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Old Nov 30, 2012, 04:49 PM   #1
andyx3x
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So I went to the Apple Store today to exchange my 16GB iPhone 5 for....

....a 32gb one. I had paid full price for the AT&T model to be able to unlock it for use on T-Mobile. Anyway the girl brings out one of the new unlocked iPhone 5's and I pay her the $106 difference and go on my way.

I go immediately to the T-Mobile store in the mall just to see if they have the new Nexus 4 in to play around with. They don't so I just stand around and talk to one of the sales reps for a little while.

I noticed the Apple employee who made the exchange for me running frantically past the T-Mobile store. She saw me, came in and said that I had not given her the 16gb iPhone 5 that I exchanged for the 32gb one. True enough, it was still in my pocket. I had given it to her when we first started the exchange but she had given it back to me to go into the back and I had just naturally put it back in my pocket and forgot about it. We completed the transaction and I was on my way with both phones. I then erased all my info on the phone and took the sim card and gave her the phone.

Just for curiosity, a buddy of mine asked me this afternoon what would have happened if I had left the mall and decided to keep the phone. I wouldn't have done this of course and would have returned the phone, but I'm curious myself. Could they have locked it up on their end? I'm not sure since they are not a carrier, just the manufacturer of the phone.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 04:56 PM   #2
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....a 32gb one. I had paid full price for the AT&T model to be able to unlock it for use on T-Mobile. Anyway the girl brings out one of the new unlocked iPhone 5's and I pay her the $106 difference and go on my way.

I go immediately to the T-Mobile store in the mall just to see if they have the new Nexus 4 in to play around with. They don't so I just stand around and talk to one of the sales reps for a little while.

I noticed the Apple employee who made the exchange for me running frantically past the T-Mobile store. She saw me, came in and said that I had not given her the 16gb iPhone 5 that I exchanged for the 32gb one. True enough, it was still in my pocket. I had given it to her when we first started the exchange but she had given it back to me to go into the back and I had just naturally put it back in my pocket and forgot about it. We completed the transaction and I was on my way with both phones. I then erased all my info on the phone and took the sim card and gave her the phone.

Just for curiosity, a buddy of mine asked me this afternoon what would have happened if I had left the mall and decided to keep the phone. I wouldn't have done this of course and would have returned the phone, but I'm curious myself. Could they have locked it up on their end? I'm not sure since they are not a carrier, just the manufacturer of the phone.
yes they have imei blacklist for stolen phones on ATT and i believe tmobile shares it now...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 05:13 PM   #3
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Assuming you paid with a credit card or they could have otherwise ID'd you, could have been charged with anything from misdemeanor larceny to obtaining property by false pretense(which is a felony). Whether you could use the phone or not would have been the least of your problems.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 05:50 PM   #4
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Assuming you paid with a credit card or they could have otherwise ID'd you, could have been charged with anything from misdemeanor larceny to obtaining property by false pretense(which is a felony). Whether you could use the phone or not would have been the least of your problems.
I love these kind of posts^
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 06:08 PM   #5
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Just for curiosity, a buddy of mine asked me this afternoon what would have happened if I had left the mall and decided to keep the phone.
You will be charged with the theft of a phone reported stolen from an Apple Store. You will be sentenced to 120 days in jail and 480 hours of community service for misdemeanor theft and probation violation, to which you will plead no contest. You will be ordered to remain under supervised probation until the completion of her community service. Due to jail overcrowding, you will serve the sentence under house arrest wearing a tracking ankle monitor for 35 days. You will violate the terms of your probation by failing to perform the required community service. You will be sentenced to 30 days of jail and 400 hours of community service. You will spend less than five hours in jail due to overcrowding. Your supervised probation will end after you completed the required community service and therapy. You will be on informal probation for the phone theft until May 2014, with the only requirement to follow the law.

You will appear in the January/February 2012 issue of men's magazine Playboy, in a shoot inspired by a nude pictorial of Marilyn Monroe from the first issue of the magazine. And you will star in the movie Liz and Dick.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 06:12 PM   #6
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You will be charged with the theft of a phone reported stolen from an Apple Store. You will be sentenced to 120 days in jail and 480 hours of community service for misdemeanor theft and probation violation, to which you will plead no contest. You will be ordered to remain under supervised probation until the completion of her community service. Due to jail overcrowding, you will serve the sentence under house arrest wearing a tracking ankle monitor for 35 days. You will violate the terms of your probation by failing to perform the required community service. You will be sentenced to 30 days of jail and 400 hours of community service. You will spend less than five hours in jail due to overcrowding. Your supervised probation will end after you completed the required community service and therapy. You will be on informal probation for the phone theft until May 2014, with the only requirement to follow the law.

You will appear in the January/February 2012 issue of men's magazine Playboy, in a shoot inspired by a nude pictorial of Marilyn Monroe from the first issue of the magazine. And you will star in the movie Liz and Dick.

Wat...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 06:18 PM   #7
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Wat...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 06:40 PM   #8
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the girl at the apple store must have been freaking out... she must have been thinking damn guy trying to pull a fast one on me...
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 06:56 PM   #9
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Assuming you paid with a credit card or they could have otherwise ID'd you, could have been charged with anything from misdemeanor larceny to obtaining property by false pretense(which is a felony).
Let's don't be dramatic here.

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the girl at the apple store must have been freaking out... she must have been thinking damn guy trying to pull a fast one on me...
She wasn't thinking that I was trying to pull one on her, but she was freaking out. She said she had run all around the food court and had just started to run around that end of the mall.

I had told her that I hated going to the malls during the Xmas season so she was sure that I had left immediately after leaving the Apple Store.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:19 PM   #10
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I'm sure if she couldn't find you they'd find a way to contact you, either through your apple ID which they probably have linked to the serial on the phone or whatever.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:37 PM   #11
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most likely if you left the mall, the missing phone would have been on the apple rep's shoulders. She would have been fired by the end of the day.

Depending on the purchase circumstances, you would have been charged for a non-contracted phone. Or your phone provider would have been charged.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 07:49 PM   #12
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She would of gotten fired I believe. It was her fault though for giving you the iPhone back and not asking for it. The cameras would of captured that. She could of said you took the phone or w/e but it would of still been her fault. However, they would of still gotten a hold on you, CC information or just cameras.

And you want to know how I know she would of gotten fired? She chased you down. Most retail stores prohibit employees to chase down or stop customers from stealing merchandise. When they are out the door, you're not supposed to do anything but file a police report.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 08:23 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boomhower View Post
Assuming you paid with a credit card or they could have otherwise ID'd you, could have been charged with anything from misdemeanor larceny to obtaining property by false pretense(which is a felony). Whether you could use the phone or not would have been the least of your problems.
No, he paid the difference for the new iPhone. The old one is on the employee. What if he put the old phone down on the counter and someone else picked it up? Basically they have no proof that he took it or that he took it willfully if he said he didn't know anything about it. Unless they have video of the entire event.

Years ago I bought a $1500 tool box and paid part in cash and part credit. The employee was very busy and we both forgot about the cash. They called me but were very nice about it and if I said that I did pay the $1000 cash there's nothing they could have done about it. I didn't of course. It was just an honest mistake. Unless they have specific obvious proof, there's nothing they can do.

Also they won't necessarily fire her as there is no definitive proof that she did anything purposefully wrong.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 10:29 PM   #14
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No, he paid the difference for the new iPhone. The old one is on the employee. What if he put the old phone down on the counter and someone else picked it up? Basically they have no proof that he took it or that he took it willfully if he said he didn't know anything about it. Unless they have video of the entire event.

Years ago I bought a $1500 tool box and paid part in cash and part credit. The employee was very busy and we both forgot about the cash. They called me but were very nice about it and if I said that I did pay the $1000 cash there's nothing they could have done about it. I didn't of course. It was just an honest mistake. Unless they have specific obvious proof, there's nothing they can do.

Also they won't necessarily fire her as there is no definitive proof that she did anything purposefully wrong.
You are correct, there has to be intent for there to be a crime. If he took the phone back once he discovered it there is no crime. If he kept the phone then their would be.

Can't do anything without specific proof? What?!?!? You certainly can in the USA. All it takes is a statement from the employee that you took the phone. That'll certainly be enough to get you charged and depend on the judge or jury whether you get convicted. You evidently haven't seen the inside of a court room much. I've seen folks who are guilty as can be let off and those that sure looked innocent without anymore proof than an obvious lier say they did it get convicted.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 10:57 PM   #15
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I'm glad she found you for her sake. I dunno if she would have gotten fired but still it looks bad on her. I mean look at previous posts saying apple would be able to track you down, block IMEI etc, but to even get to this process, the employee would have to admit to her supervisor she messed up and forgot to get the exchange unit. That wouldn't sound too great as an employee now would it? Hate for anyone to lose a job on an oversight.

I'm just glad she found you. I'm also going to believe you would have returned to the store when you realized you still had the phone in your pocket =)

Take care!
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 11:05 PM   #16
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the downside to all this is that go back not too many years, the store would ahve assumed it was an honest mistake. But now in this day in age, its assumed that you tried to rip them off from the get go. No more benefit of the doubt.
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 11:33 PM   #17
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the downside to all this is that go back not too many years, the store would ahve assumed it was an honest mistake. But now in this day in age, its assumed that you tried to rip them off from the get go. No more benefit of the doubt.
Because economy
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Old Nov 30, 2012, 11:38 PM   #18
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Because economy
I think it has more to do with people have lower moral standards now and assume that everyone else does too. Kind of like liars think everyone is a liar.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 09:51 AM   #19
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You are correct, there has to be intent for there to be a crime. If he took the phone back once he discovered it there is no crime. If he kept the phone then their would be.

Can't do anything without specific proof? What?!?!? You certainly can in the USA. All it takes is a statement from the employee that you took the phone. That'll certainly be enough to get you charged and depend on the judge or jury whether you get convicted. You evidently haven't seen the inside of a court room much. I've seen folks who are guilty as can be let off and those that sure looked innocent without anymore proof than an obvious lier say they did it get convicted.
I meant in my specific case. Once you leave the property of the retailer there's nothing they can do unless they have specific proof like video. An employees word is not good enough.

And you're wrong to assume that I haven't spent time in court rooms. I actually spent quite a bit of time in all different courtrooms from municipal to criminal to divorce and quite a few in between. It was part of my job.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:23 AM   #20
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An employees word is not good enough.
Actually it is. Whether a jury would convict or not would depend on how truthful they sound in court but it is certainly enough to get you there.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:28 AM   #21
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nobody here that isnt part of apple manegemnet would know. i doubt they would charge you for it its the reps responsibility . i think the store would of just taken the loss, its just ONE phone at their expense who would even send you the email, would the employee tell her boss ?
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 10:31 AM   #22
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You would go to jail, directly to jail, you wouln't pass go or collect $200.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:12 AM   #23
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I was actually in the Apple Store today buying the iPad mini and I talked to the girl who exchanged my iPhone 5.

She told me that there was nothing Apple could have done about it. They would have emailed me asking if I still had it but that they had no recourse to either try to get it back legally or to brick the phone for future use. She said "why do you think my manager had me scrambling to try and find you?"

I would have taken the phone back when I realized I still had it but less scrupulous people would be free and clear to do anything they wanted with it.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 11:36 AM   #24
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the downside to all this is that go back not too many years, the store would ahve assumed it was an honest mistake. But now in this day in age, its assumed that you tried to rip them off from the get go. No more benefit of the doubt.
Have you seen how many threads there are on here about people trying to defraud them for phones? On of the results of this that Apple tightens up CS and forgiveness and understanding decreases. Don't blame Apple for this, blame other consumers.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:40 PM   #25
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Actually it is. Whether a jury would convict or not would depend on how truthful they sound in court but it is certainly enough to get you there.
Are we talking about shoplifting? Because like I said earlier, once you leave the property there's nothing they can do. Unless they have video of you taking something from the store. Of course they also need your name and address but that's something else.

In New Jersey you cannot be arrested on an employee's word if there's nothing in your possession. We're not talking about rape or assault here. That's a different story but shoplifting is different. The items you are accused of taking have to be found in your possession (unless they have video).
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