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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:34 AM   #76
GoSh4rks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syd430 View Post
Ok. I'll tell you what....

How about you go to a casino and drop of the car with the Valet service.

Lets say that I am also at the same casino and when I come outside, the Valet confuses me for you, and mistakenly hands me the keys to your car, and I happily take it and park it in my garage knowing that it's not mine.

When you come to my house a week later, furious that I stole your car, this is what i'll tell you:

"I didn't steal your car, the Valet handed me the keys to it by mistake, I didn't go out looking for a car to break in to, so actually it's my car now"

You're an idiot.
A set of keys are not a car.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:46 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by GoSh4rks View Post
A set of keys are not a car.
You're right, a set of keys that doesn't belong to you is not the same thing as that person then getting in the car and driving it, instead of returning the keys.

And an iphone still sealed in a box that doesn't belong to you, is not the same thing as the OP opening up the box, then activating it and firing up Angry Birds, instead of returning the iphone.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:48 AM   #78
swervinsuburban
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They take your CC for a reason, there is fine print in there saying that if you somehow acquire extra devices over what you have you will be charged for the full price of the device, this already happened to my friend but it took like a month to charge him. No point to this argument it's considered theft because you are keeping a device you didn't pay for. If a company you work for pays you double your wage on accident and you spend it that's theft and they will prosecute you it's a well known fact.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 02:02 AM   #79
GoSh4rks
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syd430 View Post
You're right, a set of keys that doesn't belong to you is not the same thing as that person then getting in the car and driving it, instead of returning the keys.

And an iphone still sealed in a box that doesn't belong to you, is not the same thing as the OP opening up the box, then activating it and firing up Angry Birds, instead of returning the iphone.
According to your analogy, as long as he doesn't open it or do anything with it, he's in the clear. He didn't steal the keys - didn't try to return them either but we're not talking about that are we?

Your analogy is questionable.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 02:05 AM   #80
syd430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSh4rks View Post
According to your analogy, as long as he doesn't open it or do anything with it, he's in the clear. He didn't steal the keys - didn't try to return them either but we're not talking about that are we?

Your analogy is questionable.
I like how you didn't say anything about the second, more relevant example I gave.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSh4rks View Post
as long as he doesn't open it or do anything with it, he's in the clear.
Actually, i did say "and return the phone".
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 03:09 AM   #81
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MOD NOTE

We have spent a considerable amount of time trying to clean this therad up a bit.

Please can we refrain from the arguing and bickering. Please review the Rules for Appropriate Debate before posting.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 03:19 AM   #82
Hawtin
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You've scored a phone, keep a hold of it. If nothing gets said after two months or so, It's yours.

Last edited by stridemat; Nov 30, 2012 at 03:26 AM. Reason: Cleanup
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 03:47 AM   #83
syd430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swervinsuburban View Post
No point to this argument it's considered theft because you are keeping a device you didn't pay for. If a company you work for pays you double your wage on accident and you spend it that's theft and they will prosecute you it's a well known fact.
I posted a similar example where the bank accidently wired someone 70k, and the receipted served jail time for spending it.

If you read through this thread though, it turns out that probably two-thirds of everone here would also spend the money, claiming it was there right to because "the bank is a multi-billion dollar corporation" and so they are allowed to because the clerk made a mistake.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Damolee View Post
Your confusing the issue. We are talking something delivered to your home, your property. Not in the public domain.
Ask this guy what happened to him when he received $70k from the bank when sitting at his home checking his internet banking and away from the "public domain":

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/0...n_1540549.html


I guess he just needed you to represent him in court so you could tell the judge that it's not theft because he checked his account balance away from the public domain.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 03:52 AM   #84
serkan
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Nobody is a good person nowadays,why dont you be one ?

Contact to Apple


orrrrrrr

Contact with meeee
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:09 AM   #85
thewitt
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The lack of morals in the participants of this thread is a microcosm of what wrong in the US today.

So very sad.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

I hope none of you who think he should keep the phone consider yourselves honest in any way.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 12:10 PM   #86
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Originally Posted by thewitt View Post
The lack of morals in the participants of this thread is a microcosm of what wrong in the US today.

So very sad.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

I hope none of you who think he should keep the phone consider yourselves honest in any way.
He's not benefiting off of someone. He's not benefitting off of even a small business.

He's benefiting off the most valuable company in the world.

The moral decision is not to return it, it's to give it to someone that would appreciate it.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 12:17 PM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by syd430 View Post
Ask this guy what happened to him when he received $70k from the bank when sitting at his home checking his internet banking and away from the "public domain":
Considering that the courts treat the 2 types of cases very differently, it may help if you stop comparing them directly.

None of the analogies are helping, because the other posters do not have a basis in understanding them, either. An analogy or metaphor is only useful if it is more familiar to the audience than the actual subject matter. When it is equally familiar, you are just wasting bandwidth.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 12:19 PM   #88
syd430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike01 View Post
He's not benefiting off of someone. He's not benefitting off of even a small business.

He's benefiting off the most valuable company in the world.

The moral decision is not to return it, it's to give it to someone that would appreciate it.
Easily the worst comment so far in this thread.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 12:38 PM   #89
raf66
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Sometimes I'm ashamed at how far societal standards have fallen. No one is perfect, and we all clearly have our own character flaws. But this one is a no-brainer that should NOT have required the OP to seek advice from anonymous posters on a public forum. I'm quite certain we would all (rightfully) call out any company or person who attempted to take advantage of an honest mistake WE made. Just because Apple is a large and successful company doesn't mean they deserve anything less than what we'd demand/expect were the situation reversed.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:07 PM   #90
syd430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike01 View Post
He's not benefiting off of someone. He's not benefitting off of even a small business.
I'd love to see a small business develop something like an iphone and then still have enough economies of scale to be able to sell it to you for $600, instead of a couple of hundred thousand dollars, if at all.

This probably also applies to virtually ever other possession that you take for granted in your house in some form or another.

It might surprise you, but there's a reason why some forms of enterprise need size and capacity.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:12 PM   #91
FlatlinerG
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike01 View Post
He's not benefiting off of someone. He's not benefitting off of even a small business.

He's benefiting off the most valuable company in the world.

The moral decision is not to return it, it's to give it to someone that would appreciate it.
No, the moral thing to do would be return it to it's rightful owner. He didn't end up paying for it, and therefor it rightfully belongs to Apple.


Quote:
Originally Posted by raf66 View Post
Sometimes I'm ashamed at how far societal standards have fallen. No one is perfect, and we all clearly have our own character flaws. But this one is a no-brainer that should NOT have required the OP to seek advice from anonymous posters on a public forum. I'm quite certain we would all (rightfully) call out any company or person who attempted to take advantage of an honest mistake WE made. Just because Apple is a large and successful company doesn't mean they deserve anything less than what we'd demand/expect were the situation reversed.
Couldn't have said it any better.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:18 PM   #92
MikeyMike01
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Why do people keep making baffling comparisons to situations where someone is in possession of something that belonged to another person (stolen cars, misplaced hats)? It's not relevant. He didn't find an iPhone lying on the ground somewhere... that'd be a vastly different situation.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:24 PM   #93
syd430
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike01 View Post
Why do people keep making baffling comparisons to situations where someone is in possession of something that belonged to another person
It belongs to Apple.

Apple is a collection of shareholders.

Shareholders are people.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:34 PM   #94
BFizzzle
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to repeat what i said earlier

Quote:
Originally Posted by BFizzzle View Post
i dont understand the confusion people. it is unjust enrichment in the USA. it varies from state to state but it is almost unanimous the if you are unjustly enriched.. and DO NOT INFORM the proper owner.. it is PASSIVE THEFT.

take a few minutes and google.
lets put the obvious lack of morals and honor you most are showing aside and talk facts.

please all you people who are arguing. Lets take a few minutes and google and read (i know i know its hard) "unjust enrichment in the USA" (it doesnt only have to do with contracts.. )

please google passive theft...(no it doesnt always have to pertain to cable and other services)

if the he is enriched unjustly..and does not contact the owner then its passive theft...

im sure we can draw pictures for those who cant comprehend.
// end of thread //
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:38 PM   #95
bradl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thewitt View Post
The lack of morals in the participants of this thread is a microcosm of what wrong in the US today.

So very sad.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

I hope none of you who think he should keep the phone consider yourselves honest in any way.
Again, we agree. Though just for clarification, 'you', referenced in bold, is referring to the group of people on the side of keeping it/selling it/profiting from Apple's mistake, not the singular 'you', referring to the OP.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeyMike01 View Post
He's not benefiting off of someone. He's not benefitting off of even a small business.

He's benefiting off the most valuable company in the world.

The moral decision is not to return it, it's to give it to someone that would appreciate it.
So just because this is a mistake made by the most valuable company in the world means that your moral compass should be thrown out the door? That doesn't make it right either, and that is also the problem right there.

I understand your premise, which is to pay it forward. But paying it forward with equipment that doesn't belong to you is still theft. And in essence, that would make the situation worse, because now a third party, who isn't privy to how the person who gave them the product received that product, would also be out, and possibly implicated in the same theft.

Now.. if the OP, after getting hold of Apple, was told by Apple, "our fault and mistake. But congratulations, keep it", then he could do what you are saying and pay it forward without any loss of integrity. That would be right. Doing it without Apple's knowledge would be wrong.

That is the difference between your logic, as well as the logic of "sticking it to the man", and doing the right thing.

BL.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:40 PM   #96
utahusker
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I still think Apple may let him keep the phone, when/if he calls them.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:42 PM   #97
BFizzzle
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Originally Posted by utahusker View Post
I still think Apple may let him keep the phone, when/if he calls them.
if they cant find it in the system yeah..maybe

i was sent two ipad 3s.

Preordered one.. day before release.. still said "processing" apple said must be and error..lets over night you one.. you'll get it a few days after release date.. Launch day comes.. wahooo my original ipad comes in.. then two days later my replacement came in. They sent me a box/label to mail it back.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:49 PM   #98
Raftysworld
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thewitt View Post
The lack of morals in the participants of this thread is a microcosm of what wrong in the US today.

So very sad.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

I hope none of you who think he should keep the phone consider yourselves honest in any way.
This made me laugh so hard.

The amount of immorality prevalent in major corporations like Apple doesn't bother you, but when a person suggests keeping a phone that was mistakenly sent, you say that we should be ashamed? It would be comical if it weren't so sad. You really need to think twice about your priorities.

EDIT: Also, those of you quoting the law as the arbiter in all decisions are equally as misguided. Have you never once broken a law? Jaywalked across a street, perhaps? Because the amount of harm inflicted on society by jaywalking across a street is probably more than the harm inflicted on Apple by keeping a second iPhone that wasn't paid for.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:52 PM   #99
BFizzzle
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Originally Posted by Raftysworld View Post
This made me laugh so hard.

The amount of immorality prevalent in major corporations like Apple doesn't bother you, but when a person suggests keeping a phone that was mistakenly sent, you say that we should be ashamed? It would be comical if it weren't so sad. You really need to think twice about your priorities.

EDIT: Also, those of you quoting the law as the arbiter in all decisions are equally as misguided. Have you never once broken a law? Jaywalked across a street, perhaps? Because the amount of harm inflicted on society by jaywalking across a street is probably more than the harm inflicted on Apple by keeping a second iPhone that wasn't paid for.
smh

its nothing about the infliction caused to the ginormous corp of apple.
two wrongs dont make a right.. simple as that..

either you have honor.. or you dont.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 01:55 PM   #100
Raftysworld
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Originally Posted by BFizzzle View Post
smh

its nothing about the infliction caused to the ginormous corp of apple.
two wrongs dont make a right.. simple as that..

either you have honor.. or you dont.
Either you have honor or you don't? Sounds a lot like George W. Bush saying "Either you're with us, or against us".

If I were to give a second iPhone I received for free to a person too poor to afford an iPhone, would I match your personal definition of honor?
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