iMac can rip a Mac Pro a new one.

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 01:03 PM

Anyone else been to the Barefeats.com site. It seems the iMac really is a player. Any thoughts?

Jake0604 · Dec 21, 2012, 01:15 PM

The lack of expandability makes it not worth it for me

theSeb · Dec 21, 2012, 01:26 PM

It depends on which Mac Pro we're talking about.

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 01:31 PM

Well the macs they are using are no slouches. I was just surprised by the iMacs performance. Compared to 5000 dollar machines it does hold it`s own. Not everyone can afford a 12 core with 128 gigs of ram. Btw I want a new mac pro to.

Mackilroy · Dec 21, 2012, 01:37 PM

The iMac has been updated several times since 2010. The Mac Pro has had a very minor update. Once it gets a full update again, no iMac will be able to touch it for software that can use >4 cores.

thekev · Dec 21, 2012, 01:38 PM

Quote:

iMac can rip a Mac Pro a new one.

Famous last words.

I find Apple's desktop solutions to be a bit limiting right now. It's very annoying if you're trying to hit a certain combination of features and flexibility, especially if you dislike their display options compared to some of what is available in discrete displays. I wonder how long the traditional desktop display will hold up as a business model. They've been kind of stagnant as a whole. Resolution and other factors haven't changed much in the past several years.

derbothaus · Dec 21, 2012, 02:49 PM

You do know that if they tested with driver parity (Windows 7) the iMac's will be slower than the 670 and especially the 680 on the Mac Pro's, right? He is testing on Mac OS X only (which has some real bad performance ports anyway). The kepler based cards running on the Mac Pro have driver issues as they are not supported fully yet. They work but optimizations have not really taken place that I know of yet. OS X will slowly get faster for the same desktop cards as new drivers and OS versions leak out. But put it up against Windows supported drivers (which is what any sane gamer uses anyway) and the story looks much different.

Zwhaler · Dec 21, 2012, 03:39 PM

http://www.barefeats.com/imac12p2.html

Meh, it's good but can't render like my 2 year old Mac Pro lol. Nice job on the GPU tests.

Moonjumper · Dec 21, 2012, 04:06 PM

The iMac is much closer than it should be because the Mac Pro has fallen behind where it should be. The Mac Pro needs to be returned to the cutting edge. Hopefully the promised update in 2013 will do this.

The Mac Pro is needed in the Apple line up. Sales have languished, but I'm sure a lot of that is due to the neglect. But anyway, the value of the model is more than just the finances. It is the most powerful device Apple creates (or should be) and is therefore a halo model and statement of capability.

SDAVE · Dec 21, 2012, 04:45 PM

Once the MP gets an update (cross fingers) it will kill anything in it's path.

Nothing beats full speed CPU's and GPU's.

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 05:15 PM

Sounds like I hit a soft spot. The whole point is the mac pro in its current form is a total wast of money. Splitting hairs doesnt make it any better. Saying the mac pro is a real killer when using windows makes no fn sence to me and the desktop 680 is not even an apple card. Leave the 5870 in there which is a real looser of a card and where are we then. Saying the next mac pro will kill it makes no sence either. Im just saying I have a mac pro and if I were to buy a new one it is still a dinosaur. Can we not even muster up a small way to go for the iMac without splitting hairs on everything.

ashman70 · Dec 21, 2012, 05:20 PM

I don't think its a waste of money, I would agree that its not great value for your money compared to the updated iMac's but lets not forget different strokes for different folks. If you need expandability and upgradeability and want to be on the OSX platform, then certainly nothing beats the Mac Pro for those things. In terms of raw horsepower, its certainly unfair since the current Mac Pro is over two years old. Lets wait and see if the Mac Pro gets updated, then we can compare apples to apples.

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ashman70

I don't think its a waste of money, I would agree that its not great value for your money compared to the updated iMac's but lets not forget different strokes for different folks. If you need expandability and upgradeability and want to be on the OSX platform, then certainly nothing beats the Mac Pro for those things. In terms of raw horsepower, its certainly unfair since the current Mac Pro is over two years old. Lets wait and see if the Mac Pro gets updated, then we can compare apples to apples.

Thats my whole point. There is no new pro. Im just saying compared to the one`s on bare feats tests it done pretty good. I didnt make up these tests to upset anyone, they are someone else's findings. It just boils my blood that I have a mac pro and because of GPU rendering going the way it is and Cuda being non existing with amd cards, my lap top is way better for the job. My mac pro is old but I cant justify buying a new one. All the cores in the world cant help with GPU rendering or am I just flat wrong.

OrangeSVTguy · Dec 21, 2012, 05:36 PM

I do like option 4+ internal hard drives/ssds and the ability to change out my CPUs and GPUs with desktop versions.

wonderspark · Dec 21, 2012, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Sounds like I hit a soft spot. The whole point is the mac pro in its current form is a total wast of money. Splitting hairs doesnt make it any better. Saying the mac pro is a real killer when using windows makes no fn sence to me and the desktop 680 is not even an apple card. Leave the 5870 in there which is a real looser of a card and where are we then. Saying the next mac pro will kill it makes no sence either. Im just saying I have a mac pro and if I were to buy a new one it is still a dinosaur. Can we not even muster up a small way to go for the iMac without splitting hairs on everything.

Ha, I think you hit a nonsense spot, nothing more. That Barefeats test showed the Mac Pro beating the iMac at almost every single task, and that's a single 6-core CPU with the 5870. Upgrade the GPU on the Mac Pro (cheaply, easily done) and it's even worse for the iMac. No thanks.

I updated my 2009 MP to 6-core for $590, and would choose it every time over a new iMac. You're impressed with the new iMac. Good for you. I'm not, because it doesn't cut it for my business. Someday, Apple may make something worthy in the iMac line, but that day is not here yet.

bernuli · Dec 21, 2012, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Anyone else been to the Barefeats.com site. It seems the iMac really is a player. Any thoughts?

I suppose it might be. But I don't like the screen.

Might make sense to get one though, and use the thunderbolt port to hook it up to an external thunderbolt display....oh wait a minute..

B

SDAVE · Dec 21, 2012, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Sounds like I hit a soft spot. The whole point is the mac pro in its current form is a total wast of money. Splitting hairs doesnt make it any better. Saying the mac pro is a real killer when using windows makes no fn sence to me and the desktop 680 is not even an apple card. Leave the 5870 in there which is a real looser of a card and where are we then. Saying the next mac pro will kill it makes no sence either. Im just saying I have a mac pro and if I were to buy a new one it is still a dinosaur. Can we not even muster up a small way to go for the iMac without splitting hairs on everything.

How is it a waste of money if it still works fine and does what I need?

My 2008 MP 8 Core is still plenty powerful. I just put in an SSD and it flies. Sure, if you NEED to buy something now, MP might not make a lot of sense. But if you already bought it, then it is a fine machine.

I do not understand people like you.

It's not a secret the MP has not been updated in a while.

wonderspark · Dec 21, 2012, 05:51 PM

The expandability and ease of modification are the biggest benefits of the Mac Pro. I have USB 3.0, eSATA, BD-R and a 12TB RAID 6 tower connected to my Mac Pro, which makes doing my job quicker and easier. The cost and hassle of adding such things to an iMac make the choice obvious for me.

I think you have it backwards, in regards to being an fn baby. Sorry to see you're upset that you don't have anyone supporting your idea that an iMac can rip new ones in Mac Pros.

gpzjock · 08:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Sounds like I hit a soft spot. The whole point is the mac pro in its current form is a total wast of money. Splitting hairs doesnt make it any better. Saying the mac pro is a real killer when using windows makes no fn sence to me and the desktop 680 is not even an apple card. Leave the 5870 in there which is a real looser of a card and where are we then. Saying the next mac pro will kill it makes no sence either. Im just saying I have a mac pro and if I were to buy a new one it is still a dinosaur. Can we not even muster up a small way to go for the iMac without splitting hairs on everything.

The Mac Pro is 2010 tech vs. an iMac that just got new boots and panties. My MP octo 3,1 still rocks the chops thanks to RAM, SSD and GFX card upgrades over the last 4 years. It may not be as fast as an i7 iMac but it still does what I want when I want it to with zero downtime. It runs 11000 point Geekbench scores while the i7 iMac does 12500 straight out of the box. Took nearly 5 years to catch me, what kept you?

Make a Hackintosh out of 2012 parts and it will hand the newest iMac its arse for the same money while being very upgradable in the future. If Apple make a new Mac Pro in the coming months it will do the same but cost a shed more. Apple are too busy coining it on the mobile market to give a toss about expandable desktop hardware and it shows.

In 4 years time the Hack or MP will still be viable/expandable, the iMac not so much, in fact not at all without major phuqery. I used to buy an iMac every 3 years because the previous one couldn't keep up and couldn't be upgraded. In 2008 I spent the same money on a MP that still runs fast enough nearly 5 years later... It may well be the last Mac I buy as making my own machine and sticking OS X on it looks more and more like a better idea everyday.

Dr. Stealth · 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Anyone else been to the Barefeats.com site. It seems the iMac really is a player. Any thoughts?

It's a "Player" alright. I'll stick with my "Worker".

Fastest Geekbench I could find for an iMac: (may be a HackiMac)

My current Geekbench score: (of course there are even faster Mac Pros)

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 06:36 PM

Ok guys. Sorry for the temper. I agree with everything about the mac pro being better. I have made all the same arguments myself. But the fact that an iMac like what I buy for my kids is climbing up on the current mac pro is some what disheartening. I am not some itoy fan nor am I making a case for the iMac. I have had every I mac that ever came out, but they have always been for my two daughters. I have always used a mac tower, G5`s and three mac pros. So I get what you are saying. Its just you are not getting where Im coming from. But when people put words into your mouth and then call you a itoy fan boy, yes I do want to choke them. Sorry. Telling me what the mac pro is and what it is capable of is something I already know. Maybe I should have looked at what bare feats posted closer. All I took from it was the iMac is doing pretty good for a machine I have never given a second look to. Sorry for being impressed with it. But that doesn't make me ignorant to what a mac pro is nor does it make me a itoy fan boy.

wonderspark · Dec 21, 2012, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lampliter

Ok guys. Sorry for the temper. I agree with everything about the mac pro being better. I have made all the same arguments myself. But the fact that an iMac like what I buy for my kids is climbing up on the current mac pro is some what disheartening. I am not some itoy fan nor am I making a case for the iMac. I have had every I mac that ever came out, but they have always been for my two daughters. I have always used a mac tower, G5`s and three mac pros. So I get what you are saying. Its just you are not getting where Im coming from. But when people put words into your mouth and then call you a itoy fan boy, yes I do want to choke them. Sorry. Telling me what the mac pro is and what it is capable of is something I already know. Maybe I should have looked at what bare feats posted closer. All I took from it was the iMac is doing pretty good for a machine I have never given a second look to. Sorry for being impressed with it. But that doesn't make me ignorant to what a mac pro is nor does it make me a itoy fan boy.

I agree there... it's impressive to see how far the iMac has come, but like you said, you get them for your children. On that note, my Mom loves her new iMac. She is a graphic designer / artist, and uses it for Illustrator and Photoshop, among other things. It's fine for her, and it's fine for your daughters, but when you need to push some limits, it's often no longer fine.

In time, Mac Pros will be dethroned... maybe.

gpzjock · Dec 21, 2012, 06:43 PM

Apology accepted, I was only taking the piss with the fanboy bit, soz man.

"The only Mac that can beat it (new i7 iMac) in all tests is an 8 or 12 core Mac Pro with a really fast fully compatible GPU -- faster than any GPU you can buy on the Apple online Store."

Barefeats pointed out the main reason the MP is more viable in the real world, sheer brute force and adaptability.
I reckon most Pro users are just as frustrated as you are about Apple's lack of development in this market.
More is the pity.

wonderspark · Dec 21, 2012, 06:53 PM

My point is that I'm specifically *NOT* frustrated at all, personally. I bought this thing at the end of 2009, and it's still better than today's iMac. I'm thrilled with how long this thing has delivered reliable and respectable performance. I would have needed to buy at least two iMacs to keep up with this level of performance by now, costing more than my whole setup by a large chunk.

lampliter · Dec 21, 2012, 07:00 PM

Thanks guys for not totally giving up on me. The rip a new one in the mac pro thing is not my opinion it was meant to grab attention and I thought it was funny at the time. Merry Christmas and the photo of Will Ferrel with the beer in his hand is priceless.

Dec 21, 2012, 01:03 PM	#1
lampliter macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	iMac can rip a Mac Pro a new one. Anyone else been to the Barefeats.com site. It seems the iMac really is a player. Any thoughts?
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 01:26 PM	#3
theSeb macrumors 603 Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Poole, England	It depends on which Mac Pro we're talking about. __________________ What is Other on my HDD? Upgrading to Mountain Lion? Check out my free iBook with video tutorials on iTunes 2012 iMac comparison chart
	5

Dec 21, 2012, 01:37 PM	#5
Mackilroy macrumors 68040 Join Date: Jun 2006	The iMac has been updated several times since 2010. The Mac Pro has had a very minor update. Once it gets a full update again, no iMac will be able to touch it for software that can use >4 cores. __________________ Can a mortal ask questions which God finds unanswerable? Quite easily, I should think. All nonsense questions are unanswerable.
	5

Dec 21, 2012, 02:49 PM	#7
derbothaus macrumors 68040 Join Date: Jul 2010	You do know that if they tested with driver parity (Windows 7) the iMac's will be slower than the 670 and especially the 680 on the Mac Pro's, right? He is testing on Mac OS X only (which has some real bad performance ports anyway). The kepler based cards running on the Mac Pro have driver issues as they are not supported fully yet. They work but optimizations have not really taken place that I know of yet. OS X will slowly get faster for the same desktop cards as new drivers and OS versions leak out. But put it up against Windows supported drivers (which is what any sane gamer uses anyway) and the story looks much different. __________________ Mac Pro W3680, GTX 680 2GB, 12GB DDR3, SSD; MBP Mid 2012, 2.6GHz Core i7, 16GB DDR3, SSD
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 03:39 PM	#8
Zwhaler macrumors 601 Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Final Cut Pro	http://www.barefeats.com/imac12p2.html Meh, it's good but can't render like my 2 year old Mac Pro lol. Nice job on the GPU tests. __________________ Mac Pro + Galaxy Note 2 Check Out My YouTube Channel~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 01:15 PM	#2
Jake0604 macrumors member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Vulcan	The lack of expandability makes it not worth it for me
	9

Dec 21, 2012, 01:31 PM	#4
lampliter Thread Starter macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	Well the macs they are using are no slouches. I was just surprised by the iMacs performance. Compared to 5000 dollar machines it does hold it`s own. Not everyone can afford a 12 core with 128 gigs of ram. Btw I want a new mac pro to.
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 04:06 PM	#9
Moonjumper macrumors 6502a Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Lincoln, UK	The iMac is much closer than it should be because the Mac Pro has fallen behind where it should be. The Mac Pro needs to be returned to the cutting edge. Hopefully the promised update in 2013 will do this. The Mac Pro is needed in the Apple line up. Sales have languished, but I'm sure a lot of that is due to the neglect. But anyway, the value of the model is more than just the finances. It is the most powerful device Apple creates (or should be) and is therefore a halo model and statement of capability. __________________ ShootStorm - universal neo-retro iOS shoot-em-up action ShootStorm Survival - free single-life version
	1

Dec 21, 2012, 04:45 PM	#10
SDAVE macrumors 68020 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Nowhere	Once the MP gets an update (cross fingers) it will kill anything in it's path. Nothing beats full speed CPU's and GPU's. __________________ iPhone 5, MacBook Pro (2011), Mac Pro 2008, Apple Cinema Display 30" Aluminium
	1

Dec 21, 2012, 05:15 PM	#11
lampliter Thread Starter macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	Sounds like I hit a soft spot. The whole point is the mac pro in its current form is a total wast of money. Splitting hairs doesnt make it any better. Saying the mac pro is a real killer when using windows makes no fn sence to me and the desktop 680 is not even an apple card. Leave the 5870 in there which is a real looser of a card and where are we then. Saying the next mac pro will kill it makes no sence either. Im just saying I have a mac pro and if I were to buy a new one it is still a dinosaur. Can we not even muster up a small way to go for the iMac without splitting hairs on everything.
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 05:20 PM	#12
ashman70 macrumors 6502a Join Date: Dec 2010	I don't think its a waste of money, I would agree that its not great value for your money compared to the updated iMac's but lets not forget different strokes for different folks. If you need expandability and upgradeability and want to be on the OSX platform, then certainly nothing beats the Mac Pro for those things. In terms of raw horsepower, its certainly unfair since the current Mac Pro is over two years old. Lets wait and see if the Mac Pro gets updated, then we can compare apples to apples. __________________ Iphone 4s 16GB, iPad Mini 32GB wifi Mac Pro 3,1 2x2.8GHz Xeon quad core, EVGA 670, 16GB RAM, 1x256GB SSD, 1x2TB, 4x3TB, LG Bluray burner, 3x Dell 23" LED
	2

Dec 21, 2012, 05:36 PM	#14
OrangeSVTguy macrumors 68040 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Northeastern Ohio	I do like option 4+ internal hard drives/ssds and the ability to change out my CPUs and GPUs with desktop versions. __________________ *010011110111001001100001011011100110011101100101010100110101011001010100011001110111010101111001*
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 05:51 PM	#18
wonderspark macrumors 68020 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Denver, CO	The expandability and ease of modification are the biggest benefits of the Mac Pro. I have USB 3.0, eSATA, BD-R and a 12TB RAID 6 tower connected to my Mac Pro, which makes doing my job quicker and easier. The cost and hassle of adding such things to an iMac make the choice obvious for me. I think you have it backwards, in regards to being an fn baby. Sorry to see you're upset that you don't have anyone supporting your idea that an iMac can rip new ones in Mac Pros. __________________ Wait a second... So you're telling me anything that happens in the sky is legal, and there's a giant crime-blimp flying around this place? I don't know how I missed that.
	2

Dec 21, 2012, 06:36 PM	#21
lampliter Thread Starter macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	Ok guys. Sorry for the temper. I agree with everything about the mac pro being better. I have made all the same arguments myself. But the fact that an iMac like what I buy for my kids is climbing up on the current mac pro is some what disheartening. I am not some itoy fan nor am I making a case for the iMac. I have had every I mac that ever came out, but they have always been for my two daughters. I have always used a mac tower, G5`s and three mac pros. So I get what you are saying. Its just you are not getting where Im coming from. But when people put words into your mouth and then call you a itoy fan boy, yes I do want to choke them. Sorry. Telling me what the mac pro is and what it is capable of is something I already know. Maybe I should have looked at what bare feats posted closer. All I took from it was the iMac is doing pretty good for a machine I have never given a second look to. Sorry for being impressed with it. But that doesn't make me ignorant to what a mac pro is nor does it make me a itoy fan boy.
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 06:43 PM	#23
gpzjock macrumors 6502a Join Date: May 2009	Apology accepted, I was only taking the piss with the fanboy bit, soz man. "The only Mac that can beat it (new i7 iMac) in all tests is an 8 or 12 core Mac Pro with a really fast fully compatible GPU -- faster than any GPU you can buy on the Apple online Store." Barefeats pointed out the main reason the MP is more viable in the real world, sheer brute force and adaptability. I reckon most Pro users are just as frustrated as you are about Apple's lack of development in this market. More is the pity.
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 06:53 PM	#24
wonderspark macrumors 68020 Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Denver, CO	My point is that I'm specifically NOT frustrated at all, personally. I bought this thing at the end of 2009, and it's still better than today's iMac. I'm thrilled with how long this thing has delivered reliable and respectable performance. I would have needed to buy at least two iMacs to keep up with this level of performance by now, costing more than my whole setup by a large chunk. __________________ Wait a second... So you're telling me anything that happens in the sky is legal, and there's a giant crime-blimp flying around this place? I don't know how I missed that.
	0

Dec 21, 2012, 07:00 PM	#25
lampliter Thread Starter macrumors member Join Date: Feb 2008	Thanks guys for not totally giving up on me. The rip a new one in the mac pro thing is not my opinion it was meant to grab attention and I thought it was funny at the time. Merry Christmas and the photo of Will Ferrel with the beer in his hand is priceless.
	0

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