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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:36 AM   #51
ObjectiveV
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Originally Posted by iOrbit View Post
wtf does this have to do with Mac?
Nothing. It's just hate bait.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:38 AM   #52
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I think a big difference here is that, as I understand it, a Metro App (for lack of an updated term) will run on all systems - RT, Windows Pro, and Windows Phones. That's a pretty big deal to developers and consumers. WIll be interesting to see how that plays out.
Oversimplification. But yes, going forward all devices will build on WinRT allowing for easier cross-"platform" development.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:40 AM   #53
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Maybe it will look something like this? http://www.razerzone.com/projectfiona
That looks like a fun toy but the controllers seem oddly placed. I love their tagline, though: "This first-of-its-kind PC gaming tablet with integrated dual controllers is definitely not for playing casual games about unhappy birds or zombie-killing flora."

As for the Xbox U (), I'm too old to play with controllers. I'm from the past generation, the one that pwns with an uber micro composed of a keyboard and a mouse.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:40 AM   #54
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Read the power output. That's a console's specs. Not a tablets. Come on, Macrumors. Learn to read.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:41 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by ObjectiveV View Post
Nothing. It's just hate bait.
just micro rumors..
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:41 AM   #56
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Smart. If Microsoft makes this 1:1 compatible with the Xbox console, or even eliminates the console altogether. This is where gaming is headed; the upgrade cycles in consoles are too slow in dedicated gaming machines leaving mobile devices to rapidly gain ground there was no iPhone when either the Xbox or PS3 were released.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:42 AM   #57
divinox
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Originally Posted by STiNG Operation View Post
Well unlike others I like your opinion. Because I had 4 give me the red rings or whatever. Though that really was just an early console problem. Haven't had a single error with my current console that I've had for a couple years. Were those consoles in the time frame when the xbox was released?
Sony had a lot of issues with their early consoles as well. First-gen consoles tend to create a **** ton of heat. **** ton of heat tend to have bad effects. Bad effects over time tend to make for broken down consoles. Doesn't help that people place their consoles in environments were they easily overheat as well.

Given the advances in base technology, i doubt either console has any real issues as of date.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:42 AM   #58
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Bringing the XBox to the Surface is one of the few things MS can do to differentiate itself from the other tablets and make it appealing to the younger gaming crowd.

However... how far can you go with a touch interface that will make it something so "wow" that everyone will have to have one? It will be interesting to see what they come up with... if the Surface is a "fail" MS is in trouble... or at least it should be Ballmer's last shot. Amazing he's survived this long given Vista and other missed opportunities.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:43 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by STiNG Operation View Post
Well unlike others I like your opinion. Because I had 4 give me the red rings or whatever. Though that really was just an early console problem. Haven't had a single error with my current console that I've had for a couple years. Were those consoles in the time frame when the xbox was released?
We bought three of them for family members and each one of them had the ring of death over the course of 3 years. Sent all three for a 130 dollar repair to Microsoft. Something about reseating the graphics card inside the box. Then they ran for a year and went kaput again. So they are all in the attic now.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:44 AM   #60
divinox
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Originally Posted by dashiel View Post
Smart. If Microsoft makes this 1:1 compatible with the Xbox console, or even eliminates the console altogether. This is where gaming is headed; the upgrade cycles in consoles are too slow in dedicated gaming machines leaving mobile devices to rapidly gain ground there was no iPhone when either the Xbox or PS3 were released.
I fail to understand your reasoning. Why are slow upgrade cycles a negative? If anything, real life data points us in the opposite direction: stability is what creates the economy, without it, the gaming industry would be radically different. We're talking about massive investments into a particular technology here. How are those to be sustained within the "app-conomy"?
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:44 AM   #61
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Originally Posted by CapnJackGig View Post
Read the power output. That's a console's specs. Not a tablets. Come on, Macrumors. Learn to read.
That's for the Stationary Computing Device portion. The tablet portion has a 7hr battery. I'm wondering if it will be a streaming thing. OK for around the house via WiFi.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:46 AM   #62
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Originally Posted by krravi View Post
We bought three of them for family members and each one of them had the ring of death over the course of 3 years. Sent all three for a 130 dollar repair to Microsoft. Something about reseating the graphics card inside the box. Then they ran for a year and went kaput again. So they are all in the attic now.
You failed to address the question about console-generation. Were these early versions of the xbox?
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:47 AM   #63
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While in partial agreement, the problem is not tablet gaming, but non-tablet games being "ported" to tablet environment. A different UI-paradigm calls for different kind of games. Sadly, far too many developers have yet to realize this.
I agree. But even if say your wrote a game tailored to touch devices how fine a control can you have over the game?

Touching and sliding your fingers over virtual controls is always not perfect.

Unless, the games don't need finer controls and just a binary state would suffice.

The best game for touch I can imagine is Nintendo's Mario - March of the mini's. All you do even there is draw ladders and undraw them. Its more of a logical game than say a game that needs fine controls.

And having downloaded a ton of them on the iPad, I can still say that no one has gotten it right yet. All of them get pretty boring or frustrating after a while.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:48 AM   #64
divinox
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Originally Posted by Popeye206 View Post
Bringing the XBox to the Surface is one of the few things MS can do to differentiate itself from the other tablets and make it appealing to the younger gaming crowd.

However... how far can you go with a touch interface that will make it something so "wow" that everyone will have to have one? It will be interesting to see what they come up with... if the Surface is a "fail" MS is in trouble... or at least it should be Ballmer's last shot. Amazing he's survived this long given Vista and other missed opportunities.
MSFT is not in any trouble if the Surface is a dud. MSFT is in trouble if W8 is a dud. Big difference.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:51 AM   #65
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Originally Posted by krravi View Post
This whole gaming on a "touch" device is getting tired. You can never get a control as precise as having real controls. Touching things can only get you so far.
Pretty sure that's about the same response a lot of naysayers said about tablets in general.

Good thing you're not the visionary at the helm of a large company...
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:52 AM   #66
divinox
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Originally Posted by krravi View Post
I agree. But even if say your wrote a game tailored to touch devices how fine a control can you have over the game?

Touching and sliding your fingers over virtual controls is always not perfect.

Unless, the games don't need finer controls and just a binary state would suffice.

The best game for touch I can imagine is Nintendo's Mario - March of the mini's. All you do even there is draw ladders and undraw them. Its more of a logical game than say a game that needs fine controls.

And having downloaded a ton of them on the iPad, I can still say that no one has gotten it right yet. All of them get pretty boring or frustrating after a while.
Let me answer your question with a question, why are "you" "designing around" the limitations of the ui-paradigm rather than "designing on" its strengths? If a tablet is limited in fine interactions, you should not create games depending on them. Simple, really. There are so many ways forward for touch gaming; clinging to old-world paradigms is not one of them. Its the equivalent of putting a ****ing desktop in a tablet computer (regardless of whether its done as in iOS or WinRT). Makes no sense*.

* In MSFTs defense, W8 tablets will mostly be hybrids, thus supporting dual modes of interacting. This is perfectly fine. The desktop metaphor still has uses. Good uses, i might add. But one needs to recognize that different things are indeed different.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:54 AM   #67
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If it doesn't have any buttons or a D-pad, I won't bother giving it a second look. I've yet to play a tablet based game that has held my interest for longer than 5 minutes (Angry Bird: Spaces holds the record of 4 mins, 37 secs)

No buttons = no interest.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:55 AM   #68
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MSFT is not in any trouble if the Surface is a dud. MSFT is in trouble if W8 is a dud. Big difference.
I have been working on MSFT since OS/2 and while I liked their progression all along. Was really impressed with Windows 7 and it would be hard to argue that Mac OS is better.

Then.. I stumbled into Windows 8.. and I have to wonder.. What the heck is MS thinking. Its a new direction for their tablets, I agree. But to put it on a desktop? Even Apple has left the desktop intact minus the launchpad which is still an option.

MSFT is over doing it, IMHO.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:56 AM   #69
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I like how you just ignore the new Microsoft Logo.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 11:58 AM   #70
krravi
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Originally Posted by divinox View Post
Let me answer your question with a question, why are "you" "designing around" the limitations of the ui-paradigm rather than "designing on" its strengths? If a tablet is limited in fine interactions, you should not create games depending on them. Simple, really. There are so many ways forward for touch gaming; clinging to old-world paradigms is not one of them. Its the equivalent of putting a ****ing desktop in a tablet computer (regardless of whether its done as in iOS or WinRT). Makes no sense*.

* In MSFTs defense, W8 tablets will mostly be hybrids, thus supporting dual modes of interacting. This is perfectly fine. The desktop metaphor still has uses. Good uses, i might add. But one needs to recognize that different things are indeed different.
Touch Gaming!! So all that marvelous screen and processing power to just tap on things? I think we have progressed from such a scenario since the 70's. No?
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:01 PM   #71
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Originally Posted by krravi View Post
I have been working on MSFT since OS/2 and while I liked their progression all along. Was really impressed with Windows 7 and it would be hard to argue that Mac OS is better.

Then.. I stumbled into Windows 8.. and I have to wonder.. What the heck is MS thinking. Its a new direction for their tablets, I agree. But to put it on a desktop? Even Apple has left the desktop intact minus the launchpad which is still an option.

MSFT is over doing it, IMHO.
Windows 7 is great. Windows 8 is great. I think you are constructing a problem, really. What is your main beef? It cant be starting applications, that is easy. It cant be the desktop, its improved. So what is it? Having something extra that you currently fail to see how you can use? Well, then, dont use it? O_o

Buy a track pad, or a touch-enabled mouse. Problem solved.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by krravi View Post
Touch Gaming!! So all that marvelous screen and processing power to just tap on things? I think we have progressed from such a scenario since the 70's. No?
Look at what MSFT is doing with the-product-formerly-known-as-surface. As far as UI goes, i'd say its richer than any console controller that i have ever used. That you restrict yourself to "tapping on things" does not mean that the material as such is similarly restricted. That is my answer.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:02 PM   #72
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Newer Microsoft logo for article:
Image
Can't blame them for using the old one.
The new one is meh

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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:03 PM   #73
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You failed to address the question about console-generation. Were these early versions of the xbox?
I havn't had any issues with the xbox. Guess, I will have to see past the one year Mark.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:05 PM   #74
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I want one.
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Old Nov 6, 2012, 12:06 PM   #75
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Maybe they should call it XSurface, it won't be a box.
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