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Old Dec 10, 2012, 01:05 AM   #101
Domalais
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Originally Posted by eltaurus View Post
Still there are other pro's which need really a Powerful Workstation ... Photo/video are not only pro ..

there are digital content creation (3D modeling / animation / simulation / VFX) plus many more.. who need proper workstation not a toy. with Multipule CPU's GPU & hell lot of ram..

i7 ahahhaha its a gaming processor .. Xeon is real deal when 3d rendering ( not processing / encoding photo /video)
An i7-3770K easily matches your Mac Pro.

Are you planning on getting rid of your toy and getting a real computer anytime soon?
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 01:43 AM   #102
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The Mac Pro hasn't been updated for 36 months. Is this move to "Made in USA" a sign that the updates will be more frequent?
I just hope if it's the Mac Pro that there's more to the update than "Made in USA".
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 01:58 AM   #103
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Originally Posted by NY Guitarist View Post
I just hope if it's the Mac Pro that there's more to the update than "Made in USA".
+1

Also..I really hope we're getting better SSD options than the iMac received. Fusion Drive in all glory and that but I want to have the very same control over all my HDD/SDD like we have today.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 02:08 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by oneMadRssn View Post
Think it'll have no optical drive, proprietary SSD, a mobile CPU, and soldered in RAM?
And the access panel on the side, will be affixed with glue.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 02:22 AM   #105
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Ok, 3 years
My Audi has a CD/DVD. But it also has a 20GB hard disk for
Music and videos which can be imported from 2 available SD card slots or USB Flash drives, not to mention iPod/iPhone connectivity.
Who wants a CD that holds 15 songs or a low quality DVD when I have dozens of movies and thousands Of songs ready to go?
On CDs...

First off, they are superior to itunes downloads in sound quality. Studios and labels will be making CD masters for YEARS to come. They may become less and less popular with consumers as the years go by, but they will be around for a long long time.

Secondly, they aren't just for music. I shuffle files around on them all the time. Mainly if I need to drop a file off at a print shop. Sure I can use thumb drives, but CDs are cheap, convenient and disposable.

DVDs...

Many many people haven't gone HD yet, of those that have, many haven't gone Bluray. Many still feel DVDs are fine or don't understand how it all works and assume that because they have an HDTV their DVDs now play in HD and are "awesome."

DVDs and Blurays will probably carry on side by side for years to come, or at least till combo discs become standard or something along those lines.

Many people here at MR vouch for the all digital/downloadble lifestyle, when in fact you are in a very small minority when compared to the rest of the world. Consider yourself lucky that your life is so great that you can even think that way.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 02:35 AM   #106
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It says in the article that Apple sells under 1 million Mac Pros a year. Has that always been the case? Did the original Power Macs back in the 1990s/Early 2000s Steve Jobs days sell as few as that? Or could the lack of innovation in the line mean sales are stagnant. I know it's a professional machine and sales aren't going to be anywhere near as much as the iMac or other cheaper Macs, but i imagined they would sell more than that. But then again we're used to such high numbers these days with the iPhone and iPad, that the under 1 million amount could still be classed as great sales for a Mac Pro....
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 02:41 AM   #107
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Duh!

A lot of said us said this a week ago. Now it's news?

Well, "No **** Sherlock".
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 02:55 AM   #108
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Originally Posted by Skika View Post
At least my toy has Thunderbolt. Lmao.
And you're using that for?

Last edited by Larry-K; Dec 10, 2012 at 02:56 AM. Reason: illicit contraction use
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 03:07 AM   #109
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Are the MacPro's not assembled here in Ireland for the European market ? I know they used to be.
Hence I assume labour costs would be about the same as the USA anyway.

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Apple Inc. Cork Site (Cork (Corcaigh))
Ireland / Cork / Cork (Corcaigh)
office building, factory, computer, Apple Inc., manufacturer, manufacturing, assembling, call center / contact center, computer services, IT support business
The Apple Cork site facilitates operations for: call center, sales, manufacturing, service and OEM management for products sold in the EMEA region (Europe, Middle East and Africa). This site has been opened in Sep 1980.

Producing - Mac Pro, Xserve

See also:
- www.apple.com/jobs/us/pro/inside/locations.html Apple main site locations.
- www.macmothership.com/timeline.html




Also will this mean Apple will be cutting jobs from its HQ here in Fermoy now ?

Not all Macs are assembled in China by big industrial faceless corporations who use staff like robots... (foxCon)

Some Macs are made in the true post Industrial Age third world countries where the populace are so broke they can't even afford to get drunk anymore despite their legendary reputations (Ireland)
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 03:40 AM   #110
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A few notes

A few notes:

•Mac Pros have been assembled in the US and Ireland for many years, for tax and logistic reasons.

•The delay in development is due to stagnation in processor development and market distraction by the massive demand for consumer grade products. This is also somewhat strategic, since slowing the high end production lowers the bar for software demand and performance expectations down the line.

•There hasn't been much negative impact on the Mac Pro's bottom line because the current machines are still very much current and sufficient for most professional applications (one of my production machines is a 1,1 and still going strong).

•The line entirely produced in the USA next year will more likely be the iMac, not the Mac Pro. Or maybe we're looking at a new line of machines entirely. The Mac Pro in its current form is already meeting the assembly logistic needs. Who knows.

•Most likely, whatever looks logical and obvious to us, will not be what we see in 2013. Like Tim Cook said in last week's interview, Apple gives people something they didn't know they needed, and can't live without. In other words, speculation is futile.

Last edited by robogobo; Dec 10, 2012 at 03:54 AM.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:03 AM   #111
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Wishlist

14 SATA-III (minimum)
8 PCI-3 x16 slots (With room for 4 way SLI etc)
4 Thunderbolt
2 10Gig Ethernet
4 Firewire800

Get Intel to release a decent new server chip since current offerings are underwhelming. Please turn off vPro and other such Intel nasties while your at it and slash your ram prices too.

Thanks
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:06 AM   #112
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So Mac Rumors is now posting lies in its own stories. What a croc!

No one has confirmed anything about a new Mac Pro. All they have said is that there will be something professionals would really like later in 2013.

Tim Cook, did NOT specify a new MacPro.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:23 AM   #113
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Itīs come to the point where Iīm just happy to see a picture of a Mac Pro on Mac Rumors!
I couldnīt care where is built, as long as they release a new Mac Pro.

I need a faster machine for my RED EPIC editing and transcoding. Please just bring the damn thing to market.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:35 AM   #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwcs View Post
That doesn't make a better product (maybe a worse one) but only a faster product. It's the individual worker who decides to do a good job that makes better products. Sadly, though, craftsmanship is becoming increasingly scarce in this world as we look to all products as being disposable.
That is one of the best things I've read on mac rumors. So true, this consumer lifestyle where people think their products are our of date when Apple rolls out a new phone every year. Craftsmanship is dying and its such a shame.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by iMikeT View Post
Where do I begin to dismantle your line of thinking?

Do you really think that people want to work like slaves for such low wages and live in horrible conditions like the people who assemble these products in China? The people there work in these conditions because there's over 1.25 BILLION people in the entire country. If one guy doesn't want a job for $7 per day, it's cool because there are a hundred people behind him that will take it for $6 per day.

You want to get real? Here's the reality. These people are working in conditions that were present in the USA 100 years ago. What you're promoting is turning the clock back and racing to the bottom.
The concerning thing is that its starting in the west too.. atleast in the UK. There are too many jobless and not enough jobs so wages are lowered as they know workers will accept them, obviously we have minimum wage which is good so businesses can't go even lower, but I see the same easily replaceable workforce as in China.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:38 AM   #115
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Originally Posted by nwcs View Post
That doesn't make a better product (maybe a worse one) but only a faster product. It's the individual worker who decides to do a good job that makes better products. Sadly, though, craftsmanship is becoming increasingly scarce in this world as we look to all products as being disposable.
It's why I like my guitar stuff. It's nearly all US, British and European-made. You can buy something good quality and keep it forever if you want. Something breaks it's worth repairing. If you need to sell something it keeps a lot of its value.

Similar is my Hasselblad V-series camera. I don't used it much as I've had to use DSLRs commercially now but it's cool that I can get a nice digital back (for a big price) and carry on using bodies and lenses dating from the 80s and 70s based on designs little changed form the 50s.

Modular. Durable. Repairable. It's environmentally sound and just feels so much more moral.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 04:47 AM   #116
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Yes!! give us new made in USA Mac Pro's
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 05:03 AM   #117
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Originally Posted by dansix View Post
Tim Cook said it wasn't about cost. That's where I raise the ******** flag. All the Apple fanboys of course will jump all over me on this because they're all zombies, eating up all the B.S. that comes out of Cupertino.
Its certainly not all about cost, at any rate.

Its as much about the lack of engineers.

In recent years in the US and Europe, the shift from manufacturing to service industry has seen a dramatic drop in the numbers of engineers of the sort required for this sort of thing. Here in the UK its something which seems to be increasingly on the radar, and an issue which seriously needs to be reversed.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 05:15 AM   #118
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Originally Posted by dansix View Post
Anybody who thinks that US manufacturing will ever get to the level of China knows very little about economics. Americans need to stick to what they do best - management. Americans have a reputation of laziness. But that's not necessarily a bad thing. It's an ideal characteristic in motivating people to find easier ways of doing almost everything. Chinese culture is one that is marked by diligence and perfectionism, which is probably better suited for manufacturing. They're also willing to work for a lot less, longer hours, and in worse conditions. Speaking in general terms of course.
What are you doing here?!

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by mkbook View Post
People in this thread saying it's a mistake to leave China since the workers are treated like slaves and therefore the products are cheaper. Get a better job so you can afford a quality product made in a country that cares about their citizens. Take pride in the fact that your product wasn't made by people working 14 hours a day for pennies but by people treated with respect and dignity.

----------



Agreed. I think it's a mistake for Apple to forget about the Pros. The other Macs that can't be upgraded or maintained are useless for serious users of computers. It's nice to see them finally updating their flagship Mac.
....and consider how many the current government in china has murdered since 1949...about 87 million.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 05:19 AM   #119
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I'll take two

I've been saving my money for the Mac Pro refresh. I need two of these Mac Pros for an upcoming project. My Mac Pro from 2007 would like some buddies.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 05:26 AM   #120
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Also, the era of ever-cheaper products is ending.

Labour costs are slowly rising in the far east as people want a fair share of the new-found success. The cheap fuel era is also drawing to a close and shipping costs will also rise. As this happens simply making the product at home starts to look evermore viable and attractive.

Seems good sense, then, to have manufacturing close to home as well as the far east so you can transition more easily than rivals.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 05:44 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carlgo View Post
It is hard to define what is "Assembled in the US and what is "Made in the US". Lots of people buy boxes of Chines parts and stuff them into a case, assembling their own computer on the kitchen table.

What percentage of the parts have to be made in the US for the whole product to be considered to have been made in the US?

Making a relatively few Mac Pros from imported parts would be easy, making millions of iPhones a day is a different deal.
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Originally Posted by Khadgar View Post
Well, the glass on the iPhone, antenna, and processor at least are manufactured in the US. It's not far fetched to believe the rest of it could as well. The reason why we can't right now is the same reason why we can't go to the moon right now; we have nothing to go to the moon in. It doesn't mean we don't have the capability to do so. We never built any infrastructure to build mass amounts of electronics like we did other things, but it doesn't mean we can't. We will and are.

It's true there's a difference between assembling and manufacturing, but I'll be surprised if this is just an assembly plant. Apple has a lot to gain from owning the manufacture of their products, and the Mac Pro should be the easiest way to start it. I very much doubt this will stop with the Mac Pro. It could possibly even fold over into Canada as well who is also like us beefing up their manufacturing sectors.
I'm going to bed so not going to look it up, but your discussion on this misses that a number of recent articles on many blogs have noted there are legal federal definitions for "Assembled in the USA" and "Made in the USA." (And have explained them.)

Research and then re-take.....
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 06:01 AM   #122
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Originally Posted by eltaurus View Post
i7 ahahhaha its a gaming processor .. Xeon is real deal when 3d rendering ( not processing / encoding photo /video)
The difference between a Xeon and an i7 these days is simply that the Xeon can support multiple sockets (only some models) and ECC memory.

Do you really use ECC memory or need it ? Is your Mac Pro a single socket ?

Otherwise, they are the same processor core.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JesterJJZ View Post
Many people here at MR vouch for the all digital/downloadble lifestyle, when in fact you are in a very small minority when compared to the rest of the world. Consider yourself lucky that your life is so great that you can even think that way.
What's great about a life where you settle for mediocre quality and a sub-par experience because you're too lazy to get off the couch 2 minutes to pop a disc in ?

I have the Internet bandwidth for VoD/Streaming/Downloads. I have the home storage for it. I still get blu-rays.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr-Stabby View Post
It says in the article that Apple sells under 1 million Mac Pros a year. Has that always been the case? Did the original Power Macs back in the 1990s/Early 2000s Steve Jobs days sell as few as that?
Probably even less. 2 factors :

- The PC Market, up to a few years ago, as been in constant expansion.
- Apple's market share is still climbing from the bottom of the barrel in the late 90s, early 00s.
- The entire market has been seeing a trend of mobile computers being much more popular, both in enterprise and consumer markets than their desktop counterparts for the last few years.

So no, it has nothing to do with stagnation. Market realities.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 06:01 AM   #123
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I would think the MacPros would be the idea build-at-home computer. Aside from the manufacture of the pieces, the whole product is extremely simple to put together or take apart.

Despite speculation for a smaller product in the Pro, I doubt it will reduce more than 33%. It could go smaller if they take the power supply outside the box, but that would create an awkward situation with a large brick tagging around the tower.

Quote:
Originally Posted by faroZ06 View Post
"-Mac Pros are easier to build and customize than any other Apple product"

Giving Americans the easy job, eh? Racist!
jk
It's because there is a lot of room for those large, meat-eating paws of the Americans and Mexicans that will work at the factory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by robogobo View Post
•There hasn't been much negative impact on the Mac Pro's bottom line because the current machines are still very much current and sufficient for most professional applications (one of my production machines is a 1,1 and still going strong).
Your points were all excellent.

I agree. The current MacPro is only lacking in two ways--USB3 and TB. Aside from that, it is a powerful machine that outstrips the other Macs in benchmarks and real world performance. My 1,1 is still more enjoyable to use than any other non-Pro Mac made in 2012 due to the ability to modify it and because the dual processors keep it from stalling and halting during complex tasks.
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 06:06 AM   #124
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So does this mean ALL Mac Pros will be built in the USA? So then they are cheaper on the US market..

But what about other markets??

Here in Australia we already pay $500 more for the Mac Pro than the US price... How much more will this move cost us?
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Old Dec 10, 2012, 06:18 AM   #125
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•There hasn't been much negative impact on the Mac Pro's bottom line because the current machines are still very much current and sufficient for most professional applications (one of my production machines is a 1,1 and still going strong).
Sufficient ? No argument there. Very few people actually need the grunt of modern processing hardware provides.

Current ? Laughable. 2 processor generations behind (Nehalem/Westmere... in 2012 ? Current ?) and a GPU old and stale.

Apple had access to the required parts to update it this year (Radeon 6000 series, nVidia 600 series, Intel Sandy-Bridge E Xeon processors) but they chose not to do it.
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