anyone play the violin?

[Mord]

does anyone play the violin here (i'm sure some do) i stoped for a while and need a little help my intonation is out and i have no way to get it back without getting a teacher (which i dont want to do i have only ever liked one of my violin teachers all the rest dont take my dyslexia into account which has a profound impact on the way i learn music) could anyone take a picture of the neck with markings on with a ruler next to it so i can get it back, also my violin is out of tune, i have done the best i can but it's still out and i'm compensating for it when i play so when i play an open string is sounds off.

thanks

also i'm thinking of getting a fender FV1, obviously not straight away as i dont want to shell out then give up and be £280 in the hole as so many do with electric guitars so i'm going to play untill christmas or untill then get one, does anyone have one and what does it sound like through a guitar amp?

[gallagb]

i don't play violin - but i play cello
so we're in the same neck of the woods

and i too did take a break for a few years & recently 'came back'-

here's what i bought in prep for that:
an electric tuner

i just got some run of the mill cheap-o battery powered tuner

i have the Seiko ST 757 Chromatic Tuner

there are some 'online' or 'downloadable' tuners
i've tried to use one once - and was just really frustrated w/ it
but- that's just me-


as for the picture w/ tapings - sorry can't help ya out
you could call a local elementary school and 'pretend' to have a student there who is interested in music...etc and get the name of a local teacher
& just call the teacher up & ask for a few pointers-

-OR- contact the local HS or college orchestra teachers- tell them you are looking for a student who wants to do a few easy lessons for ya-
that way you've got some "non-professional teacher" helping ya out-
and have the kid do the markings for ya-

& u can just pay the kid for an hour- and have them mark up the violin for ya- & maybe play a few things for u- so u can hear it...etc

[gwuMACaddict]

i've played since i was 5ish, but i'm not sure what i can do to help you out...

"tapings", aren't good for every different key- not going to help you with sharps and flats...

that being said, google around a bit, i'm sure you'll find something- or visit a local music store- they'll be able to give you a name of someone to call i'm sure.

might be worth taking lessons again

[Mord]

i'm 17 and my current school does not have a teacher and the last was a psycho bitch and refused to place a sticker where i my finger should be saying i had to do it for myself and seeing as she wouldent tune my violin saying i had to do it for myself i has a very hard time of it. hence the two year break, i have been playing scales and getting a feel for it.

i have a tuning pipe which works ok and i can get it roughly tuned right but it's still not right.

[gwuMACaddict]

i DEFinitley reccomend some private lessons, well worth the investment- move at your own pace, play what you want to play, etc.

[Mord]

yeah, i'm kind of reluctant because my last two teachers were very very bad and they made me play music i dident want to play and made me view it as a chore not as something which i enjoy, and i do when i'm playing music which is fun to play.

[ZoomZoomZoom]

I highly suggest an electric tuner. Those things are so nice for tuning, at least when you're not in a crowded room. In a crowded room, you'll have to use one of those clip-on electric tuners (which don't work as well) or a tuning fork.

As for tapes, I'm a couple hundred miles away from my home with violin and cello, so... can't help you there. However, you can probably put on the tapes this way if you can hear octaves, and if you can hear perfect fifths.

Tune your "A" to a tuning fork. Use perfect fifths to tune E, D, and G.
Put one finger on D, where you think E is supposed to be. Play this note, and play open E, and adjust your finger until you hear an octave. That will be your first tape. What you're hearing then is a whole step. Memorize what the whole step "sounds like" - compare it to a half step if you need. Then you can move down from the first tape and put on the rest of your tapes.

But I still say that an electric tuner is the way to go. Or for a temp fix, get a musical friend to lend a hand. A breeze for people with perfect pitch...

[whaley]

http://www.smartmusic.com/

Will take you to an interesting piece of software. I don't know how well it works for strings (they have added the string features recently,) but it does work well for brass and woodwinds.

There is a really good sized sample of the program in the Essential Elements 2000 (method book 1,) if you want to give it a try for less than $10.

Hope this helps
Roger

PS. The tuner is built into the program.

[devilot]

No offense, Hector, but I agree w/ the teacher you called a 'psycho bitch.' I've had classical training (from a really really overly passionate Russian violinst whose wife teaches piano as well) and I do agree w/ the notion that you shouldn't use tape or stickers, and you should figure out how to tune your instrument yourself.

It's important to be able to hear if you've got the right note or not-- not just if your first finger is on a sticker. Plus, every instrument is slightly different so you couldn't just copy somebody else's picture of a taped fingerboard anyway.

[Stampyhead]

GarageBand has a built in tuner, which seems to work pretty well. Use it to tune your A string and then, as someone else said, use the perfect 5th intervals to tune the other strings. Once you have the strings tuned you can use the GarageBand tuner to find the correct finger placement.

[emw]

I played the violin and viola for about 8 years, but left off when I went into high school. At the time, I didn't think anything of it, but now I regret not continuing to play (I'm well out of high school now). Reading this makes me want to get back into it, but I'd have to purchase a new violin and everything. I'm thinking of getting a piano instead and learning along with my kids.

I would agree that using tape/stickers is not a good long-term solution, but may be helpful in the interim while you get back on track.

I'm sure you could find a teacher that would work with your dyslexia - and having a good teacher will be significantly better than trying to struggle back on your own, or trying to mimic someone else's sticker placement.

[Mord]

Originally Posted by devilot76

No offense, Hector, but I agree w/ the teacher you called a 'psycho bitch.' I've had classical training (from a really really overly passionate Russian violinst whose wife teaches piano as well) and I do agree w/ the notion that you shouldn't use tape or stickers, and you should figure out how to tune your instrument yourself.

It's important to be able to hear if you've got the right note or not-- not just if your first finger is on a sticker. Plus, every instrument is slightly different so you couldn't just copy somebody else's picture of a taped fingerboard anyway.

at the moment i find it very very hard to get my fingering in tune, it's a very large block for me and every time i get it right after trial and improvement i loose it a couple of days latter, i need a reference which i can learn from consistently, i have tryed putting sticker on myself but i they tend to be off slightly, i'm not a dedicated music student or anything like that, i'd never consider going to music school so i'm not your average violinist,

and yes i realize my violin is different to others, personally i hate playing other peoples violins they feel and sound very very wrong to me, everyone may get that i dont know but i do have a very nice violin (JA baader, made in mittenwald)

as far as getting a teacher is involved my aim is to get back as good as i was so i can with a little effort play back something i have heard or just made up on the fly without haveing to write out a score and practice it for half an hour.

[gwuMACaddict]

learning to improvise, like you described- is best learned with a music theory class. sounds funny, buts it's true- will help you to learn how scales operate together.

[MattG]

Doesn't Katie-something (sorry...I forgot the rest of her Macrumors name) play violin? I seem to recall...

[jim.]

Tape doesn't always help, because your leading tones will vary in sharpness depending on the key you are in. Also, the distance from nut to bridge differs from instrument to instrument, so measurements won't work either. I can't imagine that you would be completely tone-deaf and trying to play a classical instrument.

Here is how you get your ear back: Scales and Etudes. Practice your major scales starting with your open string ones like G,D,A and E. If you have a decent ear, you will hear the open strings vibrate enharmonically with certain scale tones. You will also hear when you are out of tune regardless as the open strings provide a good reference. Once you are done with that do your minors. Then after that switch to 2nd position (biggest pain in the butt position there is for some reason). If you nail 2nd position scales, congratulations you have your ear back.

Doing some old Bach Etudes will help you hear the intervals and their subsequent overtones again. Plus it will let you relearn harmonies and how they work. Bach practically was the inventor of modern harmony (yes, you heard me right).

I am a viola player, and lately I have been really off and on in my playing. Typically my ear comes back after my first run through the major scales on my C string in positions 1-4. I then have to use the Etudes to get my dexterity back. After that, it's time to bust out the Hindemith (just kidding). YMMV, of course.

Jim

[Mord]

ok, after a day of scales i have my fingering back, at only the cost of a few blisters on my fingers, need to get that calast back, now all i need is my timeing.

has anyone played an electric violin and if so do you have a recording, i cant seem to find a place that just shows how it sounds also how does it sound when the amp is on overdrive?

[Fiveos22]

First things first. I've played the violin since I was 5 (i'm 21 now). My parents made all of the children in my family (three sisters and my brother) start when we were five. We hated it. It was a chore. Until we got to high school and started playing with orchestras. Personally, my music career kicked into over-drive in high school and I landed in the principle violin position for two years and began composing orchestral music.

None of that would have been possible without the agony of being forced to practice and take lessons (remarkable foresight on my parents' behalf). Hell, if I wouldn't have been so stubborn about not practicing, I would have progressed probably twice as quickly, if not faster. So my first point is, put in the time before you expect rewards.

Second, as far a practice is concerned, I began under the Suzuki method and had tape on the neck of the violin. This did not last terribly long due to the Suzuki method focusing on ear training (being able to match pitches with recordings of music). I would suggest using tape, at least for fingers 1 and 3 (maybe 4 but definately not 2), until you can hear the pitches correctly. Then ditch the tape completely. All subsequent practicing should be at the discretion of a discerning ear, the more you play and practice, the sharper your ear will get. In time you will eventually develop such a discerning ear that things that may sound "not quite right" to you, will actually be so closely in-tune that an audience will not notice. It's a process of making you more picky than your listeners (i.e. push yourself).

Just be sure to pace yourself and have patience. A violin is a very rewarding instrument with an immensly steep learning curve. Don't give up.

Originally Posted by Hector

has anyone played an electric violin and if so do you have a recording, i cant seem to find a place that just shows how it sounds also how does it sound when the amp is on overdrive?

I was involved with a band for a while (a rather ecclectic one) and bought a pickup for it. If you have got a nice violin, one that you like the sound of, I would suggest buying a pickup instead of a whole electric violin. Transferring technique between instruments, especially after using one violin for a long time, is difficult and has an adjustment period.

I used this pickup (V200, bottom of the page). Its a good low end pickup, it requires a lot of fiddling with settings, but it can perform quite well. If you do use a pickup, I would suggest using it for acoustic amplification, not overdrive, or at least, very little overdrive. It becomes very difficult to play when you hear two different sounds 1) your instrument and 2) the distortion of overdrive through the amp. But that's just my two cents.

[Fiveos22]

One more thing (at the risk of post-whoring) once you've got first position down pat, move on to third positon (skip 2nd until you're comfortable with 3rd). When practicing that (and any higher position) I've found it can be helpful to make small pencil markings on the fingerboard, especially when large jumps are involved (think the first high C jump in the Bach Double, or the beginnings of runs in Saint-Saens' Introduction and Rondo).

Its a little trick someone taught me that helps in a pinch.

[Mord]

as i said i seem to have got my fingering back, i managed to tune my violin so it sounds right then it fingering became much easier, also playing tricky music is easier than i remember, maybe it's the muscle i have got typeing like i have been solidly for the last few years (i got my ibook just when i stopped playing the violin

what i'd really like to know is how it sounds through an amp on overdrive and normally it'd hard to imagine, maybe i'll try playing my friends guitar with a bow

oh and i never was taught 2nd or 3rd position, i was taught from age 6 till 9 properly, and thats all the real teaching i have had, the rest was my teachers makeing me play music i was way way past but found very hard due to my dyslexia (i find it hard to play anything without a tune to it, i could play 2nd/3rd violin parts as part of an orchestra but found it very very hard on my own) so they never deemed me worthy of teaching me to play anything with any real tune to it untill one acctually saw me play in orchestra and was shocked at how good i was compared to the crap she made me play, then she left and got replaced by a new crappy teacher ), i got a bit better via practicing and orchestral playing but that gives you an idea of my skill level

[Mord]

finally found some music with a fender FV1 being played by yellowcard, and man i want one so bad now i'm going to have to save every penny.

[iSaint]

Originally Posted by MattG

Doesn't Katie-something (sorry...I forgot the rest of her Macrumors name) play violin? I seem to recall...

Katie ta achoo I think does play violin and or viola

[Nutter]

Third violin parts? Are you sure you don't mean viola? ;-)

I agree with most of what has been said here. The most important thing is to train your ears, as you have to be able to hear the correct intonation before you can play it. Some purists would say that in order to train your ears you shouldn't add marks to the fingerboard at all; in practice, it is often the best way of learning the correct hand shapes.

But that's all it is! Don't ever fall into the trap of using it to learn intonation. Good intonation can only come from your ears, never from your eyes.

[Nutter]

Originally Posted by Fiveos22

I was involved with a band for a while (a rather ecclectic one) and bought a pickup for it. If you have got a nice violin, one that you like the sound of, I would suggest buying a pickup instead of a whole electric violin. Transferring technique between instruments, especially after using one violin for a long time, is difficult and has an adjustment period.

By the way, though I hate to contradict this excellent post, I would say that if you want to get the acoustic sound of the violin, using an instrument microphone is always a better solution. The sound of stringed instruments come from a combination of sources, and the vibrations of the bridge won't give you much on its own. Using a pickup or an electric violin is only a "better" solution if you want to add effects or overdrive to the sound.

[Fiveos22]

Originally Posted by Nutter

Third violin parts? Are you sure you don't mean viola? ;-)

Sure, there are third violin parts in Bach's Brandenburg Concerto No. 3 (there are also third viola and third cello parts in that work). I've seen third violin stuffs before...but you're right, it is quite uncommon.

[Mord]

now i'm not sure what to get http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/WHITE-FENDER-V...QQcmdZViewItem or http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Artisan-electr...QQcmdZViewItem

will their be much benefit bar the pre amp and the better looks of the fender?