Go Back   MacRumors Forums > iPhone, iPod and iPad > Alternatives to iOS and iOS Devices

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:24 PM   #101
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
It is not irrelevant at all. Apple would not allow it in the app store if the design compromised performance as you seemingly believe. You can open 50 tabs in Chrome and nothing happens to degrade performance.




I don't really care what their reason is. I assume it is just like everything else: they think they know best and what users want doesn't really matter all that much. But I know it is not about RAM or performance.

Once again I would like to point out that this is exactly what the OP was talking about. Instead of realizing it is a drawback to the iPhone you are seemingly grasping at straws trying to justify why Apple does it. I suspect if in iOS 7 there is suddenly no tab limitation, or greatly increased, it will be because that was the perfect time for it.

Instead you should be questioning why such an artificial limitation is there and for so danged long. IMO of course.




Michael
You're assuming that the person who tested Chrome would open 50 odd pages to see how it runs, when I find that unlikely.

I don't question why the limit is there because it's pointless.. I won't get an answer.

I just recognise that there HAS to be a reason. Why place an arbitrary limit on the number of tabs you can open if there's no reason to do so? Logic tells me that there has to be a reason for that, and I suspect it to be performance related.

Apple has made a number of trade offs to make sure that the OS remains smooth and battery longevity is good; no widgets, limited background task functionality, static wallpapers. It's not hard to believe that they would limit other things too.

It may just be a legacy thing from when the iPhone had less RAM at its' disposal, but who knows. You know as much as I do without seeing the code.
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:25 PM   #102
onthecouchagain
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
This is coming from someone who was all about the Nexus 4 and how great it is...then you create a thread about all the issues it has and how many people are sending theirs back. interesting.


The Nexus 4 is great. It also has issues. That's something I can comfortably say.
onthecouchagain is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:28 PM   #103
ericrwalker
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Albany, NY
Quote:
Originally Posted by powderblue17 View Post
Maybe because they've passed the FIPS 140-2 security certification.
True, but there are many smartphones that have passed as well. iPhones and Android devices, I think it's more of they're comfortable with it.
ericrwalker is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:29 PM   #104
rmhop81
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Dallas, Tx
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
I'd reconsider whether that's a valid excuse this day and age.

This fear of adding some freedom, flexibility, options, features, etc. might be abated by the fact that Apple offers classes in their stores where people sign up and line up happily for. Every time I visit an Apple store, the classes are packed. Packed with people eager to learn how to use their new shiny products.

And for the "most innovative" company in the world that has the supposedly best people working there, is it a little silly to say they really can't come up with a way to dynamically improve iOS and still make it simple enough to use or, at the very least, teach?

Come on, now.
who is pressuring them to make a change? the only one's that complain are the techies that are on sites like macrumors etc. vast majority of users are basic users and can easily understand how to use it vs. android. android is eventually gonna run out of ideas as they update every single chance they get...same with all the hardware. if it just works why change the formula? seems to be a successful formula don't you think?

you guys just want something to complain about. The nexus 4 was the best thing on earth until you guys got one in your hand. what happened with the advanced technology you had there?
__________________
MacBook Air|13.3"|128GB • iPad Mini 2|32GB|LTE • iPhone 6 Plus|64GB|LTE • Apple TV • Time Capsule
rmhop81 is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:32 PM   #105
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
I'd reconsider whether that's a valid excuse this day and age.

This fear of adding some freedom, flexibility, options, features, etc. might be abated by the fact that Apple offers classes in their stores where people sign up and line up happily for. Every time I visit an Apple store, the classes are packed. Packed with people eager to learn how to use their new shiny products.

And for the "most innovative" company in the world that has the supposedly best people working there, is it a little silly to say they really can't come up with a way to dynamically improve iOS and still make it simple enough to use or, at the very least, teach?

Come on, now.
Out of the millions upon millions of iDevices they sell, how many do you think actually take classes? Just because the classes are full every time you go in doesn't mean they're actually popular in terms of how many devices they sell.

What about all the online orders.. you don't get a free online class each time you order an iPhone.

iOS IS improving, just gradually. Copy/paste, multitasking, notification centre, iCloud, photo stream, none of this was in iOS when it was released...

They are adding to it.

Why do you want iOS to be like Android when Android exists? What's the point in the two OSes being the same?
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:32 PM   #106
onthecouchagain
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
who is pressuring them to make a change? the only one's that complain are the techies that are on sites like macrumors etc. vast majority of users are basic users and can easily understand how to use it vs. android. android is eventually gonna run out of ideas as they update every single chance they get...same with all the hardware. if it just works why change the formula? seems to be a successful formula don't you think?
The implication here is that Apple should hold back upgrades to have stuff to upgrade. Amazing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
you guys just want something to complain about. The nexus 4 was the best thing on earth until you guys got one in your hand. what happened with the advanced technology you had there?
The Nexus 4 has issues. Why is it so amazing that people can be intellectually honest about a device they were looking forward to (and like)?

Thoroughly confused.
onthecouchagain is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:33 PM   #107
Philscbx
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Mpls Mn
Quote:
Originally Posted by powderblue17 View Post
I've had an iPhone for years but it's been left behind so I'm moving on. It just seems since Leopard was introduced all the innovation has just abruptly stopped.


Even RIM the company everyone loved to hate has caught up and passed it with Blackberry 10 which is why their stock is climbing while Apple's is crashing.
You are Spot On-
To Prove a valid Point - all software upgrades from iCloud to ML are all geared to the Mobile devices.
Then killed MobileMe so none of the basic services no longer function. I'm still shaking head.

Nothing's been touched to advance existing Pro Software -
Soon After I purchased Final Cut Studio 2-3 years ago - it all went dead.
$1100 worth dead. Oh well.

All effort is the iPhone and Pads as you noticed - in rapid succession.
Pro-Sites out there doing studio editing with other wares not related to Apple any longer- when it used to be king.

So if more worry over the iPhone comes - it might not be a Happy Hour event. China sales that used to be illegal are now released -
this was another odd twist in the game with a woman going to jail over trying to bring iPhones from here back to China - you all know about it.

Home Page News http://www.apple.com/startpage/
The headlines are only about toys - iPhones & iMacs - NFL Playbooks, OOooo, gotta have that - 3 Mil iPads in 3 Days - That's about it. All Toys.

Not the least interested in iMac - I'll wait till Samsung comes out with curved screen monitors for 3 screen entertainment for the MacPro.
__________________
MP3.1,8GB,4TB, MBPro13 5.5, iPad1 64G, iPhone 3gs, iTouch, PB15 1.6, ATv, Rxv3900.

Last edited by Philscbx; Jan 15, 2013 at 03:45 PM.
Philscbx is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:33 PM   #108
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
who is pressuring them to make a change? the only one's that complain are the techies that are on sites like macrumors etc. vast majority of users are basic users and can easily understand how to use it vs. android. android is eventually gonna run out of ideas as they update every single chance they get...same with all the hardware. if it just works why change the formula? seems to be a successful formula don't you think?
Couldn't have said it better. It's enthusiasts who want the OS to change, but enthusiasts are not even a large percentage of their market. Average consumers seem to like it as they're still selling a bundle.

I know we don't have the numbers for the iPhone 5 yet, but I'm sure they still sold plenty
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:41 PM   #109
rmhop81
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Dallas, Tx
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
The implication here is that Apple should hold back upgrades to have stuff to upgrade. Amazing.



The Nexus 4 has issues. Why is it so amazing that people can be intellectually honest about a device they were looking forward to (and like)?

Thoroughly confused.
no but why give up all your surprises just as you think of them? Android rushes to get a new model phone out the door every 6 months bc of a few upgrades.

I just find it funny how you bash apple products bc you want them to be like the competition....yet when you buy the competition it has hardware flaws....but that's totally ok it's still a wonderful device!

Just funny to me that the Nexus 4 was this amazing piece of technology...then as soon as you got it in your hands you complained about it.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
Couldn't have said it better. It's enthusiasts who want the OS to change, but enthusiasts are not even a large percentage of their market. Average consumers seem to like it as they're still selling a bundle.

I know we don't have the numbers for the iPhone 5 yet, but I'm sure they still sold plenty
haha thanks.

Apple does what they want, when they want. They sell anything like hotcakes. I've given android a try a few times, but I've always been back to Apple and am here to stay. It's easy to use and it just works. Battery life is great. If I ever have a problem...go to genius bar.

oh yeah and high resale value is kinda nice too.
__________________
MacBook Air|13.3"|128GB • iPad Mini 2|32GB|LTE • iPhone 6 Plus|64GB|LTE • Apple TV • Time Capsule
rmhop81 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:43 PM   #110
onthecouchagain
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
iOS IS improving, just gradually.
That's the problem.

No one is saying iOS should be like Android (that'd be absurd). People who are dedicated to the Apple ecosystem or the iPhone would benefit from more improvements.

This is really not difficult to understand.



Speaking generally now... most, if not all, the things being said in this thread are classic apologetic arguments we've seen time and time again.

All one has to do to demonstrate how silly these arguments are is ask the question, "If Apple had X feature, what would that do?" (X being anything iOS/iPhone doesn't have, be it features, screen sizes, etc.)

I guarantee you if the tables were truly turned, Apple would be heralded for features like Smart Stay, or hardware like larger screens, waterproof, 1080p, etc. We might even call them innovators, pushing the technology, forward thinkers...

Again, everything in this thread is an ironic waste of time. This is a game, intentionally or not, of pure obfuscation that detracts us from an intellectually honest discussion of iOS' shortcomings. What's more ironic is that these apologists think they're really helping Apple. It is folly.

That's the last I'll say.
onthecouchagain is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:46 PM   #111
Tinmania
macrumors 68030
 
Tinmania's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Aridzona
Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
You're assuming that the person who tested Chrome would open 50 odd pages to see how it runs, when I find that unlikely.

I don't question why the limit is there because it's pointless.. I won't get an answer.

I just recognise that there HAS to be a reason. Why place an arbitrary limit on the number of tabs you can open if there's no reason to do so? Logic tells me that there has to be a reason for that, and I suspect it to be performance related.

Apple has made a number of trade offs to make sure that the OS remains smooth and battery longevity is good; no widgets, limited background task functionality, static wallpapers. It's not hard to believe that they would limit other things too.

It may just be a legacy thing from when the iPhone had less RAM at its' disposal, but who knows. You know as much as I do without seeing the code.
Really grasping at straws here. To me that just seems like relying on blind faith when the evidence at hand shows it is an artificial limitation. There is no performance issue. There is an Apple issue.

It is the same Apple that places artificial restrictions on older devices to justify holding back features. Sure they come out with some nonsense that has a kernel of truth to it: such as the noise-canceling microphone in the 4S as the deciding factor for it being the only device to get Siri. But then another company, in this case Google, shows how pathetic of an excuse that is by delivering a product that works better than Siri and, yep, does so even on the iPhone 4. Ditto for maps. There was no good reason for the iPhone 4 not to have turn-by-turn directions other than to get more people to upgrade. My girlfriend has an iPhone 4 and I have used both google search and maps on it and was very impressed.

Don't think I always felt this way. I didn't. A year ago I was like you. I probably even defended Siri being 4S-only. But when I saw the iPhone 5 I had had enough. I really woke up after getting my Nexus 4 and realizing just how restricted and confined iOS is.


BTW: I didn't just randomly say 50 open tabs in Chrome. I actually did it. No issues.




Mike
Tinmania is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:46 PM   #112
rmhop81
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Dallas, Tx
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
That's the problem.

No one is saying iOS should be like Android (that'd be absurd). People who are dedicated to the Apple ecosystem or the iPhone would benefit from more improvements.

This is really not difficult to understand.



Speaking generally now... most, if not all, the things being said in this thread are classic apologetic arguments we've seen time and time again.

All one has to do to demonstrate how silly these arguments are is ask the question, "If Apple had X feature, what would that do?" (X being anything iOS/iPhone doesn't have, be it features, screen sizes, etc.)

I guarantee you if the tables were truly turned, Apple would be heralded for features like Smart Stay, or hardware like larger screens, waterproof, 1080p, etc. We might even call them innovators, pushing the technology, forward thinkers...

Again, everything in this thread is an ironic waste of time. This is a game, intentionally or not, of pure obfuscation that detracts us from an intellectually honest discussion of iOS' shortcomings. What's more ironic is that these apologists think they're really helping Apple. It is folly.

That's the last I'll say.
sure iOS has it's shortcomings....but I don't see you or anyone else that has suggestions. Just complaining that these iOS lovers are on apple's side 100%. It's funny bc i have seen several people complain that you can't send multiple pics at once from an iPhone....when....you can. Just a lack of knowledge.

The ironic part is you want all these changes to apple and praise the nexus 4 like it was a god. Then you used it....and of course complained. You just want to complain....we get it!
__________________
MacBook Air|13.3"|128GB • iPad Mini 2|32GB|LTE • iPhone 6 Plus|64GB|LTE • Apple TV • Time Capsule
rmhop81 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:49 PM   #113
onthecouchagain
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
sure iOS has it's shortcomings....but I don't see you or anyone else that has suggestions. Just complaining that these iOS lovers are on apple's side 100%. The ironic part is you want all these changes to apple and praise the nexus 4 like it was a god. Then you used it....and of course complained. You just want to complain....we get it!
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1501886 (This is only one example).

And resorting to ad hominem, an even better argument than obfuscations.
onthecouchagain is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:51 PM   #114
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
That's the problem.

No one is saying iOS should be like Android (that'd be absurd). People who are dedicated to the Apple ecosystem or the iPhone would benefit from more improvements.

This is really not difficult to understand.



Speaking generally now... most, if not all, the things being said in this thread are classic apologetic arguments we've seen time and time again.

All one has to do to demonstrate how silly these arguments are is ask the question, "If Apple had X feature, what would that do?" (X being anything iOS/iPhone doesn't have, be it features, screen sizes, etc.)

I guarantee you if the tables were truly turned, Apple would be heralded for features like Smart Stay, or hardware like larger screens, waterproof, 1080p, etc. We might even call them innovators, pushing the technology, forward thinkers...

Again, everything in this thread is an ironic waste of time. This is a game, intentionally or not, of pure obfuscation that detracts us from an intellectually honest discussion of iOS' shortcomings. What's more ironic is that these apologists think they're really helping Apple. It is folly.

That's the last I'll say.
I don't think the majority of iOS users care about any of that stuff.

Smart stay: very useful but I doubt many people know what it is or care what it is.
Larger screens: obviously doesn't bother everyone who bought an iPhone.
Waterproof: clearly anyone would be pleased with that and it is a good thing to have, but honestly, I've never had a water damaged phone in my life.
1080p: just nah. Not innovative or needed. The likely hit to battery life is unlikely to be worth the slight bump in quality.

If apple wants to add any/all of those things I'd happily use them, but do I see a pressing need for them? Nope.
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:51 PM   #115
rmhop81
macrumors 68020
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Dallas, Tx
Quote:
Originally Posted by onthecouchagain View Post
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1501886

And resorting to ad hominem, an even better argument than obfuscations.
lol of course it's in the alternative to iOS thread.
__________________
MacBook Air|13.3"|128GB • iPad Mini 2|32GB|LTE • iPhone 6 Plus|64GB|LTE • Apple TV • Time Capsule
rmhop81 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:55 PM   #116
TheHateMachine
macrumors 6502a
 
TheHateMachine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Houston, TX
Meh....
__________________
I own stuff that is cool and fits my needs.

Last edited by TheHateMachine; Jan 15, 2013 at 03:58 PM. Reason: Gone
TheHateMachine is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 03:59 PM   #117
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
Really grasping at straws here. To me that just seems like relying on blind faith when the evidence at hand shows it is an artificial limitation. There is no performance issue. There is an Apple issue.

It is the same Apple that places artificial restrictions on older devices to justify holding back features. Sure they come out with some nonsense that has a kernel of truth to it: such as the noise-canceling microphone in the 4S as the deciding factor for it being the only device to get Siri. But then another company, in this case Google, shows how pathetic of an excuse that is by delivering a product that works better than Siri and, yep, does so even on the iPhone 4. Ditto for maps. There was no good reason for the iPhone 4 not to have turn-by-turn directions other than to get more people to upgrade. My girlfriend has an iPhone 4 and I have used both google search and maps on it and was very impressed.

Don't think I always felt this way. I didn't. A year ago I was like you. I probably even defended Siri being 4S-only. But when I saw the iPhone 5 I had had enough. I really woke up after getting my Nexus 4 and realizing just how restricted and confined iOS is.


BTW: I didn't just randomly say 50 open tabs in Chrome. I actually did it. No issues.




Mike
You call if blind faith but I call it logical reasoning.

There is NO BENEFIT for Apple to arbitrarily limit the amount of tabs you can open in mobile safari on iOS.

They don't gain anything by imposing this limitation, therefore the only logical conclusion is that there must be a reason for doing so. Performance is the easiest and most logical conclusion to arrive at.

I went the other way, went from a galaxy S3 to iPhone 5 and I prefer iOS. It's so smooth and simple and does everything for me. I leave wifi and Bluetooth on all the time, it automatically connects to my cars Bluetooth when I sit down in my car (S3 was hit and miss, as was my previous S2). It syncs really well with my iPad. I can talk to the mrs on her iPad.
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 04:17 PM   #118
Tinmania
macrumors 68030
 
Tinmania's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Aridzona
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmhop81 View Post
sure iOS has it's shortcomings....but I don't see you or anyone else that has suggestions.
That is nonsense.

If I say I can set whatever browser I like to be the default on my Nexus but can't on my iOS devices I don't get answers like "yes that would be a nice option to have" or "yes, Apple should do that." Instead I get a bunch of bogus apple-apologetic reasons why Apple does it that way. Or the classic: why? as if I asked for the moon.

If I say I want more than 8 tabs in Safari? Well Apple knows better or it must be performance or due to RAM. Never-mind that the iPad 2 has 24, with a slower processor and half the RAM. Never-mind that performance is the same with 1 tab open or 8. It's after 8 that things will surely come crashing down. Has to be that or Apple would give us more tabs. They know best. Never-mind that I can open 50, yes 50, tabs in Chrome with no degradation. Right on iOS.

So it is not that people aren't suggesting what they want. And yes that may be done by pointing out shortcoming that are readily available on competing platforms. It's that few people--though that is beginning to change from what I see--seem to do anything but defend the status quo.





Michael

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
I don't think the majority of iOS users care about any of that stuff.

Smart stay: very useful but I doubt many people know what it is or care what it is.
Larger screens: obviously doesn't bother everyone who bought an iPhone.
If you don't think the general population is noticing larger screens, and liking them, you are in denial.

Take a walk into a cellphone store and the iPhone stands out because the screen is so small. Well that and the fact that there are like 10 Android smartphones and just two lonely iPhones on the display shelf (maybe 4 if they have one of each color). People are using their phones nowadays practically as PC replacements and the small screen is a drawback whether you believe it or not. Furthermore, I believe this is just the beginning.

Of course as soon as Apple releases an iPhone with a meaningful screen-size increase--and you had better believe they will--it will be perfect.



Michael

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
You call if blind faith but I call it logical reasoning.

There is NO BENEFIT for Apple to arbitrarily limit the amount of tabs you can open in mobile safari on iOS.

They don't gain anything by imposing this limitation, therefore the only logical conclusion is that there must be a reason for doing so. Performance is the easiest and most logical conclusion to arrive at.
Well you go right ahead and keep believing that.




Mike
Tinmania is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 04:34 PM   #119
Yujenisis
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: May 2002
Send a message via AIM to Yujenisis
Quote:
Originally Posted by powderblue17 View Post
Anyway the same argument could have been made about Apple in the late 90's which was cool to say but wrong.
Yes, and the difference there was a successful change of leadership to someone with vision who would drive Apple's successes by upending the industry. Thorstein Heins, while pragmatic and intelligent, doesn't seem to have

Don't get me wrong, BB10 looks fantastic and RIM's hardware has been consistently fantastic. But so far, RIM's vision has been limited to playing catch up and BB10 is playing it safe and borrowing much from the market leaders.

I am not convinced it is enough to stay in the game, especially with Microsoft's billions they seem perfectly content to throw at assuring a third place finish for their mobile phone products.

Either way, RIM has a tough fight to stay relevant in this market. I've certainly been wrong before.
Yujenisis is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 04:40 PM   #120
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
If you don't think the general population is noticing larger screens, and liking them, you are in denial.

Take a walk into a cellphone store and the iPhone stands out because the screen is so small. Well that and the fact that there are like 10 Android smartphones and just two lonely iPhones on the display shelf (maybe 4 if they have one of each color). People are using their phones nowadays practically as PC replacements and the small screen is a drawback whether you believe it or not. Furthermore, I believe this is just the beginning.

Of course as soon as Apple releases an iPhone with a meaningful screen-size increase--and you had better believe they will--it will be perfect.

Michael
I can't speak for everybody else but I'm not that fussy when it comes to screen sizes. I've used a 3.5" iPhone 1st gen, 3.7" HTC Desire, 4.3" Galaxy S2, 4.8" Galaxy S3 and 4" iPhone 5 and I liked every single one of them at the time. I loved the screen on the S3 and I kinda miss that phone. That said, I also love the iPhone 5 and the smaller screen doesn't bother me. It's still plenty big enough to accomplish everything I need to on it.

The fact that the iPhone 4S was the most popular smartphone on the planet for the majority of last year clearly indicates that a great deal of customers are still happy with a 3.5" screen. You can argue to the contrary until you're blue in the face, but that won't change the sales numbers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
Well you go right ahead and keep believing that.




Mike
I'll believe it until I hear a compelling argument to the contrary, of which you're yet to provide

WHY limit tabs? WHYYYYY? That is the question that needs answering.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
That is nonsense.

If I say I can set whatever browser I like to be the default on my Nexus but can't on my iOS devices I don't get answers like "yes that would be a nice option to have" or "yes, Apple should do that." Instead I get a bunch of bogus apple-apologetic reasons why Apple does it that way. Or the classic: why? as if I asked for the moon.

If I say I want more than 8 tabs in Safari? Well Apple knows better or it must be performance or due to RAM. Never-mind that the iPad 2 has 24, with a slower processor and half the RAM. Never-mind that performance is the same with 1 tab open or 8. It's after 8 that things will surely come crashing down. Has to be that or Apple would give us more tabs. They know best. Never-mind that I can open 50, yes 50, tabs in Chrome with no degradation. Right on iOS.

So it is not that people aren't suggesting what they want. And yes that may be done by pointing out shortcoming that are readily available on competing platforms. It's that few people--though that is beginning to change from what I see--seem to do anything but defend the status quo.
iOS should let you choose the default browser IMO, and the default app for documents too. They could let you configure each app/document type in a GUI similar to where it lets you choose how you want it to handle each type of notification in notification centre.

You are not thinking objectively about the tabs issue though.
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:05 PM   #121
Tinmania
macrumors 68030
 
Tinmania's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Aridzona
Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
The fact that the iPhone 4S was the most popular smartphone on the planet for the majority of last year clearly indicates that a great deal of customers are still happy with a 3.5" screen. You can argue to the contrary until you're blue in the face, but that won't change the sales numbers.
Last year. I believe that will change this year, at least to some extent. The 4S and the 5 had plenty of inertia so were practically guaranteed to succeed.

Also, world-wide, Android has already surpassed the iPhone in the smartphone arena with the gap increasing. It's possible 2013 sees that happen more and more in the US too.

If the 5S does go into production this spring, as the front page article here right now claims, I think it will face even more competition. That is if it is just an improved 5 and not a true redesign with a larger screen.

Time will tell....




Michael

----------

Looks like the story about iPhone 5 orders being cut was true.
Quote:
Apple does appear to be cutting back on orders for its latest iPhone from its manufacturing partners, as Nikkei of Japan and The Wall Street Journal reported earlier. Paul Semenza, an analyst at NPD DisplaySearch, a research firm that follows the display market, said that for January, Apple had expected to order 19 million displays for the iPhone 5 but cut the order to 11 million to 14 million. Mr. Semenza said these numbers came from sources in the supply chain, the companies that make components for Apple products.
http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/




Michael

----------

Looks like the story about iPhone 5 orders being cut was true.
Quote:
Apple does appear to be cutting back on orders for its latest iPhone from its manufacturing partners, as Nikkei of Japan and The Wall Street Journal reported earlier. Paul Semenza, an analyst at NPD DisplaySearch, a research firm that follows the display market, said that for January, Apple had expected to order 19 million displays for the iPhone 5 but cut the order to 11 million to 14 million. Mr. Semenza said these numbers came from sources in the supply chain, the companies that make components for Apple products.

The reduction in orders for screens could be related to excess inventory, or because consumer demand for the iPhone 5 just was not as strong as Apple had predicted, Mr. Semenza said. “Certainly, demand from Apple to the display makers seems to have been corrected pretty significantly,” he said.
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/15/te...nes.html?_r=2&

http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/




Michael

----------

And more....


Quote:
The juicy profit margins Apple enjoyed, with no discounting, attracted lots of competition. While Apple rested on its laurels, and came out with a few small enhancements, the competition performed major leaps. I have had the Galaxy 3 for six weeks. It’s far ahead of iPhone 5 in my opinion. And a lot more beautiful. Mark Cuban just said that he thinks the new Nokia is much better than the iPhone. In short, the competition has not been asleep. Now you will see “margin compression.” And you can get discounts from the competitors.


http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/
Tinmania is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:08 PM   #122
onthecouchagain
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
"Demand For Samsung Smartphones Jumps To 23% For Early 2013, iPhone Interest Down 21 Points From Last Quarter"

http://techcrunch.com/2013/01/15/dem...-last-quarter/


I hope it's clear there is no gloating here. This is hopefully a wake up call.
onthecouchagain is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:14 PM   #123
The iGentleman
Banned
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by matttye View Post
No. Android Beam uses NFC for both pairing and transfer. S Beam (limited to Samsung devices) uses NFC for pairing and WiFi direct for transfer.
This is incorrect, Android Beam only transmits very small amounts of data using NFC. Maps, apps, and webpages are transmitted over NFC, but larger files like pictures and videos, are transmitted over bluetooth. Things such as maps, apps, and webpages can be transmitted over bluetooth because it isn't actually sending the data itself, but more so just sending what equates as a link to be opened by the recipient device. When it comes to transmitting larger files such as pictures and videos, Android Beam is used to pair the devices, and transmit the data via bluetooth.

Quote:
Bump is faster than Android Beam most of the time.
That would be dependent on both the sender and recipient's internet connection. If either of them have a slower connection, it will lengthen the time it takes to transmit the data since it is being uploaded to a server and then downloaded from said server. Android Beam on the other hand transmits data via bluetooth, which can transmit at speeds up to 24Mbps (not off the charts, but decent enough). That said, depending on your internet connection, a bluetooth transfer can often times be much faster than Bump. Also, remember that to use Bump, the data has to travel two paths (uploaded to the server, then downloaded from the server. On the other hand, Android Beam is peer to peer, and thus only has to travel one path (from one device to the other).


Quote:
That's using NFC simply as a pairing tool and not to actually carry out the transfer. There's a difference. It is convenient, sure, but it's not really that inconvenient to just pair them using the usual bluetooth or WiFi direct methods. The benefit of those two methods is of course that you don't even need to get off your lazy arse, you can stay where you're sat
What you're failing to realize is that is exactly what NFC's role is in file transfer. NFC's throughput is too low to transmit files through, hence why it is used as a quick pairing method to transfer files via other protocols (bluetooth and wifi direct on Galaxy phones).

Quote:
As far as I know Android Beam uses NFC itself to transfer the file, so if you broke away from the other phone mid-transfer it would pause/stop. I can't find anything online which suggests it uses Bluetooth.

NFC transfer rates are 106, 212 or 424 kbit/s according to Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Near_field_communication
That is complete false. NFC doesn't have the throughput to quickly transfer anything larger than a few kilobytes. To correct your statement, no your transfer would not stop if you pulled the devices apart mid transfer. The reason is because you don't have to have them together. The only time they need to be together is when you make the initial NFC pairing. After that, NFC has already paired them via bluetooth (or wifi direct on Galaxy phones). The data transfer will continue until completed. There are many places online you can visit to read more about how it works.


Quote:
Just because you don't want to use it doesn't make it invalid. Using Android Beam to send a large file would be ridiculously slow.. have you tried it?
I wouldn't use Android Beam to transmit a very large file. For transmitting pictures or a song, it is fine. For transmitting a large video file, it would take longer than I'd be willing to wait. Instead, I'd simply use Wifi Direct which can send a 50mb file in a couple seconds. Needless to say, that is MUCH faster than uploading a 50mb file to an email, sending it, then waiting for the recipient to download it.


Quote:
Everything I can find online suggests it uses NFC itself for the transfer.[COLOR="#808080"]
There are many places online that explain it. Furthermore, I know because I actually use it.. But anyway, for your convenience here's one quick link..
http://www.androidcentral.com/jelly-...r-android-beam
The iGentleman is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:19 PM   #124
Still100
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
There so many people out there that think apple customers are stupid. Why? For getting less spec for their money. Less spec for your money is fine when there is great innovation over competitors because your paying for that innovation.

Now there isn't.

Others have caught up and moved ahead with the latest spec. Like nfc on android. Others allow the one thing apple refuse to make easy to do on the iPad. Work. Like microsoft.

It's 2013 and I still can't upload a document on the web!!!!!! I have to go to a pc!!!
Still100 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 15, 2013, 05:33 PM   #125
matttye
macrumors 601
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Lincoln, England
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmania View Post
Last year. I believe that will change this year, at least to some extent. The 4S and the 5 had plenty of inertia so were practically guaranteed to succeed.

Also, world-wide, Android has already surpassed the iPhone in the smartphone arena with the gap increasing. It's possible 2013 sees that happen more and more in the US too.

If the 5S does go into production this spring, as the front page article here right now claims, I think it will face even more competition. That is if it is just an improved 5 and not a true redesign with a larger screen.

Time will tell....




Michael

----------

Looks like the story about iPhone 5 orders being cut was true.


http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/




Michael

----------

Looks like the story about iPhone 5 orders being cut was true.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/15/te...nes.html?_r=2&

http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/01/yes...y-explanation/




Michael

----------

And more....






http://www.forbes.com/sites/investor...n-apple-stock/
I would be surprised if Android DIDN'T surpass iOS given the sheer number of manufacturers supporting it.

Everyone is jumping the gun a bit with the reduction in the order. Who knows, maybe they are planning a six month iPhone upgrade too and getting ready for the next one

Quote:
Originally Posted by The iGentleman View Post
This is incorrect, Android Beam only transmits very small amounts of data using NFC. Maps, apps, and webpages are transmitted over NFC, but larger files like pictures and videos, are transmitted over bluetooth. Things such as maps, apps, and webpages can be transmitted over bluetooth because it isn't actually sending the data itself, but more so just sending what equates as a link to be opened by the recipient device. When it comes to transmitting larger files such as pictures and videos, Android Beam is used to pair the devices, and transmit the data via bluetooth.


That would be dependent on both the sender and recipient's internet connection. If either of them have a slower connection, it will lengthen the time it takes to transmit the data since it is being uploaded to a server and then downloaded from said server. Android Beam on the other hand transmits data via bluetooth, which can transmit at speeds up to 24Mbps (not off the charts, but decent enough). That said, depending on your internet connection, a bluetooth transfer can often times be much faster than Bump. Also, remember that to use Bump, the data has to travel two paths (uploaded to the server, then downloaded from the server. On the other hand, Android Beam is peer to peer, and thus only has to travel one path (from one device to the other).



What you're failing to realize is that is exactly what NFC's role is in file transfer. NFC's throughput is too low to transmit files through, hence why it is used as a quick pairing method to transfer files via other protocols (bluetooth and wifi direct on Galaxy phones).


That is complete false. NFC doesn't have the throughput to quickly transfer anything larger than a few kilobytes. To correct your statement, no your transfer would not stop if you pulled the devices apart mid transfer. The reason is because you don't have to have them together. The only time they need to be together is when you make the initial NFC pairing. After that, NFC has already paired them via bluetooth (or wifi direct on Galaxy phones). The data transfer will continue until completed. There are many places online you can visit to read more about how it works.



I wouldn't use Android Beam to transmit a very large file. For transmitting pictures or a song, it is fine. For transmitting a large video file, it would take longer than I'd be willing to wait. Instead, I'd simply use Wifi Direct which can send a 50mb file in a couple seconds. Needless to say, that is MUCH faster than uploading a 50mb file to an email, sending it, then waiting for the recipient to download it.



There are many places online that explain it. Furthermore, I know because I actually use it.. But anyway, for your convenience here's one quick link..
http://www.androidcentral.com/jelly-...r-android-beam
Yep I stand corrected - I didn't realise that the Jelly Bean update had changed anything with Android Beam. The initial version used only NFC, but didn't support photo or video transfer.

My main point is that it's a small convenience only having to hold devices together rather than pair them using the usual bluetooth manner.

People act like Apple is in the dark ages by not adding NFC to the iPhone, when it's not massively useful at present.

It's worth noting that any QR code generator/reader can be used in place of NFC tag functionality.
__________________
iPad 2 16GB Black (WiFi+3G) -- iPhone 5s 64GB Space Grey.
matttye is offline   0 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > iPhone, iPod and iPad > Alternatives to iOS and iOS Devices

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Apple Customer Support Claims Apple Stymied by Phone-Switching iMessage Glitch MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 258 Jul 16, 2014 09:35 AM
iPad Mini: Apple is hurting their own inventory - Can not cancel in process order nostresshere iPad 5 Nov 12, 2013 10:50 PM
Apple Releases Statement on Customer Privacy and Law Enforcement Requests for Customer Data MacRumors Politics, Religion, Social Issues 154 Jul 22, 2013 12:47 PM
Intelligence Program Gives US Government Direct Access to Customer Data on Apple Servers [Update: Apple Denies] MacRumors Politics, Religion, Social Issues 460 Jun 18, 2013 12:06 PM
upcoming announcements hurting apple? Cody21 iPhone 22 Aug 24, 2012 04:30 PM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:28 PM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC