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Old Dec 6, 2012, 03:27 PM   #101
Nunyabinez
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But seriously, BTO Macs have been assembled in the US for a while and I haven't heard of any BTOgate, so I would assume that the quality is no different than China.

On the other hand, I don't expect to see iPhone plants here any time soon. Macs are one thing, iPhones and iPads are completely different in terms of manufacturing issues.

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Originally Posted by Thunderhawks View Post
Wish there was an honest assessment of who will get this labor (for that matter even want it)

Most min wage jobs are done by the hispanics and they are good at it.

I don't see many jobs for Americans coming, nor do they want them!

As for education, check reality again. The amount of American students in Math, Sciences etc. is not at a desirable level.

All in all just lip service by FoxConn and Apple to calm down critics.

Make the 500 pcs. of MacPros and be done.
Hispanic and American are not mutually exclusive. Jobs for legal hispanics ARE jobs for Americans.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 04:25 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by HMI View Post
I'm sad it's through Foxconn and not directly for apple.
I want more American companies actually making things here directly, not hiring some other country to build another building here.
It's called specialization... if you want a simpler example, people don't build their furniture, farm, or even cook all of their meals. Sometimes it's easier and cheaper just to buy the service from someone else (who is specialized to do it).

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Originally Posted by drorpheus View Post
You mean the non existent quality control they operate under now? I'd rather have a 20-30 yr old American making something rather than a 13 yr old chineese kid that lives in an onsite dorm, thats called a camp.

Child labour is illegal in China... Ironically, the minimum working age in China is 16 and the minimum age in the US is 14...
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 04:27 PM   #103
Tech198
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lol...

Trying to get over the who "low production" vs "high production" in Chine/USA respectively, just like Intel manufactures its own motherboards now, so they can ship them both as one, rather than waiting for a given manufacture/issues arising, this would also be good or Apple too.

This was Apple, and Foxconn working side-by-side would be able to launch products like never before, no-delays (or very few), and increase production.

This would be a good idea.

Then again, it would look wired, since everything we buy nowadays is made in China, or some other country.... How much is made in the USA ?
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 04:40 PM   #104
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Originally Posted by Bruce Oksol View Post
will set up production in a right-to-work state?
It's a pretty safe bet. It'd be a suicide mission for a company as high profile as Apple or Foxconn to set up any kind of substantial manufacturing facility outside of a right to work state.

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Originally Posted by SoApple View Post
Foxconn employs work around the clock. 24hrs a day 7 days a week. By American standards im not sure its right and I doubt that americans would like to work those kind of shifts.
Sure it may bring jobs and who knows, it might create a boom in the american economy but are we prepared for that?
Prices are probably go up and production rate my go down.
Americans have worked various shifts at manufacturing and distribution facilities for as long as these businesses have been in operation. Most of these kinds of facilities are open 24/7, it's nothing new. People get hired for a particular shift and work those hours.

Really, I'm explaining the concept of shift work to someone? What are you 12 years old?
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 04:54 PM   #105
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Originally Posted by Tayobi View Post
Union bosses must be drooling over the prospect of Apple setting up factories in U.S.
False. A. Apple has a directive left by Steve Jobs to choose right to work states. B. A Chinese manufacturer would never allow unionization. Foxconn is still in charge of manufacturing. It's proven that Japanese and Chinese factories that operate in the US have workers that are both non union and happy. Unions are things of the past...less than 10 percent membership in the US now and has declined every year for the past two decades.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 05:09 PM   #106
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"Clumsy Sausage Fingers"

http://www.theonion.com/articles/app...s-in-us,30633/
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 05:36 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by ctdonath View Post
Question remains: where are the current "Made in USA" iMacs being made?
USA
Some are made in the US, just not all. My 2008 Mac Pro is a US-made computer.

I'm glad they're shifting to USA production not because I'm some kind of anti-global market person but because Chinese labor is virtual slavery. It's stupid how American labor laws and taxes can be sidestepped so easily by hiring in a different country. Hopefully, USA politicians will lower corporate taxes to encourage USA production instead of scaring everyone away to China.

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Originally Posted by Bruce Oksol View Post
will set up production in a right-to-work state?
Right-to-work is such a win! Anything that angers unions is typically great. Any cut-the-BS politician is always opposed by unions. I'm not saying that unions have no purpose, but they do plenty of harm.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 05:52 PM   #108
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I think this is an interesting development. If you think about it, it makes sense for Apple to dip it's toe into the water of American manufacturing again. As Chinese currency appreciates, and the American dollar continues it's fall, American manufacturing may indeed be a value-based proposition.

It must be difficult for them to plan labor costs when labor costs rise 18% per year in a country where the currency continues to appreciate.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 06:56 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by G4DP View Post
You're hoping in vain. The prices will go through the roof, unless Apple are prepared to take a massive hit on the profits they make. Something I doubt.
Actually, previous studies have shown that for the 27" iMac, production cost would only go up about $15, and for iPhones and iPods and such, they would only go up about $5. I'm sure that Apple could foot the extra bill considering the profit margins they have.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 07:31 PM   #110
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Unions won't have to come in if the company treats it's people well.

Most workers don't want the hassle of dealing with union rules and fees. However if the employer treats it's people unfairly, then a good, strong union may be needed to secure bargaining rights for workers. Individual workers can't deal with the powerful, wealthy people at the top of corrupt businesses.
Best statement of the day.






Too bad the product that will be made here will be such a small percentage of the total. This is a token move. A publicity move. To be added to the the list of companies like caterpillar, dow and GE that are moving production back to the USA.

One model of mac computer. Big Woop de do. All of the mac computers models combined is only 15% of apple's total. So how much will one model be?

Either way, i'll buy the made in the usa one over any other. I try to do that for anything I have the option to do it with. I am waiting anxiously for my new Made in the USA TV. Hope I get it for Christmas.

Last edited by MuddyPaws1; Dec 6, 2012 at 07:37 PM.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 07:40 PM   #111
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Originally Posted by faroZ06 View Post
Right-to-work is such a win! Anything that angers unions is typically great. Any cut-the-BS politician is always opposed by unions. I'm not saying that unions have no purpose, but they do plenty of harm.
Yeah so don't whine when you can't work more than 30 hrs per week, get no pension, no benefits, no insurance, no wage increase. Sounds like a total win if your into getting sharted on.


Can't wait for the Foxxconn Aerospace division to take off.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 08:00 PM   #112
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The good news: Apple's opening new factories in America to assemble their products.

The bad news: It will be 99% robotic, with one guy being paid minimum wage to turn the lights on and off.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 08:40 PM   #113
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Higher priced US made products are of better quality and longer lasting. Go to Home Depot and compare the US made screwdrivers with imports. Then, go to Kohls and check out US made boot socks vs the cheap imports. Lastly, order some US made floor mats for your car and see how exact the fit is.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 09:24 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by jdbr View Post
Well I hope the quality is up to scratch. US assembled products don't often have a good reputation. Remember all those dodgy cars!
I've been in a Dodge. It was pretty dodgy.

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Originally Posted by drorpheus View Post
Yeah so don't whine when you can't work more than 30 hrs per week, get no pension, no benefits, no insurance, no wage increase. Sounds like a total win if your into getting sharted on.
Still better than having to move to China to get a factory job if you want one.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 09:26 PM   #115
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Is Foxconn going to bring their workers with them? Then I can see this actually working.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 09:27 PM   #116
faroZ06
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thunderhawks View Post
Wish there was an honest assessment of who will get this labor (for that matter even want it)

Most min wage jobs are done by the hispanics and they are good at it.

I don't see many jobs for Americans coming, nor do they want them!

As for education, check reality again. The amount of American students in Math, Sciences etc. is not at a desirable level.

All in all just lip service by FoxConn and Apple to calm down critics.

Make the 500 pcs. of MacPros and be done.
So mostly illegal immigrant Hispanics would take factory jobs for Apple? I find this hard to believe.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 10:18 PM   #117
Thunderbird
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Jobs!
Steve?
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 10:20 PM   #118
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Originally Posted by Technarchy View Post
I'm surprised Apple hasn't moved toward greater automation for the iPhone and iPad production as is.
Probably strictly economic reasons. Robotics are super-accurate, but also very expensive, and with a population of 1.35 billon, China's labor pool is vast, and at rates of ~$2/hr (with no unions), it's been a no-brainer in the past.
But now with increased scrutiny and added pressure to help our domestic labor market, 'Proudly' made in the USA, will hopefully be seen on more and more of the next generation of not just APPLE's, but all products.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 10:35 PM   #119
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anybody else getting tired of the same Foxconn picture in these posts?
Not me, she's cute.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 10:37 PM   #120
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Originally Posted by coolspot18 View Post
Child labour is illegal in China... Ironically, the minimum working age in China is 16 and the minimum age in the US is 14...

LOL

You really think there aren't kids much younger than 16 working in factories in China? Misguided you are.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 11:16 PM   #121
pertusis1
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Originally Posted by senseless View Post
Higher priced US made products are of better quality and longer lasting. Go to Home Depot and compare the US made screwdrivers with imports. Then, go to Kohls and check out US made boot socks vs the cheap imports. Lastly, order some US made floor mats for your car and see how exact the fit is.
No kidding, man. Since when have tools become a consumable commodity? You buy a set of pliars these days, made in China, and you can expect the hinge to be clunky, the handle made of crappy plastic, and the components to rust within 2 years unless kept in a desiccator. Get a cheap screwdriver and your screws will constantly be stripping your screwdriver.

I bought a set of Klein (made in the U.S.A.) wire cutters/pliars last year, and they're just a beautiful thing to use. I paid an extra $8 or something for the pliars, but they'll probably be sharp and smooth for my son when he grows up. It just seems like you're less likely to get a piece of reverse-engineered garbage when you buy it made in America, although there are entire product categories that are simply NOT built in the U.S. anymore.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 11:27 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by MuddyPaws1 View Post
LOL

You really think there aren't kids much younger than 16 working in factories in China? Misguided you are.
No more than any other illegal activity in any other country.

The Chinese government takes child labor laws very seriously.

You are misinformed if you believe otherwise.

Sent from my iPad, from Suzhou, China
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 11:44 PM   #123
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I'd agree that initial pay is higher but the agency to move up the rung is easier in fast food than a production line.
That may be true up to assistant or store manager levels, but you've generally got *farther* to go before you hit that ceiling in manufacturing companies. They have a lot more employees in one location, they've got a lot more managerial positions to fill. They also have a lot more non-managerial, technical positions to fill, with a wider variety of responsibilities.

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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
With Samsung also moving some production into the US, this is good news all around, and much needed for the US economy.

Contrary to popular belief, the wage difference does not amount to much as far as the product price goes. The % of a product's cost which is related to wages for manufacturing employees is so small as to not matter whether the guy makes 1$ or 30$ an hour, it's a difference of a few pennies to a dollar to cost.

Something Apple can very well afford with their current margins.
Yep. It's the added infrastructure costs, not the higher wages, that sent most of those electronics manufacturing jobs out of the US. I'm hoping that this move leads to (or happens along with) more companies doing the same. Maybe companies are finally realizing that shipping all the jobs over seas to save a few bucks means they have fewer people in their target markets capable of affording the goods they manufacture.

It may take a couple days for an iPhone to go from a 'pile of parts' to a completed, functioning unit, but most of that 'build time' is spent waiting (for paints to dry, or adhesives to cure, or the like), not actually being handled for assembly.
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Old Dec 6, 2012, 11:46 PM   #124
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Unions won't have to come in if the company treats it's people well.

Most workers don't want the hassle of dealing with union rules and fees. However if the employer treats it's people unfairly, then a good, strong union may be needed to secure bargaining rights for workers. Individual workers can't deal with the powerful, wealthy people at the top of corrupt businesses.
The dialog above is over 60 years old. That's how it used to work, but no longer.

Union employees are merely pawns under the thumb of the union. Dues paid to fatten the union bosses wallets.

Oh sure, millions actually believe this warm & fuzzy story because they want to. They like the idea of being taken care of by someone else. They actually believe the union is working for them. Sadly through no fault of their own (other than complacency) they just don't know any better.

The all powerful Unions grease the skids of politicians high up in Washington to achieve their hidden agendas. It's all a game, carefully cloaked in the same old fish wrapper.
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Old Dec 7, 2012, 12:38 AM   #125
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You really think there aren't kids much younger than 16 working in factories in China? Misguided you are.
No, just saying that is what's on the books - it's ironic the United States has a lot of loop holes in it's own child labour laws...i.e. kids as young as 12 years old work 10+ hours a day on farms:

http://www.hrw.org/support-care
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