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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:07 PM   #26
needfx
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Originally Posted by jontech View Post
Speak for you own house buddy
was satirizing efficiency across the board, why the hazing?
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:10 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by guerro View Post
Thanks for the History update. I already know all this. However, you might not have been able to sense my sarcasm. And, no, Apple did not go bankrupt.
They were VERY close to bankruptcy however. Around 90 days away from bankruptcy in fact.

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Originally Posted by pandamonia View Post
All that expectation and all they can do is release the same phone 5 years in a row
Was playing around with my original iPhone. The difference is night and day. It is not the same phone, unless you are are a kid that demands that every single update have a complete redesign of the UI.

Seriously, loading the facebook app takes at least 20 seconds on the original. iPhone 4S does it instantly.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:12 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by needfx View Post
was satirizing efficiency across the board, why the hazing?
I was making a funny
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:14 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by jontech View Post
I was making a funny
were you now?
I sensed a disturbance in the force
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:14 PM   #30
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Sounds good on paper. However, knowing a couple of hardware engineers at Apple I would never even consider working for that sweatshop. 12-14 hour days + weekends without better compensation are a modern form of slavery. Good products, but at the price of its employees.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:16 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by needfx View Post
were you now?
I sensed a disturbance in the force
Probably because I am out of toilet paper!
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:18 PM   #32
needfx
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Originally Posted by jontech View Post
Probably because I am out of toilet paper!
clever one I must admit!!

seems though that my toilet humor (or simply lack of...) has took a turn for the worse, while pulling along the rest of humanity off-topic.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:19 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by 12dylan34 View Post
Without the leadership of Steve Jobs, yes. While Steve was off founding NEXT, Apple's leadership was shotgun-blasting the market with products like printers, CD players, speakers, and digital cameras.

Steve came back by Apple acquiring NEXT and made the famous chart with consumer and professional on one axis and portable and desktop on the other. He minimized their computer line to 4 products, which, along with some funding from Microsoft, saved the company.
You might do well to read a book. Some of what you say was true. However, Apple never went bankrupt nor did Apple ever approach bankruptcy. The point, however, where betrayed your unfamiliarity with facts is the $150 million settlement with Microsoft. This sum was 3.75% of Apple's $4 billion in the bank, a drop in the bucket.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:24 PM   #34
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Originally Posted by SmileyBlast! View Post
Man why so cynical? Apple ruined your company or something?
And even if they did...at least the paid you for it
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:28 PM   #35
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I take exception to the slam on Intel. I worked for Intel for 3 years as a marketing manager before I returned to get a Ph.D, and to say that they don't expect excellence out of employees is B.S.

I love the great things that Apple does, but it's not like there is a bunch of crap coming out of Intel. This guy is just taking a shot at a former partner. Intel has always had the reputation of hiring the best and brightest. Maybe Apple is wringing more out of their employees, but Intel is no slouch at innovation and consistent, quality improvement.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:29 PM   #36
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Originally Posted by daftpunker909 View Post
Sounds good on paper. However, knowing a couple of hardware engineers at Apple I would never even consider working for that sweatshop. 12-14 hour days + weekends without better compensation are a modern form of slavery. Good products, but at the price of its employees.
It is not like they went into the job blind. I am sure that most people know what is expected of them plus they paid quite well to start with.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:31 PM   #37
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Originally Posted by Squilly View Post
Just another company for Apple to ruin. Or maybe... miraculously.... it'll be a decent partnership/buyout.
Are you a Samsung marketing employee? I was reading about a less publicized Samsung marketing tactic the other day. It involves hiring regular forum Trolls to wage a war of attrition against Apple to tarnish their brand.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:35 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phillipduran View Post
... things reach a point that they are really good enough how they are....
This is something that should never be said when dealing with a company that has done some major innovations in the markets that it's in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mono1980 View Post
If you do it right the first time, there is no need to reinvent it.
Same with this. The products Apple helped reinvent were done rather well, but Apple still found room for improvement.

Quote:
Originally Posted by macingman View Post
Was playing around with my original iPhone. The difference is night and day. It is not the same phone, unless you are are a kid that demands that every single update have a complete redesign of the UI.

Seriously, loading the facebook app takes at least 20 seconds on the original. iPhone 4S does it instantly.
I would put most of the improvements from the ver A model to the current gen up there with the march of technology. We do have faster dual core processors, fantastic SoCs, and a bevy of other improvements. The UI and the overall form of the device has stayed the same.

Now, I agree, there shouldn't be change for change sake, but most devices from the competitors that break away from the norm are changing for the sake of the user experience.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:38 PM   #39
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He probably just got out shined too many times at the weekly or bi-weekkly meeting.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:40 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guerro View Post
Apple went Bankrupt in the late 1990s??????????????
If it weren't for the Microsoft bailout they would have.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PlutoPrime View Post
Are you a Samsung marketing employee? I was reading about a less publicized Samsung marketing tactic the other day. It involves hiring regular forum Trolls to wage a war of attrition against Apple to tarnish their brand.

I would love to see a link and evidence. (serious).
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:42 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by jav6454 View Post
Expecting A+ always vs rewarding A+... different approaches and yet both are leading the same road albeit different markets.
I wonder what A+ is responsible for iTunes 11. And the swiss railway clock disaster. And you can't fix maps with a dozen A+ people, but you can with 1000 B-.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GuitarDTO View Post
One of my favorite parts of the Jobs biography was the talk about how he didn't want "B team" players at Apple, only A team players. *Sounds like they still carry that approach. *Not many companies do it that way either, there are always B team players. *It's fascinating I think.
That's the correct approach for players. But there is tons of work that needs doing, and I think the players are overstretched.

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Originally Posted by powers74 View Post
If it weren't for the Microsoft bailout they would have.
That's nonsense.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:42 PM   #42
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If I was given a Golden Parachute too I would say whatever they wanted me to say. Just sayin'
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:43 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by jav6454 View Post
Expecting A+ always vs rewarding A+... different approaches and yet both are leading the same road albeit different markets.
Difference is one leads to burn out and once does not.
It could also be said one use the stick for everything and the other use a carrot
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:53 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12dylan34 View Post
...which, along with some funding from Microsoft, saved the company.
The funding from Microsoft was nothing more than a publicity stunt. $150 million when Apple had a couple billion in cash, does not make a "save." At the time Steve took over, Apple's operating costs and product lines were out of control. They were hemorrhaging money and were very close to bankruptcy; the $150 million from Microsoft would've only lasted a week or two.

The Microsoft "deal" consisted of several things and probably were somewhat responsible for helping to save Apple - at least in public perception...

Microsoft would "invest" $150 million in Apple.
They would promise to continue develop Office for Mac.
Apple would drop all patent litigation.
They would both agree to cross-licensing (of current technology) for the next ten years.


What really saved Apple was Steve Jobs trimming off all the fat. Allowing the money they did have to last longer giving them time to refocus, develop new products and get them on the market.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:55 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by powers74 View Post
If it weren't for the Microsoft bailout they would have.
In most ways Microsoft's investment was symbolic and orchestrated by Steve and Bill to help both Apple's image of relevance and Microsoft's image of playing well with others (facing down anti-trust issues at the time). It was also coupled with cross licensing and Office development guarantees. Apple had substantially more money available then the 150m they got from MS ignoring the potential of taking financing. Apple was in bad shape but it had cash on hand, it hand the potential to get more cash (loans), and it could (and very much did) take steps to radically cut costs.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:56 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gnasher729 View Post

That's nonsense.
Yeah, after reading a couple articles, the loan was only $150M when they had over a B in the bank at the time. Who know why these things happen. Essentially covered some marketing costs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtomlin View Post
The funding from Microsoft was nothing more than a publicity stunt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by shawnce View Post
In most ways Microsoft's investment was symbolic and orchestrated by Steve and Bill to help both Apple's image of relevance and Microsoft's image of playing well with others (facing down anti-trust issues at the time).

Yikes, didn't mean to start that landslide.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 12:56 PM   #47
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my guess

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Originally Posted by Squilly View Post
Just another company for Apple to ruin. Or maybe... miraculously.... it'll be a decent partnership/buyout.
Anti-apple company ceo
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 01:07 PM   #48
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Originally Posted by KdParker View Post
It is not like they went into the job blind. I am sure that most people know what is expected of them plus they paid quite well to start with.
Actually Apple is known in the industry for having pretty average pay. It's actually one of the reasons they don't get the "best" people overall. Lower pay, and a culture that is pretty controlling.

Google is known for getting the best engineers. Excellent pay, excellent work environment, and a much more creative and "open" culture.

You can look into this stuff yourself, if you don't believe me.
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 01:09 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by carmenodie View Post
KFC has been frying of chicken for over 40 years in a row and that sh** is still fingering licking good.
Are you saying Apple is the KFC of consumer electronics?

Quote:
Originally Posted by daftpunker909 View Post
Sounds good on paper.
Toilet paper?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
I take exception to the slam on Intel. I worked for Intel for 3 years as a marketing manager before I returned to get a Ph.D, and to say that they don't expect excellence out of employees is B.S.

I love the great things that Apple does, but it's not like there is a bunch of crap coming out of Intel. This guy is just taking a shot at a former partner. Intel has always had the reputation of hiring the best and brightest. Maybe Apple is wringing more out of their employees, but Intel is no slouch at innovation and consistent, quality improvement.
I don't think it was a slam on Intel - he wasn't saying Intel doesn't hire great people who do great work, just that if you spent a day at Intel doing merely good work you wouldn't be worried about keeping your job. Sounds like working at Apple must be horrible, to be honest!

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by TennisandMusic View Post
Actually Apple is known in the industry for having pretty average pay. It's actually one of the reasons they don't get the "best" people overall. Lower pay, and a culture that is pretty controlling.

Google is known for getting the best engineers. Excellent pay, excellent work environment, and a much more creative and "open" culture.

You can look into this stuff yourself, if you don't believe me.
I'm an Apple fanboy, but I know where I'd rather work! (Not that either of them would hire me, of course!)
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Old Jan 9, 2013, 01:10 PM   #50
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Originally Posted by Nunyabinez View Post
I take exception to the slam on Intel. I worked for Intel for 3 years as a marketing manager before I returned to get a Ph.D, and to say that they don't expect excellence out of employees is B.S.

I love the great things that Apple does, but it's not like there is a bunch of crap coming out of Intel. This guy is just taking a shot at a former partner. Intel has always had the reputation of hiring the best and brightest. Maybe Apple is wringing more out of their employees, but Intel is no slouch at innovation and consistent, quality improvement.
I can imagine this being the case.

Still, regardless of their comparative standards, Intel still gets results. They seem to have had a symbiotic relationship with Apple. The latter wanted lower-heat CPUs for their new slim model laptops... bang.
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