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Old Jan 24, 2013, 03:39 PM   #126
53x12
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Originally Posted by thelookingglass View Post
Would you rather they put out slightly less stellar products and give you a completely new, re-designed iPhone every year with basically the same innards? How about every six months?
YES!! We wan't colors. Red. Blue. Green. Yellow. Gray. Orange. We want colors.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 03:47 PM   #127
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Originally Posted by tdream View Post
Im saying this is a pep rally when the folks at wall street arent buying their story but you clearly do and you are smarter than those folks in wall street. That much is iobvious.

If you havent noticed a lot of folks are leaving apple, Cook probably told them everything is great too until the door was shown. I wonder how long until Tim is shown the door.
"A lot of folks"? Who are all these people? I'm sorry but Apple recorded revenues and profits this quarter. Most companies would kill for $13B profits in ONE QUARTER. It's ridiculous to think Cook wouldn't thank employees for their hard work. And since Wall Street is so down on the stock right now it makes perfect sense for Cook to host a town hall and talk to employees, calm fears, take questions etc.

It blows my mind that people would have a go at Cook for sending a thank you note to employees and hosting a town hall.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 03:54 PM   #128
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Originally Posted by thelookingglass View Post
These comments are just hilarious. Have you ever managed a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company?
Have you?


Quote:
Originally Posted by thelookingglass View Post
Are you aware that Apple can't work magic and that sometimes their pace of innovation is limited by what OTHER component makers have the ability to make?
I am well aware. The stock lost over 30% just in 40 month. These are just excuses. Samsung, for instance, does not have such. I mean do you really need 60,000 employees to duplicate the same product year after year?

Be creative: you are "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company", aren't you? And you have all the cash: buy component makers, build your own manufacturing, whatever... so I don't have to teach you how to run "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company".
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:10 PM   #129
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Originally Posted by iAco View Post
They had a winning quarter-over-quarter for a while now. How come the congratulations comes now? Oh snap! It's because Apple's stock is heading south and it will be the last stunning quarter from Apple for a while.

What a way to juice your employees.

Too bad in the end Google will dominate the world with marketshare and data and services that are just a little more useful then hardware build by folks with OCD. But don't get me wrong, I love the shiny toys!
You'd better hide before the OCD-Nazis come at you in full force
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:28 PM   #130
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You'd better hide before the OCD-Nazis come at you in full force
I wouldn't worry about it. They're all too busy goosestepping exactly 55 times around the house and washing their hands afterwards to do anything else.

...yeah, I'm gonna spend a couple years in purgatory for that one. BUT IT WAS WORTH IT!
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:31 PM   #131
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Originally Posted by Chupa Chupa View Post
Simple... Apple didn't meet sales targets, esp on iPhone 5. Profit margin was down. Investors don't see anything to fuel additional growth. Shorter: Apple needs a new "big thing" product for the stock to break out on the upside again. Cook needs to deliver.
Actually, not entirely true. They met their own targets - in fact, they superseded them. They didn't meet financial analysts' projections. So despite a fantastic year for them, selling way more than they expected and way more than last year, because those not connected with the company thought they'd do better, their stock went down.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:32 PM   #132
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Town Hall isn't in DeAnza 3. Town Hall is in 4 Infinite Loop (called "IL4" by employees).

Source: I've been to IL4 6 times and to Town Hall twice.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:44 PM   #133
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Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
"A lot of folks"? Who are all these people? I'm sorry but Apple recorded revenues and profits this quarter. Most companies would kill for $13B profits in ONE QUARTER. It's ridiculous to think Cook wouldn't thank employees for their hard work. And since Wall Street is so down on the stock right now it makes perfect sense for Cook to host a town hall and talk to employees, calm fears, take questions etc.

It blows my mind that people would have a go at Cook for sending a thank you note to employees and hosting a town hall.
I thought his job was to make products that redefine the industry. Not act like captain HR, "yay we all love you Tim"... His job is not to pat everyone on the back and scrunch their hair.

He's a by the book manager, making sure everyone is happy and satisfied with their jobs, make sure all the logistics are all sorted out (well apparently this area isn't even going well according to some articles). He's taking action on everything bar the giant elephant in the room, the most important thing to any company, making great products. Oh you can say isn't the iPhone 5, etc, etc great. Well sort of, but they are still legacies of the previous tenant.

I'm sure the majority of the employees began when Steve was in charge. They didn't sign up be led by a man the likes of Tim Cook and his Kumbaya campfire stories.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:47 PM   #134
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Ok ill ask again, wouldn't some of that already be priced in to the stock? I mean its not like the stock has been on a tear lately. It's basically been down since September.
The story about good revenue growth but shrinking margins was offered at the last conference call, and then at this conference call with no suggestion that there is an expectation that this will change other than the usual hyperbole about "incredible" things on the horizon. If those incredible things are just product refreshes, you will get financial numbers that no one likes. This story didn't change in the conference call, so the stock will sell off until it does.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 04:54 PM   #135
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Originally Posted by Herculeinstein View Post
Instead of crying and complaining about Apples stock price dropping you should be moving your money elsewhere if you were smart, but instead you're blinded by your love of Apple when there are so many more great opportunities out there to invest your money. Forget about Apple they have nowhere to go but down. Again INVEST YOUR MONEY SOMEWHERE ELSE there are some great opportunities out there if you can get over your Apple love. If not then you deserve to lose. Atleast pull your money out then get back in when it hits rock bottom like the evil stock manipulters you hate so much are doing. You guys holding on to your stock forever and complaining when it goes down don't know how to play the game and you WILL LOSE trust me.
Bailing and getting back in makes no sense unless you're a fortune teller. You pay almost 2x in taxes with that day trader mentality. Apple fell from $200 to $80 not too long ago and bounced back strong to $700. Along the way, they had a couple of big drops. You can't predict these things. I agree you shouldn't hold a stock based on blind faith or love, but the last thing people should do is panic. In fact, the best time to make money is when others are panicking.

For those who are long Apple, take a deep breath, examine the facts, and make an informed decision. In my mind, now is a good time to get in, not out for several reasons:

1. There's a good possibility that China mobile and NTT DoCoMo will carry the iPhone this year. That's about a billion more people who'll have access to the iPhone.

2. Strong product pipeline: iPhone 5S, iPad mini 2, iPad 5, next gen iOS and Mac OS and possibly an Apple TV.

3. Robust demand. Apple left billions on the table because they couldn't reach supply/demand balance for quite a few products: iPhone 4, iPhone 5, iMac and iPad mini.

4. They're growing. They grew by double digits YoY but people were disappointed by next quarter's guidance. What many forget is that unlike last year, Apple won't have a new iPad launch, and yet they're still expecting to grow 5-10% which is very impressive.

5. Cash. They just added over $16B to their cash pile, which is enough to buy Nokia based on their current market cap.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:00 PM   #136
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Originally Posted by 53x12 View Post
Wasn't Google Voice Search out before Siri when you consider its integration into Google Chrome?

From my experience with both Siri and Google Voice, Google blows Siri away. Faster, more languages supported, easier to use, more accurate...etc.
I recall it got pushed into Android because Google found out that Apple bought Siri (which was already an iphone app) and knew they needed to be a player in this space, too. They then rushed this product into Android so they could be "first"
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:03 PM   #137
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Originally Posted by ifij775 View Post
I recall it got pushed into Android because Google found out that Apple bought Siri (which was already an iphone app) and knew they needed to be a player in this space, too. They then rushed this product into Android so they could be "first"
I'm pretty sure Google Voice Search was out long, long before any of us had even heard of Siri, let alone cared much about it.

Voice commands aren't exactly a new thing. Even before Siri and Google Voice, we all had access to Dragon software. Before that? Hell, I dunno. There's been tons over the years.

Don't make it look like Google were caught off guard on the whole issue. They weren't.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:19 PM   #138
archipellago
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Originally Posted by Karma*Police View Post
Bailing and getting back in makes no sense unless you're a fortune teller. You pay almost 2x in taxes with that day trader mentality. Apple fell from $200 to $80 not too long ago and bounced back strong to $700. Along the way, they had a couple of big drops. You can't predict these things. I agree you shouldn't hold a stock based on blind faith or love, but the last thing people should do is panic. In fact, the best time to make money is when others are panicking.

For those who are long Apple, take a deep breath, examine the facts, and make an informed decision. In my mind, now is a good time to get in, not out for several reasons:

1. There's a good possibility that China mobile and NTT DoCoMo will carry the iPhone this year. That's about a billion more people who'll have access to the iPhone.

2. Strong product pipeline: iPhone 5S, iPad mini 2, iPad 5, next gen iOS and Mac OS and possibly an Apple TV.

3. Robust demand. Apple left billions on the table because they couldn't reach supply/demand balance for quite a few products: iPhone 4, iPhone 5, iMac and iPad mini.

4. They're growing. They grew by double digits YoY but people were disappointed by next quarter's guidance. What many forget is that unlike last year, Apple won't have a new iPad launch, and yet they're still expecting to grow 5-10% which is very impressive.

5. Cash. They just added over $16B to their cash pile, which is enough to buy Nokia based on their current market cap.

Agree but to play devils advocate..

1. Access to does not equal sales, might do, but might not.

2. Strong pipeline that is just yet more incremental upgrades? I'd argue its not strong at all. iPhone 5 shows the slowdown is happening.

3. Over here in Europe none of the phones were in short supply, iPhone 5 was in stock everywhere less than a week after launch. iMac maybe but sales are niche at best. Apple market share w'wide is half that of US... (OSX).

4. Profit isn't growing.

5. Tax issues? A demonstrably poor use of already a large asset.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:23 PM   #139
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Agree but to play devils advocate..

1. Access to does not equal sales, might do, but might not.

2. Strong pipeline that is just yet more incremental upgrades? I'd argue its not strong at all. iPhone 5 shows the slowdown is happening.

3. Over here in Europe none of the phones were in short supply, iPhone 5 was in stock everywhere less than a week after launch. iMac maybe but sales are niche at best. Apple market share w'wide is half that of US... (OSX).

4. Profit isn't growing.

5. Tax issues? A demonstrably poor use of already a large asset.
I'm just going to take issue with one of your notes, which is 4. Profit isn't growing, you can't have it both ways. Innovating companies have diving profits because margins will come down. Gross Revenues is a better indicator of growth and while it's slowing, it's still around 20%, nothing to laugh at.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 05:43 PM   #140
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While it sucks to see Apple plummet from such heights, I'm also somewhat relieved. It was time to let a little steam out and this downturn, I'm hoping will flush out a lot of the daytraders. I think it'll be good for the stock in the long run for Apple to be perceived as a pretty good company with steady consistent earnings with ~10-15% annual growth, rather than some magical, grow exponentially forever, can't-do-any-wrong company. When you're flying so high, people are bound to paint a big bullseye on you. And with that much money invested, there's bound to be manipulation.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 06:12 PM   #141
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Originally Posted by Shadowpig View Post
Try being in education. The word innovation is used constantly, even as stupid as it seems in people titles.
I just don't want the Chinese to get a hold of these terms. Anything from a Chinese seller is already always "new", "luxury", "deluxe", and "super". Soon, you might see an iPhone case on eBay that's "innovative, green, smart, and innovative."

----------

Can't they get a better picture or at least use different ones?


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Old Jan 24, 2013, 06:49 PM   #142
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Originally Posted by tdream View Post
I thought his job was to make products that redefine the industry. Not act like captain HR, "yay we all love you Tim"... His job is not to pat everyone on the back and scrunch their hair.

He's a by the book manager, making sure everyone is happy and satisfied with their jobs, make sure all the logistics are all sorted out (well apparently this area isn't even going well according to some articles). He's taking action on everything bar the giant elephant in the room, the most important thing to any company, making great products. Oh you can say isn't the iPhone 5, etc, etc great. Well sort of, but they are still legacies of the previous tenant.

I'm sure the majority of the employees began when Steve was in charge. They didn't sign up be led by a man the likes of Tim Cook and his Kumbaya campfire stories.
Cook's not the first or last CEO to send a memo to employees talking about quarterly results and thanking employees for hard their work. I don't see what's wrong with that. Personally I like the town halls we have at my company because we get to hear from leadership about goals and strategic plans for the year. So I guess I don't see this as a bad thing or abnormal.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 06:51 PM   #143
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You really seem a bit jaded. Maybe it is time to get a girlfriend, or go outside, or take up a hobby.

Relax man, if you're unhappy with Apple go on and find something else to make you happy.

Your posts just make you appear to be a man left at the altar. I'm in no way being facetious, I just really think you need to chill.


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Originally Posted by saturn88 View Post
Have you?




I am well aware. The stock lost over 30% just in 40 month. These are just excuses. Samsung, for instance, does not have such. I mean do you really need 60,000 employees to duplicate the same product year after year?

Be creative: you are "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company", aren't you? And you have all the cash: buy component makers, build your own manufacturing, whatever... so I don't have to teach you how to run "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company".
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 07:01 PM   #144
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Speculators vs investors

"It's because Apple's stock is heading south and it will be the last stunning quarter from Apple for a while." --iAco
This is a common prediction for the past ten years, but it never pans out. Stock price does not tell the future; it only tells the opinion of speculators.

"Good, solid companies are shunned" --bbeagle
No, good, solid companies are well-accepted. Notice that plenty of people keep investing in Microsoft and IBM purely on the basis that they are good, solid companies. Stock prices from one week to the next are not much driven by investors. They are driven by speculators who primarily try to guess what other speculators will do. News and rumors are the main yardsticks, not profit and management. It isn't the long-term investment in good, solid companies that causes these wild swings in stock prices. It is the daily madness of speculators who have no loyalty, just greed. They aren't looking for 100-200% every 3 months. They could hardly expect so much, and in fact almost never get it, because they rarely stick with a stock that long. They are looking for 5% every 3 days--if they can get it.

Read anything from Benjamin Graham to understand the market.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:19 PM   #145
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Maybe I can not see the apples for the trees... but what was the meat of the town hall meeting?
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:20 PM   #146
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Originally Posted by britabroad View Post
Actually, not entirely true. They met their own targets - in fact, they superseded them. They didn't meet financial analysts' projections. So despite a fantastic year for them, selling way more than they expected and way more than last year, because those not connected with the company thought they'd do better, their stock went down.
Right. And kids everywhere say the same thing to their parents and school counselors... "I set out to make straight Bs and I did. So what if you thought my potential was As."

When you revisit reality, it's investors that dictate Apple's share value, not Apple. This was hardly the stellar quarter and I say that as a shareholder and Apple Fan. Apple's going to make lots of money guaranteed just like Microsoft or any large company. Question is how are they going to grow earning, not just rely on current customers trading up? They need truly fresh product and ideas, not just more incrementalism. Tim Cook suggested we'll see it this year. I hope for his and Apple's sake that's true.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:27 PM   #147
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Originally Posted by saturn88 View Post

I am well aware. The stock lost over 30% just in 40 month. These are just excuses. Samsung, for instance, does not have such. I mean do you really need 60,000 employees to duplicate the same product year after year?
Innovation is not driven by stock prices. I don't know why that's relevant. And Samsung is a poor example. You do realize why in part Samsung devices are so big, right? Because they didn't take the time to try and cram all kinds of sophisticated gadgetry into a smaller form factor. They took a short cut and just made the device bigger which made it easier to fit everything else in. In this particular instance, it's worked out for them since the masses are easily enamored by large screens. But that still doesn't take away from the fact that they primarily copy or iterate, not innovate. Radical innovation, of the sort you seem to be referring to, is not something that can be pulled out of a hat each year. By definition, radical innovation only comes about every now and then. All you can say is "be creative", ... what EXACTLY are you looking for then that NO OTHER company has been able to do?

Quote:
Be creative: you are "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company", aren't you? And you have all the cash: buy component makers, build your own manufacturing, whatever... so I don't have to teach you how to run "a cutting edge multibillion dollar tech company".
You do know, for example, that to cram a retina display into an almost-iPad 2 form factor and increase the horsepower all while maintaining consistent 10-hr battery life is not an easy feat of engineering no matter how much money you have, right?

And, you DO understand that what they're running is a business, correct? The idea of having to re-design a completely new outer casing (which would require re-designing the inner casing as well and all the various components) just to cater to those of us who with attention deficit disorders is insanely stupid. Do I need to go into details why?
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 08:55 PM   #148
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And Samsung is a poor example. You do realize why in part Samsung devices are so big, right? Because they didn't take the time to try and cram all kinds of sophisticated gadgetry into a smaller form factor. They took a short cut and just made the device bigger which made it easier to fit everything else in.
This seems to be the new "the reason why my stuff is better than your stuff because..." spiel going around these days. I'm pretty sure it's at least the third time I've heard it around here.

Where are you getting your information? The S3 was thinner than the (then current) 4S when it came out, and a tiny, tiny bit lighter. I'm sure Samsung could've easily fit the hardware into a casing the size of the iPhone. But they didn't. Why? Simple. Because they wanted to make a device with a big screen.

There is no ulterior reason Android devices have larger screens. Other than the fact the manufacturers want them to have larger screens, anyway.
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 09:10 PM   #149
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Mr. Cook, please don't thank the team who has been responsible for iphone's design for past 3 years since they have been doing nothing.

In fact, don't thank iphone team for past 3 years since they have done nothing.

There is a reason why company is losing more than 10% of it's stock.. Whoever says apple is doing great needs to wake up. This place is becoming so static..

----------

For them to sustain their amazing run was almost impossible and it had to end sometimes.. However, for them to just sit there and print out most boring product for past 3 years is a crime. For them to come out w/ iphone 5s would most certainly will kill the stock prices again. Apple, I love you.. but please.. please wake the hell up.

----------

There are HUGE demand for bigger iphone.. HUGE..(see samsung).. so what part do you not understand?
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Old Jan 24, 2013, 09:11 PM   #150
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Originally Posted by mr666 View Post
"It's because Apple's stock is heading south and it will be the last stunning quarter from Apple for a while." --iAco
This is a common prediction for the past ten years, but it never pans out. Stock price does not tell the future; it only tells the opinion of speculators.

"Good, solid companies are shunned" --bbeagle
No, good, solid companies are well-accepted. Notice that plenty of people keep investing in Microsoft and IBM purely on the basis that they are good, solid companies. Stock prices from one week to the next are not much driven by investors. They are driven by speculators who primarily try to guess what other speculators will do. News and rumors are the main yardsticks, not profit and management. It isn't the long-term investment in good, solid companies that causes these wild swings in stock prices. It is the daily madness of speculators who have no loyalty, just greed. They aren't looking for 100-200% every 3 months. They could hardly expect so much, and in fact almost never get it, because they rarely stick with a stock that long. They are looking for 5% every 3 days--if they can get it.

Read anything from Benjamin Graham to understand the market.
Yup, people just don't understand what investing is about. Stocks always swing from exuberance and pessimism because of speculators. Value investors profit by buying in times of pessimism. Solid companies give you the safety of adequate, long-term earnings and dividends. Ben Graham said to generally avoid growth stocks, unless their price is reasonable.
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