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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:01 AM   #26
leekohler
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Originally Posted by chrono1081 View Post
This!

There should be mandatory classes for gun ownership. No exceptions.
As well as criminal background checks. I don't know why anyone would be against this.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:02 AM   #27
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Did they also take lessons on how to use said weapons? I doubt it. And that's the problem.
I don't know what state thewitt calls home, but I know that when I took my CHL training in Texas several years ago (after having been shooting for many years prior to that), portions of the class included safety training, firearm familiarity training and firearms handling and firing competency testing. It is my understanding (although I have no specific references to cite) that this is pretty common in any concealed handgun licensing requirement.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:03 AM   #28
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As well as criminal background checks. I don't know why anyone would be against this.
Are there states without felony checks? I wasn't aware of that if they are but i agree.

Here in Oregon the background check takes 5 minutes while you wait in the store, it goes out to the database looks for a felony and done.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:03 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by CalWizrd View Post
I don't know what state thewitt calls home, but I know that when I took my CHL training in Texas several years ago (after having been shooting for many years prior to that), portions of the class included safety training, firearm familiarity training and firearms handling and firing competency testing. It is my understanding (although I have no specific references to cite) that this is pretty common in any concealed handgun licensing requirement.
Yeah, but we're not just talking about concealed carry.

No doubt there are stricter regulations for that than just owning a rifle.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:04 AM   #30
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Are there states without felony checks?
All states avoid felony checks when you buy the gun at a gun show or online - just like 40% of all guns sold.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:06 AM   #31
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Yeah, but we're not just talking about concealed carry.

No doubt there are stricter regulations for that than just owning a rifle.
I agree. And I have stated my agreement with stricter regulations for the acquisition of any firearms several times in this forum. Not doing so is insanity.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:08 AM   #32
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All states avoid felony checks when you buy the gun at a gun show or online - just like 40% of all guns sold.
Ah i had forgot about gun shows because i have never been to one or purchased there. Yeah thats not a good loophole at all.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:10 AM   #33
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All states avoid felony checks when you buy the gun at a gun show or online - just like 40% of all guns sold.
That 40% figure, if I recall correctly, comes from a very anti-firearm organization. I'm not about to say it's not true, since I haven't really seen any other sources one way or the other, but based upon my own knowledge and personal experience, I suspect it's an inflated number.

Don't misinterpret my post... I am positively against the gun show loophole, and am of the opinion that no matter what the true percentage is, it is too high if greater than zero. It's just that 40% sounds way out of kilter to me personally.

By the way, I have purchased firearms online, and the procedure involves having the firearm shipped to an FFL holder only, in your residence state. You then must abide by all of the same requirements as walking into any retail shop to purchase in order to get it.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:13 AM   #34
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If it's anything like the last one then it will only apply to weapons sold after the law starts, so these people will get to keep their weapons.
And just like the last one, sell them for a tidy profit.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:17 AM   #35
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All states avoid felony checks when you buy the gun at a gun show or online - just like 40% of all guns sold.
Not all guns sold at gun shows are private sales, a lot of gun dealers sell there as well. They will perform a background check, unless you live in a state where a gun permit/license does not require a background check. But, you are still required to fill out an ATF form 4473.

Firearms purchased online, even from sites like GunBroker (similar to eBay), the firearm must ship to an FFL (Federal Firearms License), where again a background check will be performed, and a form 4473 is still required.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:22 AM   #36
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Originally Posted by chrono1081 View Post
This!

There should be mandatory classes for gun ownership. No exceptions.
Nearly everyone in rural areas takes hunter's safety courses sometime in their life, my parents put me through it before I could go hunting, I think I was 11 or 12.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:25 AM   #37
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Nearly everyone in rural areas takes hunter's safety courses sometime in their life, my parents put me through it before I could go hunting, I think I was 11 or 12.

Nearly everyone, huh? I'm sure you have some citation other than what your parents did.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:28 AM   #38
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Nearly everyone, huh? I'm sure you have some citation other than what your parents did.
I am from a rural area, everyone I knew took the courses so they could hunt with their dads. Anecdotal perhaps, but they don't keep statistics on who takes the courses anyways.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:34 AM   #39
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I am from a rural area, everyone I knew took the courses so they could hunt with their dads. Anecdotal perhaps, but they don't keep statistics on who takes the courses anyways.
If there's one thing I've noticed on this forum, it's that everyone is a liar until proven otherwise.

Your own life experiences seem to have no bearing on anything, anecdotal as it might be. If you can't cite a dozen web references than it just isn't true. I'd like to have $1 for everything I've read from "reliable sources" that was so agenda influenced as to be laughably false.

----------

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Originally Posted by glocke12 View Post
This blatantly flat out FALSE....

Online sales: Ive bought several guns online. They need to get shipped directly to an FFL who than processes the transaction as per federal regulations.

Gun Show Loop Hole: Don't know why its called the GSLH...every gun show Ive been to requires dealers to be FFL holders and to process transactions as per federal regulations.

What is meant by the GSLH is the fact that some states allow private transactions of LONG GUNS ONLY..These take place anywhere and everywhere, and most certainly do not make up 40% of gun sales.


Handguns are regulated more stringently at the federal level, so a private handgun transaction without going through an FFL would be a felony.
I have to correct your impression, even given that I am a very ardent firearm owner.

At least in the State of Texas, I have purchased handguns from "private dealers" at gun shows, with absolutely no vetting done.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:36 AM   #40
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I am from a rural area, everyone I knew took the courses so they could hunt with their dads. Anecdotal perhaps, but they don't keep statistics on who takes the courses anyways.
I can back you up on that too. This was the 1980s but every kid i knew that handled guns has the same course at about age 12. I attended that class with many of my friends and it was taught at the police station i believe. The other place we got gun safety was in boy scouts, it was one of the most popular badges.

Now a far lower percentage of kids are in scouting now ( i think the peak was the 1950s) but that organization teaches an incredibly decent amount of life skills.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:37 AM   #41
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Nearly everyone, huh? I'm sure you have some citation other than what your parents did.
I took these courses as child, as did my brothers, and probably 2/3's of the kids I went to school with.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:42 AM   #42
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Fear has an effect on every society. Let's not try to sound all superior

If there are suddenly more robberies, alarm companies and lock companies do lots of business.
Not acting superior. I'm an American. Just stating, just get the American public scared about something and they will act and call for action.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:43 AM   #43
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I took these courses as child, as did my brothers, and probably 2/3's of the kids I went to school with.
I'll go you one better...

I grew up in an upper middle class Jewish family on Long Island (talk about the height of Liberal thinking!). Given my families advantages, I went to a sleep-away summer camp starting at the age of 7. It was there that I was first taught how to handle and shoot a bolt action .22 rifle (Stevens, as I recall, and then Mossberg).

Luckily, the instructor was extremely competent, and I learned, at the tender age of 7, the two cardinal rules of firearms.

(1) A gun is always loaded
(2) Never point a gun at anything that you don't intend to shoot.

59 years later, those are still the two most important rules affecting my perspective on gun safety.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:43 AM   #44
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If there's one thing I've noticed on this forum, it's that everyone is a liar until proven otherwise.

Your own life experiences seem to have no bearing on anything, anecdotal as it might be. If you can't cite a dozen web references than it just isn't true. I'd like to have $1 for everything I've read from "reliable sources" that was so agenda influenced as to be laughably false.

----------



I have to correct your impression, even given that I am a very ardent firearm owner.

At least in the State of Texas, I have purchased handguns from "private dealers" at gun shows, with absolutely no vetting done.

I stand corrected...that is the law in my state of PA...not federal law.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:44 AM   #45
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Not acting superior. I'm an American. Just stating, just get the American public scared about something and they will act and call for action.
You're right i re-read your statement i was out of line in saying that. Thanks

RD
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:44 AM   #46
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Interesting blog here:

http://piccoloshash.blogspot.com

Americans are panicking, and are speaking with their wallets. If the majority of citizens here in the US want these banned as the news reports say, why have people been flocking to gun stores to get whatever semi-auto weapon they can?

I include myself here.....
it isn't "Americans" that are panicking but rather "some gun owners" who have misled themselves into believing the propaganda that guns are about to be banned......claims like this one for example;

Quote:
I fully anticipate a ban of some type to pass within the next year. I bet it will be comprehensive, and will ban most everything except for bolt action, lever action, and single shot weapons.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:47 AM   #47
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If there's one thing I've noticed on this forum, it's that everyone is a liar until proven otherwise.

Your own life experiences seem to have no bearing on anything, anecdotal as it might be. If you can't cite a dozen web references than it just isn't true. I'd like to have $1 for everything I've read from "reliable sources" that was so agenda influenced as to be laughably false.
The problem with life experiences is that mine might well be different .
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:48 AM   #48
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The problem with life experiences is that mine might well be different .
That very well may be the case, but it does nothing to invalidate that which I know from my own.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:51 AM   #49
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Luckily, the instructor was extremely competent, and I learned, at the tender age of 7, the two cardinal rules of firearms.

(1) A gun is always loaded
(2) Never point a gun at anything that you don't intend to shoot.

59 years later, those are still the two most important rules affecting my perspective on gun safety.
These were the same rules taught at my course when I went. I believe that they greatly enforced the fact on my young brain that these were not toys and one mistake could mean death for someone or something.

Our courses were held at the VFW with policemen and other local veterans.
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Old Dec 22, 2012, 11:51 AM   #50
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I took these courses as child, as did my brothers, and probably 2/3's of the kids I went to school with.
To be fair, if this is generally true what's the issue with making it compulsory?
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