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Old Jan 15, 2013, 01:16 PM   #1001
samcraig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Valmike View Post
Well, you have me convinced. The fact that it happened that way before guarantees that it will happen the exact same way this time.
The irony of this statement is it's often used to promote the idea that Apple will remain on top/will have record sales/will outperform/etc

I agree with you though. The past doesn't equal the future.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 01:17 PM   #1002
Tinmania
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Originally Posted by ctyrider View Post
Stop being obtuse.
Obtuse is writing "it's a PHONE" and expecting anyone to take it seriously. It's 2013. You can drop that absurd phrase now.




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Old Jan 15, 2013, 01:52 PM   #1003
KnightWRX
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
The irony of this statement is it's often used to promote the idea that Apple will remain on top/will have record sales/will outperform/etc

I agree with you though. The past doesn't equal the future.
Anyway, people are sooooo misinterpreting Phil's words, it's getting ridiculous. He didn't say they weren't going to make a low cost phone, he said they would never do so by sacrificing quality.

IE, iPod Nano/Shuffle type low cost iPhone. Lower cost, no quality compromise.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 02:10 PM   #1004
irDigital0l
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Originally Posted by aliensporebomb View Post
The front facing camera is 13 megapixels? What's the back facing camera? 50 megapixels?
Meant back lol
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 02:16 PM   #1005
roxxette
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Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
Obtuse is writing "it's a PHONE" and expecting anyone to take it seriously. It's 2013. You can drop that absurd phrase now.




Mike
Damn straight !
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:14 PM   #1006
nutjob
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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Anyway, people are sooooo misinterpreting Phil's words, it's getting ridiculous. He didn't say they weren't going to make a low cost phone, he said they would never do so by sacrificing quality.

IE, iPod Nano/Shuffle type low cost iPhone. Lower cost, no quality compromise.
It's marketing speak. Who defined what "sacrificing quality" means?All they're doing is making their cheap plastic phone "without sacrificing quality" by definition, that is: "this is what we meant by not sacrificing quality".

Apple has trained its monkeys well, and they have typewriters!
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:16 PM   #1007
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
This article lacks any original content/research other than hyping the doom/gloom aspect which is pure link bait.
Consider yourself baited! Lol.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:57 PM   #1008
archipellago
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http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/


New York Times via gizmodo confirming original story with plausible figures and also calling out the nonsense that gruber and dalrymple posted.

----------

http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/


Unemotional analysis from a veteran investor who has been right with his predictions recently.

$422
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 04:33 PM   #1009
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Quote:
Originally Posted by archipellago View Post
http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/


New York Times via gizmodo confirming original story with plausible figures and also calling out the nonsense that gruber and dalrymple posted.

----------

http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/


Unemotional analysis from a veteran investor who has been right with his predictions recently.

$422
This guy speaks with credibility. Very sobering.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:01 PM   #1010
apolloa
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Originally Posted by katewes View Post
Those of you old enough to remember Apple's 1st era of market dominance in the early 90's, before it fell off the cliff of near bankruptcy, only to be saved by Steve Jobs' return --- this will feel all too familiar: Apple pioneers a new market segment, dominates market, refuses to budge on price. A competitor comes out with an inferior but widely-licensed product (then, Microsoft/IBM), and gradually Apple loses market share to the point of obscurity.

All this stuff of Phil Schiller's -- "we're not going to reduce price to compromise quality" -- is the same tape recorder as Apple's approach in the late 80's, when Apple did not see it coming. Apple did not see it coming then, and Apple does not see it coming now.

The $120 billion cash pile perhaps makes Apple less vulnerable, but, as you can see from RIM Blackberry, a cash pile will prolong the torture as the victim dies a slow rather than quick death, but a cash pile cannot save you when the market says, "Hey, iPhones aren't cool anymore." That is the point of the death spiral, when a sufficient critical mass says, "Hey, Apple's not cool anymore".

And don't anyone say that's not possible.

All I can say is, the seeds of arrogance have been sowed. Apple thumbing its nose at important market segments, saying they "can't please everyone", and only focusing on the crowd that brings in the money. Well, I have news for Apple. That segment that Apple is kowtowing to, the consumers, are the ones that can, within the space of 1-2 years, decide that Apple is no longer cool, and move to the next cool thing. Is Apple then going to crawl back to its original user-base - the creatives, the professional artists, and start supporting them again.

In history, there is a phenomena known as castles crumbling because of a poor foundation. Apple is destroying its solid base by only focusing on the crowd that, apparently, seemingly, brings in the most money. But, like RIM/Blackberry, that crowd can spin on a time and turn on Apple in an instant.

Apple has rejected the strategy of building a broad user-base, by rejecting its formerly core user base.

Take for example, Apple's 6 year total rejection of the professional graphics market that needs matte or anti-glare screens on its desktop equipment. Do you realise that Apple - as a major supplier of a worldwide OS -- does not provide ANY desktop hardware that has an anti-glare screen.

All fanboys can laugh, and think it is funny, citing that Apple just can't please everyone, and claiming that everyone loves glossy screens.

Well, when the fickle users do a RIM/Blackberry on Apple, at the tipping point when they decide that Apple is no longer cool, Apple will realise the folly of not catering to a wider user-base.

If you think this a rant, you just need to refresh your memories to the recent past when Blackberry was the cool kid on the block, when we admired people with Blackberries, and it was a status symbol.

Anyone who thinks that that can't happen to Apple is no student of history, and those types are bound to repeat history's mistakes.
Cool post mate, kinda explains just why I got a Nexus 7 for Christmas, because the iPad Mini was too little too late and for far too much. Wider market indeed as you stated.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:15 PM   #1011
apolloa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by archipellago View Post
[/COLOR]http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/


Unemotional analysis from a veteran investor who has been right with his predictions recently.

$422
Wow! Very very very very very dark reading in that report! And I trust what he say's. I believe him that the bubble has burst, as he said Apple will remain operational, but if the hedge funds etc sell stock in Apple, blimey.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:32 PM   #1012
almostinsane
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Quote:
Originally Posted by katewes View Post
Those of you old enough to remember Apple's 1st era of market dominance in the early 90's, before it fell off the cliff of near bankruptcy, only to be saved by Steve Jobs' return --- this will feel all too familiar: Apple pioneers a new market segment, dominates market, refuses to budge on price. A competitor comes out with an inferior but widely-licensed product (then, Microsoft/IBM), and gradually Apple loses market share to the point of obscurity.

All this stuff of Phil Schiller's -- "we're not going to reduce price to compromise quality" -- is the same tape recorder as Apple's approach in the late 80's, when Apple did not see it coming. Apple did not see it coming then, and Apple does not see it coming now.

The $120 billion cash pile perhaps makes Apple less vulnerable, but, as you can see from RIM Blackberry, a cash pile will prolong the torture as the victim dies a slow rather than quick death, but a cash pile cannot save you when the market says, "Hey, iPhones aren't cool anymore." That is the point of the death spiral, when a sufficient critical mass says, "Hey, Apple's not cool anymore".

And don't anyone say that's not possible.

All I can say is, the seeds of arrogance have been sowed. Apple thumbing its nose at important market segments, saying they "can't please everyone", and only focusing on the crowd that brings in the money. Well, I have news for Apple. That segment that Apple is kowtowing to, the consumers, are the ones that can, within the space of 1-2 years, decide that Apple is no longer cool, and move to the next cool thing. Is Apple then going to crawl back to its original user-base - the creatives, the professional artists, and start supporting them again.

In history, there is a phenomena known as castles crumbling because of a poor foundation. Apple is destroying its solid base by only focusing on the crowd that, apparently, seemingly, brings in the most money. But, like RIM/Blackberry, that crowd can spin on a time and turn on Apple in an instant.

Apple has rejected the strategy of building a broad user-base, by rejecting its formerly core user base.

Take for example, Apple's 6 year total rejection of the professional graphics market that needs matte or anti-glare screens on its desktop equipment. Do you realise that Apple - as a major supplier of a worldwide OS -- does not provide ANY desktop hardware that has an anti-glare screen.

All fanboys can laugh, and think it is funny, citing that Apple just can't please everyone, and claiming that everyone loves glossy screens.

Well, when the fickle users do a RIM/Blackberry on Apple, at the tipping point when they decide that Apple is no longer cool, Apple will realise the folly of not catering to a wider user-base.

If you think this a rant, you just need to refresh your memories to the recent past when Blackberry was the cool kid on the block, when we admired people with Blackberries, and it was a status symbol.

Anyone who thinks that that can't happen to Apple is no student of history, and those types are bound to repeat history's mistakes.
Insightful!. Dumped my iPhone last year and went to Android. Dumped my Mac 2 years ago and went back to Windows.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 06:02 PM   #1013
samcraig
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Originally Posted by louis.b View Post
And why are you here again?

----------



Hm. let's see how many Galaxy has been released in 2012.

Galaxy s3, galaxy s2, galaxy s2+, galaxy s and s duos, galaxy y and y duos, galaxy w, galaxy mini, galaxy pocket, galaxy music, galaxy ace, galaxy note 2, galaxy BS.

How many of those are phones. And how many are all available in the same market?

Yes - Samsung makes several phones in the Galaxy line. But the S3 and Note are are flagship phones. You know it. I know it. And pretty much everyone else knows it.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 06:51 PM   #1014
FrozenDarkness
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Originally Posted by xofruitcake View Post
But there is a second part of the story. Iphone 4S launched in 4Q11 with 37m sales. 1Q12 Iphone sales was 32M unit. So let's say Iphone 5 sales is 45m unit (remember we have the quality debacle with scuff gate that Iphone 5 was on dealy shipment until mid Nov) and 1Q13 is 32M unit.. And Tim Cook has this fast launching strategy of 100 markets in 4Q.. All the important Iphone market already has Iphone 5 now. So at best we can say is that Iphone 5 will sell about 11-12% better than 4S. And that is in the back drop of an industry that is growing about 40%ish .. How is it not bad?

The problem is that everyone has products that are lower in price point while Apple only has one price point and one model. It works when they are the only game in town. And Apple miss the bigger screen market which can easily mean 20m to 30m a quarter sales.. Apple don't get to decide what is quality product, customer do.. And I think Tim Cook understand this. This market share data is scary if you are Apple..

http://www.icharts.net/chartchannel/...nits_m3rxwypbc

Image
the only thing tim cook understands is profits. people like you need to remember the bottom line
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 08:42 PM   #1015
skottichan
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Apple supplier sees big Q4 boost, likely a good sign for iPhone 5 demand


But... but... Apple... Doomed™
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 08:45 PM   #1016
cameraguy23
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In Canada and I think in the U.S. this was the first time I couldn't buy a unlocked iphone 5 on opening day. Is it because of trafficking that other countries don't have the phone yet? That's bad on you apple, who cares. You just lost a sale on me and many others that lined up that day and couldn't buy the phone. So now three months later after the launch you start selling them unlocked.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 09:22 PM   #1017
cappadonna
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Originally Posted by skottichan View Post
http://www.wired.com/gadgetlab/2013/...demand-report/

http://appleinsider.com/articles/13/...upplier-shifts

http://www.businessinsider.com/chart...-demand-2013-1

I feel like someone decide to troll android users yesterday to make them get excited or something! lol.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 09:47 PM   #1018
maxosx
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Mr. Dohmen is someone who's highly regarded in the investment community. I've regularly read his evaluations & opinions for over a decade. He has a track record of accuracy that is one of the best & most respected.

After I read his recent assessment that I've linked to, it reminds me of how vulnerable Apple may be.

If Apple fails to improve their overall position technically, it will be very disappointing. The iPhone 5 I currently use, by all outward appearances to the average person, looks identical to the three year old iPhone 4. Here in the USA buyers expect fresh new designs on the products they buy. For reasons that only Apple knows, they've kept cranking out the same old thing.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:03 PM   #1019
Sensamic
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It's funny seeing how many Apple fans finally admit iOS is outdated, the iPhone is not revolutionary anymore and its way overpriced, they want bigger screens, they are tired of no jailbreak, etc.

Yet they still buy their products... which doesn't help to force Apple back to work and stop stealing your money with minimal upgrades.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:12 PM   #1020
cappadonna
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Originally Posted by Sensamic View Post
It's funny seeing how many Apple fans finally admit iOS is outdated, the iPhone is not revolutionary anymore and its way overpriced, they want bigger screens, they are tired of no jailbreak, etc.

Yet they still buy their products... which doesn't help to force Apple back to work and stop stealing your money with minimal upgrades.
It probably means that they don't think Apple is stealing their money and are just fine with Apple's offerings.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:18 PM   #1021
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Originally Posted by Sensamic View Post
It's funny seeing how many Apple fans finally admit iOS is outdated, the iPhone is not revolutionary anymore and its way overpriced, they want bigger screens, they are tired of no jailbreak, etc.

Yet they still buy their products... which doesn't help to force Apple back to work and stop stealing your money with minimal upgrades.
Well, maybe because competition offers no viable alternative?
Because if you want a modern smartphone with a great hardware and software,
you can buy Galaxy S, which has outdated pentile screens with visible pixels and lower resolution; the only "innovation" Samsung provides is bigger and bigger screens (but there are always even bigger phones..), or you can buy HTC with its huge clock widget and weird buttons.. or you can buy Windows Phone with its live tiles resembling Mac Launcher of 1990s..
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:27 PM   #1022
flux73
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Originally Posted by Sensamic View Post
It's funny seeing how many Apple fans finally admit iOS is outdated, the iPhone is not revolutionary anymore and its way overpriced, they want bigger screens, they are tired of no jailbreak, etc.

Yet they still buy their products... which doesn't help to force Apple back to work and stop stealing your money with minimal upgrades.
Besides novelty, what do the other phones offer?

Why do you say they're minimal upgrades? What could they add to make you go "Wow!"?

It's funny that Apple bashers keeps saying new iPhones aren't innovative enough and the only thing they keep pointing out is "bigger screen".
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:48 PM   #1023
Digital Skunk
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Originally Posted by azentropy View Post
You realize when Cook took over APPL was at ~370?
So I take it you have nothing to say about Apple's drastic decrease in the past 4 months?

Guess you're only good for epic fail one liners.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 10:51 PM   #1024
flux73
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So I take it you have nothing to say about Apple's drastic decrease in the past 4 months?

Guess you're only good for epic fail one liners.
What does that have to do with Tim Cook? If they have several quarters of crappy earnings with decreasing revenue, then there's some justifiable cause for criticism. The stock price decrease in the absence of earnings report info says less about Tim Cook than it does about the gullibility of shareholders and the manipulativeness of analysts.
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Old Jan 15, 2013, 11:03 PM   #1025
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Blackberry going to introduce a faster operating system this could changing things again. They all fighting to be on top. Remember what going up will going down. You treating other badly will come back to you. Apple on a downslide we will all see how steep the slope is being.
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