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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:31 AM   #26
bruinsrme
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I'm not even sure why that tax break would be necessary. If you want more, then pay for it.

But the model of a baseline UHS system supplemented by private insurance is the way to go in my book as well.

Now if we could just convince our conservative friends, we could free business from the burden of providing health insurance altogether.

Make Papa Johns a moot point.
I don't think businesses will abandon insurance. It is a means of attracting talent.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:32 AM   #27
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Just wait more businesses will follow, and if you're going to be boycotting on that principal you might want to learn how to grow your own food and make your own material goods.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:35 AM   #28
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papa johns is junk regardless
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:39 AM   #29
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papa johns is junk regardless
I endorse this message.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:44 AM   #30
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This is ridiculous. No one would have noticed a 15 cent increase in their pizza prices. Does he really think going complaining about 15 cents per pizza will gather sympathy for him and create outrage toward ACA?

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Just wait more businesses will follow, and if you're going to be boycotting on that principal you might want to learn how to grow your own food and make your own material goods.
Hopefully Papa Johns will be hit hard by this and companies will reconsider. Or at least not disclose how much( or little) it will raise the prices of their products.........
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:45 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by Renzatic View Post
Pizza has a huge, huge, HUGE margin on materials alone. Just counting the ingredients (not the cost to deliver the materials, the employees to make it, ect), it costs about $2.50 to make a large supreme pizza that sells for at least $10.00. That's a 400% return.
Ingredients are one thing. There are more profitable industries.

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Originally Posted by neiltc13 View Post
Democrat voters now finding out what it means to have universal health care?

There is a reason that here in the UK we have an additional income tax called national insurance that runs at about 12% - this is in addition to income tax, which ranges from 20% to 50%. We also have 20% VAT on almost every product bought.

Seems like there was a desire for this healthcare, but when it comes down to paying for it people have had other ideas.
I'm aware of VAT, but isn't that your primary sales tax? A lot of countries have sales tax set at a national level. Here they're assessed at a local + state level. It's around 10% in CA. I'd have to look up the exact percentage at the moment. Income tax is probably structured a bit differently there.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:54 AM   #32
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Originally Posted by bruinsrme View Post
I like what I have now, so keeping business involved suits my needs.
Obviously medical coverage is a huge expense to any company large or small.
If a person is on Unemployment...
Companies that hire part time...
The employee should...
Private insurance companies become more active in pooling small business...
My company contributes quite a bit...
Everything you talk about above has to do with business and healthcare. The reason why I don't like the business-providing-healthcare approach is that it leaves out those who are not formally employed by a business. I'm a freelancer. My wife was a freelancer until we had our baby, and she's currently not working (looking for work, which will end up being very low-paid). We pay over $14,000 a year a a family solely for health insurance (in addition to the $7000 out of pocket for this year). That's great that you pay less than $3600 a year...I'd love to have that luxury. But what I do for a career doesn't generally involve full-time employment. Could I go work full time? Yes. But staying in my field, I'd most likely make half of what I do now.

So the choices are: work for an employer who provides full coverage and keep your costs down, pay out the nose for non-group insurance, go uninsured. Those aren't great choices.

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Originally Posted by citizenzen View Post
I'm not even sure why that tax break would be necessary. If you want more, then pay for it.
The only reason I suggest that is that those with private insurance would likely be using the public model less, saving some costs. Let them save a hundred dollars a year to counteract the thousands they might cost the public system.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:54 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by bruinsrme View Post
I don't think businesses will abandon insurance. It is a means of attracting talent.
And they wouldn't have to abandon health insurance even in the case of universal healthcare. They could offer additional private coverage as a means of attracting talent.

However, businesses like Papa Johns, who seem uninterested in providing coverage to their employees would not be forced into doing so.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 10:56 AM   #34
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And they wouldn't have to abandon health insurance even in the case of universal healthcare. They could offer additional private coverage as a means of attracting talent.

However, businesses like Papa Johns, who seem uninterested in providing coverage to their employees would not be forced into doing so.
I was just about to edit my post above to include almost this exact message. Well said.

EDIT: Funny, I just got an email from Papa John's about getting a free pizza. Oh, the irony.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:02 AM   #35
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EDIT: Funny, I just got an email from Papa John's about getting a free pizza. Oh, the irony.
Damage control??
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:04 AM   #36
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I wonder what Walmart's response will be?
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:20 AM   #37
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Is there a conservative member here who would support something like NHS here in the U.S.?
Yes, provided there remains the option to buy other insurance outside the federal system. Instead of 2,000+ pages of "we have to pass it to know what's in it" we would get "enroll everyone in Medicare".
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:20 AM   #38
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I think it's quite funny that a company that is probably helping to cause some health issues objects openly to paying a bit more tax to help with those health issues...
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:25 AM   #39
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Why anyone would support a pizza place that serves the garbage papa john's does is beyond me anyways.

Yet another scumbag company that cares only about profit, and not their employees or the crap product they are producing. The "new" american way I guess.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 11:44 AM   #40
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Looks like Applebee's also gets the joke:

HuffnPuff

Quote:
"We've calculated it will [cost] some millions of dollars across our system. So what does that say -- that says we won't build more restaurants. We won't hire more people," Zane Tankel, chairman and CEO of Apple-Metro, told Fox Business Network on Thursday.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:10 PM   #41
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Looks like Applebee's also gets the joke:
So when the price of gas goes up ... or the price of timber ... or even labor ... does Crapplebee's also throw up their hands and say they won't be building restaurants?

This totally smacks of corporate blackmail.

There are plenty of entrepreneurs capable of making money even under the onerous burden () of Obamacare. Any company that chooses to curl up into a fetal. quivering ball is only hurting themselves.

I say, call their bluff.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:10 PM   #42
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Looks like Applebee's also gets the joke:

HuffnPuff
At least they are smart to say it will cost millions making people think ACA is a bad thing. Papa John's was stupid enough to break it down on a per pizza basis making people think Papa John's is a greedy business for crying over 15 cents and think customers will all of a sudden not buy their pizza due to a 15 cent increase in their price......
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:24 PM   #43
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In the UK you can choose private health insurance too, though the NHS can also respond very quickly when necessary. Your experience of naval bureaucracy does not invalidate the model.
My grandmother died as due to being a staunch tory she refused to be treated at an NHS hospital, the private place she was at didn't have the facilities to save her. The NHS is pretty damned good, as I'm sure you appreciate I just think it's worth citing the example to show that private does not equal better.

Thankfully family politics are not hereditary.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:33 PM   #44
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Everything you talk about above has to do with business and healthcare. The reason why I don't like the business-providing-healthcare approach is that it leaves out those who are not formally employed by a business. I'm a freelancer. My wife was a freelancer until we had our baby, and she's currently not working (looking for work, which will end up being very low-paid). We pay over $14,000 a year a a family solely for health insurance (in addition to the $7000 out of pocket for this year). That's great that you pay less than $3600 a year...I'd love to have that luxury. But what I do for a career doesn't generally involve full-time employment. Could I go work full time? Yes. But staying in my field, I'd most likely make half of what I do now.

So the choices are: work for an employer who provides full coverage and keep your costs down, pay out the nose for non-group insurance, go uninsured. Those aren't great choices.



The only reason I suggest that is that those with private insurance would likely be using the public model less, saving some costs. Let them save a hundred dollars a year to counteract the thousands they might cost the public system.
I don't mean to sound cold that is a choice.
My company pays $11,000 for my policy.

Personally, I don't think the government could touch that. Their inefficiencies and multi level busslhit could never make anything affordable.

So if my company opts not to pay someone has to pay for coverage.
Would my coverage come from taxes?
Out of pocket?
New taxes?

I am curious where all this money is going to come from?
Can tax payers afford the infrastructure of a government run health care system?

Obama wrote a check to Boston City hospital for $200,000,000 to bring them out of the red. This is one of the designated care facilities for Romney Care.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:36 PM   #45
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We aren't doing any hiring due to Obamacare. Nor are we using export markets that are usually most profitable.

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Originally Posted by glocke12 View Post
Why is it so hard to fathom that increased costs to a business is going to result in one of two things? Either less employees or costs passed onto a customer.

Businesses can't keep raising prices all the time or people will simply stop buying their product which is what I did with Starbucks. When my daily latte went from costing under 4 bucks to just slightly over 4 bucks a couple of years ago I cut that cord.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:39 PM   #46
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I don't mean to sound cold that is a choice.
My company pays $11,000 for my policy.

Personally, I don't think the government could touch that. Their inefficiencies and multi level busslhit could never make anything affordable.
FYI, average annual total cost per head of the NHS is around $2,700.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:41 PM   #47
bruinsrme
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FYI, average annual total cost per head of the NHS is around $2,700.
ok i am at $11,000, minus eye and dental.

If the company drops coverage, pays the $2k fine where is the $9k difference coming from?
My pocket and/or someone elses.

If it costs that per head that money is coming out of tax payers income/house hold and economy one way or the other.

the only way to cover such costs is it impose new/higher taxes such as a VAT.

Last edited by bruinsrme; Nov 11, 2012 at 12:50 PM.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:43 PM   #48
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ok i am at $11,000
Which amount would you rather pay? Remember that you are still paying for Medicare and so on in addition.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:46 PM   #49
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I've only had their ****** pizza once or twice, but now I will never order from there again! Unless he changes his policy towards Obamacare.
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Old Nov 11, 2012, 12:56 PM   #50
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Which amount would you rather pay? Remember that you are still paying for Medicare and so on in addition.
I am pretty happy paying under $300 a month for full medical/eye/dental for the family.

Like I said I sought out this job. Going from hi-tech to biotech has been a very difficult transition. A transition I didn't want to make but was the choice I made to ensure I had coverage.

Medicare is should be part of obamacare.
It is supposedly a seperate system in which every working person pays into.
There is absolutely NO WAY the feds will give up that established revenue stream.
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