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Old Feb 1, 2013, 03:46 PM   #276
perspectivebass
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Y View Post
Apple must be pleased! Also, good luck finding any 27" panel from any manufacturer that has even backlight when looking at a solid grey screen. It looks to me like you're looking for issues/attention.

Also, for the record, the underlying panel in the 2012 is the same 27" panel you got in every old 27" iMac, the ACD/TBD and most of Dell's 27" panels.
Well I had about the same issues and wasn't even looking for them on a gray screen. It happens during day to day use!

I like the products of apple and don't want to exchange anything. And that former iMacs don't have problems don't say anything even if that use the same panels.

Lets just face it there are a lot of problems with displays from apple at the moment/ recent pass.

I love apple love Mac OSX but saying that nothing is wrong is just ignorant.

Note: I don't say these problems are not existence at other company's displays.

I just wait for the next iMac speed bump upgrade and hope they will get rid of the display problems.
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Old Feb 1, 2013, 03:49 PM   #277
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I was just looking through some of my old forum posts, and found this one. People were complaining about backlight bleed on the 24" Cinema Display, and I posted a picture of mine. This is what I expect because it is representative of what I've had for a long time. Maybe I've just been lucky, but this is what I want. I actually ended up returning that one because of some other issues with shifting colors, though. I bought a 24" iMac after.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...3&postcount=11

So, after the problem with the 24" Cinema Display in 2008, I had no more complaints with monitors until now. That is four years of no problems with monitors. I don't think I'm just looking for problems. I can see there is a difference from what I've had for the last few years, and it bothers me.

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Old Feb 1, 2013, 10:00 PM   #278
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I finally tested the replacement iMac with the color grid test pattern. To my surprise, only cyan created IR. In the other test it was magenta, light magenta, blue, and a highly specific shade of white that caused IR. Weird. Again, this blue IR is very hard to notice unless you're really looking for it.

Test Grid
Resulting IR



Quote:
Originally Posted by Swiddle View Post
As mentioned before, the replacement iMac I got has much less IR than the previous one. The blue IR doesn't show up from the black and white grid test pattern. In case anyone was wondering, this is the color image I used:

Color Test Pattern

And this is a color test pattern grid that I just slapped together, that I will try tomorrow:

Color Grid Pattern

I beleive pure blue and pure magenta leave behind the strongest blue IR. I'm going to open a support case with Apple regarding the blue IR in the replacement iMac, but am not going to request a repair or replacement. I just want a record of the problem in case it gets worse over time.

Previously posted:
Video of MAJOR IR in Original iMac
Video of MINOR IR in Replacement iMac
Photo of IR of Checkerboard Pattern on Original iMac
Photo of Color Test Image
Photo of IR of Color Test Image on Original iMac

(Zoom 1)(Zoom 2)
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Old Feb 2, 2013, 02:17 AM   #279
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Y View Post
Apple must be pleased! Also, good luck finding any 27" panel from any manufacturer that has even backlight when looking at a solid grey screen. It looks to me like you're looking for issues/attention.

Also, for the record, the underlying panel in the 2012 is the same 27" panel you got in every old 27" iMac, the ACD/TBD and most of Dell's 27" panels.
(Getting frustrated with posts like this in this thread now)-
Already had plenty of IPS screens that are completely perfect in the 2011 iMac.
Also, the part number is the same but they are NOT the same screens as previous generations, it is a new screen from a different manufacturer.
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Old Feb 2, 2013, 02:43 AM   #280
Brian Y
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmorterlaing View Post
(Getting frustrated with posts like this in this thread now)-
Already had plenty of IPS screens that are completely perfect in the 2011 iMac.
Also, the part number is the same but they are NOT the same screens as previous generations, it is a new screen from a different manufacturer.
No - they're LG screens. As every iMac screen has been since 2008.
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Old Feb 2, 2013, 10:21 PM   #281
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Saw my first 27 inch imac last night... And 10 being rolled into the shop. Tested for IR, zero found.
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Old Feb 2, 2013, 10:46 PM   #282
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I've been posting in the thread about replacement iMacs but thought I'd chime in on here because my last 2 replacements have been plagued with image retention issues.

I thought my most recent unit was good because soon after taking it out of the box I ran an IR test and didn't not notice any issues. However. after a few hours of light usage I had left a few windows open for about 10-15 minutes while I transferred over some data from my old MBP and I noticed this tons of IR. My 2nd unit had IR (and a ticking\popping sound that seemed to be affected a change in screen brightness) but this seems worse.

Do people actually have good screens that don't have IR, yellowness or uneven lighting? After 3 units I'm starting to give up hope...
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Old Feb 3, 2013, 04:57 PM   #283
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGuy7 View Post

Do people actually have good screens that don't have IR, yellowness or uneven lighting? After 3 units I'm starting to give up hope...
Would also really like to know this- have there been any tried and tested success stories? Presumably they cant all be this bad because surely this thread would be going crazy?
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Old Feb 3, 2013, 07:27 PM   #284
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Originally Posted by tmorterlaing View Post
Would also really like to know this- have there been any tried and tested success stories? Presumably they cant all be this bad because surely this thread would be going crazy?
Yes. Mine has no retention. Or if it does, I can't see it.

My 2008 iMac had retention along with it's replacement screen (replaced days before applecare expired!!!). But the retention didn't start until about 1 and a half years into its life. It started after they replaced the internal power unit of the machine. It was the same as some of the examples on this thread. It's unacceptable really and you should send them back until a decent unit comes along. But this isn't a new issue and only on the 2012. this happens with every new Imac from what I've seen on these forums.
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Old Feb 3, 2013, 09:34 PM   #285
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGuy7 View Post
I've been posting in the thread about replacement iMacs but thought I'd chime in on here because my last 2 replacements have been plagued with image retention issues.

I thought my most recent unit was good because soon after taking it out of the box I ran an IR test and didn't not notice any issues. However. after a few hours of light usage I had left a few windows open for about 10-15 minutes while I transferred over some data from my old MBP and I noticed this tons of IR. My 2nd unit had IR (and a ticking\popping sound that seemed to be affected a change in screen brightness) but this seems worse.

Do people actually have good screens that don't have IR, yellowness or uneven lighting? After 3 units I'm starting to give up hope...
how long does it take to go away ?
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 07:03 AM   #286
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mushroomtip View Post
how long does it take to go away ?
About 20-25 minutes for it to fully fade away.
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 07:47 AM   #287
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One half day of normal use and I don't see any retention, I say this so you guys can have some confidence that not all of the iMacs have it. Not to say I won't develop it in the next month... but on day 1, things look solid.
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 07:57 AM   #288
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DerekS View Post
Here's my thinking...

1. Right now these machines are impossible to get.
2. The problem may go away on its own as the panel wears in.
3. You have a warranty for 1 year.

So what I would do? Run it as is for now and see if it improves. If not, schedule a repair w/ Apple. I also highly recommend AppleCare on iMacs, as the LCD panels are prone to issues over time. (You can get AppleCare any time within the first year)
As someone who also has AppleCare on a new late-2012 iMac, I +1 this.

But it does make me laugh when I think of all the people who still think IR can't happen to an LCD/LED or IPS display. (Mostly hear this on the TV side of things, where people spread FUD about plasma displays, saying that only they can experience IR.)
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 08:19 AM   #289
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I think its outrageous that this IR is occurring, there can not be any quality control going on. For these screens to get to market is crazy.
We pay top prices for our Apple gear and should not have to except this sort of issue.
I realise that with the long wait for these things it could be a real pain getting things sorted and i wish anyone with this issue good luck in getting it resolved, there is no way i could except this.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGuy7 View Post
About 20-25 minutes for it to fully fade away.
Not fit for purpose then!
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 08:54 AM   #290
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Quote:
Originally Posted by righteye View Post
I think its outrageous that this IR is occurring, there can not be any quality control going on. For these screens to get to market is crazy.
We pay top prices for our Apple gear and should not have to except this sort of issue.
I realise that with the long wait for these things it could be a real pain getting things sorted and i wish anyone with this issue good luck in getting it resolved, there is no way i could except this.

----------



Not fit for purpose then!
Lol. Image Persistence can be a feature, to varying degrees, of pretty much any IPS LCD panel. Dell etc all "suffer" from the same "problem" since they use the same LG panels, and the same IPS technology. As with all LCD panels, a small amount of image persistence, dead/stuck pixels and backlight "bleeding" is within accepted specifications, and isn't faulty, nor unfit for purpose.

You might be paying "top dollar" as you put it - but it's a mass produced consumer grade item. If you want perfection, you're going to have to pay more than a couple thousand $.
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 10:30 AM   #291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Y View Post
Lol. Image Persistence can be a feature, to varying degrees, of pretty much any IPS LCD panel. Dell etc all "suffer" from the same "problem" since they use the same LG panels, and the same IPS technology. As with all LCD panels, a small amount of image persistence, dead/stuck pixels and backlight "bleeding" is within accepted specifications, and isn't faulty, nor unfit for purpose.

You might be paying "top dollar" as you put it - but it's a mass produced consumer grade item. If you want perfection, you're going to have to pay more than a couple thousand $.
Its a "feature" i could do without!
You are correct about getting what you pay for but this still seems to be substandard in any ones book.
I have a separate Eizo and LaCie monitors (the laCie is relegated to iTunes and www. as its old and no where near as good as the Eizo), this is one of the reasons i did not go down the iMac route appealing as the all in solution is(of course you can add another monitor if wanted but slightly detracts from all in one simplicity and style.
As people are describing and showing it its more than superficial nuisance, i couldn't live with that and although not suffering from this directly i support those who are being inconvenienced by it.
Iam not sure what Apple describe as being in tolerance are dead pixels acceptable?
EDIT; found this from 2010 about dead pixel tolerance from different manufacturers.

http://www.tested.com/tech/1337-we-u...jor-lcd-maker/

Last edited by righteye; Feb 4, 2013 at 11:51 AM.
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 10:51 AM   #292
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Just got a phone call from a Apple Executive Relations.

They asked me to send in some pictures of my 3(!) iMacs with image retention. they also asked the serial numbers I coudn't give the serials because all 3 iMacs are back at the retail store.

On the phone the executive told me that it was the first time(!?) she heard of the problem and that they are investigating the problem of the iMacs.

So maybe things will get sorted out in the long run? (lets hope)
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 10:58 AM   #293
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How many of you found IR after a month, but didn't have it right out of the box?
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 02:15 PM   #294
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lava Lamp Freak View Post
I was just looking through some of my old forum posts, and found this one. People were complaining about backlight bleed on the 24" Cinema Display, and I posted a picture of mine. This is what I expect because it is representative of what I've had for a long time. Maybe I've just been lucky, but this is what I want. I actually ended up returning that one because of some other issues with shifting colors, though. I bought a 24" iMac after.

http://forums.macrumors.com/showpost...3&postcount=11

So, after the problem with the 24" Cinema Display in 2008, I had no more complaints with monitors until now. That is four years of no problems with monitors. I don't think I'm just looking for problems. I can see there is a difference from what I've had for the last few years, and it bothers me.
Your images aren't of bleed. That's just IPS viewing angles, which are terrible on black.
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Old Feb 4, 2013, 08:46 PM   #295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perspectivebass View Post
Just got a phone call from a Apple Executive Relations.

They asked me to send in some pictures of my 3(!) iMacs with image retention. they also asked the serial numbers I coudn't give the serials because all 3 iMacs are back at the retail store.

On the phone the executive told me that it was the first time(!?) she heard of the problem and that they are investigating the problem of the iMacs.

So maybe things will get sorted out in the long run? (lets hope)
\

The person I've been dealing with from Executive Customer Support repeated the same line of "this is not something we've heard of about with these new iMacs and it's the first time I've heard of it". I know that part of their job is "damage control" but it's a bit frustrating to hear them say this stuff.

They're supposed to call me tomorrow to figure out the next steps.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 04:15 AM   #296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WilliamG View Post
Your images aren't of bleed. That's just IPS viewing angles, which are terrible on black.
Yeah I noticed this as well though on the 2012 imac- however again I quote, our 2011 work iMac is absolutely fine on black, so this idea of it being 'acceptable IPS behaviour' isn't true.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Y View Post
Lol. Image Persistence can be a feature, to varying degrees, of pretty much any IPS LCD panel. Dell etc all "suffer" from the same "problem" since they use the same LG panels, and the same IPS technology. As with all LCD panels, a small amount of image persistence, dead/stuck pixels and backlight "bleeding" is within accepted specifications, and isn't faulty, nor unfit for purpose.

You might be paying "top dollar" as you put it - but it's a mass produced consumer grade item. If you want perfection, you're going to have to pay more than a couple thousand $.
People need to stop posting this, the IR and non-uniformity of these screens is NOT acceptable. I would say that a top spec iMac is above standard consumer spec and price, and will again quote, very very few of the previous generations had issues anywhere near this bad. I know IPS displays at this price point aren't 'perfect', but they have been perfect to the naked eye up until this point, so anything less is therefore not acceptable. It IS faulty if its retaining images after 10 minutes- of course it is. Use common sense, its a screen for viewing stuff in real time. Anything which obstructs that is therefore something which makes its purpose redundant to some extent.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 05:36 AM   #297
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Get everyone you know to sign up for this

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Old Feb 5, 2013, 06:54 AM   #298
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Have just skim read this thread and it's really a sense of De Ja Vu. The issue of yellowing, uneven backlight and back light bleed seems to have been an ongoing issue with iMac screens since at least the 2009 re-design. I speak from experience having owned both a 2009 27" iMac and my current 2011 27" iMac. It really does seem pot luck what problems you get, new for 2012 seems to be image retention.

In 2009 the uneven yellowing was so bad that I went through 6 iMacs before I felt sufficiently happy with the display - and i'm not some hyper neurotic perfectionist, it really was that bad. The other issue that the 2009-2011 iMacs can suffer from is blotchiness smoke like markings that accumulate in the display over time - this has happened on my previous 2009 iMac and I've just had the screen swapped out on my 2011 iMac. Before people say it's environmental this same issue has manifested itself on two individual friends iMacs and two work iMacs.

I have extensively dealt with Executive Care who, to be fair, are helpful and go out of their way to assist but always have to deny any knowledge of any such issues being common. Apple will never admit an issue and they are obviously playing a numbers game. Only a certain percentage of buyers are discerning and justifiably want these issues addressed, however there will also be a larger percentage who are oblivious to these issues even if they are present on their screen and finally they'll be those who get good screens.

My advice is that you insist that you keep hold of your current iMac until you receive your replacement - Executive Care were always happy to do that for me and don't believe them when they claim that your new iMac replacement will be thoroughly checked before despatch - on at least three occasions my replacements were worse than the one I was holding.
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Old Feb 6, 2013, 10:09 AM   #299
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelGuy7 View Post
I've been posting in the thread about replacement iMacs but thought I'd chime in on here because my last 2 replacements have been plagued with image retention issues.

I thought my most recent unit was good because soon after taking it out of the box I ran an IR test and didn't not notice any issues. However. after a few hours of light usage I had left a few windows open for about 10-15 minutes while I transferred over some data from my old MBP and I noticed this tons of IR. My 2nd unit had IR (and a ticking\popping sound that seemed to be affected a change in screen brightness) but this seems worse.

Do people actually have good screens that don't have IR, yellowness or uneven lighting? After 3 units I'm starting to give up hope...
How quickly does the IR disappear ? Also for the heck of it use a busy wallpaper that is loaded with color and detail and see if you notice it as much.
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Old Feb 6, 2013, 01:00 PM   #300
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From LifeHacker: Is “Burn-In” Still an Issue on TVs and Monitors?

http://lifehacker.com/5982108/is-bur...s-and-monitors


According to CNET (you know - that company that used to be a reliable news organization):

"Screens are most susceptible to burn-in in the first 100 hours of use ... so for those first 100 hours keep your contrast low (below 50%), and try to avoid watching non-widescreen shows."
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