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Old Dec 1, 2012, 02:25 PM   #1
Ticker
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Aperture 4

Any rumors aout Aperture 4 release? Tired of just updates to 3. I have become comfortable with Aperture and hate to learn the other "better" products. Have been waiting for a true upgrade. Heard Apple may not upgrade Aperture at all and may concentrate on iPhoto alone. Thats crazy since the graphics and digital media community always supported Apple while everyone was on the Windows bandwagon.
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Old Dec 2, 2012, 10:29 AM   #2
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What do you think "4" will be? It's just a version number.
Most of the wishes I see are for lens distortion correction and better noise reduction. Personally, I'm hoping for Apple to bring those to version 3.
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Old Dec 4, 2012, 02:34 PM   #3
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What features do you want? No offense, but one of my pet peeves is people saying "We need a new version/system/product!" without saying why. Is there a specific problem you want fixed, a certain feature you want that Aperture 3 doesn't have, or just a change for the sake of change?
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Old Dec 5, 2012, 02:10 AM   #4
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I'd be happy if Apple just fixed the crashing and the lack of true Flikr integration for updated albums. Yeah the initial album sharing is great, but add a photo to your album or project and the change does not go to Flikr unless you sync the entire album....which then creates a duplicate!!!

I know, amature needs but the crashing and syncing are annoying as heck.
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Old Dec 5, 2012, 03:51 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guzhogi View Post
What features do you want? No offense, but one of my pet peeves is people saying "We need a new version/system/product!" without saying why. Is there a specific problem you want fixed, a certain feature you want that Aperture 3 doesn't have, or just a change for the sake of change?
The image processing is the least important part.

The big thing is better integration with professional workflows.

There are exporters for various publishing tools, but we also need exporters for other destinations, including social media. (the current Facebook/Flickr integration is pretty horrible).

Normally a pro workflow would write a custom plugin for export, but guess what? The plugin API doesn't exist anymore in the developer site, and the previous export APIs don't even work in newer XCode!

There needs to be better metadata input and usability. I'd like to be able to catalog a whole series of fashion items based around price, color, style, etc..

I'd like to be able to publish a blog post directly from Aperture, for example, without having to go through the filesystem. This should be done in a custom export API plugin that connects directly to our own web CMS, the way it does for Getty/Flickr/etc..

Also right now the Aperture database can't be shared concurrently among multiple computers and users, which is bad in a newsroom with lots of photographers. How is an editor supposed to pick a photo among all the shots of the day, for example? Does every photographer have to edit his own photos and export them to the editor? Where does a retoucher/art director fit in the workflow? And so on..

Right now Aperture's workflow integration is in its infancy.
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Old Dec 5, 2012, 09:07 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by mozumder View Post
The image processing is the least important part.

The big thing is better integration with professional workflows.

There are exporters for various publishing tools, but we also need exporters for other destinations, including social media. (the current Facebook/Flickr integration is pretty horrible).

Normally a pro workflow would write a custom plugin for export, but guess what? The plugin API doesn't exist anymore in the developer site, and the previous export APIs don't even work in newer XCode!

There needs to be better metadata input and usability. I'd like to be able to catalog a whole series of fashion items based around price, color, style, etc..

I'd like to be able to publish a blog post directly from Aperture, for example, without having to go through the filesystem. This should be done in a custom export API plugin that connects directly to our own web CMS, the way it does for Getty/Flickr/etc..

Also right now the Aperture database can't be shared concurrently among multiple computers and users, which is bad in a newsroom with lots of photographers. How is an editor supposed to pick a photo among all the shots of the day, for example? Does every photographer have to edit his own photos and export them to the editor? Where does a retoucher/art director fit in the workflow? And so on..

Right now Aperture's workflow integration is in its infancy.
Okay, thanks for the info. It just bothers me when people say they want/need something new/different but specifically what or why. Maybe I'm a little OCD or something.
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Old Dec 7, 2012, 02:01 AM   #7
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I'm pretty happy with the way Aperture is now. A few more social media upload controls would be nice, but it's not that important to me.

My biggest fear is when then update to Aperture 4 I'll have to invest in all new and upgrade Plug-ins! They aren't bloody cheap!
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 06:15 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by whiteonline View Post
What do you think "4" will be? It's just a version number.
Most of the wishes I see are for lens distortion correction and better noise reduction. Personally, I'm hoping for Apple to bring those to version 3.
I'd like those too.
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Old Dec 15, 2012, 09:14 PM   #9
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The version number isn't significant, except for people pointing at Lightroom saying they're ahead in versions. What is important is adding things like the aforementioned lens correction and noise reduction. Other things in Lightroom 4 would be similarly desirable, like gradient filters / masks. Performance / resource usage are other areas that need work, and something that could warrant the v4 label.
The recent emphasis by Apple in their keynote and Macbook Pro ads on Aperture and emphasis as a Pro app gives me hope, along with the rumours of job ads for IOS developers for Aperture. Just as OSX was delayed when IOS was developed, Aperture 4 may be delayed by diverted resources to an iPad version of Aperture.
I choose to be patient and keep hope alive that major improvements are coming. Having given Lightroom 4 a good go and maintaining some projects on it still, I can say I just prefer Aperture given a choice; I enjoy it more, and feel more productive.
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Old Dec 16, 2012, 09:45 AM   #10
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My only complaints don't warrant a new version, only an update. The Flickr upload button should have a setting in Preferences. I have to change it from the default Set to Photostream every time I post a pic. The Crop tool is buggy too. I have to click and drag several times to get it to work. This should have been fixed eons ago.

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Old Dec 17, 2012, 01:14 PM   #11
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Rather than features I'm kinda concerned about speed and compatibility.

I don't think Apple would abandon Aperture, but I'm not sure. They're so opaque. It's easier to see the progression with LR. And then there's cost: both applications cost about the same over the same period of time. But Aperture would be a better deal if it gets upgraded and you don't have to buy a new version. Hard to say.

If they had an iPad version I'd be much more convinced of its continued viability.
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Old Dec 17, 2012, 03:57 PM   #12
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Rather than features I'm kinda concerned about speed and compatibility.

I don't think Apple would abandon Aperture, but I'm not sure. They're so opaque. It's easier to see the progression with LR. And then there's cost: both applications cost about the same over the same period of time. But Aperture would be a better deal if it gets upgraded and you don't have to buy a new version. Hard to say.

If they had an iPad version I'd be much more convinced of its continued viability.
Photo editing apps like Aperture, LightRoom and PhotoShop are all big screen apps. The more space the better. If any of them were to be released in iPad or any other tablet format, that would signal the end of continued viability.

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Old Dec 17, 2012, 06:11 PM   #13
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I would be very happy when Apple would upgrade the UI of Aperture.
I mean, that grey depressive UI Aperture has isn't very beautiful. Do you guys?
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 08:13 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guzhogi View Post
What features do you want? No offense, but one of my pet peeves is people saying "We need a new version/system/product!" without saying why. Is there a specific problem you want fixed, a certain feature you want that Aperture 3 doesn't have, or just a change for the sake of change?
-Real, meaningful support for raw formats on newer standards (Please, please, please add support for the X-Pro1/X-E1's X-Trans sensor as it has amazing RAW recovery)
-Like Adobe work with individual manufacturers to get solid 'out of the box' raw conversion
-Built-in support for correcting lens distortion (including automated pre-sets)
-Native HDR support (Really, Apple?)
-Panoramic "stitching" functions
-Provide more fine-tuned controls for "edge detection" brushes
-Better Noise Reduction (compared to every plugin on the market Aperture "scrubs" too hard)
-Film grain emulation (as a "prosumer" product, I'm pretty surprised this was never added)
-Additional post-processing functionality when exporting to the web (e.g add sharpening)
-Significantly decrease processing time (See LR4)
-Beef up highlight and shadow recovery (See LR4)
-Add "Clarity"-like filter (See LR4)
-Add meaningful video support (See LR4)
-Don't change workflow because IMHO, it's the only thing keeping me from jumping ship.

I could keep going but honestly, that's what I got off the cuff. We have nothing to show from Apple in the last two years in terms of significant upgrades. Aperture used to be the program that kept Adobe execs awake at night and was truly a disruptive piece of technology. LR4 in almost every way is now superior since Apple has left Aperture to languish.

In general, the majority of Aperture folks are looking for something that offers at least parity with LR4.3. I think that's all we can expect from Apple at this point. It's sad when the guy who has written THE BOOK on Aperture is looking to jump ship...

I'm not ready yet, but if I don't see anything from Apple in 2013 I am moving on with a heavy heart. The last three cameras I've had Apple never even added native RAW support for...

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Quote:
Originally Posted by TweakOnline View Post
I would be very happy when Apple would upgrade the UI of Aperture.
I mean, that grey depressive UI Aperture has isn't very beautiful. Do you guys?
It's neutral on purpose so that photographers can focus on making their photos beautiful.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 09:31 AM   #15
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Faces

As a great organizer Aperture already is, I would like Faces to be able to be grouped in categories and subcategories like "Family", "Friends", "Work", etc. ...of course each photo could belong to different categories.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 11:24 AM   #16
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I wish Apple had acquired NIK (instead of Google) and integrated their plugins into Aperture as core capabilities. Their dfine (noise reduction), viveza (selective control point editing), and silverfx (b&w) tools are better than anything else I've ever seen. Once you use Viveza, you realize the folly of applying an adjustment to the whole image. Rarely, if ever, is that a good way to adjust photos.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 12:04 PM   #17
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NO to lens correction!

I hope they don't waste their time on lens correction. That is probably the least useful post-processing tool, something no one will ever notice.

Aperture is a professional product. It's more important for Apple to integrate workflow improvements, especially for newsrooms/publishers.
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 12:24 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mozumder View Post
I hope they don't waste their time on lens correction. That is probably the least useful post-processing tool, something no one will ever notice.
Let me help you with that:

I hope they don't waste their time on lens correction. In my opinion, that is probably the least possible post-processing tool, something I have never needed.

Photography is a diverse field of work and certainly not everyone needs every check-mark ticked, but to pretend that everyone uses your kit to do the kind of photography you do, and using the same workflow you do misses how rich the field of prosumer/professional photography is.

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I wish Apple had acquired NIK (instead of Google) and integrated their plugins into Aperture as core capabilities. Their dfine (noise reduction), viveza (selective control point editing), and silverfx (b&w) tools are better than anything else I've ever seen. Once you use Viveza, you realize the folly of applying an adjustment to the whole image. Rarely, if ever, is that a good way to adjust photos.
Amen. I am as concerned about Aperture's uncertain future as I am with the Nik plugins I have come to rely on to fill the gaps in Aperture.

Last edited by Yujenisis; Dec 21, 2012 at 12:23 PM. Reason: Grammar
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 12:49 PM   #19
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Photo editing apps like Aperture, LightRoom and PhotoShop are all big screen apps. The more space the better. If any of them were to be released in iPad or any other tablet format, that would signal the end of continued viability.

Dale
Maybe not a replacement app, but a companion app would be awesome! Reviewing and rating on the road then sync back to Aperture for editing? That would be fantastic!
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 01:21 PM   #20
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I'm about done with Aperture, worked on some photos last week and with basic editing such as clone out a few specs and such, applied some white balance corrections and used Topaz in the mix Aperture decided not to save the work. Did everything possible to fix things and it again happened. I don't like the auto save, just give me the save function back, I'll do it myself and that just works, really simple, laughs. I also tried everything the same and not including the Topaz plug-in and the same thing happened, more so when zooming in and out this seems worse and Aperture quit half a dozen times. Things really started to slow down after 10-12 photos which were also jpeg, not RAW so not sure what that was all about. But the point it performance and it being stable for the most part.

I agree with VirtualRain about buying NIK, they buy way more companies that offer less (my opinion there). I also have become crabby with Apertures printing qualities, waiting for corrections to apply (my plug-ins are instant, not Aperture) and printing/layout/setup. I will wait until the holidays are over then dive into LR and see what it has to offer.

I could care less about better FB integration but that's just me, I don't hear, read many people asking PS to have this added so either do it right or dump it and move on.

Wants, layers could be added, create a small set of your own brushes and saving some custom settings that one uses the most. Sorry but if a program like SketchBookPro can have some of this and it is really affordable then there is a good possibility a photo organizational program can have a few of those things and do them very well without a huge cost increase. I know Aperture has some great features that you can apply if you use the WB, sharpen and so on all the time but a small custom selection would be great. If this can already be done then please correct me and show me the way so I can apply these
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Old Dec 21, 2012, 09:38 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Artful Dodger View Post
I'm about done with Aperture, worked on some photos last week and with basic editing such as clone out a few specs and such, applied some white balance corrections and used Topaz in the mix Aperture decided not to save the work. Did everything possible to fix things and it again happened. I don't like the auto save, just give me the save function back, I'll do it myself and that just works, really simple, laughs. I also tried everything the same and not including the Topaz plug-in and the same thing happened, more so when zooming in and out this seems worse and Aperture quit half a dozen times. Things really started to slow down after 10-12 photos which were also jpeg, not RAW so not sure what that was all about. But the point it performance and it being stable for the most part.
Sorry to hear. Aperture saves every adjustment you make, the moment you make them, so I don't know what exactly went wrong, but if this is a widespread issue then it's certainly a big problem.
And yes Aperture's managed library tends to lag a lot, but a referenced library can clean up those jams pretty well. It also sounds as if the Aperture installation is corrupted in itself, which may explain a lot of the errors you're getting.

I jumped ship to Lightroom and the RAW processing is so much better, with distortion correction and noise reduction built in. The only gripe is that for it to generate the same quality preview as Aperture, it takes around 4x the time.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 12:36 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by msandersen View Post
The version number isn't significant, except for people pointing at Lightroom saying they're ahead in versions. What is important is adding things like the aforementioned lens correction and noise reduction. Other things in Lightroom 4 would be similarly desirable, like gradient filters / masks. Performance / resource usage are other areas that need work, and something that could warrant the v4 label.
The recent emphasis by Apple in their keynote and Macbook Pro ads on Aperture and emphasis as a Pro app gives me hope, along with the rumours of job ads for IOS developers for Aperture. Just as OSX was delayed when IOS was developed, Aperture 4 may be delayed by diverted resources to an iPad version of Aperture.
I choose to be patient and keep hope alive that major improvements are coming. Having given Lightroom 4 a good go and maintaining some projects on it still, I can say I just prefer Aperture given a choice; I enjoy it more, and feel more productive.
Why are people comparing Apeture to Lightroom? If you think it's better, use it. Apeture doesn't have to keep up with anyone. It's a good program. Yes, it need better integration with Flickr. Smugmug would be nice too but Facebook? Other social sites? I don't see Apeture as a program for the casual editor. iPhoto is that. Apeture is, IMHO, an intermediate program between iPhoto and CS.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 12:37 AM   #23
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Why are people comparing Apeture to Lightroom? If you think it's better, use it. Apeture doesn't have to keep up with anyone. It's a good program. Yes, it need better integration with Flickr. Smugmug would be nice too but Facebook? Other social sites? I don't see Apeture as a program for the casual editor. iPhoto is that. Apeture is, IMHO, an intermediate program between iPhoto and CS.
In fact Aperture does have to keep up with its processing engine, which is at the moment rudimentary when compared to others.
Remember, it's not the features that matter, it's the final image which counts.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 12:40 AM   #24
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Why are people comparing Apeture to Lightroom? If you think it's better, use it. Apeture doesn't have to keep up with anyone. It's a good program.
Yes, it's a good program, but it's falling behind and will be obsolete and irrelevant if Apple doesn't do something to keep it tracking with state of the art tools. If you like it, you should wish it to improve too.
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Old Dec 23, 2012, 08:15 AM   #25
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People have stated what they feel is lacking in Aperture. Have you told Apple by giving them feedback? Telling Apple what you would like to see doesn't guarantee it will happen, but it does give them something to think about, especially if a lot of people are asking for the same feature(s).
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