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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:28 AM   #51
madrag
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Originally Posted by Phx08 View Post
Quite the contrary, the small number of countries OUTSIDE of the United States will most likely see the bottleneck in supply. The USA market will have plenty....(
I said that just some countries will probably get it, what's that contrary to your statement?

You're saying that the USA will have plenty, ok, but I'm not at the USA, and so I would like every country to have plenty.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:28 AM   #52
dearlaserworks
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Originally Posted by Jetson View Post
Whining???

People still need to use optical media to transfer commercial content. NOT ONE COMPANY puts commercial content on USB sticks, but on CDs and DVDs. They are NOT obsolete.

Your solution is that we shell out additional money for an unsightly stand alone optical drive so that our super expensive "all in one" computer now can access commercial content.

It makes no sense, except that you are trying to justify Apple's decision here.
VMWare Fusion 4 & 5 come with both optical media and USB stick in the box. With laptops, minis & now iMacs without optical drives, you can bet software vendors will make their wares available for download or on USB sticks to reach all potential customers.

Apple has a good handle on what percentage of iMac users use their optical drives and how often. Clearly many more folks can do without. It does seem unfair that the optical drive is gone yet the price has jumped.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:29 AM   #53
dashiel
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Originally Posted by Jetson View Post
Whining???

People still need to use optical media to transfer commercial content. NOT ONE COMPANY puts commercial content on USB sticks, but on CDs and DVDs. They are NOT obsolete.

Your solution is that we shell out additional money for an unsightly stand alone optical drive so that our super expensive "all in one" computer now can access commercial content.

It makes no sense, except that you are trying to justify Apple's decision here.
And you are trying to justify a minority position. Apple has unprecedented metrics on how their computers are used, from automated crash reports to Genius bar repair logs to sales of “edge case” products. 80% of Apple’s computer sales were mobile last quarter and full two-thirds of Apple’s mobile offerings lack an optical drive including the most popular model.

The reality is optical simply isn’t important for most of Apple’s users. For those, like yourself still tethered to that medium there’s an option.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:33 AM   #54
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The arguments here about optical drives and thinness are all moot. It's coming. It's thin. It has a bulge, chin, and NO optical drive. Either you buy one or move one. Done deal already.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:33 AM   #55
deconstruct60
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Originally Posted by Jetson View Post
"Whatever Apple does it's okay by me and anyone that disagrees is an enemy of the Apple state!" - typical fanboy attitude
Typically troll misdirection. Apple isn't primarily driving the trend away from optical. Most users are taking this trend all by themselves.

An inexpensive $5-8 Flash drive is cheaper than a large bulk (50-100 ) package of blank CDROMs. USB Flash drives are very widely used to implement sneaker-net data transfer tasks these days. 10's of millions of people do it every day. To claim otherwise is to be some kind of ODD fanboy.

A primary need for ODDs to implement sneaker-net is a very weak argument.

Apple is aggressively following the trend, but they are aligned with where the bulk of users are going. It isn't just Apple. The whole personal computer market is moving that way.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:36 AM   #56
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I don't think it will be possible, isn't the whole computer fused and glued together?
The chin is welded to the back. The display will come off to access the components for repair. Just how the display is attached is still a mystery. We all hope for magnets as in the last revision. Glue would be a nuisance at best.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:45 AM   #57
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I can't for the life of me understand why they made it thinner (while using it you'll never notice), rather than getting rid of the chin (staring right at you while using the machine).
I don't understand the issue with the chin. It's what identifies it as an iMac rather than a standalone display. What is it with the chin that people find so bothersome?

And they gotta put the Apple logo somewhere.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:46 AM   #58
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I have no desktop and have been very annoyed with the lack of release date so the 21.5" better launch next week
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 10:47 AM   #59
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Originally Posted by LagunaSol View Post
I don't understand the issue with the chin. It's what identifies it as an iMac rather than a standalone display. What is it with the chin that people find so bothersome?

And they gotta put the Apple logo somewhere.
But it looks so ugly compared to the cinema display
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:16 AM   #60
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Originally Posted by dearlaserworks View Post
The chin is welded to the back. The display will come off to access the components for repair. Just how the display is attached is still a mystery. We all hope for magnets as in the last revision. Glue would be a nuisance at best.
The difference from the last model is that on the new one the glass is laminated on the display. This means is not attached with magnets. I am afraid it will be a similar assembly like on the iPad or iPhone. I really hope this isn't the case because I plan to add an SSD and more RAM myself
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:22 AM   #61
sucramdi
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Originally Posted by bigcat318 View Post
Glad I'm not the only one who found this odd. People seem to be making a huge deal over needing to plug in a USB drive for the few times they need it. Going so far as to buying an old computer with outdated technology is ridiculous.
I use my powerbook to make disk images of any CDs I need to use. Never even considered buying an external drive.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:24 AM   #62
HMI
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So, here is a good question:
Will Apple intentionally wait until after the Friday, November 23rd Black Friday event to release the iMac in an effort to avoid the $101 discount, or will they make sure to release it before, so that they have at least some available for purchase that day?
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:26 AM   #63
everything-i
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Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
And Apple's stock is up $16 so far today. Good Monday wake up to.
And so it continues, loads of FUD stock price falls bit of good news and its back up. Looks like the big players are using Apple to pump money out of the markets.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:38 AM   #64
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Originally Posted by wmikulic View Post
My son has been using a first generation Mac mini and needed a new computer. As soon as the "new" iMac was announced with no optical, we went to the nearest Apple store and bought the current iMac. There's just too many school assignments where the product has to be turned in on CD or DVD and I'm a believer the optical should be part of the computer. I've owned iMacs since the original tube screened one, and not once has a desktop's thickness been an issue for me. What a great business model, remove features so people have to buy add-ons. Maybe they should remove the hard drive/SSD so they can charge extra for that too?
I think they should transform iMacs and MacBooks into displays (and sell them at the same price as they currently sell, obviously) and then offer external:
• flash drives, mouse (you can fit both in a pocket anyways)
• foldable keyboards
• external motherboards, graphics cards and RAM (they are very thin and light=extremely mobile!)
That way they could make the thinnest and sexiest laptop/computer ever!

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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:47 AM   #65
CosmoCopus
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Originally Posted by EwanMcTeagle View Post
I think they should transform iMacs and MacBooks into displays (and sell them at the same price as they currently sell, obviously) and then offer external:
• flash drives, mouse (you can fit both in a pocket anyways)
• foldable keyboards
• external motherboards, graphics cards and RAM (they are very thin and light=extremely mobile!)
That way they could make the thinnest and sexiest laptop/computer ever!

They should go up on the price also. This ain't no Ford F150 were talking about here.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:48 AM   #66
JHankwitz
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Originally Posted by HMI View Post
So, here is a good question:
Will Apple intentionally wait until after the Friday, November 23rd Black Friday event to release the iMac in an effort to avoid the $101 discount, or will they make sure to release it before, so that they have at least some available for purchase that day?
Why would the even consider giving a discount on a new release? Would you do that if you were Apple? Apple may appear dumb at time, but they certainly aren't stupid.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:48 AM   #67
wmikulic
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Originally Posted by ctdonath View Post
in fact keeps its edge by dropping features more aggressively than most companies. They keep a pretty tight reign on what is supported, thus making sure what is supported works well and does not contribute to lethargic obsolescence. Do you need a parallel printer port? PS/2 connectors? RS-232 (25- or 9-pin)? VGA? a dozen other flavors of video output? 3.5" floppies? 5.25"? Zip drives? multiple drive bays from "laptop" 2.5" to "full-height" 5.25"? 3" optical? Firewire? CD/DVD? At what point should a manufacturer, controlling costs & features, decide enough customers don't want something that it should be dropped - even though a small number will be annoyed in the process? And at what point should a manufacturer, wanting to guide the industry to a favorable future, take something away to encourage customers elsewhere?
The optical drive in the current iMac works very well and is not obsolescent. When your hard drive/system is corrupted how are you supposed to boot your mac off of a startup disc when there's no startup disc or optical drive? How are you supposed to play the movie you just picked up from the Redbox out front of the grocery store? The CD/DVD optical drive is STILL state of the art and currently in widely-accepted use, unlike all those other technologies you just mentioned. It should NOT be dropped.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:51 AM   #68
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Apple didn't drop the SuperDrive because it was obsolete. They dropped it because it got in the way of their "everything must be wafer-thin" paradigm.
That's how I feel too. I think they should have left it alone, added the less reflective screen and allowed for easy, user replaceable, drives. Also, why offer access to RAM on the 27" and not the 21.5"? Do they really feel users of the larger screen are the only ones wanting to expand on what they buy without paying Apple for overpriced RAM?

That special feeling I had for Apple is gone. Not because of the iMac changes but their business practices in general. It's never going back to how it was and that's sad, to me.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:52 AM   #69
Phx08
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People complaining about no OD...you can just plug one in. Problem solved...I'll take my consultation fee now.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 11:53 AM   #70
wmikulic
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Originally Posted by deconstruct60 View Post
For example, the school could take submissions through Google Drive or use a USB Flash Drive for sneaker-net. Few courses are going to have assignments that use anywhere near the storage capacity of a DVD drive.
Yes they do, when they're for film class. And many non-film classes and other projects require submission on optical medium. And if you think you're going to change the way one of the largest public school systems does things, you're not too bright or are looking to become very frustrated.
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:04 PM   #71
katanna
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Originally Posted by Jetson View Post
People still need to use optical media to transfer commercial content. NOT ONE COMPANY puts commercial content on USB sticks, but on CDs and DVDs. They are NOT obsolete. Your solution is that we shell out additional money for an unsightly stand alone optical drive so that our super expensive "all in one" computer now can access commercial content.
As pointed out there are SOME companies that put out their content on USB, but USB is not CD/DVD's replacement, digital distribution is! Most companies offer their product in download form, including "pro" apps like Photoshop (which has been offered as a download for several years now); even operating systems have ditched physical media and are being offered primarily as a digital download.

For those that need it there is a plethora of external drives that you can buy (not just Apple's SuperDrive). And There are MANY people that will need this option. The minute the 21" iMac comes out my church will buy one and the minute the 27" iMac comes out I am buying one for myself, and in BOTH cases an optical drive is a requirement; but in both cases it is WORTH having an external drive (that you can unplug and store in a drawer when you aren't using it) for the upgrades you get; not JUST the sexy design, other upgrades like USB 3 and the Fusion Drive are great upgrades and well worth the "hassle" of buying a $30 external drive.

This is EXACTLY like the original iMac's dropping of the floppy drive: Apple is NOT forcing you to not use an optical drive, they are focusing on the future instead of the present; IE: they are aiming not to where computers are now they are aiming to where computers will be 5 years from now.

With or without an external optical drive the new iMac is a phenomenal machine. Embrace the future or buy a PC.

Matthew

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wmikulic View Post
Yes they do, when they're for film class. And many non-film classes and other projects require submission on optical medium. And if you think you're going to change the way one of the largest public school systems does things, you're not too bright or are looking to become very frustrated.
I agree that optical drives are essential for some people (I myself graduated from film school in 2007 and regularly burn DVDs for clients). What I don't understand about your argument is that you are essentially saying "I would rather limit myself to old hardware (USB 2 as an example) because I don't want to buy a $30 external drive." Is having an external drive so bad that you are willing to give up faster processing power for the rest of the machine? If so then great; myself, I would rather have a brick that I bring out of a drawer once a week then have an overall machine that is slower.

Matthew
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:05 PM   #72
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Thumb resize.

someone had to

But seriously i'm ready... i've ready for a new desktop since i got my mbp
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:07 PM   #73
katanna
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Apple didn't drop the SuperDrive because it was obsolete. They dropped it because it got in the way of their "everything must be wafer-thin" paradigm.
Disagree. Apple didn't drive the SuperDrive because it was obsolete, Apple is dropping optical drives because they very soon will be obsolete.

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Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:11 PM   #74
wmikulic
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This is EXACTLY like the original iMac's dropping of the floppy drive
No it isn't the same, because when the original iMac didn't include a floppy drive, it did include another removable medium type - the optical drive. But this time, the optical drive has been dropped but nothing has replaced it.

When the new iMac won't boot off the internal system, what are you supposed to boot off of? Does the new iMac come with OSX Mountain Lion preinstalled on an enclosed USB thumb drive?
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Old Nov 19, 2012, 12:14 PM   #75
HMI
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Why would the even consider giving a discount on a new release? Would you do that if you were Apple? Apple may appear dumb at time, but they certainly aren't stupid.
Ok. So, why would Apple even consider giving a discount on any of their products over the last several years during all their Black Friday events? Perhaps they see this as a "smart" business move on the biggest shopping day of the year.

I don't think a product's newness has anything to do with their decision.
It probably has more to do with their projected sales for a given product.

Apple can afford not to give any discounts, and offering them still gives them a generous profit margin.
Maybe they figure it is the "smarter" thing to do.

Or maybe they really want to spread Christmas magic around the world.
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