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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:31 PM   #101
Peace
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I wouldn't laugh this off. Apples been working on very powerful ARM chips.

As a matter of fact this is the future of computers. Not just Apple.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:31 PM   #102
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It would be interesting, intel dominates at the moment and it would be nice to a see a rival in the high performance desktop market. Not sure where it would leave OSX and developers though.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:32 PM   #103
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This would be a disaster, mainly due to the complete compatibility with Windows a Mac has, remove that and what you going to do? Not every app and very few games run on Mac OSX.

I cannot see this as being a Jobs decision if true? IMO it would put Apple back into the dark ages again. An iOS device is a lot different to a Mac computer.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:32 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by azentropy View Post
One of the huge advantages of Apple going x86 was the ability to basically run any x86/x86-64 OS at close to native speeds (not including GPU). I do this now with daily running Windows XP, Windows 7, RedHat EL 4,5 and 6 VMs.

Going to ARM or some other custom route would negate that.
Already today Linux runs on ARM. Microsoft is moving to ARM then if Apple switched you woud still be able to run Mac OSX, Windows (8 or maybe "9") and Linux all on ARM.

Also seeing as Apple can design this any why they like, perhaps they put an x86 core in the ARM CPU? No reason all the cores have to be identical.

I've been thinking of years that non-symetric multi processing is a good idea.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:33 PM   #105
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Will Apple really power the Mac Pro with a cellphone CPU?

LOL LOL
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:33 PM   #106
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If this turns out to be the case, I won't be buying from Apple anymore...
Never mind just realized we can turn of sigs
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:33 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by Cougarcat View Post
Apple would only do this if/when ARM processors aren't "way slower."
They will do it when it makes it way thinner. ...
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:33 PM   #108
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The fact that "ARM Macs" that don't replace "x86 Macs" (not 486... Apple actually uses the 686 architecture or x86_64) are already here ? They're known as iOS devices. Windows RT has nothing to do with Windows for x86.
Ok, let me phrase it like a question:

Assuming Apple comes out with ARM Macbook Airs next year, WHAT makes anyone think the iMacs will switch too?

Seems like everyone is assuming that an ARM Mac means their can't be Intel Macs anymore and, frankly, I don't know why anyone is thinking that.

I'm saying that the existence of Windows RT next to Windows 8 shows that it's certainly possible to run a company that way.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:34 PM   #109
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Also seeing as Apple can design this any why they like, perhaps they put an x86 core in the ARM CPU? No reason all the cores have to be identical.
.
Intel doesn't license out x86 anymore. AMD has a perpetual license because of historical reasons.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:34 PM   #110
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This could just be some FUD spread by apple itself to coerce Intel into giving it better deals, etc.

Or, it could be some of Apple's products in a Windows RT sense and the unification of iOS and OSX where some laptops might be very low powered/high battery devices.

I really doubt after going to the trouble to switch to Intel they would find competitive advantage in trying to switch back away.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:34 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by Wardenski View Post
It would be interesting, intel dominates at the moment and it would be nice to a see a rival in the high performance desktop market. Not sure where it would leave OSX and developers though.
Up $#1+ creek with no paddle that's where
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #112
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I would rather wish Apple built flash chips that have a super high density (1 TB per square inch), unlimited read/write cycles, file placement acts like HDD but with 10X the speed of the current flash chips.

"My dream"......
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #113
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no more bootcamp?
You could still Bootcamp Windows RT.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #114
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Sure, but it's not a virtual machine. You don't get bytecode shipped to you and compiled at runtime by this "virtual machine". The developer ships you pre-compiled machine code that is x86.

The "VM" part is not a "VM" like you're thinking : ie, a runtime envirronnement that does JIT compiling or interprets bytecode. Read the sites you posted to actually know what you're talking about.

LLVM is just another compiler with a different model to support multiple architectures.
Blaha Blah Blah Blah Blah. I had already called out that your rebuttal would be a silly attempt at narrowly defining what a Virtual Machine is and isn't.

The other extraneous blather about bytecode was needlessly injected by you to someone show some Alpha Male superiority.

LLVM "is" another compiler but the static analysis and ability to target other platforms is the key message here.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #115
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In 4 years time x86 architecture could have reached its' limits with ARM designs catching up fast.

Although is is strange to what was essentially Acorn computers become so dominant.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #116
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Originally Posted by Small White Car View Post
Assuming Apple comes out with ARM Macbook Airs next year, WHAT makes anyone think the iMacs will switch too?
And let me rephrase as "Why would they ship iOS MacBook Airs" ? What aren't you getting of the Windows ARM strategy ?

Windows 8 ARM (Windows RT) = iOS
Windows 8 x86 = Mac OS X

What would be the point of shipping a laptop iOS device with the iPad doing so well ?
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #117
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Let's look at the bright side tho, at least there will be an easy port for angry birds. ...lol
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #118
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Will Apple really power the Mac Pro with a cellphone CPU?

LOL LOL
What if it powers it with 12 to 24 of them? 25 if you dock your iphone
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:35 PM   #119
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The benefit would be not having to wait on Intel for processors. I think Intel is mainly to blame for the lagging update for the Mac Pro in my opinion.
So why exactly does the current Mac Pro come with a three-year old (!) CPU?

Do you really believe hasn't put out anything in the last three years worth of being a replacement for the Xeon W3565?

Oh yeah, and about USB3.0?
Thunderbolt?
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:36 PM   #120
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Again?

How may of these dopey processor changes do I have to put up with?
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:36 PM   #121
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If this is true, I guess my 2012 mbp will be my last Mac...
Buh Bye, UberGeeks, Hello Grandma!

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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:36 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by Small White Car View Post
What I'm saying is that Windows came out with ARM Windows and it didn't replace 486 Windows, it supplemented it.
Yeah, ARM is a better chip for low powered devices that don't absolutely need processing power. They're great for consumption and light workload computers, but are ultimately, like you said, supplementary to x86.

It's like a scooter is great for going to places around town, but when you want to do some travelling, you'll want to drive a car.

Quote:
So what makes anyone think that ARM Macs will replace 486 Macs?
...the title of the thread?

Question is, why would they do that? What advantages would an ARM Mac offer over an x86 Mac? Better battery life at the expense of processing power? That'd basically be an iPad with a built in keyboard and no touchscreen capabilities. There aren't any reasons for Apple to make an ARM based Mac any time soon.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:37 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by nuckinfutz View Post
Blaha Blah Blah Blah Blah.
Glad to see you're finally understanding how what you're talking about has nothing to do with this thread topic. Too bad the only way to admit it is by moving goalposts.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:37 PM   #124
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If every company started creating ARM-compatible versions of their software, it'd be fine. If every piece of software (first and third-party) that is already out for the Mac received an ARM-compatible update, it'd be fine.

If not, this move will surely do more harm than good.

The switch to Intel CPUs was an age-long request from most software companies and from most users. But no one is pushing for ARM to become an alternative to x86 on desktops or laptops.
No. One.

I hope Apple doesn't go down this road just for the sake of being different and for the sake of breaking paradigms.
I love my Mac, but I won't hesitate to switch if Apple decides to prevent me from using the software I need, just for the sake of being industry rebels.
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Old Nov 5, 2012, 03:37 PM   #125
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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Intel doesn't license out x86 anymore. AMD has a perpetual license because of historical reasons.
Which is why they're done.

Apple likely has an Architectural License or will have one soon enough so that they can design ARM chips they way then need to.

I don't a future where Intel is going to offer this kind of customization and Apple's lifeblood is being just different enough than the competition.
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