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Old Nov 10, 2014, 05:52 PM   #1
SoundMan
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Where to find Graphic designers?

Hi everyone,

Let me just start by saying.

I've not come across a subject this difficult in my life!!!, all I can find are the elite webdesign companies that want 50k to 150k.

This has been a 2 year journey and we still haven't redesigned our site. I'm just lost now where to really look finding a Web-designer/Ecommerce person.

We've tried all the Freelance sites:Elance,Freelancer etc..

All we get is job offers from India or the middle east. If the work was "clean and not fly by night" everything would be fine with that solution.

We have tried most of the Colleges locally but have gotten (ZERO) results. Even reached out to the Professor's/Teachers but never get emails/phone calls back.

We've made topics on all the Graphic design sites/SEO forums looking for leads.

I'm just lost now on finding a candidate for building a new Magento Ecommerce site.

I'm hoping some members can help,my only option is going to school and learning everything or spending close to 50k

Thanks
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Old Nov 10, 2014, 08:07 PM   #2
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Have you tried any of the creative staffing agencies, the agencies that you work with to find a designer that can specifically fit your needs? You didn't name any of theses so maybe try one of these.

http://www.roberthalf.com/creativegroup/
http://aquent.com
http://thebossgroup.com
http://vitamintalent.com
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Old Nov 10, 2014, 08:57 PM   #3
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Originally Posted by styymy View Post
Have you tried any of the creative staffing agencies, the agencies that you work with to find a designer that can specifically fit your needs? You didn't name any of theses so maybe try one of these.

http://www.roberthalf.com/creativegroup/
http://aquent.com
http://thebossgroup.com
http://vitamintalent.com
WOW thanks I have never heard of those types of sites before,I will need to read to fully understand how it works.
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Old Nov 10, 2014, 09:10 PM   #4
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Originally Posted by SoundMan View Post
I'm just lost now on finding a candidate for building a new Magento Ecommerce site.
Where are you located?
Have you tried some of the smaller graphic design firms or advertising agencies in your area?
Scout out some local computer or web design user groups.

Keep in mind that a graphic designer and a web database/ecommerce designer are very different disciplines, you may need one of each.

Keep in mind that a custom designed and programmed ecommerce site DOES take a lot of expertise and time, and will cost money.

If you can work with modifying preexisting templates, it will be easier.

Do you have your business requirements written out and organized?
Do you have your product/service/sales data organized in a database?

Defining the scope of work before looking for talent is worth some time on your part, otherwise you will be paying someone to do it for you. And chances are they won't intuitively know what you need.

Believe me, building a site 3/4 of the way and -then- deciding "it's just gotta do X" when "X" wasn't panned for at the beginning, is a very expensive way to do it.
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Old Nov 11, 2014, 08:35 AM   #5
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Be realistic in what you're able to afford to pay. I've seen so many job listings posted where people want me to build them a "Facebook-like Website" for $2500. I laugh to myself, and quite honestly; it's an insult. I wouldn't get out of bed in the morning for that little amount considering the work I'd have to put in to it.
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Old Nov 11, 2014, 09:15 AM   #6
SoundMan
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Originally Posted by CanadaRAM View Post
Where are you located?
Have you tried some of the smaller graphic design firms or advertising agencies in your area?
Scout out some local computer or web design user groups.

Keep in mind that a graphic designer and a web database/ecommerce designer are very different disciplines, you may need one of each.

Keep in mind that a custom designed and programmed ecommerce site DOES take a lot of expertise and time, and will cost money.

If you can work with modifying preexisting templates, it will be easier.

Do you have your business requirements written out and organized?
Do you have your product/service/sales data organized in a database?

Defining the scope of work before looking for talent is worth some time on your part, otherwise you will be paying someone to do it for you. And chances are they won't intuitively know what you need.

Believe me, building a site 3/4 of the way and -then- deciding "it's just gotta do X" when "X" wasn't panned for at the beginning, is a very expensive way to do it.
I'm located in Toronto Ontario,

Yes, I never thought a programmer and Graphic designer where two different people. I thought they teach everything in school.

We want a nice clean site but have cool features in different parts, I've already been looking into 360 Degree images instead of using flat images.

I'm more then willing to work,I just don't have a strong Coding background or PS experience. I just want the site built and have help setting up the Modules like intrac online payments.

We don't even want SEO help,a company called the Seach engine People will complete the work.

We have an existing site with Voluison (NEVER USE THEM). I've been told we just need to transfer all the url's over.

I've even thought about attending Bitmaker labs in T.O but they don't teach PHP. I'm just not sure about a full 3 year degree for Graphic design and then another 2-3 years learning code.
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Old Nov 11, 2014, 10:46 AM   #7
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A graphic designer will design the structure and layout of the site and provide/create any images, but it is highly unlikely they will write the code as well. My girlfriend does the former, but can't code websites. They are both very specialist disciplines, I doubt you will find somebody who can do both.
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Old Nov 11, 2014, 11:42 AM   #8
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The best designers are not necessarily the best programmers.
The best programmers are not the best designers.
Neither is the best at e-commerce consulting.

If you want a one-stop shop, you need an agency, with specialists in all. If you've checked out their portfolios, and like what they've done, make an appointment, ask for a quote on just the re-design of something small, logo, a few graphics, the website opening page, etc. See how they are to work with, and whether the recommendations for the next step fit in with what you are looking for. A good shop can break down the expected costs for each phase, and explain how they arrived at the estimate. Expect to pay for their time, don't expect design comps for free, from anyone with considerable experience.

I am a designer. I have seen a number of folks who come to me with their bargain $50 logos (for example), and then they end up paying me hundreds more to rework it, so the design will work for web and print, large signage, and tiny ads, etc.
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Old Nov 11, 2014, 10:23 PM   #9
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If you are getting quotes for 50k to 150k, and you can't find students willing to contact you back, I suspect your offer is way too low for the amount of work required.
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Old Nov 13, 2014, 03:45 PM   #10
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Most developers want a detailed specification of the work that they are taking on. Getting vague requests for features without any details is not helpful for a programmer since they then need to guess what you mean. This leads to wasted time (and your money since most decent developers charge by the hour) since the developer constantly has to ask you what you think about how they have interpreted your instructions.

As a programmer myself who does web development I can tell you right off the bat that a web developer does NOT necessarily know anything about design. Most often these are two completely separate jobs done by different people.

What is your budget anyway? What is it that you want to be done exactly? If you could post up some more details we would be able to help you more.
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Old Nov 13, 2014, 04:31 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fat jez View Post
A graphic designer will design the structure and layout of the site and provide/create any images, but it is highly unlikely they will write the code as well. My girlfriend does the former, but can't code websites. They are both very specialist disciplines, I doubt you will find somebody who can do both.
This.

And if you can, they'll rightly be charging a fortune.
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Old Nov 13, 2014, 04:41 PM   #12
fotomarc
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Where to find Graphic designers?

There is a big difference between a web and graphic designer.

There are some new applications where you can design your own site with drag and drop.

Search online.
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Old Nov 14, 2014, 05:45 PM   #13
Verdenshersker
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I agree with the other people.
There is a big difference between a web developer and a digital design.

I'm a Sr. Digital Art Director myself and although I can do some coding, I prefer to stick to design.

PM me if you still need help with some design
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Old Nov 14, 2014, 07:10 PM   #14
SoundMan
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Thanks for all the reply's

In all my job listings I've posted sites similar to the final product. I've also said we want all the code to be clean (W3C) compliance. I haven't given a list of features and we ask to contact us on the price so I can see everybody's quotes.

I unfortunately haven't gotten a real reply on my listings to filter everything.

Here's my job listing

Hi,

We are currently looking for a candidate to redesign our e commerce site. This will be a new and completely fresh build using Magento. We want the final site to be clean and "wow", but also interactive to the customer in certain categories. We can explain more in detail about the interactive features in our phone call or email as it's quite detailed.

We aren't looking for the candidate to complete any SEO work, we are only looking to have the site built and get help inputting the mass of the products from our current site with setting up the correct portals/plugins for Magento.

The end goal is having a fully functioning e commerce site.

Here's some site references.

http://shop.nordstrom.com/
http://www.ralphlauren.com/
http://www.corbetts.com/

Thank you


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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cromulent View Post
Most developers want a detailed specification of the work that they are taking on. Getting vague requests for features without any details is not helpful for a programmer since they then need to guess what you mean. This leads to wasted time (and your money since most decent developers charge by the hour) since the developer constantly has to ask you what you think about how they have interpreted your instructions.

As a programmer myself who does web development I can tell you right off the bat that a web developer does NOT necessarily know anything about design. Most often these are two completely separate jobs done by different people.

What is your budget anyway? What is it that you want to be done exactly? If you could post up some more details we would be able to help you more.
Hi,

Thanks for your reply.

Can you please share the exact title for coding/programmers. I want to see if any schools around here teach that.

I'm very shocked to learn Webdesign/Coding aren't the same class. It's a bit crazy,I've spoken with many elite company's and nobody has every talked about this.

learning is power.
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Old Nov 16, 2014, 08:05 AM   #15
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Hi,

Thanks for your reply.

Can you please share the exact title for coding/programmers. I want to see if any schools around here teach that.
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by this. If you want to learn how to program then pick a programming language (from what you said you want to use Magento which is written in PHP so I'll use PHP for this example) and just search the web for learning resources. I often find books to be a better place to learn since they are generally (but not always) better content.

But if you want to start learning PHP then there website is a good first port of call.

This website will teach you the PHP programming language: http://php.net/manual/en/langref.php

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoundMan View Post
I'm very shocked to learn Webdesign/Coding aren't the same class. It's a bit crazy,I've spoken with many elite company's and nobody has every talked about this.

learning is power.
"Elite companies" as you put it often employ designers and programmers separately. They just provide the whole service as a package to the customer so they don't have to worry about the differences.

Programming and design are two skills that are so far apart from each. It is like expecting your car mechanic to also be able to design a new car scratch and make it look pretty. They just don't it is a completely different skill set.
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Old Nov 17, 2014, 07:39 PM   #16
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hmmmm $50K is too high, yet you're using Ralph Lauren and Nordstrom as examples...

Can I respectfully suggest that if $50K is out of your price range that the most realistic option might be to scale back expectations somewhat and look at a more off the shelf ecommerce solution like Shopify or similar?

I know that you're more limited in what you can do, but you get a solid backend, e-commerce fully integrated, and lots of clean looks at a price that's probably more realistic by the sounds of it.

Yes you might not be able to do some of the fancy stuff (although with customisation you probably can in the future).

Good luck with the site :-)
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Old Nov 26, 2014, 04:50 PM   #17
SoundMan
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Originally Posted by Cromulent View Post
I'm not entirely sure what you mean by this. If you want to learn how to program then pick a programming language (from what you said you want to use Magento which is written in PHP so I'll use PHP for this example) and just search the web for learning resources. I often find books to be a better place to learn since they are generally (but not always) better content.

But if you want to start learning PHP then there website is a good first port of call.

This website will teach you the PHP programming language: http://php.net/manual/en/langref.php



"Elite companies" as you put it often employ designers and programmers separately. They just provide the whole service as a package to the customer so they don't have to worry about the differences.

Programming and design are two skills that are so far apart from each. It is like expecting your car mechanic to also be able to design a new car scratch and make it look pretty. They just don't it is a completely different skill set.

Thanks for your help,we still don't have any new leads or a site getting built. I had some people send me PM's but nothing has happened.

All you hear is people want "work" but they really don't it seems, I've decided I'm just going to school and will build my own site and make a Career.

I always wanted to specialize in SEO, So understanding PHP,JQuery files,ccs,HTML,HTML5 will be wonderful for my skills.

I have a strong design mind just can't draw using a mouse in PS so maybe a drawing tablet will work. I also want to build some amazing features I haven't seen in E commerce sites.

Cromulent can you please share your Title,was looking at different schools but not sure what course. I've seen everything from Front end developer to just web developer.

thanks

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verdenshersker View Post
I agree with the other people.
There is a big difference between a web developer and a digital design.

I'm a Sr. Digital Art Director myself and although I can do some coding, I prefer to stick to design.

PM me if you still need help with some design
Did you get my PM?
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Old Nov 29, 2014, 05:37 AM   #18
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All you hear is people want "work" but they really don't it seems, I've decided I'm just going to school and will build my own site and make a Career.
It's not that people don't want "work," it's that people would like to be paid an amount that reflects the difficulty of the work they are being asked to perform.

$50K for the type of e-commerce site that you are looking for is a completely reasonable estimate, and in all actuality is on the low end of the scale.
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Old Nov 29, 2014, 06:11 PM   #19
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It's not that people don't want "work," it's that people would like to be paid an amount that reflects the difficulty of the work they are being asked to perform.

$50K for the type of e-commerce site that you are looking for is a completely reasonable estimate, and in all actuality is on the low end of the scale.
Hi,

I didn't start the topic to cause a argument, I'm the first to say "peoples time is worth money" aseptically if they took the time and went to school.

You need to look at this through the eyes of a normal person and not a business making millions or billions a year. 50k buys a lot of stock or a nice car

I was hear in shock that in almost 2 years I haven't gotten leads from companies or people only the leading design firms can be found.

The reference sites was the end look I want,so a template and some features can happen. I gave up on my Volsion site and now sell on amazon, we make more $$$ there then in the 2 years having a standalone site.

It's nothing but garbage with that company,we can't even have $10 shipping on just shoes or buy 1 t-shirt and the second is 40% off. There platform doesn't support those options it's just very sad.

That's why I want Magneto because I have the freedom of having those options.
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Last edited by SoundMan; Nov 29, 2014 at 06:20 PM.
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Old Dec 17, 2014, 10:59 AM   #20
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have you try fiver?
you can set a small budget and find lots of people willing to help you on a small fee.
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Old Dec 29, 2014, 09:35 AM   #21
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$50k is a reasonable starting range to design/develop a magento ecomm site.

If you want to do it on a budget, check out woocommerce + wordpress.

Also, if you think $150K comes close to what Nordstrom spent on their website, think again. I'd guess north of a million, and they probably spend $50k/month just updating/maintaining.
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Old Dec 30, 2014, 05:21 PM   #22
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OP: I'll use Squarespace myself. Looks better than the websites you wrote as samples and in Squarespace you could easily administer your e-commerce.
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Old Jan 8, 2015, 08:03 AM   #23
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.Also, if you think $150K comes close to what Nordstrom spent on their website, think again. I'd guess north of a million, and they probably spend $50k/month just updating/maintaining.
I've just finished up a responsive solution for an IPTV/HBBTV project (not a whole site refactor, just adding additional functionality.), we were burning through $140K per two week sprint.

For the person who was asking, if it's ecommerce I'd suggest either:
- Trying Big Commerce, I worked there as Lead UX this might be exactly what you're looking for.
- Hit up the Linkedin threads, you might be able to connect with some good professionals looking for a fun side project.
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Old Jan 25, 2015, 03:04 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by WinstonRumfoord View Post
$50k is a reasonable starting range to design/develop a magento ecomm site.

If you want to do it on a budget, check out woocommerce + wordpress.

Also, if you think $150K comes close to what Nordstrom spent on their website, think again. I'd guess north of a million, and they probably spend $50k/month just updating/maintaining.
I think this is very valid advice....

If you are starting out, why not just get a tailor theme for wordpress/woocommerce, I paid $500 for one. And do the content yourself.

Heck even for magento there are plenty of theme developers, setup your own server (aka run the script) and pop a tailored theme on it...Personally if you start small, I would go down the wordpress route. Much easier to manage from day one.
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Old Jan 25, 2015, 10:21 PM   #25
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I think this is very valid advice....

If you are starting out, why not just get a tailor theme for wordpress/woocommerce, I paid $500 for one. And do the content yourself.

Heck even for magento there are plenty of theme developers, setup your own server (aka run the script) and pop a tailored theme on it...Personally if you start small, I would go down the wordpress route. Much easier to manage from day one.
Absolutely. We have found that most people who think they want a magento website have no need for it and the associated higher costs it brings.

Get a wordpress theme, and you can handily find someone to get woocommerce set up and your site customized to your taste for under $2,000 I'm willing to bet. Make sure it's a local person, don't bother mucking around with fiverr or any of those rubbish sites that will have some chode offshore screwing everything up (but hey its so cheap!)
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