, 2014, 05:38 AM   #874
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That's a pretty old thread. What version of OS X came with the Mini? The firmware update over a year ago got rid of the problem for most people. My quad-core i7 Mini hasn't had a blanking issue in over a year with either output.
Sorry, I should have updated my situation with my NEW i7 Mac Mini running Mavericks.

It was a faulty Display Port Adaptor. Got a free replacement at the Apple Store today and everything is Gravy.
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