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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:38 AM   #26
samcraig
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Originally Posted by KdParker View Post
Sure, but the numbers are going to be higher, so still good for apple.
Are you sure they will be higher. That's conjecture.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:40 AM   #27
mjtomlin
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We don't know if ATT's iPhone sales for this quarter were best ever for the iPhone - we just know that ATT's smartphone sales were best ever
From AppleInsider quoting the actual press release,

"The carrier said on Tuesday that it sold a record number of iPhones in the holiday quarter. AT&T's previous record came in the 2011 holiday quarter, in which it sold 7.6 million iPhones."
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:41 AM   #28
samcraig
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Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post
From AppleInsider quoting the actual press release,

"The carrier said on Tuesday that it sold a record number of iPhones in the holiday quarter. AT&T's previous record came in the 2011 holiday quarter, in which it sold 7.6 million iPhones."
Are you sure.

I can't find it on the press release:

http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pi...rticleid=35923

ETA: Just checked AppleInsider - they are making the same error this site is and not reading the actual press release and/or making leaps...
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:45 AM   #29
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Are you sure.

I can't find it on the press release:

http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pi...rticleid=35923

ETA: Just checked AppleInsider - they are making the same error this site is and not reading the actual press release and/or making leaps...
Or... someone actually spoke with an AT&T representative after the press release!? The AppleInsider article doesn't specifically say where they got the information, all they said was, "The carrier said..."


However, more than likely everyone is just assuming past trends of iPhone being 80% of sales.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:47 AM   #30
samcraig
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Or... someone actually spoke with an AT&T representative after the press release!?
Responsible journalism would have been to cite that. And given that the press release was issued - and that information is outside of that scope - you would think that AppleInsider would want to "boast" the fact they had new/better info.

So no - I think they are making a leap of facts based on their headline. And I think this site just has it wrong period.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:49 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Are you sure they will be higher. That's conjecture.

AT&T today announced that it sold over 10 million smartphones during the quarter, including "best-ever" sales of both iPhone and Android devices

Since this is an anouncement from AT&T, doesn't seem like 'conjecture' to me.

edit: Hmm seems I spoke to soon since the actual AT&T announcement didn't break down the sales by phone.

Guess we will wait and see.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:51 AM   #32
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Responsible journalism would have been to cite that. And given that the press release was issued - and that information is outside of that scope - you would think that AppleInsider would want to "boast" the fact they had new/better info.

So no - I think they are making a leap of facts based on their headline. And I think this site just has it wrong period.
Well think what you want. There's no reason to think the iPhone wasn't responsible for 80% of AT&T's smart phone sales as that's what they've always been.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:59 AM   #33
samcraig
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Well think what you want. There's no reason to think the iPhone wasn't responsible for 80% of AT&T's smart phone sales as that's what they've always been.
Yes. By all means - let's not let facts get in the way of conjecture. I think it's best to wait for the actual numbers. You can feel free to randomly pick numbers/percentages...

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by KdParker View Post
AT&T today announced that it sold over 10 million smartphones during the quarter, including "best-ever" sales of both iPhone and Android devices

Since this is an anouncement from AT&T, doesn't seem like 'conjecture' to me.

edit: Hmm seems I spoke to soon since the actual AT&T announcement didn't break down the sales by phone.

Guess we will wait and see.
Yeah - that was my point. I am sure iPhones did great. But I'm waiting to see what the actual numbers are because it's possible that it wasn't a record quarter for iPhones. Not necc probable. But possible.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 12:08 PM   #34
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Yes. By all means - let's not let facts get in the way of conjecture. I think it's best to wait for the actual numbers. You can feel free to randomly pick numbers/percentages...
Okay, Debbie Downer, choose to assume the downside. No one really cares if they did or didn't, but why wouldn't anyone just assume they did?

I'm not picking random numbers. The iPhone has always pretty much been 80% of AT&T's smartphone sales. Let's also look at recent reports of Apple pushing past 50% US marketshare and knocking Android down to just over 40%.

You're absolutely right, we won't ACTUALLY know until AT&T releases ACTUAL numbers, but in the meantime, why would you assume otherwise?


Honestly, Samsung NEVER releases ACTUAL numbers and yet no one has a problem believing what all the analysts say with regards to their #1 marketshare.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 12:36 PM   #35
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Sorry but do they CAP your data? or do they throttle you over a certain amount so that you get what you are paying for with your 2007 unlimited data plan. You are paying for 3G speeds, not LTE. I suggest AT&T let you have 3G unlimited, at the 1mb or less you would have gotten in 2007.

I get 35-40mb/s regularly on AT&T LTE network in Tampa. Should I be allowed unlimited data on the cellular network at that speed. If they did, it would crush the network.

I am flipping sick of clueless people who moan and complain when they can't get stuff for free.

AT&T is clearly investing in faster LTE networks which is not free...
Sorry man but this is simply wrong!
If ATT throttle me by slowing my speeds to 1Mb I would be happy, but thats not the case!
Im being throttled right now and my speed is about 256kb when I can get over 20Mb on LTE and 4-7MB on "4G".

I completely understand the high traffic and that they have to throttle some people to be able to keep their network alive buuut puting us below 1Mb thats simply outrageous!
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 12:37 PM   #36
samcraig
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Since when is looking for factual information being a Debbie Downer? If no one cares - why associate my desire for the actual fact with being "depressing"

Assumptions can be made in any direction - they are assumptions.

FYI - the past doesn't equal the present and future. Just because historically it's been 80 percent doesn't mean that's a given....

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post
Okay, Debbie Downer, choose to assume the downside. No one really cares if they did or didn't, but why wouldn't anyone just assume they did?

I'm not picking random numbers. The iPhone has always pretty much been 80% of AT&T's smartphone sales. Let's also look at recent reports of Apple pushing past 50% US marketshare and knocking Android down to just over 40%.

You're absolutely right, we won't ACTUALLY know until AT&T releases ACTUAL numbers, but in the meantime, why would you assume otherwise?


Honestly, Samsung NEVER releases ACTUAL numbers and yet no one has a problem believing what all the analysts say with regards to their #1 marketshare.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 12:48 PM   #37
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every damn quarter has been the "best ever" for AT&T
It is with every carrier usually. They can't say they had the worst quarter now can they?

I cancelled my Verizon contract a year early due to not having a 3G signal in my house and dropped calls. I put up with it a year and just had enough. I could not cancel my AT&T line due to needing a dependable phone while at home. It'e been contract free since May so I'll be using it to upgrade the 3GS to Whatever iPhone comes next. AT&T has never let me down, great customer service and dependable 3G everywhere I go.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 12:51 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Since when is looking for factual information being a Debbie Downer? If no one cares - why associate my desire for the actual fact with being "depressing"

Assumptions can be made in any direction - they are assumptions.

FYI - the past doesn't equal the present and future. Just because historically it's been 80 percent doesn't mean that's a given....
Seeing that the iPhone just recently surpassed over 50% marketshare in the U.S. for the first time ever and Android continued its slide to 40%, I would find it hard to believe this wouldn't be reflected in AT&T's sales since they sell more iPhones than any other U.S. carrier.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 01:07 PM   #39
samcraig
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Seeing that the iPhone just recently surpassed over 50% marketshare in the U.S. for the first time ever and Android continued its slide to 40%, I would find it hard to believe this wouldn't be reflected in AT&T's sales since they sell more iPhones than any other U.S. carrier.
I wouldn't argue that point. That being said - the title of this article and any reference to the fact ATT has stated as such at this point is not accurate.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 02:34 PM   #40
IJ Reilly
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I wouldn't argue that point. That being said - the title of this article and any reference to the fact ATT has stated as such at this point is not accurate.
You're never going to score many points around here by being a careful reader and insisting on accuracy. It only annoys people and disturbs the great MR gestalt.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 02:38 PM   #41
trunten
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
I wouldn't argue that point. That being said - the title of this article and any reference to the fact ATT has stated as such at this point is not accurate.
From http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pi...rticleid=35923

"AT&T Inc. (NYSE:T) announced today that it sold more than 10 million smartphones in the fourth quarter of 2012, topping its previous record quarter of 9.4 million, set in the fourth quarter of 2011. This included best-ever quarterly sales of Android and Apple smartphones."

See the bit in bold. It makes all the difference imo
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 02:57 PM   #42
samcraig
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From http://www.att.com/gen/press-room?pi...rticleid=35923

"AT&T Inc. (NYSE:T) announced today that it sold more than 10 million smartphones in the fourth quarter of 2012, topping its previous record quarter of 9.4 million, set in the fourth quarter of 2011. This included best-ever quarterly sales of Android and Apple smartphones."

See the bit in bold. It makes all the difference imo
Yes. I read that. That doesn't state that it had iPhone record sales. It said combined it had record sales. So what's the confusion? The title of the article MR has is wrong.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 03:17 PM   #43
trunten
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Yes. I read that. That doesn't state that it had iPhone record sales. It said combined it had record sales. So what's the confusion? The title of the article MR has is wrong.
I read it as:
We have record smart phone sales. Included in that record is individual sales records for both Android, and Apple devices.

I think you can admit that it would be very odd of them to say that they had record smartphone sales and even if you remove all the other smartphone phone OS's (windows and...?) leaving just ios and android it's still a record!

For one it would be a pointless metric to track
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 03:20 PM   #44
samcraig
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I read it as:
We have record smart phone sales. Included in that record is individual sales records for both Android, and Apple devices.

I think you can admit that it would be very odd of them to say that they had record smartphone sales and even if you remove all the other smartphone phone OS's (windows and...?) leaving just ios and android it's still a record!

For one it would be a pointless metric to track
I read it as combined - we've had the best smart phone sales this quarter.

The headline of this article states that ATT has best ever iPhone sales in 4Q. Sorry - but while it might ultimately true - there's no way to cull that from ATT's press release as fact.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 03:43 PM   #45
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Carriers will always find a way for something to be "record sales", whether it's over a weekend, quarter, hour, whatever

The main thing to keep in mind, is that while they give total smartphone sales, AT&T never reports the number of iPhone sales... they only report the number of iPhone activations, which results in a more impressive figure.

Activations include hand-me-down and resold iPhones. They also include all the new iPhones, of course, no matter which model (5, 4S, 4) they are.

Often AT&T will add something like "the majority of activations were the new model XX", which could mean anything from 34%-99% of the three models being sold.

--

As for old phones, historically, if the incoming iPhone is a rehash model, the percentage of old device activations is only around 11%, as people don't upgrade as much for incremental changes.

OTOH, if the new iPhone is a very desirable style change or software addition (like Siri), people are quicker to get rid of their old phones, and the fallout used activations can be over 20% of the total on AT&T.

-- For example, when the 4S came out, AllThingsD and CIRP Research found:
  • 79% of iphone sales on AT&T were upgrades.
  • 49% of those upgrade buyers sold/gave their old phone to someone else.
  • 87% of those old phones were likely activated by the new owner.
  • ========
  • 33% total (87% of 49% of 79%) of sales result in a used activation
So for every three new iPhone 4S sold+activated on ATT, one used iPhone was also activated... or 25% of the total eventual activations. That's an impressive used market, but it also meant some of the headlines about 4S "sales" were way off if they just relied on activation count.

Last edited by kdarling; Jan 8, 2013 at 03:55 PM.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 03:45 PM   #46
trunten
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I read it as combined - we've had the best smart phone sales this quarter.

The headline of this article states that ATT has best ever iPhone sales in 4Q. Sorry - but while it might ultimately true - there's no way to cull that from ATT's press release as fact.
But they said that once already. I personally think it would be odd to restate it in the next sentence only slightly differently. As I've said, just my opinion. (see what i did there :P)

Last edited by trunten; Jan 8, 2013 at 03:57 PM. Reason: needed a comma
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 08:22 PM   #47
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some of the people here are so funny

ever since the iphones inception it has been a disgustingly overwhelming majority of sales at AT&T, but this will be the quarter where making that extrapolation based on ATTs press release would be wrong

OF COURSE, the iPhone is going to sell close to 8 million at AT&T this quarter. Anyone who's trying to devil's advocate around that is just being silly.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 08:57 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
I read it as combined - we've had the best smart phone sales this quarter.

The headline of this article states that ATT has best ever iPhone sales in 4Q. Sorry - but while it might ultimately true - there's no way to cull that from ATT's press release as fact.
You forgot about wishful thinking, the most powerful force on the planet. It can make anything true.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 09:00 PM   #49
samcraig
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some of the people here are so funny

ever since the iphones inception it has been a disgustingly overwhelming majority of sales at AT&T, but this will be the quarter where making that extrapolation based on ATTs press release would be wrong

OF COURSE, the iPhone is going to sell close to 8 million at AT&T this quarter. Anyone who's trying to devil's advocate around that is just being silly.
I (and I don't think anyone is arguing) that the iPhone is going to make up the majority of sales. That's not the issue. Do I need to instruct you to read the headline of the article. That's what is what I (personally) object to - because there's no evidence whatsoever that it's true based on the information MR is citing.
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Old Jan 8, 2013, 11:16 PM   #50
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I (and I don't think anyone is arguing) that the iPhone is going to make up the majority of sales. That's not the issue. Do I need to instruct you to read the headline of the article. That's what is what I (personally) object to - because there's no evidence whatsoever that it's true based on the information MR is citing.
i'm not disagreeing with that. my point is it seems rather silly to sit around arguing about semantics like that. we all know the iPhone is going to be around 80% of ATT smartphone sales. We also know that ATT sold 10 million smartphones in the quarter. If history repeats itself (and there's ZERO indication that it won't) iPhone will sell around 8 million units. The best ever at ATT is 7.6M. You're making it sound like some stretch that Apple could have beaten the record at ATT.

I'm a betting man btw, and I have no problem entertaining your semantic argument if you're so inclined

My prediction? Apple is setting a record at ATT, I'll make a crapload of money, and some of the people here will talk about how Apple's qtr was a disappointment!
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