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Old Nov 26, 2012, 09:18 PM   #1
MagicThief83
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iMac Gaming & BootCamp?

Who games on their iMac in Bootcamp using Steam? Do you use Windows 7 or 8? Is windows 7 stable in Bootcamp for Steam gaming (meaning no constant errors and driver issues)? I ask because I downloaded Windows 8 on my MBA, and tried to play Steam games using Bootcamp, and each game I downloaded and played, greeted me with an error message and would force close the application. What's weird is that I used the Windows 8 release preview and everything was working with that version. By the way, I downloaded the Windows 8 Pro (64-bit) version. Some of the error messages I received were .NET errors and "graphic card undetected." It also wouldn't recognize my wireless Logitech gamepad (like I said, everything worked flawlessly before in the release preview). I think I'm just going to stick to Windows 7. What are your experiences with Windows 7, Bootcamp, and Steam gaming? Are all your gaming peripherals supported as well? Thanks!
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:18 AM   #2
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I game in bootcamp on win 7. Most games are optimized for win 7, this will (may?) change in the future, but if you want to play games that are out now, use windows 7.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:24 AM   #3
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I have Bootcamp with Windows 7. I haven't used it for anything in over a year. I won't bother with it this time around. If I wanted to run Windows, I would have just switched to Windows. I just prefer Unix, which I was using when Apple was on System 9, otherwise I would just own a PC.

For people that want to play games, why not just buy a PC?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 09:29 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by Scrapula View Post
For people that want to play games, why not just buy a PC?
The exact reason you do not want to run windows because OS X is much better for everything else but playing games Why would I limit myself with just windows when I can run both and be happy?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 09:46 AM   #5
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I work on my OS X side and game with Bootcamp/Windoz7. It works just fine although W7 runs the machine pretty hot so I have a small fan blowing across the back which solves the problem. W7 is pretty solid and I'm not going to upgrade to W8 until the bugs are worked out if at all.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 10:11 AM   #6
MagicThief83
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How would I go about installing Windows 7 on the new iMac? Being that it doesn't have an optical drive, I'm sure I would have to use an external cd-drive. How would I extract the iso from the install cd? Would I use the official Windows 7 USB tool? I just hope I don't run into any issues when trying to game on Steam in Bootcamp, because I just bought a ton of Steam games during the recent sale, and have some older games I would like to play and finish that I never really had the chance to because of school and work. I had a Windows 7 gaming laptop before and Steam ran fine, so I'm hoping Bootcamp will be no different. I think Windows 8 is a confusing and chaotic pile of junk and a sorry excuse for a desktop OS. It's the ultimate compromise, yet Microsoft touts it as a "no compromises" OS-what bullsh**!
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 10:15 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicThief83 View Post
How would I go about installing Windows 7 on the new iMac? Being that it doesn't have an optical drive, I'm sure I would have to use an external cd-drive. How would I extract the iso from the install cd? Would I use the official Windows 7 USB tool? I just hope I don't run into any issues when trying to game on Steam in Bootcamp, because I just bought a ton of Steam games during the recent sale, and have some older games I would like to play and finish that I never really had the chance to because of school and work. I had a Windows 7 gaming laptop before and Steam ran fine, so I'm hoping Bootcamp will be no different. I think Windows 8 is a confusing and chaotic pile of junk and a sorry excuse for a desktop OS. It's the ultimate compromise, yet Microsoft touts it as a "no compromises" OS-what bullsh**!
If you don't yet have the Win 7 disk, you should be able to buy a digital copy off Microsoft.com. You need to hunt but the Windows 7 store is still up. You'd then put the digital copy on a USB flash drive and install off that.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 11:30 AM   #8
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If you don't yet have the Win 7 disk, you should be able to buy a digital copy off Microsoft.com. You need to hunt but the Windows 7 store is still up. You'd then put the digital copy on a USB flash drive and install off that.
Digital copy is no longer available unfortunately, I could've also used my student discount, but to no avail.

----------

Just ordered the OEM disc from Newegg.com.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:00 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Scrapula View Post
For people that want to play games, why not just buy a PC?
Such a cliche response! Why would I buy a PC solely for gaming? I prefer OSX, and can experience the best of both worlds. I'm not a hardcore gamer, and don't require a dedicated Windows gaming PC. The sole purpose of my machine won't be for gaming. In plus, there is much clutter and wasted space that comes along with owning a PC; I prefer the simplicity and clean design of the iMac. The iMac when in Bootcamp, can play PC games at a respectable performance, thereby negating the need for a stand-alone gaming PC.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:26 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scrapula View Post

For people that want to play games, why not just buy a PC?
Me: I'm buying a new Audi. Are there any concerns about taking it to the corner store?
You: If you're going to the store, why not just buy a bicycle?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:30 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by MagicThief83 View Post
Digital copy is no longer available unfortunately, I could've also used my student discount, but to no avail.

----------

Just ordered the OEM disc from Newegg.com.
I might do the same. Are we supposed to buy the 64-bit OEM or the 32-bit?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:33 PM   #12
81Steven
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the only issue I see in the new iMac in gaming, is the bootcamp problem with the 3TB fusion drive I would like to order
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:39 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by glitch44 View Post
i might do the same. Are we supposed to buy the 64-bit oem or the 32-bit?
64.

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Originally Posted by 81Steven View Post
the only issue I see in the new iMac in gaming, is the bootcamp problem with the 3TB fusion drive I would like to order
I have a hard time imagining needing a 3TB internal drive. Why not a 1TB fusion and a USB3 external?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:46 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by 81Steven View Post
the only issue I see in the new iMac in gaming, is the bootcamp problem with the 3TB fusion drive I would like to order
It's not really a "problem", it's just Fusion'ing doesn't work and Bootcamp/W7 runs off the HD only. There may be a work around but I don't know anything about it.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:50 PM   #15
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It's not really a "problem", it's just Fusion'ing doesn't work and Bootcamp/W7 runs off the HD only. There may be a work around but I don't know anything about it.
You can't Bootcamp a 3 TB drive at all (Fusion or otherwise).
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 12:55 PM   #16
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This is just ridiculous. Why can't Apple offer a 256gb SSD + 3tb option? Fusion drives might be great for people who only need a very simple setup. If you want to have bootcamp and windows 7 for gaming, this is a complete disaster. What, so now I have to get an extra external thunderbolt SSD just to play games in Windows? Very disappointing move by Apple.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:06 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagicThief83 View Post
Digital copy is no longer available unfortunately, I could've also used my student discount, but to no avail.

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Just ordered the OEM disc from Newegg.com.

For the 100th time on this forum, a simple external USB CD/DVD is less than $12 shipped to your door. It's slim and will take up almost no space in your desk, closet, shoebox, attic, etc. for the one time per year you might need it. Buy the cheapest one you can find, not apple's version.

I swear to god i need to take out an ad in the Sunday paper to remind the human race that they can buy a USB DVD drive for less effort than it takes to post on a forum about what a pain its going to be to mount an ISO on a USB thumb drive.

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This is just ridiculous. Why can't Apple offer a 256gb SSD + 3tb option? Fusion drives might be great for people who only need a very simple setup. If you want to have bootcamp and windows 7 for gaming, this is a complete disaster. What, so now I have to get an extra external thunderbolt SSD just to play games in Windows? Very disappointing move by Apple.
Sounds like a BIOS/EFI or driver problem. Lets see what the terrain looks like once the dust settles and the drivers are released. I've been pleasantly surprised by MS before. (disclaimer: I've been disappointed an equal number of times - so it's a gamble)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by 81Steven View Post
the only issue I see in the new iMac in gaming, is the bootcamp problem with the 3TB fusion drive I would like to order
So I know it's all still rumors and speculation, but are we sure the general consensus is that there will be no pure SSD option?
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:09 PM   #18
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This is just ridiculous. Why can't Apple offer a 256gb SSD + 3tb option? Fusion drives might be great for people who only need a very simple setup. If you want to have bootcamp and windows 7 for gaming, this is a complete disaster. What, so now I have to get an extra external thunderbolt SSD just to play games in Windows? Very disappointing move by Apple.
I'm not sure I understand your consternation...

You can order your iMac with a Fusion drive then just break the Fusion when you get it.

However, even if Apple offered a BTO that was a SSD+3TB HDD, you still wouldn't be able to install Boot Camp on it.

The limitation isn't Apple's, it's Windows. When Boot Camp was introduced, GUID wasn't supported. Boot Camp emulates MBR and MBR can't boot a drive larger than 2.2TB.

In order to boot from a volume larger than 2.2TB, Boot Camp needs to be re-written to support GUID. However, that will require 64-bit Windows 7 as a minimum.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:10 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by forty2j View Post
(addressing quote re: why not just buy a PC for gaming)
Me: I'm buying a new Audi. Are there any concerns about taking it to the corner store?
You: If you're going to the store, why not just buy a bicycle?
I agree. Sure there are jenky workarounds. I lived that way when I was in college and in grad school. Multiple frankestein parts-swapping computers, cables everywhere, monitors everywhere; all the while having many capabilities that simple setups did not have.

Now I don't want my house to look disorganized and hackneyed. I have a particular space set aside for an all-in-one and I don't want a tower sitting out in the open (and I know enough about computers to dismiss any idea of stuffing a tower in a cabinet). No other AIO comes close in the GPU performance category. That's why I really want this iMac.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:13 PM   #20
81Steven
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Originally Posted by MatthewAMEL View Post
The limitation isn't Apple's, it's Windows. When Boot Camp was introduced, GUID wasn't supported. Boot Camp emulates MBR and MBR can't boot a drive larger than 2.2TB.

In order to boot from a volume larger than 2.2TB, Boot Camp needs to be re-written to support GUID. However, that will require 64-bit Windows 7 as a minimum.
Microsoft manages this, Bootcamp don't.

Bootcamp should be upgraded to manage both boot methods as soon as they release hardware that otherwise wont work as intended
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:17 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by MatthewAMEL View Post
I'm not sure I understand your consternation...

You can order your iMac with a Fusion drive then just break the Fusion when you get it.

However, even if Apple offered a BTO that was a SSD+3TB HDD, you still wouldn't be able to install Boot Camp on it.

The limitation isn't Apple's, it's Windows. When Boot Camp was introduced, GUID wasn't supported. Boot Camp emulates MBR and MBR can't boot a drive larger than 2.2TB.

In order to boot from a volume larger than 2.2TB, Boot Camp needs to be re-written to support GUID. However, that will require 64-bit Windows 7 as a minimum.
Well I'll put it this way: Do you want to run Windows and high-end, demanding games with GBs of graphics from a slow 5400rpm HD or a fast SSD? The fusion drive is a neat consept if you're only going to have one partition, but if you want Windows/bootcamp, then not so much...
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:26 PM   #22
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Hello all. I'm a long time listener, first time caller. I'm also a little freaked out. I've been waiting 9 months for my new, and first, fully loaded 27" with 1tb drive + fusion. My plan was to purchase windows 7 and install it using a external drive to allow me to run ms flight sim and other flight sims using bootcamp. I realise everyone is going to tell me to buy a windows PC but I don't need everything maxed out. This forum seems to be saying that the new fusion drives won't support bootcamp which is news to me. Does anyone know is if the straight 3tb drive without fusion will work? Or am I misunderstanding. I find it hard to imagine apple would cripple such a unique and sought after option as bootcamp.
Thanks in advance.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:47 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Minotaur51887 View Post
Hello all. I'm a long time listener, first time caller. I'm also a little freaked out. I've been waiting 9 months for my new, and first, fully loaded 27" with 1tb drive + fusion. My plan was to purchase windows 7 and install it using a external drive to allow me to run ms flight sim and other flight sims using bootcamp. I realise everyone is going to tell me to buy a windows PC but I don't need everything maxed out. This forum seems to be saying that the new fusion drives won't support bootcamp which is news to me. Does anyone know is if the straight 3tb drive without fusion will work? Or am I misunderstanding. I find it hard to imagine apple would cripple such a unique and sought after option as bootcamp.
Thanks in advance.
You cant bootcamp a 3tb drive fusion or no fusion.
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 01:58 PM   #24
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You cant bootcamp a >2.2tb drive fusion or no fusion.
fix
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Old Nov 27, 2012, 02:31 PM   #25
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You cant bootcamp a 3tb drive fusion or no fusion.
I am planning to get a NEW 27" IMAC [if they ever come out] and use Bootcamp for PC Gamming.
I work with Photoshop, and Adobe Premier, After Effects and I play WoW on MAC and Star Wars Old Republic and other PC only games. I have a Synology DS212+ NAS for Data and Backup.

Going with:
27" 3.4GHz quad-core Intel core I7 with 8MB L3 cache
8GB Ram, Upgrade to 32GB 1600MHz DDR3 from OWC or Crucial
1TB 7200rpm Fusion Drive, or 768GB SSD with an External Thunderbolt Drive.
NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680MX Graphic processor with 2GB of GDDR5 memory
AppleCare Protection Plan
External Samsung SE-506AB Slim Portable Blu-ray Writer to replace the Super drive Apple remove.

Choices of drive 768GB SSD, 1T or 3T Fusion HHD, 1T or 3T HDD

The problem is with Bootcamp you need to partition your internal drive It will not work on an external Drive. When you have a Fusion Drive you have to partition HDD and use the non fusion HDD partition side for Bootcamp and Windows. You cannot use the SSD side for Windows so you lose the extra speed you may have if you could. (Note - 3TB drives can't currently be partitioned for Bootcamp.) and I rather use Bootcamp. I am confused as to what Drive setup I should get?

Now we get to the reason why I might wait before I get my Imac. Maybe OWC has looked into doing Turnkey with the New Imac's and Install Larger SSD [256GB or 512GB with a fast 1T HDD or 2T] with or without the Fusion part? Not knowing if the IMAC 27" Drive bay will even accept them? Here’s Hoping.

Apple may even fix Bootcamp to work with 3T HDD and Fusion 3T. But would be even better is for them to give upgrades of 256GB or 512GB ssd with the Fusion Drive. I may get the 768SSD But at this time I don't even know if Bootcamp will work on the 768 SSD. Does anyone know??
So this is the reason I might wait.
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