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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:23 PM   #126
Thunderhawks
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Originally Posted by ChrisA View Post
Maybe Apple is planning to build the new "Apple TV Set" in the US. They could build then here if they used enough automation, robots and so on.

Or it might be some low-volume Mac.

I'm betting it will be a new product of some kind that sells in low volume.

One more guess. They always have done their refurbishing here in the US. Perhaps they will combine assembly andrefurbs in the same place?
Just ordered a refurb iPad, which was shipped from China, so much for that refurb in USA theory.

All the components are over there, why would one set up a facility here?
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:25 PM   #127
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While its easy to assume that wherever you are located -- your local economy may seem still way off a cliff. Some education - here in Los Angeles -- construction of new buildings, new businesses, new infrastructure projects, home sales etc ARE THROUGH THE ROOF.

Case in point - home sales : Areas east of Los Angeles -- homes for sale currently have 30 sometimes 40 buyers submitting offers ThE SAME DAY or a day or two later after being listed on the market. And yeah - generally the homes are closing $10,20,30 grand over asking.

After a five year lull things HERE are heating up. Companies like Google are hiring here, tons of new start ups, Apple is rumored to be planning offices here.

Industries here are way healthier. The film industry is thriving again - theme parks here showed record attendance - while I'm not professing it's all bliss right now for all, at least in this market -- it's clear the downturn has now begun an upturn.

Seriously the area in the workforce that will experience huge growth is healthcare. Technology will clearly benefit from the potentially 30/40 million new people who might come into that system once Obamacare takes its effect.

Apple itself has hired a ********* of people here in Cali - just in the last year, I'm sure Google, Facebook etc have all done the same. We r in the midst of a paradigm shift in the workforce. It's this generations technological revolution
Nope. Most jobs of the last 40 years already went to the service sector looking for jobs but even those jobs become obsolete when automation takes it over.

Its one crash after the other. Don't believe the hype that this economy will survive.

Obama healthcare?
Do you know how Obama has spent YOUR money?

Since January 1, 2012 the U.S government alone has spent. $50,842,731,716 of taxpayer money, on the War on Drugs".

Since 2001 the U.S government alone has spent. $1,401,006,986,551 of taxpayer money, on the War on Terror". (this includes Bush but if you check the lists you'll see Bush is nothing compared to Obama.)

Tell me how much he cares about the health of the American people?

Have you ever heard a president tell the truth when its country is going down? Think about, question everything. Politics is lying in your face with BS (Bad Science) and since people don't check things the politicians get away with it.

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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:36 PM   #128
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200 more than Obama has created!!

200 more than Obama has created!!
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:42 PM   #129
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Agreed.

Apple isn't even going to run the facility, it's going to be Foxconn.
We don't KNOW that. Folks are assuming such because of current relationships. But until the two parties announce details it isn't fact.

But you are correct that Foxconn's expansion won't be just about Apple. IF this is what Tim is referring to, it will be a fraction of the game. As a fraction yes it could be a low volume item for Apple and who knows what else for the other clients.

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Originally Posted by swingerofbirch View Post
Both Steve Jobs and Tim Cook have stated that the reason manufacturing isn't done in the US is that we don't teach the skills in our schools anymore that are needed for these jobs. I've even heard them say that the education system would need to be reformed to bring manufacturing jobs to the US.
We have few trade schools and way too much push to get all kids to finish high school and not only go to college but do it the very next fall. Rather than letting kids that don't want to go to college go to a training program to learn these type of skills.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:45 PM   #130
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The components are still going to be made in china (with the exception of things such as the chip & glass, which we knew were US parts for some time now), no matter where the final assembly point is. You aren't really going to see a quality increase in this, rather, just the same Macs you've already been seeing, if that is what some of you were hoping for.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:47 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by Thunderhawks View Post
All the components are over there, why would one set up a facility here?
Given how much flack Apple has gotten for using Foxconn (with little attention paid to Sony, Toshiba, Dell, Panasonic, HP, etc, etc).....PR.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:49 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by Thunderhawks View Post
Just ordered a refurb iPad, which was shipped from China, so much for that refurb in USA theory.

All the components are over there, why would one set up a facility here?
Because it would reduce the growing complaints that an American company should have "some" manufacturing jobs in America.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 01:51 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by appleguy123 View Post
Look at it for what it is. A cost effective PR campaign. During the election season, Apple got a lot of bad press for manufacturing in China. This is a good argument against that because now Apple will be able to say that they created manufacturing jobs in the US and it will get them good media coverage.
Nailed it! While I agree 200 is better than none at the end of the day it's still a Chinese company (Foxcon) and most of the money is still sent back to China.

And here I am typing this on my iPhone and my MacBook Air is sitting next to me.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:07 PM   #134
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Project SAND all over again?

Jobs had the idea for a factory you poured sand in one end, and got computers out the other. He got the idea from the WayBack Machine.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:08 PM   #135
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I can't WAIT for the inevitable...

...posts that endlessly compare the quality of Macs made in the US vs. China.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:25 PM   #136
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That 200 number is VERY misleading. There will be significantly more downstream jobs created from all of the repairs needed for manufacturing defects.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:41 PM   #137
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Now the question is how much Apple/Foxconn are milking from Federal and State Economic Development Corporations. I bet there is a bidding war going on between states to land these 200 jobs.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:42 PM   #138
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It's a really sad commentary that you can hire people for cheaper than robots.

Is it?

Robots aren't "cheaper" in the sense that they cost less per hour. After the upfront cost, they are surely very cheap, as you don't need to pay them by the hour.

I don't think robots being "cheaper" then humans is sad...or at least no sadder then any advance in technology that has changed the way in which we work.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:47 PM   #139
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This is definitely just going to be the Mac Pro.
If it is you have a longer wait.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:47 PM   #140
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Very good PR indeed - They can now say "Some of our products are made right here in the USA!"
More like assembled in USA.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 02:56 PM   #141
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I am looking at the photo of those Chinese women in clean suits assembling the computers. I just can't picture Americans doing that day in and day out. They will get bored. No offense intended.
Because Americans have never worked on assembly lines before?
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:06 PM   #142
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Will this impact the price of the imac?
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:15 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by cc3d View Post
200 more than Obama has created!!
sore loser

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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryanasimov View Post
...posts that endlessly compare the quality of Macs made in the US vs. China.
um it will be ugly at first
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:20 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by IbisDoc View Post
That 200 number is VERY misleading. There will be significantly more downstream jobs created from all of the repairs needed for manufacturing defects.
If you think about it, Apple only created 3 jobs at the very beginning.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:31 PM   #145
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That is, if 200 is a real number. People here are saying that the source of this info is pulling the number out of its butt, but let's just wait and see.
There's nothing to wait for. It's a political gimmick - nothing more. How the hell is the U.S. supposed to compete with labor that costs Apple a whopping $1.55/hour?
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:42 PM   #146
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it's about the quality of the skill sets too

It might sound harsh to most American forum users, but to some extent, Foxconn employees in China works like a robot, and it's hard for American workers to do the same.

What I mean by is this:
If you read Cook's interview, he said it's hard for the skill sets to be imported back to US. It DOESN'T mean Americans aren't skillful in any way, you guys are still the most technologically advanced country in the world... but it's more like... I really can't picture American workers to work physically, like Foxconn employees do...

It's tough. But I'm happy that some jobs are created and Apple is doing what's best for the US as well.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:45 PM   #147
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Originally Posted by NT1440 View Post
Given how much flack Apple has gotten for using Foxconn (with little attention paid to Sony, Toshiba, Dell, Panasonic, HP, etc, etc).....PR.
This was an answer to REFURB, which I can guarantee is cheaper the way they are doing it now and there are not enough REFURBS to set up major production for of it.

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Originally Posted by NT1440 View Post
Given how much flack Apple has gotten for using Foxconn (with little attention paid to Sony, Toshiba, Dell, Panasonic, HP, etc, etc).....PR.
See my answer about REFURB.

You took that sentence out of the context of the answer.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:47 PM   #148
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Apple has that many employees working in Chicagoland Apple stores. What a joke. Nothing but a front to keep the critics mouths shut.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 03:57 PM   #149
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We're getting to the point where robots are cost effective against cheap labor.

Expect this to happen more in the next 20 years -- people need to realize that cheap manual labor will soon be a thing of the past, and that most if not all blue collar manufacturing jobs will be replaced by automated assembly lines.
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Old Dec 8, 2012, 04:20 PM   #150
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These kind of discussions are usually filled with emotions and patriotism.

All without thinking through the various stages of the supply chain, each step providing jobs one way or another.

There are American workers in Cupertino, who work on these projects,
administrators in purchasing, accounting, sales service for these products

There are American customs clearance officers, workers unloading freight, freight forwarders, truck drivers, distribution center employees, sales people
etc.etc.

The world has become an interlinked place and corporations have the goal to make money. So, they buy where it's cheapest!

So, do the consumers.

It should all so be made clear that the world is overpopulated and there just cannot be enough jobs for everybody.
(Deduct the unwilling and incapable. Overall a small percentage)

The business climate in USA actually hinders manufacturing. Tax structures,
employment laws, zoning , environmental, education.

With ever changing technology and products the smart thing to do is not own and run a factory, but pay somebody for it.

If it's really 200 jobs, it's not better than nothing. It is nothing!

Until the fundamentals of manufacturing in the US are not changing, this will remain a PR stunt.

Apple can play a role in changing the fundamentals, but over 30 years of letting things slide by industries and governments (i.e. the people) cannot be reversed in a hurry with 200 jobs.

If one analyzes why manufacturing was lost to other countries it will become clear that too many hurdles for manufacturers were put up.

Why hassle with having a factory, when you can sell the same product made
some place for the almost same margins.

Assembly line work is hard work. (I happen to be in the contract industry) and
any time something is hard in America, people want to turn to somebody whom they can blame for the situation.

Any assembly line worker who manages to make money with 2 or even 3 jobs, spouse working too wants to make sure that her/his child has a better life.

So, guess what? They do not want their children to become assembly workers.

There are so many facets to this issue that it cannot all be discussed in this forum.

Rarara, jobs for America is not the solution.

Americans have over decades become consumers who don't want to sweat, get dirty and if at all possible want to have somebody else do the work.

Americans want to "service" or "manage" , be creative, run businesses, yet the base (as in education) is lacking.

The so called craftsmen, contractors employ are in the majority from other countries, the harvests in many parts of the country is brought in by the latinos
and working with ones hands as an American is not as widespread as it should.

When there is a task that requires physical labor, Americans need a machine.
When it gets hot they need air conditioning, etc.etc.

OSHA help, I had to bend three times in a row and now my back hurts.

Workers who come here from other developing countries are not spoiled and will do whatever a job requires.

This entitlement generation will not work on assembly lines!

People just be honest. Which of you posters would?

But, I am sure you'll want other Americans to do that.

It's good for Americans to get manufacturing jobs?
Would be nice, if they wanted them at the prevailing wages.

Even there the States and government can't agree.

The entire system has so many flaws that I find it funny that we expect Apple to be the cure all, just because it is(for the moment) a successful company.
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