Register FAQ / Rules Forum Spy Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Dec 11, 2012, 12:55 AM   #51
BuckusToothnail
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrxak View Post
So you now admit that Apple didn't rip off Google like you said they did a few minutes ago? Okay, thanks, that's all I wanted.
So you now admit that other companies didn't rip off Apple like you said all over this forum? Okay, thanks, that's all I wanted.
BuckusToothnail is offline   5 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 12:59 AM   #52
AppleScruff1
macrumors 603
 
AppleScruff1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestonHarvey1 View Post
Ripping off Google Maps, or just maps? Google did not invent maps. They didn't even invent digital maps, or digital maps on the internet.
But Apple sued Samsung over a rectangle with rounded corners, neither of which apple invented.
AppleScruff1 is offline   7 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 12:59 AM   #53
BuckusToothnail
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestonHarvey1 View Post
What it shows me is a couple of things:

1. If you wanted to do maps and not be subjected to a lot of ridicule, you probably should have started in 2000, and not any later than 2005. No doubt products back then had problems like what we're seeing today, but no one was yet relying on the data for mission critical applications. The novelty of the thing completely eclipsed any data problems users encountered.

2. That said, Apple Maps proves you CAN take on a huge mapping monopoly in 2012 - and still create a great product and platform. You'll have to take your lumps and fight through the pain, enduring a level of scrutiny your competitors never had to, but you will see light at the end of the tunnel.
I agree with your first point. However, I'm not sure Apple Maps has "proved" anything other than being a complete disaster at this point.

"[S]till create a great product and platform"??? Yeah, I don't think so.
BuckusToothnail is offline   8 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:07 AM   #54
iMikeT
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: California
That was fast. I'm guessing they also made sure that people don't drive into a pack of dingos?
iMikeT is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:09 AM   #55
janderson0719
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
I laugh at all the issues that keep arising.

I haven't had one single problem with Apple maps. I love it. It works (for me). Goodnight.
janderson0719 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:10 AM   #56
iBug2
macrumors Demi-God
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckusToothnail View Post
oogle isn't suing them, just making a FAR SUPERIOR product and letting the consumer decide.
They can't sue Apple. Apple didn't infringe on any Google mapping patents when they made their own maps.
__________________
MP Hex D700 32GB-1TB, rMBP 2.7 15" 16GB, ACD 30", iPhone 4S, iPad Air
iBug2 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:16 AM   #57
randyj
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
I dont blame Apple. I blame TomTom. They are the main supplier of data to Apple maps (as stated directly in the app itself) and are arguably the best name in GPS.
For Apple to individually check each and every address is not possible. It is unfortunate that we the public have to help fix the data.
At least in this case there was a timely fix. When I reported a problem to Google many years back, they took years to fix it.
Personally I have had no issues with it and am enjoying the turn by turn built in.
The other day I was lost and I said to siri 'take me home siri' and sure enough I got directions back home.
randyj is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:16 AM   #58
G4DP
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by iBug2 View Post
They can't sue Apple. Apple didn't infringe on any Google mapping patents when they made their own maps.
Apple didn't make a single Map. They copy and pasted second hand data. Apple wouldn't have the first clue about creating maps. If they had, they would have got someone to check the thing before it was released. You will always get small errors, but some of the mistakes in the app that are being reported show that they thought they could throw any old carp out the door and the iSheep would lap it up.

No wonder cartography is up a creek with no paddle if people think Apple created any of their own maps.

Quote:
Originally Posted by randyj View Post
I dont blame Apple. I blame TomTom. They are the main supplier of data to Apple maps (as stated directly in the app itself) and are arguably the best name in GPS.
For Apple to individually check each and every address is not possible. It is unfortunate that we the public have to help fix the data.
At least in this case there was a timely fix. When I reported a problem to Google many years back, they took years to fix it.
Personally I have had no issues with it and am enjoying the turn by turn built in.
The other day I was lost and I said to siri 'take me home siri' and sure enough I got directions back home.
Why are Apple not to blame? Who took the data and stripped it down to the bare minimum so it would cost almost nothing? Apple did. Who released a Map app with more flaws than a North Korean missile? Apple did.

Trying to do this on the cheap is once again biting them on the backside.
__________________
Apple wouldn't know a cartographer if they stabbed them with a pair of compass' in the backside!

Last edited by G4DP; Dec 11, 2012 at 01:25 AM.
G4DP is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:18 AM   #59
8a22a
macrumors 6502a
 
8a22a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Yorkshire, UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckusToothnail View Post
EXACTLY what I wrote. Ripping off Google Maps, the PLATFORM, the features, the functions, the look-and-feel, basically EVERYTHING.
How can they rip off something that doesn't exist?

There's never been a fully Google made maps app for iPhone. It was always been Apple's interface using Google's map data.
__________________
iPhone 5 32GB iPad mini 16GB TV 3
8a22a is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:21 AM   #60
Mr. Retrofire
macrumors 601
 
Mr. Retrofire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: www.emiliana.cl
Quote:
Originally Posted by seydurin View Post
So that's how you get Apple to fix map errors. They need to be featured on world wide media as life threatening.
Obviously, yes.
__________________

“Only the dead have seen the end of the war.”
-- Plato --
Mr. Retrofire is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:23 AM   #61
Vinamra
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Send a message via Skype™ to Vinamra
Quote:
Originally Posted by lilo777 View Post
... responding to one official police warning at a time. This may take a while.
This! For data to be updated quickly, one must lodge a police complaint and the police must give a warning.
Vinamra is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:27 AM   #62
OTACORB
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Central, Louisiana
Anyone stupid enough to just blatantly follow a map for miles and miles without having previously done a bit of checking is just down right stupid. I don't trust any of these mapping services and that includes Google. I have always when planning a trip checked out a few map sources and then compared it to what is in my Garmin. I've had Garmin maps take me off the beaten path before, but because I had actually looked I knew something was wrong. These mapping programs are simply meant as a guide and certainly shouldn't ever been used in place of common sense. Then again not everyone has common sense!
__________________
Samsung Galaxy Note 3
MacBook Pro Retina (2013)
Mac Mini (2012)
iPad rMini 32GB White Wifi
OTACORB is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:31 AM   #63
wikus
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Planet earth.
Good work Apple. Now to fix the rest of the worlds maps.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by G4DP View Post
Apple didn't make a single Map. They copy and pasted second hand data.
Essentially what Apple does with everything. Conjure up a device and get everyone else to slap it together.

Nothing of whats inside an Apple device is completely its own. Which is hilariously stupid when I hear someone say 'Apple is not a software company, its a hardware company' I laugh every time. The hardware thats manufactured by samsung, sony, intel, etc is Apples but the operating system code thats been written isn't Apple's?

LMFAO.
wikus is offline   5 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:37 AM   #64
burtba
macrumors member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Its official. From now on, I'm sending all my IOS error reports to the Victorian Police. They get action.
burtba is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:39 AM   #65
coolspot18
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by gmanist1000 View Post
Have you not followed Apple's relationship with Google over the past couple years?
Yes, but companies cross license competitor products all the time. Last I looked, Samsung is still manufacturing parts for Apple... The fact they are bitter competitor doesn't mean the two companies could not have come to a mutually benefit agreement.


... and in other news, Apple and Google are making a $500 million joint bid for Kodak patents...
coolspot18 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:42 AM   #66
warwickharry
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by mrxak View Post
It's Antennagate all over again.

Step 1: Find a minor problem that exists in all similar products, that most users don't encounter.
Step 2: Write lots of articles about it online and in the press. Because it's Apple, it gets an inordinate amount of attention.
Step 3: Get the television media involved, because they're slow and only get their news from newspapers already in a panic.
Step 4: Get as many customers as possible to do something they'd never do in order to encounter the minor problem, making the problem appear widespread.
Step 5: Force Apple to apologize publicly, then criticize them for using reality as a defense.
Step 6: Get the fandroids to never shut up about it, and badmouth the Apple product everywhere on the internet.
Step 7: ???
Step 8: Apple still sells more of the product than they've ever sold before, since overall it's a superior product for most users in most situations.
This application is unusable in Australia. Which is one of apple's largest customers.
I have looked all over my own state and can honestly say 80% of all the towns are in completely the wrong location. Not slightly wrong, 30-40km wrong. Not a "minor" problem if you ask me. Apple realize how big of a disaster this is, hence the unusual apology. Dont try and dismiss this as a beat up by "fandroids". Im an avid apple user and this is totally unacceptable.
warwickharry is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:46 AM   #67
BuckusToothnail
Banned
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by AppleScruff1 View Post
But Apple sued Samsung over a rectangle with rounded corners, neither of which apple invented.
HILARIOUS! This is EXACTLY the reaction I expected when I pointed out the irony of Apple touting "innovation" and "invent your own stuff" and then going on to ripping off Google Maps.

Of course all the Apple apologists, like Pavlov's dogs, are going to jump in at the same time and chime "but but but...Google didn't invent maps!!!" (oh really? duh), not realizing the total HYPOCRISY they just underlined of Apple suing EVERYONE based on "innovations" they didn't invent!

The pure irony is Apple was BUILT on its own illustrious history of stealing, whether from XEROX, Creative, Palm, Cisco, Nokia, etc., or even CURRENT cases like the $368 MILLION LOSS to VirnetX last month, trying to skirt paying Motorola for infringing its 3G patents in which they'll most likely ALSO lose, and stealing MobileMedia Ideas' screen rotation technology, etc.

Apple isn't ONLY the biggest PATENT TROLL in the tech industry, it's also the biggest PATENT INFRINGER. But don't expect any Apple apologists to be able to register this fact, all they know is when Apple rings a bell with a new product launch they'll all...

Last edited by BuckusToothnail; Dec 11, 2012 at 02:19 AM. Reason: typo
BuckusToothnail is offline   9 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:55 AM   #68
Moccasin
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Newcastle, UK
Recently I heard UK mountain rescue volunteers bemoaning the fact that they were having to rescue ever increasing numbers of walkers and climbers who were actually using their smartphone mapping apps to navigate in the hills and getting lost. Bad enough when you have a signal but very reckless when in rural areas where reception is poor.

While not denying that Apple have a lot of work to do to their mapping, people do have to take some responsibility when travelling to areas they don't know. This is true everywhere but even more so in places where getting lost can be a matter of life and death and not just an inconvenience. Hopefully the Australian Police have done everyone a favour by highlighting the stupidity of relying on mobile map apps in the wilderness.

The ability to read a map properly should be tsught to everyone at school.
Moccasin is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:58 AM   #69
macsmurf
macrumors 65816
 
macsmurf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by MacRumors View Post
Interestingly, The Register reports that the error was not entirely Apple's fault, as the incorrect location was included in the official Australian Gazetteer.
The Register article grossly misrepresents the quality of the data source. One can actually do this search oneself: http://www.ga.gov.au/place-names/

As it turns out, there are not 2 but 33 matches on Mildura. However, only one of these are marked as a town (the correct one). The rest are other places with Mildura in the name such as Mildura Rural City which is marked with the feature code DI (Agricultural area, County, District, Local government area, Parish, Region).

So the claim that this is the fault of the Gazetteers of Australia is entirely without merit. Please edit your article to reflect that.
macsmurf is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 01:59 AM   #70
Moccasin
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Newcastle, UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by warwickharry View Post
This application is unusable in Australia. Which is one of apple's largest customers.
I have looked all over my own state and can honestly say 80% of all the towns are in completely the wrong location. Not slightly wrong, 30-40km wrong. Not a "minor" problem if you ask me. Apple realize how big of a disaster this is, hence the unusual apology. Dont try and dismiss this as a beat up by "fandroids". Im an avid apple user and this is totally unacceptable.
Makes you wonder why people are relying on such poor data to navigate through the outback. How does it work when you lose signal?
Moccasin is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 02:06 AM   #71
H2SO4
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by WestonHarvey1 View Post
Punishment? It's a beautiful country.
Being beautiful hasn't stopped people being sent there before.
H2SO4 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 02:10 AM   #72
warwickharry
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moccasin View Post
Makes you wonder why people are relying on such poor data to navigate through the outback. How does it work when you lose signal?
The "outback" is not where I am talking about! These are large rural cities/towns that are incorrectly placed. Signal is definately available in these areas.
warwickharry is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 02:11 AM   #73
wikus
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Planet earth.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckusToothnail View Post
HILARIOUS! This is EXACTLY the reaction I expected when I pointed out the irony of Apple touting "innovation" and "invent your own stuff" and then going on to ripping off Google Maps.

Of course all the Apple apologists, like Pascal's dogs, are going to jump in at the same time and chime "but but but...Google didn't invent maps!!!" (oh really? duh), not realizing the total HYPOCRISY they just underlined of Apple suing EVERYONE based on "innovations" they didn't invent!

The pure irony is Apple was BUILT on its own illustrious history of stealing, whether from XEROX, Creative, Palm, Cisco, Nokia, etc., or even CURRENT cases like the $368 MILLION LOSS to VirnetX last month, trying to skirt paying Motorola for infringing its 3G patents in which they'll most likely ALSO lose, and stealing MobileMedia Ideas' screen rotation technology, etc.

Apple isn't ONLY the biggest PATENT TROLL in the tech industry, it's also the biggest PATENT INFRINGER. But don't expect any Apple apologists to be able to register this fact, all they know is when Apple rings a bell with a new product launch they'll all...
You're my hero.
wikus is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 02:12 AM   #74
ConCat
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: In an ethereal plane of existence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BuckusToothnail View Post
This just goes to show "fixing" Apple Maps is a lot TOUGHER than people realize. Considering the worldwide negative publicity this is generating for Apple, if it was "easy" to fix it would have been done in the first hour.

Nearly two days have passed now and it's still not completely fixed, and they can't even change the LABEL of Mildura to show the correct location.

Now if it's THAT difficult and time-consuming to make this ONE seemingly easy correction which is generating global negative media coverage about endangering people's lives, then how quickly do you think Apple will respond to the everyday user corrections submitted to them by the THOUSANDS?

As I mentioned in another thread, I've submitted at LEAST a couple of dozen corrections to Maps the past few months since I got my iPhone 5 and NONE have been updated yet. And reading other people's post it doesn't seem my experience is uncommon.

In comparison the few times I needed to send a correction to Google Maps, all POI-related like a store having moved or being on the wrong side of the street, it was usually fixed within a couple of weeks.

Sadly it seems this whole "crowd sourcing" and "the more people use it the better it'll get" mantra is all just smoke-and-mirrors RUBBISH. What's the point of "crowd sourcing" if Apple isn't going to utilize the user data?
Okay, here's how software debugging works: You identify problems, you attempt to fix them, then you debug the fixes to make sure those fixes don't have bugs, then when all's well, you release it. The amount of incorrect data in a new mapping service has to be mind-boggling. There are places all over the world that need corrections in Apple's Maps. The fixes will take time. A lot of time. The world is a huge place, and digital maps are not as simple as they look on your screen. It isn't simply a matter of fixing a name on a map.

Just to clarify a bit: Coordinates. Those need to be retrieved for each and every area that's incorrect. I don't know how apple's planning on doing it, but I'd just fire up Google Maps. Heh.

Last edited by ConCat; Dec 11, 2012 at 02:22 AM.
ConCat is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Dec 11, 2012, 02:23 AM   #75
Moccasin
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Newcastle, UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by warwickharry View Post
The "outback" is not where I am talking about! These are large rural cities/towns that are incorrectly placed. Signal is definately available in these areas.
My mistake, sorry. Sounds like as a minimum, Apple need to have a team of cartographers in Audtralia and NZ going through key POI and checking against other maps. Probably need to ask for their money back from those who provided the data in the first place.

In Apple's defence, if they did indeed use data from Tom Tom (or another company) - they don't have their own data - how has that company managed in Australia until now?

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by wikus View Post
Good work Apple. Now to fix the rest of the worlds maps.

----------



Essentially what Apple does with everything. Conjure up a device and get everyone else to slap it together.

Nothing of whats inside an Apple device is completely its own. Which is hilariously stupid when I hear someone say 'Apple is not a software company, its a hardware company' I laugh every time. The hardware thats manufactured by samsung, sony, intel, etc is Apples but the operating system code thats been written isn't Apple's?

LMFAO.
Not entirely true. Apple design some of their components and get third parties to manufacture then on their behalf. No different to anyone else these days. No point having a camera factory, battery factory, processor factory etc.

Apple design their devices using components that are available where possible. If required they design their own or ask third parties to tweak a design to suit their precise needs. Same goes for HP etc
Moccasin is offline   0 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:28 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC