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Old Jan 18, 2013, 02:16 PM   #126
maxosx
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It's just business. Happens everywhere, everyday. Inconsequential.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 02:16 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Hardware vendors cannot modify Windows, only Microsoft can. They can license it from Microsoft and that's it. They are not free to do with it what they want as far as changing it and branding it, they have to adhere to terms of their license with Microsoft. Contrast that to Android (look at what Amazon did with Android and the Kindle). No one could do the same with Windows because it's just not an open system.
Have you ever played with an HP TouchSmart system? That is certainly a modified Windows system.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 02:34 PM   #128
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Here comes the death of the 9.7
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 02:41 PM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
The exact quote is this :



So yeah, "Steve would never have shipped an iPad Mini" is quite accurate (though I know Steve was one of the biggest flip-floppers around... iPod Video after "People don't want to watch video on a small screen" and "People don't read anymore" a year before iBookStore).

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Steve said. Steve's dead.

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Steve said 10 inch minimum. Steve said the iPad Mini was bad, even at 7.9 inch. Because 7.9 < 10. So what you said flies in the face of Steve's "knowledge".

Too bad the Internet is so good at remembering quotes uh ?

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Jobs talked about everything less than 10 inches. *taps the quote*.
Spot on. Steve was simply wrong about the "ideal tablet size". Remember, he was a master salesman. As such, he was selling the iPad, hard as hell. But there was internal discussions at Apple whether or not he was right. He wasn't.

"Steve said. Steve's dead." Hahahahahahah..I shouldn't be laughing, but, HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH! Awesome. (sorry)

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Quote:
Originally Posted by macfacts View Post
One thing I'm wondering, why cut orders from Sharp. It would make more sense to cut out Samsung.
Good question. Quality and or speed in getting them out, perhaps?
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 02:58 PM   #130
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There's rumors that Apple is going into clothing. Shirts, pants, shoes and leaving the electronic consumer market. I wonder how analyst will react to this.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:01 PM   #131
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here we go again


we dont get to hear such stories about others - sony , sammy, LG

Apple breathes in - stocks shakes
Apple takes a sleep - everyone knows and taking it like a serious tsunami

am sure apple be like - we hate this lime light , we only love it when we show off our new products , not when we wanna sneeze.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:04 PM   #132
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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
I'm using the definitions of open/closed as used in this industry. It's not a case of opinions.

Single vendor, proprietary = closed. The Cathedral.
Multi vendor, documented standard = open. The Bazaar.

Why do people feel "Closed" is an insult and absolutely must defend so kind of twisted notion that "Windows is open!". Windows is a closed operating system, it uses a different development model than an open operating system. No wrong about that. Closed or Open is not inherently Bad vs Good.
I find it amusing that to this day I encounter plenty of IT folks and PC fans that dis and complain about Apple's "proprietary" OS, walled gardens, and the like but then evangelize Windows "superiority".

For me Apple's 'hybrid" gives the best combination of geekery if /when I'd want it and "consumeristic" fire-and-forget simplicity. I can dig deep if I want to, but I don't have to.

Definitely, the Cathedral and the Bazaar is the best/reference document explaining the open/closed OS paradigm. Way more interesting read than I expected.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:06 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by simon.hibbs View Post
Apple.
Proudly going out of business since 1976.

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Make that your sig. NAO!
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:08 PM   #134
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I agree with others that this is probably non-news meant to get people riled up again.

I will say that from day one I thought that the original iPad was too big. It has always been an awkward size not quite small enough to be portable and thus overlapping too much with a more functional laptop. But it was the only size of iPad available at the time and it is from Apple so people bought it.

The ipad mini is the perfect size and would be the perfect iOS tablet if Apple had introduced it first. But instead they shoved iPad2 specs into the device and gave it the iPad2 interface even though the mini is smaller. It is the opposite problem of having phone apps blown up to tablet size. Having a large tablet interface shrunken just enough to be annoying (to me atleast) to a smaller size.

But it is an amazing form factor and as this is only revision 1 I'm sure Apple can only improve from here. Wouldn't be surprised to see the iPad mini become the main iPad and the original iPad become an iPad Pro (which would be kind of cool if it came with iOS Pro)
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:25 PM   #135
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I'm probably not going to buy a bigger iPad anymore, the find the iPad mini to be such a great size, since getting the mini I've been using it so much more. Just seems so much convenient to take places!
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:38 PM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lozpop View Post
Jobs talked about 7 inches tablets, the iPad mini is 8 inches — a huge difference in terms of user experience.

In fact now it seems that Samsung is planning an 8 inch tablet to compete.
Actually, knowing Samsung (and the trends in Android phones in general) it's probably an 8" smartphone.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:42 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by japanime View Post
Will be interesting to see how the stock market reacts to this latest news.
Like they react to all Apple news: ”Apple is doomed!”
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:44 PM   #138
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JS3 View Post
Here comes the death of the 9.7
This sort of thing is ridiculous. I hope it is sarcasm.

Like water finding it's own level, introducing a new product in the Apple ecosystem, and it's ripples through the industry... things will find a new level.

Why would an ~8" tablet automatically negate a ~10" version?

I don't get why commenters go nuts about market diversification.

So what if you can get a 5", 8", and 10" apple touch device, with or without a phone embedded?

Different people have different priorities, iMagine that...

Soon, as things continue to migrate toward comms over data streams, rather than comms (phone minutes and texting) being treated differently than data, it won't matter which device you have... they'll all be operable communicators with text, vox, or vid modes...

Pick your preferred size, and go.

If the public preference is 3 varied sizes of touch-screen there will be three.

Maybe eventually it will migrate to other sizes, as people try things and buy what they find that they like the best.

Between my iPhone, and the iPad that my wife mostly uses, and loves... she prefers the largest, and more powerful iPad, but the laptop is too bulky for her preference, and she can't draw directly on the screen.

I find myself using my iPhone less and less, but still sometimes when I am away from any other computer... but I prefer using the laptop to compose comments like this one. I don't carry it around the house as much, and it is much easier for typing.

I wish my iphone were bigger for portable internet access, and I really like the iPad Mini's larger screen real-estate, but much lighter weight than the full-size iPad.

I would consider a very small and basic cell phone in my pocket, if I could figure a way to carry an iPad Mini around in a practical sense for internet access, but I don't usually carry a bag, and iPad Mini won't fit in a front pocket, and I would rather not sit on it in a back pocket, even if it would fit. Men usually don't carry bags for accoutrements, either. I don't even like to carry a coat around if I think I can endure the cold for a little while.

So I continue to use my iPhone 4 until I really want something better enough to pay for it. Maybe I'll upgrade to an iPhone 5S, maybe I won't. Maybe I'll figure out how to carry around an iPad Mini with cell network access, in a way that isn't tedious and likely for me to leave it, rather than bring it. I don't see myself finding a way to carry a 10" tablet around everywhere, but my wife will probably get another one in the future.

This is the market at work. This is how it operates for companies to figure out what their customers want.

There is room in the market for all of it... and as the market adopts these products en masse, the growth rate necessarily levels off with fewer people left that have yet to participate.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 03:56 PM   #139
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Originally Posted by TC03 View Post
That's not the edge Android devices have, people could care less about whether it's open. 'Open' just means 'open', not better. What does give Android devices an edge is the following:

1. They're cheaper.
2. They have bigger screens.
No, the real edge is that there are more resources dived into it, which means more variation, more innovation over time and better price/feature ratio.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Windows held a monopoly over the desktop/laptop segment (and still does) for decades with a closed platform. Open/Closed as nothing to do with it.
Windows is not a closed platform, since it lets everyone develop hardware for the platform. "open" does not equal to "free".

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Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
Windows is a proprietary operating system that is controlled by a single vendor.
Android is 99%+ controlled by a single company -- Google, too. Again, "open" does not equal to "free". Of course, "open and free" is even better.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 04:08 PM   #140
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Originally Posted by KPOM View Post
Any company can take Android, customize it however they want, and put it in their products to sell. You can't do that with Windows. First of all, Microsoft charges a license fee, and second, they don't allow you to edit the code.
Wrong! Windows allows hardware manufacturers to plug in their own system extensions and drivers, gives APIs to general purpose software companies to change almost every part of the OS.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 04:09 PM   #141
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The biggest problem of the full size iPad is weight. When you hold it, you soon notice it's similar to the weight of a MacBook Air (very comfortable for a laptop, but not so comfortable for a tablet)

Second problem is size: it's fine if you're always to have it on a desk, but it doesn't fit on a pocket, so it's somewhat uncomfortable to wear

The iPad mini fixes all of this: a more comfortable weight, and fits on a (large) pocket. So, when it gets a retina display, it can be a real killer, no doubt about it.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 04:33 PM   #142
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The biggest problem of the full size iPad is weight. When you hold it, you soon notice it's similar to the weight of a MacBook Air (very comfortable for a laptop, but not so comfortable for a tablet)

Second problem is size: it's fine if you're always to have it on a desk, but it doesn't fit on a pocket, so it's somewhat uncomfortable to wear

The iPad mini fixes all of this: a more comfortable weight, and fits on a (large) pocket. So, when it gets a retina display, it can be a real killer, no doubt about it.
Just like full-size iPad is too big, too heavy and too bulky for certain things, mini is too small for others. It's called choice. Just like 11" Air vs 15" Retina. Again, choice. For me I need the full-size iPad to read PDFs and large technical books, and I much prefer to browse on a large screen without zooming. My wife swears by her Mini as it's great for reading novels and watching videos.

Why do people say that a Mini will kill the bigger iPad just because they like the smaller size better is beyond me.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 04:43 PM   #143
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Originally Posted by TallManNY View Post
I work in law and the energy industry. If I go to a meeting that is expected to last sever hours, maybe one where a bunch of people flew in for it, if there are 20 people in the meeting there will be four or five iPads. People like to get their email during meetings and it is easier to read them on the iPad and to respond. And those emails often have Word documents attached, which they can look at much easier then if they just brought a iPhone or blackberry. The top level guys like to travel with the light iPads instead of bringing a laptop. It is sort of a status thing I think. Kind of like someone else has to carry their briefcase or at least carry the heavier laptop, while they travel light with just the latest technology.
Makes sense I guess...
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 04:58 PM   #144
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Originally Posted by KnightWRX View Post
I'm using the definitions of open/closed as used in this industry. It's not a case of opinions.

Single vendor, proprietary = closed. The Cathedral.
Multi vendor, documented standard = open. The Bazaar.

Why do people feel "Closed" is an insult and absolutely must defend so kind of twisted notion that "Windows is open!". Windows is a closed operating system, it uses a different development model than an open operating system. No wrong about that. Closed or Open is not inherently Bad vs Good.
"Open" does not equal to "Open Source". The original discussion was using Windows platform to compare to the Android platform, versus the iOS platform. Under this comparison environment, the Windows platform should definitely be classified as an open platform.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:02 PM   #145
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Mini won't sell they said, it's too expensive they said, Apple is making a mistake they said.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:02 PM   #146
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Add me to the list of those consumers shifting interest. It's not very likely that I'm going to buy either in the near future, but I do like the smaller form better.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:07 PM   #147
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No. When we're talking about "open" vs. "closed", single-provider platforms like Windows and OS X are closed. Open-source platforms (multiple contributor) platforms like Linux and FreeBSD are open.
This is the worst among all of the threads on this topic, because you specifically used the word "platform" and don't realize that a platform is made up not just the OS but also the hardware that runs the OS and the kernel extensions (including drivers) to the OS. iOS platform is a totally closed platform. Android, Linux, FreeBSD, OpenBSD, Windows platforms are all open platforms, although some of them are free, some of them are not, some of them are open at source code level and some of them are not. OS X platform is somewhere in between, but lean more towards the closed platform side.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:13 PM   #148
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Just like full-size iPad is too big, too heavy and too bulky for certain things, mini is too small for others. It's called choice. Just like 11" Air vs 15" Retina. Again, choice. For me I need the full-size iPad to read PDFs and large technical books, and I much prefer to browse on a large screen without zooming. My wife swears by her Mini as it's great for reading novels and watching videos.

Why do people say that a Mini will kill the bigger iPad just because they like the smaller size better is beyond me.
Would you mind if Apple increased the screen size from the current 9.7" to 11-12"? I think that's what Apple will need to do.
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:16 PM   #149
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[QUOTE=crepuscular;16686120]No, that is not what "open" means.

Parts of OS X, however, are

Don't confuse the meaning of "open platform" with "open source".
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Old Jan 18, 2013, 05:32 PM   #150
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Would you mind if Apple increased the screen size from the current 9.7" to 11-12"? I think that's what Apple will need to do.
Yes, I have always wanted a larger iPad since day one.
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