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Old Jan 11, 2013, 05:00 PM   #126
AppliedMicro
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Originally Posted by cgc View Post
I don't see why Apple can't do both (e.g. sell outright and stream for monthly fee).
Isn't that what they are already doing?

First selling you music outright on iTunes.
And then charging you a monthly* fee to stream to you with iTunes Match?





* OK, so the fee is yearly, not monthly
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 05:39 PM   #127
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The problem with the streaming services is that the artist gets absolutely jack. That might not matter so much for chart topping pop artists who have countless additional revenue streams (huge concerts, endorsements, appearances, etc.) but for the majority of artists who have to survive on less than a traditional 9-5 job it matters a lot.

According to this article by Damon Krukowski (of Galaxie 500 and Damon & Naomi), to make the same amount of money as selling one LP they need 47,680 plays on Spotify and an incredible 312,000 plays on Pandora.
http://pitchfork.com/features/articles/8993-the-cloud/
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 06:25 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by iAco View Post
The money is in the material. Not assembly. China is assembly labor. $90/mo/peasant (50+hrs/wk).

Depending on the materials you use, and believe the list is infinite, and how you engineer it (eg you can use square drivers over circles to push more volume), is what determines the price and performance.

You can get a plasma speaker and enjoy 0 Ohms. Crystal clear sound but lacks bass. But this is just an example of "materials" used and the technology that produces the sound. It's more complicated for headphones because you're moving so little air. I'm talking about bass specifically (as the OP discusses Beats). For good bass in any headphone it must be around ear. With good seal/suction. The oval shape in the Bose QC15 is very good at this. Your ears aren't circles. They are gonna fit better in ovals. This is why I think the comfort level on them is second to none. Those big circular cans/cushions, as you see in the Beats or some Sinneisers, rest against parts of your ear (not head) and that can get irritating/heated. Mind you I'm only talking about cheap headphones (under $400). If you get something like the D7000 or HiFiMan HE-6, those cans are huge and will surely fit comfortably. In some cases you can replace the cushion with cooling-gel in it. This will keep your head cool. Once again, more on materials...

You can buy a plasma speaker, custom made, for $5-10K. But I think that's enormously stupid.

Just saying...

Image
Against all better judgement and everything I have said before: you do have some nice cans

Still: material cost is nothing...just some plastic and metal and manufacturing headphones and tuning them acoustically is much easier then say loudspeaker. Whenever it comes to some ~phile you always get into an area off diminishing returns and people are getting ripped off. Even when you go over on head-fi you see people being very divided there. I mean cryo cables? Really?
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 06:37 PM   #129
iAco
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Originally Posted by Galatian View Post
Against all better judgement and everything I have said before: you do have some nice cans

Still: material cost is nothing...just some plastic and metal and manufacturing headphones and tuning them acoustically is much easier then say loudspeaker. Whenever it comes to some ~phile you always get into an area off diminishing returns and people are getting ripped off. Even when you go over on head-fi you see people being very divided there. I mean cryo cables? Really?
I use cryo cables. I mean why not? If you can, why not? But yes that is complete overkill. Most people aren't ~philes.

I do gotta say the Dolby ATMOS with its 116 surround sound speakers is the best thing that ever happened to my ears outside headphones. :P
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 06:44 PM   #130
Galatian
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I use cryo cables. I mean why not? If you can, why not? But yes that is complete overkill. Most people aren't ~philes.

I do gotta say the Dolby ATMOS with its 116 surround sound speakers is the best thing that ever happened to my ears outside headphones. :P
Why spend money in bogus things? I guess we both just have a completly different feeling what the value of hard earned money is. So I'll leave with that...
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 06:48 PM   #131
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How would Apple make a streaming music service better? Pandora gets the job done for me without any issues, not sure what they could bring to the table that would make me switch.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 09:11 PM   #132
iAco
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Why spend money in bogus things? I guess we both just have a completly different feeling what the value of hard earned money is. So I'll leave with that...
Why spend your hard earned money on a Apple computer when you can get the same at 1/3 the price? Both do the exact same thing. The experience differs.

Same applies to cables. Cryo cables look great and I would assume there is some science that explains why it was introduced to the world in the first place (over traditional copper (twines))

If it wasn't for cable innovation we wouldn't be able to discuss this thousands of miles apart.


Needless to say, spending money is a good thing. And I encourage you to spend more of it! You don't want the German economy to stagnate. By all means keep that money moving, especially into the US by buying Apple! That'll make up for that lovely S7 in my driveway...

Oh boy. I can praise the S7's beauty and the Schwaben build quality like I do headphones and everything else insanely great!

Last edited by iAco; Jan 11, 2013 at 09:25 PM.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 09:16 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by Bobtodd View Post
The only thing "Beats" bring to the Apple store is thieving scum who steal the **** out of them.
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Originally Posted by FreeState View Post
And incredibly bad headphones that have been marketed brilliantly.
And they sell them at the Apple store. Hmmmm....
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 09:27 PM   #134
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Originally Posted by iAco View Post
No.



No? No what? You don't have to agree with me but you won't get a lot of people that will disagree nor will you get a lot of people that will agree with you either. In case you already remembered to care I'm referring to those rappers you call "wannabes" and those Bose headphones you think are so far superior to the rest in the industry and that's just plain wrong.
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Old Jan 11, 2013, 09:56 PM   #135
iAco
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No? No what? You don't have to agree with me but you won't get a lot of people that will disagree nor will you get a lot of people that will agree with you either. In case you already remembered to care I'm referring to those rappers you call "wannabes" and those Bose headphones you think are so far superior to the rest in the industry and that's just plain wrong.
I dislike the word wannabe. That just carries a lot of negativity and stupid people use it. Either you rap, or you don't. No such thing as wannabe. Its like me calling you a wannabe Apple enthusiast.

You haven't gone through some of the previous posts I wrote earlier. I am not saying the Bose headphones are the best in the industry.

I'm saying the Bose QC15 at $300 will be a better value for the buyer than the Beats/Sin counterparts (in the $300 range). Superior comfort, noise cancellation, and great blend of sound! That's it.

Last edited by iAco; Jan 12, 2013 at 12:43 PM. Reason: Moderator action
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 02:18 AM   #136
Cisco_Kid
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Maybe you should learn how to listen to Rap music.
Eww crap music....
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 05:11 AM   #137
Galatian
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Originally Posted by iAco View Post
Why spend your hard earned money on a Apple computer when you can get the same at 1/3 the price? Both do the exact same thing. The experience differs.

Same applies to cables. Cryo cables look great and I would assume there is some science that explains why it was introduced to the world in the first place (over traditional copper (twines))

If it wasn't for cable innovation we wouldn't be able to discuss this thousands of miles apart.


Needless to say, spending money is a good thing. And I encourage you to spend more of it! You don't want the German economy to stagnate. By all means keep that money moving, especially into the US by buying Apple! That'll make up for that lovely S7 in my driveway...

Oh boy. I can praise the S7's beauty and the Schwaben build quality like I do headphones and everything else insanely great!
Yeah well you are kind of making my point:

Apple has a great buildt quality and has different software and hardware then PCs. I can't get a high DPI screen, in such a small chassis with such great battery life like I do with my 13" rMBP on any Windows Notebook. It was a now brained to me, as I work heavily with text and pictures everyday and In getting a good rebate through Apple on Campus. I would however not spend the normal price on it, because 2000$ just doesn't feel right. I don't feel like I get the same value in return when spending that much money.

Cables are something different. It has been scientifically proven, that cryo cables are bogus. It's just electrons moving through the cable. If you want something "superior" to cooper, get silver wires, but I really doubt it will make any difference, evaluate after all, it'a still just electrons moving through the wire. You are falling for their advertisement. You don't even know what they do with the cables. They probably just buy them cheaply on bulk, manufacture them by hand with some fancy connector and sell it to you for 500$. It's simply a rip of and no value what so ever. And while in act spending money is certainly good for economy on normal scale, this kind of behavior actually leads to inflation...basic business science...

But alas I see there is probably not a point in discussing this any further. You live in your in world so by all means, do however you please.
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 12:41 PM   #138
iAco
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Eww crap music....
Ewww.. you!
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Old Jan 12, 2013, 03:18 PM   #139
MrDc2
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If you don't like Beats you're racist against African-Americans. It's that simple.
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 06:39 AM   #140
cgc
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Originally Posted by AppliedMicro View Post
Isn't that what they are already doing?

First selling you music outright on iTunes.
And then charging you a monthly* fee to stream to you with iTunes Match?





* OK, so the fee is yearly, not monthly
They're doing the same thing as Amazon's AutoRipper but not streaming where I can pay monthly or yearly and listen to anything I want, not just the music I bought.
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Old Jan 13, 2013, 09:48 AM   #141
Howdee
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And incredibly bad headphones that have been marketed brilliantly.
A lot of people also say the same about iProducts in general. lol Great marketing, branding, great housing, but the guts are sub-par.
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 10:05 AM   #142
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Spotify will have around 7 million paying subscribers by the end of this year.

7 million paying on average $120 a year = $840 million a year


Subscription will coexist with legal downloads and CD purchase. But with the rise of smartphone, subscription services are also becoming more popular.
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Old Jan 14, 2013, 03:25 PM   #143
AppliedMicro
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Originally Posted by cgc View Post
They're doing the same thing as Amazon's AutoRipper but not streaming where I can pay monthly or yearly and listen to anything I want, not just the music I bought.
Sure.
But why would they offer "unlimited" (more or less) streaming?
I don't think it makes sense for iTunes/Amazon from a business perspective (yet).

Purchasing songs/albums has only recently become "mainstream", even among non-technophile and/or older people. The average Joe has - only recently - moved from CD purchases to Amazon/iTunes Download purchases (if they are still paying for music rather than pirating, that is). And a lot of them are still entrenched in the idea of "owning" their music. So this mainstream crowd are the customers to whom Amazon and iTunes are catering to: by selling individual songs & albums. The matching functionality to move your existing collection over is sold as an "add-on".

I guess that makes them more money in the end than offering a subscription service. Especially when you consider that Apple is still making and selling lots of non-streaming capable hardware (iPods) which the streaming services aren't.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 06:42 AM   #144
cgc
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Originally Posted by AppliedMicro View Post
Sure.
But why would they offer "unlimited" (more or less) streaming?
I don't think it makes sense for iTunes/Amazon from a business perspective (yet).

Purchasing songs/albums has only recently become "mainstream", even among non-technophile and/or older people. The average Joe has - only recently - moved from CD purchases to Amazon/iTunes Download purchases (if they are still paying for music rather than pirating, that is). And a lot of them are still entrenched in the idea of "owning" their music. So this mainstream crowd are the customers to whom Amazon and iTunes are catering to: by selling individual songs & albums. The matching functionality to move your existing collection over is sold as an "add-on".

I guess that makes them more money in the end than offering a subscription service. Especially when you consider that Apple is still making and selling lots of non-streaming capable hardware (iPods) which the streaming services aren't.
Justing looking at the popularity of streaming sites shows it's a great potential revenue stream. People listen to the radio without owning the songs...
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 07:41 PM   #145
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Originally Posted by MrDc2 View Post
If you don't like Beats you're racist against African-Americans. It's that simple.
im black beats suck.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 07:55 PM   #146
MrDc2
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Originally Posted by cpuguy18 View Post
im black beats suck.
You racist
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 08:24 PM   #147
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You racist
Bose QC15 is better.
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Old Jan 16, 2013, 08:45 PM   #148
MrDc2
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Bose QC15 is better.
You still racist.

<jk jk >
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 08:43 AM   #149
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Originally Posted by iAco View Post
Dr Dre, Birdman, Jay-Z, 50 cent

These are just some names with a higher net worth than any of the artists you listen to. Maybe all the artists you listen to combined. They also invested in a lot of ventures outside of music. Dre with Beats. 50 cent with Vitamine Water. Jay-z...

Wiz and Mac are on their way to the top.

The genre you dislike is at the top. And your at the bottom.

Maybe you should learn how to listen to Rap music.

----------



Maybe you're not cool enough for em.

----------



If you want the best quality go with Bose.

Compared to the 3 you listed, Bose QC15s are best.


I went through the most expensive Beats and Sennheisers. Bose still has the best all around ear headphones.

Most comfortable.
Best noise canellation (noticable).
Very good balance between bass and treble.

Beats has more bass than treble (duh)

Sennheiser is a cheaper Bose, less quality
I don't know where to start with this. Bose are crap. Beats are crap. Anyone who thinks otherwise is probably happy with 128Kbps MP3's, and/or are tone deaf. Sennheisers are worlds better, as are AKG, even AT.

Unbelievable, the sort of ridiculous crap that's spewed on the internet these days.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 01:34 PM   #150
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Or people would like to spend money on headphones that live up to the pricetag If I wanted beats quality headphones, I'd pay the 20 they are worth. As it stands my DT 770 Pro's are fine for my needs and were at a fair pricetag for the quality level you get.
yeah exactly! the DT770 are awesome and like the HD25-1 II and the Sony MDR7506 they're industry standards - people should buy these "cans" they're professional and you hear the music the way the artists heard it when they created it.
If you need to EQ you can on your phone but music shouldn't be tainted like it is with Bose and Beats, ever recorded your own music and played it through Bose headphones to find the bass ... your bass overexagerated to the max!
Buy multi purpose headphones kids and get some respect:
DT770
DT880
HD25-1 II
MDR7506
MDR7509HD
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