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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:05 AM   #76
InfinitiG
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anyone know if the HD and Ram are upgradeable?
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:20 AM   #77
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Originally Posted by komodrone View Post
What kind of useless questions are these? Sure I'll have a stab at being on the opposite end then:

Does anyone use the Super Drive? No.
Does removing the Super Drive allow the iMac to be eight pounds lighter? Yes
Did Apple add any new features? Fusion Drive
Can you install more than 16GB of ram? Yes.
Does it perform better? Yes. Fusion Drive + Ivy Bridge + 1536 CUDA cores GFX + 32GB ram + less reflection on the display
My question is though, why does it all have to be slimmed down?
It makes sense with the macbook pro line, and iOS devices, those need to be portable.
I mean it's a desktop there's no point in making it thinner and lighter. It's going to be standing in one place, for an extended period of time. If not the rest of its lifespan. Just give us some more powerful graphics, and make heat dissipation more efficient. Making the system also more silent.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:20 AM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komodrone View Post
What kind of useless questions are these? Sure I'll have a stab at being on the opposite end then:

Does anyone use the Super Drive? No.
Does removing the Super Drive allow the iMac to be eight pounds lighter? Yes
Did Apple add any new features? Fusion Drive
Can you install more than 16GB of ram? Yes.
Does it perform better? Yes. Fusion Drive + Ivy Bridge + 1536 CUDA cores GFX + 32GB ram + less reflection on the display
There is no way that all eight of those pounds are dependent on removing the Super Drive. I realize that it is not just the weight of the Super Drive itself, but everything that goes into supporting its existence in the iMac. I am 100% sure they could have reduced the weight of the iMac while keeping the drive. Phil Schiller did not mention the Super Drive when talking about how they reduced the weight but he did mention it when talking about making it so thin on the edges.

Now, that does not mean I am not opposed to removing the Super Drive. While I disagree with you saying that no one uses it, it probably does not get used by as many people as it was a few years ago and it was in the way of Apple's plan to make the iMac as thin as it is. But is does get used enough for Apple to still sell a Super Drive. There are other companies that make external drives that work with a Mac just as easily as the external Super Drive (some are Blu-Ray and work very well with a Mac!)

Which brings me back to the weight, How often will these get moved? Maybe as often as the Super Drive gets used? Some will never move it, some will move it a few times and a few will move it a lot (probably should have gotten a notebook computer) Those same things can be said about the Super Drive. I am 100% sure there are some that use it very often and many do not need it all all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by spcdust View Post
Superdrive is still used by people and I like the aesthetic of the all-in-one without now having another lead trailing out of the back of the iMac..
I believe that if you really need a Super Drive an external one is a good option. If you want one for the few times you use it, you do not have to have it connected at all times, so it does not need to sit there ruining the look of the iMac, but I think that the people who need it probably need other external devices as well. For example: Perhaps you need to be able to create DVDs for clients from the footage you shot with the camera that is also connected to the iMac along with an external hard drive also connected to the iMac. Video footage fills up a drive very fast, even that 3TB iMac will not be enough for some filmmakers without external storage...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:27 AM   #79
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Originally Posted by punchdrunk55 View Post
Looks pretty nice to me

but

What kind of monster uses their mouse on the left hand side. I mean, seriously. I'm super left handed and I can't even imagine doing that.
I do and always have although I use the magic trackpad at home and a mouse at work.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:29 AM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Blount View Post
Does anyone else look at this thing and just think its an overgrown laptop? I hope the performance doesn't suffer because of this.
In case you need more power, I doubt you do, buy the MacPro.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:36 AM   #81
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Wow, that's amazing. There's not much inside there at all. I'm used to seeing desktop's with lots of hardware and wiring inside.

This is a nice clean look, outside and inside.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:39 AM   #82
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Originally Posted by MeFromHere View Post
Which would also require:
Bigger power supply - With components getting much more efficient coupled with some intelligent power management it wouldn't need a larger power supply
More and bigger fans - Not needed since the iMac is basically a big heat sync anyway
More software development (to support BluRay) - VLC. Sorted.
Much higher price - Apple's model is to keep the price the same (or as close as possible) whilst improving the unit.

I suppose Apple analyzed the market and decided their version would please more customers and generate more revenue and/or profit than your version. Maybe their analysis was right, maybe it was wrong. If they got it wrong, it just leaves a bigger opportunity in the market for someone else to offer something more pleasing to folks like you.

There's no slavery involved here. You don't have to buy what they offer, and they don't have to offer what you want.
Comments in quote.

Last edited by stridemat; Nov 30, 2012 at 07:48 AM. Reason: added comment
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:41 AM   #83
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Electromechanical devices fail at a higher rate increasing service cost for such a sleek machine. Ditching the optical drive was a smart trade-off in my opinion.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:44 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Blount View Post
Does anyone else look at this thing and just think its an overgrown laptop? I hope the performance doesn't suffer because of this.
You are 100% correct! It basically is an overgrown laptop; once they started the all in one design of the iMac they have used a lot of laptop-like components and designs.

But just think about what a laptop is: a computer that has to be smaller, thinner and lighter, still a computer.

Ultra thin laptops have worse performance than larger laptops but only because they are smaller, they have to use weaker CPUs because of space, battery life and heat. Larger laptops have better performance. Now imagine a 21 or 27 inch laptop! In terms of a laptop, you have so much more room to fill it with better performing CPUs and GPUs.

Performance won't suffer when compared to other All-in-ones like the older iMacs. But if you need more power, go with a Mac Pro which is much larger.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:52 AM   #85
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Looks promising for DIY upgrades. Of course they don't say how hard it is to take out the screen and the pictures skip some steps. Hopefully it is just held on with magnets like previous iMacs and there are only a couple of wires to disconnect. The HD looks to be easily replaceable and possibly with removing the fan there is enough access to the DIMM sockets.

$1299 + $50 (16 GB RAM) + $160 (256gb SSD) + DIY = $1509
vs
$1499 (have to get the higher model for SSD/Fusion option) + $200 (RAM) + $250 (Fusion) = $1949.

at least for what I plan on using it for, plus I already have a SSD.

Can't wait to see the upgrade reports...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:53 AM   #86
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Originally Posted by punchdrunk55 View Post
Looks pretty nice to me

but

What kind of monster uses their mouse on the left hand side. I mean, seriously. I'm super left handed and I can't even imagine doing that.
Pirates with only one arm? Left handed people like my grandfather? Right handed people that have carpel tunnel in the right arm? Oh, and monsters!

Back on topic... the new iMac looks awesome! But, I think I will stick to using a macbook pro and mac mini until the iMac gets a retina display (also the SD card slot needs to be on the side of the computer... it is near useless on the back!).
My dream set up, which I plan to purchase when I finish college, would be a 27" retina iMac with two retina Apple cinema displays (assuming that Apple releases retina displays and iMacs by 2015).

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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:53 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by komodrone View Post
Does removing the Super Drive allow the iMac to be eight pounds lighter? Yes
Newsflash: It's not a portable. It sits on a desk and stays there.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:58 AM   #88
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While the teardown was decent, it wasn't as detailed as I had hoped. I think 21" owners can take solace in the fact that the RAM is indeed on DIMMS and will be user-replaceable (albeit with some difficulty).

Of more interest (and not covered) is the HDD/SSD Fusion system. If the Fusiondrive is completely in software as shown in early reports, it may be cost effective to just order the standard HDD and add an SSD from OWC at a a discount. A closer look at the connections, etc. will be needed though.

I look forward to the ifixit guides for 21" and 27" models coming soon.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:00 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ArchAndroid View Post
Gotta love the new iMac design.

Does it make the iMac less tall? No. (Limited by the screen height)
Does it make the iMac less wide? No. (Limited by the screen width)
Does it improve the iMac depth wise? No. (Limited by the stand)

Does it improve thermals? No. (Slightly less heat dissipated in a lot less volume)

Did Apple take away features? Yes. (Super Drive replaced with an internal plastic wedge).

Way to innovate, Apple.

Gotta love your post.

Is it helpful in any way? NO
Does it really matter if the dimensions haven't improved? NO
Is anyone worried about internal thermals? NO

Way to dwell on crap that no one really cares about and the one single negative; the lack of a SuperDrive, which really isn't much of a negative since you can buy USB DVD drives for $20 - $30.

You completely left out the dozen or so things that have improved over the previous version.

Are you just a troll? YES

Way to go, whoever you are.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:07 AM   #90
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Baby got back!

No but seriously, What is scaring me is the pictures of the break down. I am thinking the RAM on the 21.5" iMac is now located on the back of the Logic Board. If this is true then even a Mac Certified Tech. has to remove all of the components just to reseat the RAM or replace.

As far as the slimmer iMac goes I move multiple iMacs daily in my job. Yes, it is a desktop but that does not mean space and portability are not needed at least in enterprise.

Something that I would like to see apple build would be a Time Capsule with dvd/ br (yeah right) built in. That way you place a disk in and access from all your computers.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:07 AM   #91
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I'm sorry, this is not impressive. The thinness is an illusion, number one. Are people really that gullible? Take a look at it at certain angles. That's why Schiller was so daintily careful not to turn the turning display table too far to expose this in the keynote. It's as thick as one would expect from removing the optical drive. The edge is thin. Big whoop! Secondly, there is little advantage to a desktop being a bit thinner anyway.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:09 AM   #92
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Looks the same when viewed from working angle, but I'm still really pleased they made it thin at the edges instead of putting another HDD bay, or keeping an ODD. I have been looking forward to spending gobs of money on the extremely limited seelction of thunderbolt externals.

Feels the same to the desks it will spend 99.99% of its life on.

Mostly I'm just glad that they don't offer any SSD options other than 768GB. Who would want 256GB? Some kind of fricken lunatic?
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:11 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by superman23 View Post
i disagree, my Best Buy had the 15" retina MBP and last 27" iMac side by side and the difference was obvious.
It would be when they're the same distance away, but in actual use, you would have the 21.5" (and especially the 27") iMac farther away from your eyes then you would a MacBook Pro with Retina Display and at those farther distances, the individual pixels are no longer visible.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:17 AM   #94
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Originally Posted by Serelus View Post
My question is though, why does it all have to be slimmed down?
Aesthetics. 99% of the time your only going to see the thin edge. Makes it look less clunky - less like a computer.

Based on a lot of the comments in this thread, most people assume that Apple decided to leave out the SuperDrive so they could make it thin.

But if you look at their other systems, it's blatantly obvious that Apple is done with the SuperDrive. It's because of this, they decided they could make it thinner.


This is all so reminiscent of the original iMac and the lack of a floppy drive. People went completely ape****.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:24 AM   #95
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Originally Posted by ArchAndroid View Post
Gotta love the new iMac design.

Does it make the iMac less tall? No. (Limited by the screen height)
Does it make the iMac less wide? No. (Limited by the screen width)
Does it improve the iMac depth wise? No. (Limited by the stand)

Does it improve thermals? No. (Slightly less heat dissipated in a lot less volume)

Did Apple take away features? Yes. (Super Drive replaced with an internal plastic wedge).

Way to innovate, Apple.
Actually, the answers to your first four questions are: No, No, Yes, Possibly.
Depth-wise, the tapered design, and lack of an optical drive slot on the side means you can put it further back into a corner. If you're set up so that your iMac is along a wall, it's no different than the prior version. If you're set up so that you're in a corner, the design change saves you some significant space. With regard to the thermal envelope, it's too early to tell whether or not the new design improves things.

As for your last question, the answer there is dependent upon a few factors, including whether or not your typical use-case involves an optical drive. Mine doesn't. The last time I needed to use one was tax time last year, and I've got two externals that I'd accumulated over the years before that. (One is a DVD burner, the other is a Blu-Ray burner.) In my case, the inclusion of an optical drive makes no difference at all. In your case, I'm guessing it does. For someone else it might, or it might not.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by 76ShovelHead View Post
How can it be? It is soldered on.
Look at the picture included in what you quoted. The RAM sockets are at the bottom right of the board in that picture. It's not soldered on.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:29 AM   #96
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Originally Posted by Pegamush View Post
1)if you judge a desktop for the ease to move it around your home, then maybe you bought the wrong computer.. isn't a laptop better for you?
2) guess what, if you use a cd player, either internal or external, it's going to make a lot of noise, viceversa if you don't use it, i don't get your argument, seems written by a fanatic.

1) yes people use cd/dvd still. talk for yourself, please.
2) no, the superdrive weighs half a pound, i don't see your argument here.
3) you can make your own fusion drive on old imacs too, is just a software implementation, as long as it fits two drives.


you forgot: an unserviceable sd slot. how the hell can i reach the back of the imac to stick in a sd card?? oww but i'm so glad the edges are tapered, i so much needed it.

i might add: before this you could swap the superdrive to fit another hard disk, if you didn't need the optical, you could raid two ssd, or add 1-2 tb of space with a 2.5" hdd. not anymore.
Agreed. Manufacturers remove choice and make what's left more difficult to use and they claim that is "better." I use the SD slot on my mid-2010 imac all the time. Reaching around the back to feel for one would be irritating. Hard drive goes bad? Don't replace it yourself. It's "better" to have to lug the whole thing to the nearest authorized repair center/store and possibly have them keep it for a few days rather than you spend a few hours buying a drive and replacing it yourself for same-day return-to-functionality.

Unrelated tech, but related concept: I bought my first Toyota RAV4 this year; a used 2008 Limited. I bought this over other RAV4s for 2 reasons: it had low mileage (was a corp lease car with 20k miles) and has a V6 and I went for the RAV4 over other makes and models due to the Toyota reputation and the spare being on the back door. If you've ever had to change the tire in the rain, you would appreciate the easy access to the tire.

The 2013 RAV4 offers no V6 (I4 only) and the spare was moved to the inside, under the cargo area floor. That's supposed to be "better." Hhmm...a car full of camping gear (yes, we camp), groceries, etc...flat tire...oh joy - one gets the added bonus of pulling everything out just to change the tire. It looks like my first RAV4 will be my last, but hopefully I won't have to worry about this for a very long time.

Limiting choice and moving accessories to unusable locations is NOT better.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Macclone View Post
All the whinny people on this forum are a disappointment to me. If you don't like it, don't buy it.

----------


I would agree to a point. I would much rather a buy more economical system designed for use over artistic appearance any day IF I could still run Mac OS. Mac OS is UNIX (which I prefer to Windows) with mass hardware and software support. I'd run Linux, but for home desktop use, it is still lacking especially with hardware support. Windows? No thanks.

Apple's insistence on making imacs $1200 "disposable" appliances is really making my choices difficult. Get what I can afford in a case much better designed for usability and suffer with an inferior OS or overpay for sealed hardware that limits choice and usability for the sake of a better OS. I honestly don't know which way I'll go when my current system becomes unusably outdated.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:31 AM   #97
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That is a wicked unboxing

Short, sweet and to the point. Sites like the Verge should hire this guy.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:37 AM   #98
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it looks eh, ok
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:37 AM   #99
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Sad but true..

I love OS X as much as the next guy... buuuut it seems to me that we have a lot of PC users here who are trying to be Mac users. If you want a powerhouse with an optical drive and user serviceable RAM and CPU, go PC. If you want a computer that's very capable for Video/Photo editing, and excellent for everyday use just go Mac! Unless the MacPro comes back, (by come back I mean updated of course..) I think we can agree Apple has switched gears.

Btw: What will you so called pro users do if the new MacPro is a glorified Mac mini?
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:38 AM   #100
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I'm convinced they made the display that way so eventually iMac and iPad will just be the same product line.

Also, someone needs to teach that kid in the video how to type.
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