Register FAQ / Rules Forum Spy Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:27 AM   #51
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by henrystar View Post
Next somebody will try to claim ownership of ordinary words, such as windows!
http://forums.macrumors.com/showthread.php?t=1518439

Please read before posting again
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:28 AM   #52
Popeye206
macrumors 68030
 
Popeye206's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: NE PA USA
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
You don't have to be an expert to know that this issue has nothing to do with who coined the phrase APP

It's irrelevant despite many many MANY people trying to argue otherwise.

Reading comprehension is apparently over-rated.

----------



I guess you never owned/used Palm Pilots.

It's cool.

PS - this has nothing to do with who made APP popular. How many times does that have to be stated
Correct... and trademarks are not patents. Prior art has little to do with it if the term being trademarked is not active or being defended in commerce. If you don't use it, or defend it, you can loose your trademark.

From a marketing stand point, I can see why Apple is trying to keep this trademark. If they can make "Apps" or "AppStore" only be associated with Apple, then that's a big win from a marketing standpoint.
Popeye206 is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:28 AM   #53
rmwebs
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexgowers View Post
I disagree the term 'appstore' is not generic at all.

It was almost never been used before apple decided to call it's programs for it's phones apps. There were many software stores online and many didn't shorten applications to apps at all! I mean come on just because it's simple doesn't mean there aren't other names, every other company has thought of something original to call their outlets with no issues.

I mean they could have called it appshop, softstore or any number of variations on a theme. Amazon are guilty of copying, now whether that is illegal is a whole different debate and that is presumably what the court wants answered. I think it's fine for amazon to call their store whatever they want but they have to admit they are copying to get customers in the door. Sadly for amazon their name is not synonymous with quality and I think apple feels they are misleading the public into believing they will get an apple like experience.

I also have to say apples app stores are still lacking after an initial revelation the usability hasn't improved and needs a massive rethink.
Why do we always get a post like this in these threads? Full of completely misinformed nonsense.

The term 'AppStore' has been in use as far back as the mid 1980's in computing. It had a 'lul' in the late 90's where it wasn't used quite as much (but was still used).

Sure, Apple popularised the term - does that given them any right own it? No.

Just because a select few people have this delusion that Apple created the term that doesn't mean they have any rights to restrict others using it.
rmwebs is offline   6 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:29 AM   #54
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Or Apple. Which there is nothing wrong with as long as you don't sell panes of glasses or fruits that fall from a tree. Then we run into the same issue we have here : "Descriptive".

There is nothing wrong with trademarking dictionary words in certain fields. There are different rules when it comes to descriptive terms however.

So bringing things up like Trademarks for Amazon or Apple or Windows is completely irrelevant, like bringing up "Application" vs "Program" or thinking Apple popularised "Application" and "App" when they obviously didn't.
Deja Vous. Multiple Facepalms.
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:29 AM   #55
MonkeySee....
macrumors 68040
 
MonkeySee....'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexgowers View Post
I disagree the term 'appstore' is not generic at all.

It was almost never been used before apple decided to call it's programs for it's phones apps. There were many software stores online and many didn't shorten applications to apps at all! I mean come on just because it's simple doesn't mean there aren't other names, every other company has thought of something original to call their outlets with no issues.

I mean they could have called it appshop, softstore or any number of variations on a theme. Amazon are guilty of copying, now whether that is illegal is a whole different debate and that is presumably what the court wants answered. I think it's fine for amazon to call their store whatever they want but they have to admit they are copying to get customers in the door. Sadly for amazon their name is not synonymous with quality and I think apple feels they are misleading the public into believing they will get an apple like experience.

I also have to say apples app stores are still lacking after an initial revelation the usability hasn't improved and needs a massive rethink.
The thread should be closed after this post. Unfortunately it will be followed by dross.
__________________
If you’re busy making everything, how can you perfect anything? - Apple

Always keep the rhythm in your feet and a little party in your shoulders. - Phil Dunphy
MonkeySee.... is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:30 AM   #56
kitsap2
macrumors newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Usually, Seattle, Washington
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Gates View Post
First of all, this little myth you are repeating has been circulated for a while now and its just not true. There are various examples of BOTH companies using BOTH terms throughout the past 30 years.

Second, neither company invented these words. They have been around hundreds of years and are just now being used in terms of computers.

Third, you can't trademark an abbreviation.

Get real
Dear MrGates

I'm real. I was just having some fun.

Now take a deep breath and relax.
kitsap2 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:31 AM   #57
Rodimus Prime
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Amazon can pretty tell Apple F U and tell them to drop it. I expect if Apple keeps pushing the case the result will be for Apple to pay all of Amazon legal fees in this.

At this point Apple base solution is to drop the case and walk away.
Rodimus Prime is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:33 AM   #58
turtlez
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexgowers View Post
I disagree the term 'appstore' is not generic at all.

It was almost never been used before apple decided to call it's programs for it's phones apps. There were many software stores online and many didn't shorten applications to apps at all! I mean come on just because it's simple doesn't mean there aren't other names, every other company has thought of something original to call their outlets with no issues.

I mean they could have called it appshop, softstore or any number of variations on a theme. Amazon are guilty of copying, now whether that is illegal is a whole different debate and that is presumably what the court wants answered. I think it's fine for amazon to call their store whatever they want but they have to admit they are copying to get customers in the door. Sadly for amazon their name is not synonymous with quality and I think apple feels they are misleading the public into believing they will get an apple like experience.

I also have to say apples app stores are still lacking after an initial revelation the usability hasn't improved and needs a massive rethink.
I agree with you on everything except Amazon not being of great quality. I have ordered a lot of things from amazon all the way to Australia and they have all turned up before or on the expected date (unlike Apple and their iMac issue haha) and very well packed for good prices. Apple invented the popularity for the term App, they should have a right to use it.

I always think it would be cool to be able to have a look at a parallel world and make Apple on world 1 invent something and then Apple on world 2 not invent it and just see how vastly different the competitors would be. I would put my money on Appstore not being used if Apple didn't start calling it that. I would put my money on mp3 players still being generic and no cool factor to them if Apple did not invent the iPod. I would put my money on ugly laptops and fingertip phones if Apple had not invented the aluminium laptops and iPhone.

I agree on the different names they could use. They invented their company name, why can't they invent a store name.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodimus Prime View Post
Amazon can pretty tell Apple F U and tell them to drop it. I expect if Apple keeps pushing the case the result will be for Apple to pay all of Amazon legal fees in this.

At this point Apple base solution is to drop the case and walk away.
They got the money and even if they don't win they still hinder other companies going for the term Appstore through fear. No one wants to be dragged through the court, especially not smaller companies.
turtlez is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:33 AM   #59
KnightWRX
macrumors Pentium
 
KnightWRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rodimus Prime View Post
Amazon can pretty tell Apple F U and tell them to drop it. I expect if Apple keeps pushing the case the result will be for Apple to pay all of Amazon legal fees in this.

At this point Apple base solution is to drop the case and walk away.
Until the USPTO rules on the actual validity of the trademark in regards to both Microsoft and Amazon's opposition to it, Amazon still has to enter good faith negotiations (their position could be to ask for a stay on the infringement claims until the USPTO has ruled).
__________________
"What you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others."
-- Pericles
KnightWRX is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:35 AM   #60
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by turtlez View Post
Apple invented the popularity for the term App, they should have a right to use it.


----------
No one is preventing Apple from using the term App. Nor App Store. And this issue isn't about the word App.

::headdesk::
samcraig is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:35 AM   #61
Renzatic
macrumors 604
 
Renzatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Who puts the washers in the woods?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeye206 View Post
Hummm.... sure... I remember the word "App" before 2008 being used here and there in the industry, but the term "AppStore" was unique to my knowledge when Apple came out with the AppStore. Sure, it's common now because everyone loved it and started using it, but does not mean Apple does not have a right to try and defend it.
From the other thread...



I believe that's a Palm Treo. So it's been around for at least a little while.

Apple wasn't the first to use the term "App Store", and didn't coin the term "apps". Just because it became more commonly used after they released their app store in '08 doesn't give them the right to it.
Renzatic is online now   5 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:36 AM   #62
turtlez
Banned
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
No one is preventing Apple from using the term App. Nor App Store. And this issue isn't about the word App.

::headdesk::
Wow I would have seriously thought anyone reading this thread would have got what I meant. I am very sorry for your head on the desk.

Incase you got amnesia, I will update you.

I mean AppStore and I mean Apple have the right to own it.
turtlez is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:38 AM   #63
Rodimus Prime
Banned
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Until the USPTO rules on the actual validity of the trademark in regards to both Microsoft and Amazon's opposition to it, Amazon still has to enter good faith negotiations (their position could be to ask for a stay on the infringement claims until the USPTO has ruled).
And I could easily see Amazon refusing to give at all to anything but a stay.

From my under standing more and more signs are pointing to the USPTO ruling against Apple.

Besides Apple is going to have to win multiple cases. Even if they win the USPTO ruling they now have to win in court and amazon only has to win one.
Rodimus Prime is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:38 AM   #64
Graeme43
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Great Britain
Send a message via AIM to Graeme43 Send a message via MSN to Graeme43 Send a message via Yahoo to Graeme43 Send a message via Skype™ to Graeme43
Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeye206 View Post
Hummm.... sure... I remember the word "App" before 2008 being used here and there in the industry, but the term "AppStore" was unique to my knowledge when Apple came out with the AppStore. Sure, it's common now because everyone loved it and started using it, but does not mean Apple does not have a right to try and defend it.

But trademarks and patents seem to be worthless anymore. No company seems to respect either unless their forced to by the courts.
Windows users have called their apps "programs" and its built into windows like program files..."

Mac OS X has used .app since it was launched and in a folder called applications...

Now Apple is popular... everyone wants a bit even though Apple has used app for like 13 years
__________________
Intel: Late 2006 Mac Pro 2.66, Early 2008 MacBook Pro 2.4
PowerPC: Early 2001 Titanium PowerBook, Late 2001 iBook G3 500, 1999 B&W G3 400
ARM: iPad 4, iPhone 5
Graeme43 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:39 AM   #65
Renzatic
macrumors 604
 
Renzatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Who puts the washers in the woods?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme43 View Post
Windows users have called their apps "programs" and its built into windows like program files..."

Mac OS X has used .app since it was launched and in a folder called applications...

Now Apple is popular... everyone wants a bit even though Apple has used app for like 13 years
AND HISTORY REPEATS ITSELF!

...hell, I'm not even gonna bother.
Renzatic is online now   5 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:39 AM   #66
fiddlestyx
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minnesota
Quote:
Originally Posted by DipDog3 View Post
Sorry, but yes, "App Store" is generic. You can't trademark it.

I don't think anyone gets confused, they know you go to the app store to get apps regardless of what device it is on.
Completely agree with this. If Amazon was calling their app store the "Apple App Store" I could see issue with it, but "App Store" is quite generic.
__________________
| 2011 Mac Mini i7 | 32GB iPad (4th Gen) | 16GB iPhone 4S |
fiddlestyx is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:42 AM   #67
MH01
macrumors 68030
 
MH01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by LagunaSol View Post
I don't know where you buy gas, but I never see the words "Gas Station" on a gas station's sign. So it's not confusing...because it's not actually there.
And yet your know what a gas station is right???

I suspect your not looking hard enough
http://www.bp.com/productslistsearch...tentId=7013632
MH01 is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:44 AM   #68
rmwebs
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
With regards to those claiming Apple coined the term 'App'.

The term 'App' has been used for years.

Now I've got your attention. This below is a screenshot from RISC OS 3.1.1. It was released in 1991. I used it at school on an Acorn computer. Notice what that folder is called? And that icon on the bottom bar?



It should also be noted that RISC OS used the term App in v2.0 which was released in 1989 (and possibly earlier versions of 'Arther') however I couldn't grab a screenshot.
rmwebs is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:45 AM   #69
KnightWRX
macrumors Pentium
 
KnightWRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme43 View Post
Windows users have called their apps "programs" and its built into windows like program files..."

Mac OS X has used .app since it was launched and in a folder called applications...

Now Apple is popular... everyone wants a bit even though Apple has used app for like 13 years
Care to participate in my homework too ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
You seem very knowledgeable and intelligent. Can you do me a favor ? I'm illeterate and have some homework that needs doing. Can you tell me how many times the word "Application" shows up on this picture vs how many times the word "Program" does ?

Thumb resize.

It would be very appreciated if you could, simply click the image to zoom in.
__________________
"What you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others."
-- Pericles
KnightWRX is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:46 AM   #70
D.T.
macrumors 68020
 
D.T.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Vilano Beach, FL
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
I think I'm bowing out of this thread now though. It's already a retread of the other friend with people continuing their reconstructed version of history.
Yeah, probably a good idea.


Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
That's hardware not in reference to the store. I see your point. But irrelevant to this, no?.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
does not matter. Irrelevant.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
It doesn't matter who popularized the word App. It's irrelevant. The only thing that matters is App Store. Not App. Not Store.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
You don't have to be an expert to know that this issue has nothing to do with who coined the phrase APP
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Ok - let's go with App Store (not App) as being trademarked by Apple.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Deja Vous. Multiple Facepalms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
No one is preventing Apple from using the term App. Nor App Store. And this issue isn't about the word App.

::headdesk::
... or not

( I feel your frustration ... )
D.T. is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:47 AM   #71
rmwebs
Banned
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Graeme43 View Post
Windows users have called their apps "programs" and its built into windows like program files..."

Mac OS X has used .app since it was launched and in a folder called applications...

Now Apple is popular... everyone wants a bit even though Apple has used app for like 13 years
See my last post. It basically disproves the complete crap you just posted:

Quote:
Originally Posted by rmwebs View Post
With regards to those claiming Apple coined the term 'App'.

The term 'App' has been used for years.

Now I've got your attention. This below is a screenshot from RISC OS 3.1.1. It was released in 1991. I used it at school on an Acorn computer. Notice what that folder is called? And that icon on the bottom bar?

Image

It should also be noted that RISC OS used the term App in v2.0 which was released in 1989 (and possibly earlier versions of 'Arther') however I couldn't grab a screenshot.
So. 1989. Thats...24 years ago.

Happy now?
rmwebs is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:47 AM   #72
KnightWRX
macrumors Pentium
 
KnightWRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmwebs View Post
With regards to those claiming Apple coined the term 'App'.

The term 'App' has been used for years.
And Application was in use before Apple even existed :

Thumb resize.

A book from the 60s!!
__________________
"What you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others."
-- Pericles
KnightWRX is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:49 AM   #73
samcraig
macrumors G5
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by D.T. View Post
Yeah, probably a good idea.

... or not

( I feel your frustration ... )
Sucker for punishment

And yet people still think this is about who coined/made popular the word APP.
samcraig is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:50 AM   #74
KnightWRX
macrumors Pentium
 
KnightWRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Quebec, Canada
Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post
Sucker for punishment

And yet people still think this is about who coined/made popular the word APP.
Even if it were, it's quite disputed that Apple are the ones, seeing all the stuff we've dugged up to disprove that completely irrelevant argument.
__________________
"What you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others."
-- Pericles
KnightWRX is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Jan 16, 2013, 11:51 AM   #75
jonnysods
macrumors 68030
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Aussie living in Canada
I say generic.
jonnysods is online now   1 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Apple and Samsung Said to Resume Settlement Talks Over Patent Dispute MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 55 Jan 7, 2014 02:02 PM
Apple and Samsung Still in Settlement Talks, 'No Indication' of Imminent Agreement MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 22 Jul 22, 2013 07:27 AM
Brazilian 'iPhone' Trademark Lawsuit Ends With Apple and IGB 'Close To Settlement' MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 45 Mar 12, 2013 03:56 PM
Apple Ordered to Pay Chinese Writers in eBook Settlement MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 65 Jan 3, 2013 09:23 PM
iPad Shipments Rise 80% in China Following Trademark Settlement MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 9 Nov 19, 2012 05:59 PM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:26 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC