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Old Jan 23, 2013, 05:06 PM   #1
jonnyb098
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Safe to put all this March iPad mini update rumors to rest after today's quarterly re

Let me preface by pointing out that personally I always felt the March rumors were ridiculous link bait. However I have laid out some points of interest/logic of why a "retina" mini won't be released until fall.

POINT 1:
Tim Cook REPEATEDLY stressed during today's quarterly conference call that iPad mini units were very constrained and still so currently. I find it extremely unlikely that we will ever see a "retina" mini before fall given they still can't keep up with current demand. If there were indeed a march release, they would need to ramp up in the coming weeks for that release. Very unlikely since they cant even keep up now!

POINT 2:
There is a SEVERE amount of engineering that will have to go into making a retina mini in such a small and light package. The full size iPad had to get thicker and heavier to accomodate this. There are massive heat and battery issues to overcome. I simply can't see that all being figured out and components ready to go in the next few weeks for a March release.

Relax until fall people
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 05:08 PM   #2
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A sane and reasonable post on these forums, you don't see that every day
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 06:16 PM   #3
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 06:25 PM   #4
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Agreed. Rest easy with your mini's, folks. You made a good purchase. Love mine so much.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 08:28 PM   #5
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I don't see the mini being updated until later this year, but the full size iPad is more than due for an update as it has had the same design since the iPad 2.
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:17 PM   #6
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I don't see the mini being updated until later this year, but the full size iPad is more than due for an update as it has had the same design since the iPad 2.
The iMac has had the same relative design since 2004,

And the iPhone since 2007
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:30 PM   #7
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Old Jan 23, 2013, 09:45 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by saving107 View Post
The iMac has had the same relative design since 2004, Image

And the iPhone since 2007
Image
This is true. I don't necessarily mean a radical new design, I mean something more modern, like the iPad Mini's design. The iPad's current design looks dated when it's put next to an iPad Mini. The same can be said for the iMac and iPhone in the images you posted. All have the same design, but they've been updated over time to look more modern. The iPhone 5 looks much better than say, the iPhone 3GS. The same can be said for the iMac when it went from the design it had in 2004 to the redesign it got in 2007, and from 2007 to 2012. It's all the same design, with slight changes to make it more modern, thinner, the lighter, etc (although you could say that the 2004 iMac to the 2007 iMac was a major redesign).
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:00 AM   #9
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Yeah, I agree.
Was hoping for a retina Mini in march, but after yesterdays report I'm sure we'll havt to wait until fall. Hopefully they do release an iPad 5.

Cook also said they were expecting to meet demand/desired stock volume near the end of this quarter. So no reason to bring out the retina when the mini is still selling that good.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:37 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by jonnyb098 View Post

There is a SEVERE amount of engineering that will have to go into making a retina mini in such a small and light package. The full size iPad had to get thicker and heavier to accomodate this. There are massive heat and battery issues to overcome. I simply can't see that all being figured out and components ready to go in the next few weeks for a March release.
Your taking about .03 inches, and .11 pounds. I hardly think that would be a determining factor of not creating a retina display mini in the very near future. The pros definitely outweigh the cons.

For all we know the "design" of the mini retina has been in the pipeline for 2 years, therefore its a matter of Apple "flipping" a switch for production to begin. Its not like they come up with entire product in a couple months before production begins.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:47 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by Mlrollin91 View Post
Your taking about .03 inches, and .11 pounds. I hardly think that would be a determining factor of not creating a retina display mini in the very near future. The pros definitely outweigh the cons.

For all we know the "design" of the mini retina has been in the pipeline for 2 years, therefore its a matter of Apple "flipping" a switch for production to begin. Its not like they come up with entire product in a couple months before production begins.
Yes, apple does have products in their pipeline for a while but it's not as quick as flipping a switch, the technology has to be ready to mass produce and apple has to order the parts. No, not as quick as flipping a switch at all.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:53 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by jonnyb098 View Post
Yes, apple does have products in their pipeline for a while but it's not as quick as flipping a switch, the technology has to be ready to mass produce and apple has to order the parts. No, not as quick as flipping a switch at all.
How do you possible know that the technology is not ready to go? There is a lot more going on that we don't have a clue about. Its all a matter of time for when Apple is going to release it. For all we know it won't be until the 3rd Gen like the iPad. Apple had the means to make the iPad 2 retina, but they added FaceTime. Apple always makes updates very slowly over generations in order to sell more units.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:53 AM   #13
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I agree with the mini 2 not coming until fall but not sure about the ipad 5. With full sized ipad sales slowing due to minis high demand, it would make sense for Apple to release a full sized ipad with a mini style design and market that without the hype of a new mini. I also agree with the technical issues with retina mini. I don't think a retina mini can be mass produced economically yet without sacrificing battery life or weight/ size.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:54 AM   #14
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Fair enough, no iPad Mini in March. I'll set my prediction to April.

Seriously though, the fact that there does seem to be a bit of fallout in terms of hype and product innovation may still indicate an "earlier than expected" update for ANY of their products simply to try to maintain their faling reputation as innovators.

People out here may strongly disagree but IMO Apple hasnt done anything exciting in quite a while and in a year where I upgraded just about every bit of Apple gear I own, in retrospect I have to say 2012 was an awful year for Apple products.

- 2011-12 hardware upgrades were disappointing (Air/Mini)
- Retina MBP's are way overpriced (Sorry, but the $2k era of laptops is long over)
- iPad Mini (I bought THREE!) are amazing but clearly lack retina
- iPhone 5's taller screen did nothing to address the demand for larger screens
- No new Apple software (iLife 11? iWork 09?)
- Weak OSX/iOS updates
- iTunes Match is still flaky (Duplicates, no metadata update, no new features)
- Thunderbolt/Lightning. New plugs with no new products

I know theres a lot of negativity there but I say it out of my love of Apple products. Apple can do much MUCH better than what we saw in 2012 and I think it sucks that they've developed this trend of playing it safe. So I fully expect 2013 to be a year where we get to see Apple show us what they can do. And I expect that all to start sooner rather than later. (And I just dont buy this idea that "Apple hasnt figured out how to do a retina mini" stuff. Its an excuse based off nothing)
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:10 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by urkel View Post
Fair enough, no iPad Mini in March. I'll set my prediction to April.

Seriously though, the fact that there does seem to be a bit of fallout in terms of hype and product innovation may still indicate an "earlier than expected" update for ANY of their products simply to try to maintain their faling reputation as innovators.

People out here may strongly disagree but IMO Apple hasnt done anything exciting in quite a while and in a year where I upgraded just about every bit of Apple gear I own, in retrospect I have to say 2012 was an awful year for Apple products.

- 2011-12 hardware upgrades were disappointing (Air/Mini)
- Retina MBP's are way overpriced (Sorry, but the $2k era of laptops is long over)
- iPad Mini (I bought THREE!) are amazing but clearly lack retina
- iPhone 5's taller screen did nothing to address the demand for larger screens
- No new Apple software (iLife 11? iWork 09?)
- Weak OSX/iOS updates
- iTunes Match is still flaky (Duplicates, no metadata update, no new features)
- Thunderbolt/Lightning. New plugs with no new products

I know theres a lot of negativity there but I say it out of my love of Apple products. Apple can do much MUCH better than what we saw in 2012 and I think it sucks that they've developed this trend of playing it safe. So I fully expect 2013 to be a year where we get to see Apple show us what they can do. And I expect that all to start sooner rather than later. (And I just dont buy this idea that "Apple hasnt figured out how to do a retina mini" stuff. Its an excuse based off nothing)
I agree that 2013 will be a true test for Apple. But I think it's important to point out the true role Steve Jobs had the last few years of his life. After reading his biography it became clear that he had an extreme urge to do a ton of great things. That urge was fueled very much by the fact that he knew his illness was getting the best of him. The proof is obvious that Apple was kicking out amazing things one right after the other starting in 2007. What we are seeing now is a company trying to do its best after the pedal has been to the metal for a number of years. Not everything will be the next iPhone or iPad. The only things in the pipeline might be a TV/box better than the current offering and maybe the slight possibility of a watch or some wearable accessory that integrates with all our devices. Apple has a lot of cleaning up to do in software. 2013 will be the year of software for sure.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:19 AM   #16
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Agreed. I don't think we'll see an update to the iPad mini until the fall.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:49 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by saving107 View Post
The iMac has had the same relative design since 2004, Image
Where's Flower Power and Blue Dalmatian?
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 09:17 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonnyb098 View Post
Let me preface by pointing out that personally I always felt the March rumors were ridiculous link bait. However I have laid out some points of interest/logic of why a "retina" mini won't be released until fall.

POINT 1:
Tim Cook REPEATEDLY stressed during today's quarterly conference call that iPad mini units were very constrained and still so currently. I find it extremely unlikely that we will ever see a "retina" mini before fall given they still can't keep up with current demand. If there were indeed a march release, they would need to ramp up in the coming weeks for that release. Very unlikely since they cant even keep up now!

POINT 2:
There is a SEVERE amount of engineering that will have to go into making a retina mini in such a small and light package. The full size iPad had to get thicker and heavier to accomodate this. There are massive heat and battery issues to overcome. I simply can't see that all being figured out and components ready to go in the next few weeks for a March release.

Relax until fall people

Many of us have been saying this for a long time, only to be lambasted.

But yes this was always the case. And to add...

POINT 3 :
AU Optronics who are responsible for the production of iPad mini's Retina Display have stated it wont be ready for production until Q3 with release Q4 2013.



So how people somehow thought a Retina display was possible in March when the crowd producing them say different was always a mystery.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Mlrollin91 View Post
Your taking about .03 inches, and .11 pounds. I hardly think that would be a determining factor of not creating a retina display mini in the very near future. The pros definitely outweigh the cons.

For all we know the "design" of the mini retina has been in the pipeline for 2 years, therefore its a matter of Apple "flipping" a switch for production to begin. Its not like they come up with entire product in a couple months before production begins.

The A5X and A6X chips are too power hungry for the iPad Mini.

The current iPad has a 42 Watt battery, the iPad mini a 15 Watt battery. Simply supplanting one chip into the other would cause a massive degradation on battery life of the mini, alongside increased heat production due to the mini having less surface area for heat dispensation.

Apple must either re-engineer the A5X or A6X to produce a radically improved performance / power ratio. (I do not imagine them wanting to spend more money re-egineering / developing Samsung chips for future iPad or iOS devices.)

or instead I imagine the iPhone 5S / iPad Mini / iPad will all get the A7 chip designed and manufactured by Apple partners which in theory should offer the performance required to drive a 2048x1536 screen without requiring an A7X variant.

The A7 will not be released until Summer at the earliest with the iPhone 5S, with initial supply / yields of the chip destined for the new iPhone and inevitable supply / demand constraints, it means that the A7 in the iPads is likely destined for Q3/Q4 instead, which co-incides with the 'Fall' release and the timeframe AU Optonics have said the iPad mini's retina display will be in production.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 09:30 AM   #19
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2013 will be the year of software for sure.
I've also been saying this. This March/April would be a great time to announce the new mac-pro and a slew of new software releases, as ALL apple software - top 2 toe - needs a refresh.

Apple needs to make 2013 the year of the MAC and not just iOS.

With Windows 8 still failing to woo PC users, a massive stampede of great MAC software and OS announcements would be very well timed.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 09:46 AM   #20
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What are people's views on an ipad 5 release after all this?
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 10:02 AM   #21
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I don't see the mini being updated until later this year, but the full size iPad is more than due for an update as it has had the same design since the iPad 2.
Actually, the iPad 3 and 4 share similar designs. They are both 'different' than the 2. Not a major difference, it's subtle...but I'm not so sure there's an actual need to change the package until the energy technology allows a slimmer/lighter shell without sacrificing up-time on the big iPad. I'm still amazed everyday using my iPad 4 how much power is in this 1.5 pound slab.
While we are enjoying the iPad Mini as well...I still very much prefer using the iPad 4 for most of what I do. My wife on the other hand won't let go of the Mini (Perhaps I've 'learned' to enjoy the iPad 4 more as I don't often have the chance to 'enjoy' the Mini ).

My point is...and as always, ymmv---the iPad 4's design is timeless...I didn't realize it weighed too much until the Mini dropped...and I'm very, VERY happy with retina screens...I'd rather have a bit heavier/larger package WITH battery life and retina than lighter/smaller without.


Quote:
Originally Posted by urkel View Post
Fair enough, no iPad Mini in March. I'll set my prediction to April.

Seriously though, the fact that there does seem to be a bit of fallout in terms of hype and product innovation may still indicate an "earlier than expected" update for ANY of their products simply to try to maintain their faling reputation as innovators.

People out here may strongly disagree but IMO Apple hasnt done anything exciting in quite a while and in a year where I upgraded just about every bit of Apple gear I own, in retrospect I have to say 2012 was an awful year for Apple products.

- 2011-12 hardware upgrades were disappointing (Air/Mini)
- Retina MBP's are way overpriced (Sorry, but the $2k era of laptops is long over)
- iPad Mini (I bought THREE!) are amazing but clearly lack retina
- iPhone 5's taller screen did nothing to address the demand for larger screens
- No new Apple software (iLife 11? iWork 09?)
- Weak OSX/iOS updates
- iTunes Match is still flaky (Duplicates, no metadata update, no new features)
- Thunderbolt/Lightning. New plugs with no new products

I know theres a lot of negativity there but I say it out of my love of Apple products. Apple can do much MUCH better than what we saw in 2012 and I think it sucks that they've developed this trend of playing it safe. So I fully expect 2013 to be a year where we get to see Apple show us what they can do. And I expect that all to start sooner rather than later. (And I just dont buy this idea that "Apple hasnt figured out how to do a retina mini" stuff. Its an excuse based off nothing)
Wow---May I address each point? Cool!!

Hardware in 2012 disappointing? IMHO---Hardly!!! In fact, 2012 was...in my 25 years of computing easily been one of the BEST years for hardware purchases, specifically because of Apple!!!

Retina Baby!!! Across the lineups. iPad 3/4. My new Retina Macbook Pro--Best laptop I've EVER owned. iPad 4 is a MONSTER!!! iPad Mini was a Home Run! iPhone 5 is easily the BEST mobile phone I've owned in two decades--a True Pocket computer --- The iTouch 5th gen is absolutey amazing. I bought my son one and we're having a blast playing games together on the Apple TV/1080p update (that was last year too, right?) The iMac redesign with Fusion drive, lack of reflective glass, USB 3 and more ThunderBolt ports...HDMI, finally! All SSD options in MBPs.....I'm just not sure Apple has ever had a BETTER or more Innovative year than 2012---A Major change for me, and my enjoyment of computing speed and 'looks' with those retina screens

Retina laptops overpriced??? Really??? Go to Lenovo.com. Click Think Pad, and build out a 180GB SSD model (15") 1080p w/16GB of RAM. It's $2200. Sony's high end laptops with 256GB SSD, just shy of $2300...HP/Dell/Alienware/IBuyPower....doesn't matter WHICH laptop you choose....ALL have trade offs, ALL can be built to within spec of Apple's MBPs and ALL are right at or near the price of Apple's Retina offerings on laptops. $2,000 computers are the 'norm' if you want high end displays, SSD storage, 16GB of RAM and decent I/O options. And as always, Apple has stayed 'true' to NOT building a POS $499 laptop.

You bought THREE Minis even though they 'clearly lack retina' --- 'nuff said

iPhone 5's 4" screen definitely addressed a bigger screen. All day, everyday-- 4" is bigger than 3.5". Many of us (about 25-30million or so) are VERY happy with the iPhone 5. Go Android if you want bigger than 4". There are LOTS of options on the market and if it's a bigger phone you want, Apple may NOT be for you. They obviously are to many though. Clearly they addressed what the market desired.

No New Apple Software....There is still nothing on the market that comes close to the iLife suite. Regardless of it's age, Apple continues to update Garage Band, iPhoto, et al. They've also spent a couple years putting together incredible iOS versions of their iLife and iWork suite---but if you're a power user, Microsoft Office has never been better on a Mac than Office 2011. I'm excited to see the iWork update sooner than later as well...but IMO, again...the iLife suite is outstanding...and one of the many benefits that come with buying a Mac. No Windows OEM comes close to this software out of the box!

I'd hardly call the Mountain Lion update weak. For me, it's been Awesome! For Apple...one of the, if not THE fastest selling OS update EVER! Compare the demand between 10.8 and Windows 8 and I think OSx speaks for itself. As far as iOS 6.0...I guess I'm in the minority, but I dig it. It's fast, efficient, does what I need...and what it doesn't, I can typically find an 'app for that'. I am excited for iOS7---but iOS6 is a polished example of a mobile operating system...it shows it's age perfectly. Mature. Stable. And Fast as Hell!!!

While iTunes match is still going through some growing pains...it crushes the competition. Amazon and Google Music. Check out Maximum PC's review of the three...iTunes Match comes out (easily) on top! It'll get there. iTunes took some time to mature---I think iTunes 11 is a big step in the right direction (and an update to your earlier slam on 2012 software in iLife). To have your library with you wherever you are is awesome!!! To update your older 128mb/s rips to AAC is even better!!! I'm sure they're constantly working to improve their 'web services'....which is definitely where I'd like to see them spend their time this year.

As far as Thunderbolt---hardly Apple's fault. It's been a wait, for sure. But in the professional sector, there's been some incredible options open up for video/audio and photography post production. Belkin and other third parties will certainly come to the table with options this year...with docks that add a couple of USB3 ports, HDMI, Ethernet, eSATA, card readers, etc, etc....T/B is only going to get better with time. It's hard to blame Apple though---3rd party peripherals have to come from 'other' companies to see growth. Hopefully 2013 is the year.

Yes...I'm typically a glass is half full person....but in my opinion, to dismiss 2012 as a big fail/miss year for Apple is a silly, half hearted attempt at a joke. Regardless of what the goofy stock market 'says'---at no time in my life has a company offered a more compelling mix of hard/software that affects my personal and business life so significantly. From early morning RSS/News through the day's communication (phone/text/email) to my business needs basic to advanced...to evening entertainment, information and relaxation---I'm at a loss for WHAT Apple could offer that would intrigue me---that I (we as a society) don't already have access to in this day and age.

...But....That's what Apple has ALWAYS been great at. Releasing a product we didn't KNOW we needed. It just doesn't happen EVERY year. There were 6 years between iPod and iPhone. 3 between iPad and iPhone. However...in the middle, some amazing updates/upgrades and evolutionary add-ons that have matured each device to a point that they are nearly 'perfect!'

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Old Jan 24, 2013, 10:08 AM   #22
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...And the iPhone since 2007
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Most people don't grasp that Apple created new manufacturing processes for the iPhone 5.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 10:50 AM   #23
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What are people's views on an ipad 5 release after all this?
Fall, most likely.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 10:50 AM   #24
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POINT 2:
There is a SEVERE amount of engineering that will have to go into making a retina mini in such a small and light package. The full size iPad had to get thicker and heavier to accomodate this. There are massive heat and battery issues to overcome. I simply can't see that all being figured out and components ready to go in the next few weeks for a March release.
Yes, there's no way to currently put a retina display in a smaller screen. Now where did I put my iPhone 4? Or my 4S. Or my 5. Oh there it is. What a screen!
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 11:03 AM   #25
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Yes, there's no way to currently put a retina display in a smaller screen. Now where did I put my iPhone 4? Or my 4S. Or my 5. Oh there it is. What a screen!
Yes and you can barely get 5 hours of heavy use compared to 10+ on the iPads! Not sure if you understand resolution and its power demands. Even a slight bump can cause much higher graphics/processor/battery demands. Its not about size but the power needed to do it. The retina iPhone 4S has a slightly lower res than an iPad 2. Pushing 2048x1536 onto the 7.9 inch screen IS a huge demand on battery and processor to get 10 hour battery life iPads are famous for. And as I stated, doing this in the larger iPad caused a slight weight and thickness increase. I never stated it wont happen, but the engineering involved is intense. The iPad 3/4 is pushing almost as many pixels as the 27" iMac I use at work. Its insanely awesome but it comes with tradeoffs. Even my 4S gets VERY warm during 3D gaming.
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