Apple 'Hard at Work' on Next Version of Logic Pro

[dysamoria]

Originally Posted by NOV

Hmm, there is a "Compare" button which goes back to the previous setting. Working over 18 yrs with Logic, it never bothered me in any way.

That's not a multiple step undo. It's a workaround for the lack of an integrated undo system in plugins.

[fredoviola]

Originally Posted by davidec

Kids aren't growing up with Logic or Tools anymore, they're using Live and controllers. If has any connection to the current music production market they will fully exploit the pitching / flexing / variable time stretching tools they introduced in L9. They need an Ableton Live' killer just like Logic 7 was the start of the 'Pro Tools' killer.
Please don't be too GarageBand and please don't be to acoustic / American oriented.

Live is great for dj work. Not so much for composition work/sound design. It's ridiculous to assume that all the new composers and producers work this way. I've tried twice to get into Ableton Live and really just hate it. I have a lot of friends who agree with me, and most the film composers I know are either Logic Pro, Pro Tools or Cubase users.

WTF does "don't be to acoustic / American oriented" mean?

[Macist]

I love Logic. There work done up to and including Logic 9 was for the most part stellar. The program's a joy to use - easy on the surface but full of as much depth as you need. The built-in plugins are brilliant. Few compressors sound as good as the standard tools in Logic.

If Apple want to 'dump' Logic there sure as hell had better sell it off rather than simply kill it.

[fredoviola]

Originally Posted by Macist

I love Logic. There work done up to and including Logic 9 was for the most part stellar. The program's a joy to use - easy on the surface but full of as much depth as you need. The built-in plugins are brilliant. Few compressors sound as good as the standard tools in Logic.

If Apple want to 'dump' Logic there sure as hell had better sell it off rather than simply kill it.

They are NOT dumping it. I'm quite confident of that, based on contact with three people working in high places in the Logic team. They are as committed as ever.

[realtwang]

I can confirm that this doesn't happen with a 15" rMBP running 10.8.2 and latest L9.

I moved several channel EQs with anylizer on to my external monitor as well.

I feel for those with the problem!

Yeah, mine's non-retina. Gotta be the difference in the graphics cards.

[Macist]

Originally Posted by davidec

Kids aren't growing up with Logic or Tools anymore, they're using Live and controllers. If has any connection to the current music production market they will fully exploit the pitching / flexing / variable time stretching tools they introduced in L9. They need an Ableton Live' killer just like Logic 7 was the start of the 'Pro Tools' killer.
Please don't be too GarageBand and please don't be to acoustic / American oriented.

Since MIDI sequencers which, let's face it, were probably used for the most part by electronica artists and processed pop acts, evolved into audio-capabile DAWs musicians of all genres now use high technology to make and record their music.

Live is primarily a DJ/electronica/live mixing tool. If kids are into that stuff and wanna be deadham5ter or Shrillex then cool. For everything else, Logic and Protools (and some people use Logic as a Protools front end) are industry standard across all types of music production. Steinberg's lineup and Digital performer have their fans too but they are nowhere near as widely used at the higher end as the big two.

[The Wedge]

Originally Posted by Rufuss Sewell

I paid $1000 for L7 in 2005. I'd be more than happy to pay the full $200 for LX.

As for lag, this happened to me in like 2008. Have you trashed prefs and reinstalled from scratch? Fix permissions?

Maybe try turning off/on punch on the fly? It happened to me once and it was a simple fix. Can't remember now though.

----------

I love the look and feel of FCPX. I really hope LPX gets a similar treatment.

I will try your suggestions. This is my first mac and I'm still a little weary of reinstalling and stuff. Afraid I'll lose something in the process.

I also like FCPX and hope LPX moves in the same direction. Logic is not very logical in many cases. Too many dropdown menus etc. And everything is so damn small.

[xgman]

Originally Posted by fredoviola

They are NOT dumping it. I'm quite confident of that, based on contact with three people working in high places in the Logic team. They are as committed as ever.

To when though?

[milo]

Originally Posted by LordJohnWhorfin

Last time they were "hard at work" for a long time we ended up with the Final Cut Pro X debacle... Let's hope things turn out a little better this time.

People always make this comparison, but it just doesn't apply. The biggest issue with FCP was that the code was old and when they tried to update it to 64 bit they just couldn't do it. Instead they ended up dumping the whole app and creating a brand new one from scratch.

Logic is an entirely different situation, it has been 64 bit for a couple years. And they've continued to make updates to 9.1.x. If they were going to dump everything and start from scratch, we would have seen 9.x updates stop, if they're still making improvements it likely means that 10 is an update to the 9 codebase - fixes to 9 probably fix the same bugs in 10.

Originally Posted by marmotmammal

LP9 is 64-bit, has offline bounce, and is cheap. That's three points Pro Tools doesn't have. Who's working hard?

Plus for $199 it includes surround mixing...with PT that's $2000 extra. Yes, that's the right number of zeroes, on top of $699 for PT itself, it's two thousand dollars more for the missing features like surround.

Originally Posted by DitteVilladsen

Notice how Soren didn't actually deny the allegations, which were very specific:

(1) There are only two pro application specialists in Europe.

(2) Apple is not hiring someone to fill a recently vacanted pro applications job.

(3) The remaining people are working mostly on an iPad application, not an OS X application.

The info you missed is that the "pro application specialists" are sales people, not programmers. There hasn't been any info saying that a single programmer has left or been let go.

Originally Posted by realtwang

I can reproduce it very consistently. Here are the steps...

I can't reproduce it here. What makes it hard for Apple to fix is that not everyone has the problem, and it can be very hard to reproduce. My guess is that it may involve third party drivers or plugins interacting with Logic and 10.8. Definitely get in touch with Apple and send them as much info as they can so they can hopefully reproduce the problem you're having.

Originally Posted by thestickman

You hear what my ears hear? When you do lemme know. 0's & 1's don't hear at all do they?

Actually, you're not hearing what you think you're hearing. Audio is notorious for having a major placebo effect. Many many tests have been done comparing various DAWs, and from a playback and mixing standpoint they all sound the same (obviously different plugins are all going to sound different).

Originally Posted by mr666

Why should they have to look at two different places to buy Apple's software?

They don't. The MAS is the way to get it, they're probably still selling the boxed version because they have copies still sitting around.

[milo]

Originally Posted by Poisednoise

Google is not a dictionary. Try the OED.

OK. From the OED, one of a number of definitions:

To destroy or remove a large proportion of; to subject to severe loss, slaughter, or mortality.

Hint: before asking someone to reference something to see that they're wrong, you might want to reference it yourself to see that you're wrong and save yourself looking foolish.

[LogicRumours]

Originally Posted by milo

They don't. The MAS is the way to get it, they're probably still selling the boxed version because they have copies still sitting around.

And possibly some studios have their DAW not on the net still. Although I wouldn't see that as a major problem on a mac...could get distracting reading the forums though..

[Charlesccps]

I've been using Logic since the Emagic days. Sadly, I've switched to Ableton Live as my host program for everything; composition, recording, performance, mastering, post. Why? Without giving details.
1. Apple has completely neglected "The Environment". Very sad because "The Environment" has so much creative potential.
2. Ableton has Max for Live.
3. Logic and Logic drivers do not play well with other programs.
4. Logic is not designed for live performance or spontaneous creation. Main Stage is high maintenance and sluggish. I suppose it works adequately if I'm simply using it as a hub for a controller to make program or patch changes and octave assignments. My primary DAW needs to be able to be played like an instrument; spontaneous and responsive. The days of sitting behind a big desk surrounded by ponderous gear are gone. Yet Logic looks and feels old school. Limited to linear layouts and consoles. Where's the innovation?
5. MIDI routing, AU implementation in Logic is dated, time consuming and requires work-arounds to accomplish the most basic tasks when using 3rd party plug-ins.
6. No Apple iPad controller app for Logic . Really Apple? Sure I could put something together in TouchOSC but why bother.
7. After the Final Cut mess combined with no word from Apple regarding Logic development I jumped ship. That's what happens when you keep your clients/customers in the dark and don't develop your services/product.

I've been a die hard Apple user for decades and a full time musician for over 40 years. It's very disappointing to see Apple ignoring development on their professional products and consequently turning their backs on the creative professionals that have supported them over the years. If and when Apple comes out with Logic X I will likely give it a chance but I can't really imagine they are going to come up with anything that will surpass my current workstations. But MAYBE Apple has been rewriting Logic from the ground up for the last three years. Getting rid of all the old code and coming up with an exciting, innovative interface and work flow that suits modern working musicians and production houses!

[milo]

Originally Posted by Digidesign

Cubase 7 releases on December 5th.
http://www.steinberg.net/en/products...whats_new.html

hard to see how Logic X will top it.

The same way they'd top any other piece of software, release something that's better.

It's funny to see Logic guys talking about how huge the Cubase 7 release is when the reaction from many Cubase users seems to be that it doesn't offer enough to justify a paid upgrade ($149 from 6.5, going up $50 for each version back), and that they're going to skip it and wait for 7.5 or 8.

The grass is always greener.

[davidec]

Originally Posted by fredoviola

Live is great for dj work. Not so much for composition work/sound design. It's ridiculous to assume that all the new composers and producers work this way. I've tried twice to get into Ableton Live and really just hate it. I have a lot of friends who agree with me, and most the film composers I know are either Logic Pro, Pro Tools or Cubase users.

WTF does "don't be to acoustic / American oriented" mean?

Film composers make up a tiny minority of DAW purchases. They alone cannot sustain this type of platform. Emagic's notator was popular because it appealed to the youth with its midi implementation and block sequencing structure in exactly the same way Live appeals with its similar sequencing style and midi controller implementation. The youth are flocking to it in droves and it will only be a matter of time before it sorts out its cumbersome midi programming.

For Logic to survive it needs to do a lot more that sell for peanuts. It needs to have accessible and versatile time pitching and stretching tools within the regions itself. It needs to focus less on superfluous features like 'Drum Replacement' and skuemorphism and more on audio manipulation - hence my acoustic / American analogy.

[fredoviola]

Originally Posted by davidec

Film composers make up a tiny minority of DAW purchases. They alone cannot sustain this type of platform. Emagic's notator was popular because it appealed to the youth with its midi implementation and block sequencing structure in exactly the same way Live appeals with its similar sequencing style and midi controller implementation. The youth are flocking to it in droves and it will only be a matter of time before it sorts out its cumbersome midi programming.

For Logic to survive it needs to do a lot more that sell for peanuts. It needs to have accessible and versatile time pitching and stretching tools within the regions itself. It needs to focus less on superfluous features like 'Drum Replacement' and skuemorphism and more on audio manipulation - hence my acoustic / American analogy.

I could care less about what "the youth" flock to. And I think too much consideration is already put on their interests (thus the constant attention to new iPads/iPhones, etc...) Anyway, I still don't get your "acoustic / American" comment. That just seems like a snarky insult aimed at Americans, no?

[LogicRumours]

Originally Posted by davidec

For Logic to survive it needs to do a lot more that sell for peanuts. It needs to have accessible and versatile time pitching and stretching tools within the regions itself. It needs to focus less on superfluous features like 'Drum Replacement' and skuemorphism and more on audio manipulation - hence my acoustic / American analogy.

With the patents that are being filed recently, we'll be getting all that flexing / in built Melodyne flexibility (get the joke?) in the Logic X.

Not sure Final Cut X has any skeuomorphic features which is a strong indicator for Logic.. That stuff is reserved for Garageband

[djarpit]

I absolutely hate using ultrabeat. They need to replace it or add a single drag and drop sampler like battery.

[Rufuss Sewell]

Originally Posted by The Wedge

I will try your suggestions. This is my first mac and I'm still a little weary of reinstalling and stuff. Afraid I'll lose something in the process.

I also like FCPX and hope LPX moves in the same direction. Logic is not very logical in many cases. Too many dropdown menus etc. And everything is so damn small.

Btw, would this by chance be Wedge the tour manager etc?

[milo]

Originally Posted by LogicRumours

With the patents that are being filed recently, we'll be getting all that flexing / in built Melodyne flexibility (get the joke?) in the Logic X.

The polyphonic pitch shift patent was filed in 2010. Melodyne already has that functionality so it's probably not a valid patent, and I wouldn't make any assumptions about what Apple is doing based on their filings, they file anything they can think of, regardless of whether they end up using it or not.

[LogicRumours]

Originally Posted by milo

The polyphonic pitch shift patent was filed in 2010. Melodyne already has that functionality so it's probably not a valid patent, and I wouldn't make any assumptions about what Apple is doing based on their filings, they file anything they can think of, regardless of whether they end up using it or not.

It's the next step after flex. Besides, other sequencers have this function. We'd be more shocked if Apple didn't have a built in melodyne editor of sort than not

[milo]

There's definitely a good chance we see more pitch options in the next version. But if we do see it, it will likely be totally unrelated to that (probably invalid) patent.

[marcar7]

The best MIDI Patch manager ever. A lot of people is demanding to return SoundDiver to Logic again....pleeease

[marcar7]

If u want to request that Apple integrate SoundDiver again, there were a petition page for this: http://www.petitiononline.com/soundDVR/

[milo]

SD ain't gonna happen. It's obvious that Apple and Logic see outboard synths as a thing of the past, and they've been doing as little as possible to support them. Heck, Logic doesn't even support the patchlist standard that's built into OSX.

[marcar7]

I only would like if they could integrate it into Logic with the Autoload functionality, maintaining it as an alpha or beta software unsupported or without maintenance by apple. Many, many people still use it and they could take some profit, as new hardware enterprises. It is a matter of respect to all those people who all these years have been working with this software. They cannot pretend that everybody sells his midi gear, and it will not happen in many years.
(sorry for my english )