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Old Jan 25, 2013, 05:45 AM   #1
glocke12
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9 day Penna gun/outdoor show cancelled due to outrage over firearms ban

Keep reading these gun threads here that essentially portray gun owners as sad cases, people with ego problems, mental issues, masculinity problems etc, and keep getting told over and over again how the majority of Americans do not want these weapons in public hands, and have also been told how they have no legitimate sporting use and how "true sportsman" do not want them around.

News flash...actions speak louder than words.

In my home state of PA there WAS going to be a huge hunting and outdoor themed exhibit that ran for 9 days. In the past, there were vendors displaying semi-auto firearms. This year, Reed Exhibitions (U.K. base go figure) BANNED anyone from displaying semi-auto weapons. The response was that MANY vendors and sponsors, most that have nothing at all to do with firearms and some with over 9,000 sq ft of floor space reserved boycotted the show and and decided to NOT attend in support of the Second Amendment and their gun owning brethren.

This decision is not something that was to be taken lightly for some of these people. Many had already spent thousands of dollars preparing displays for this show, many more depend on this show to generate income for the coming year.

http://www.exhibitionworld.co.uk/new...l-hunting-show

http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news/...188235341.html

Here is the complete list of vendors that have pulled out because of Reeds decision. SOrry for the length, but it is important that people understand it is not just gun groups pulling out.

So, tell me again that we are in the minority in the shooting world, that we are all mentally ill, have masculinity problems, etc...if thats the case than the same applies to ALL of these people/entities in this list. Including a company that makes boats, not guns, and a company that only makes log cabins.


2 Million Bullets.
24/7 Hunting TV.
Absaroke-Beartooth Outfitters
Alaska’s Ravencroft Lodge.
Alaskan Outdoors TV.
Ambush Firearms
American Whitetails of PA.
Antler Insanity
Apex Tactical
Appalachian Big Game TV.
Archery Tag
Arrowhead Outdoors
Artistic Visions Wildlife Studio.
Athens Archery
Atlantic Tactical
Atsko, Inc. / Sno-Seal Inc.
Avian X Decoys.
Backwoods Whitetails Outfitters.
Bad Boy Inc.
Bad Dog Accessories.
Banded Calls
Bangin Redhedz Turkey Gear.
Bear Archery
Beavertail Products
Big Game Butter.
Blitz TV
Body Guard 360.
Bohning Archery
Boulder Basin Outfitters.
Boondock Outdoors
Bow Hunter’s Den.
Bow Life, LLC.
Bramco / Golden Valley Enterprises.
Briley Outfitters
Buck Bomb
Burt Coyote Lumenok.
C&D Outfitters
Cabela’s
Camo Addiction
Campbell Cameras
CanCooker
Central Penn Sporting Clays & Game Preserve.
Chaparral Hunting Adventures.
Cochrane River Outfitters.
Cody Turkey Calls.
Cold Steel Knives.
Combative Edge
Continental Divide Outfitters.
Cross Canyon Arms.
Cutting Edge Bullets.
Darkwoods Blind
DCVR
Dead Ringer
Deer and Deer Hunting.com.
Direct Action Tactical Firearms.
Dirty Buck Soap and Scents.
Dirty Dog Outdoors.
Domari Nolo Defense Consulting.
Dominance is Everything Hunting System.
Dominator 365
Dokken Oakridge Kennels.
Down N Dirty Outdoors.
Drakes Migration Nation.
Driven TV
Droptine Outfitters
DuckWater Boats
Dunn Knives
Eastern Chapter Wild Sheep Foundation.
Eastern Outdoors
Easton Bow Hunting.
Excalibur Crossbow US, Inc.
Farmland Trophies Outfitting.
Fear No Evil.
Field Proven Calls.
Firearms Industry Consulting Group.
Firenock
Fish Outdoor Properties.
Flatline Productions
Flyway Custom Sales.
Foiles Migrators, Inc.
Forbes Turkey Calls.
FOXPRO High Performance Game Calls.
Full Circle Outdoors.
Furtakers TV
GhillieSuits.com
Ghost River Outfitters – Alberta.
Goey Hunting Calls.
Gone Wild Outdoors.
Goodling Rifles
Grand-Safari.com – South Africa/Tanzania/Cameroon.
Gut N Tag, LLC.
Hart Rifles
H.S. Specialities
Heartland Whitetails
Herd Guard
Hevi-Shot
High Lonesome Outfitters.
HookHunt
Hoyt Archery Inc.
Honey Creek Outfitters.
Hunter Safety Systems.
Hunter Specialties w/ Rick White.
Hunters and Guides Connection.
Hunters Comfort, LLC.
Hunter’s Specialties
Huntin’ Is Good! TV
IceHole Coolers
International Bowhunting Organization.
Iron Kin Hunt Club.
IScope
J & M Traditions.
Katahdin’s Shadow Outfitters.
Keystone Country Store.
Keystone Elk Country Alliance.
King of the Mountain Inc.
Kinsey’s Outdoors
Kodabow
Lac Suzie Outfitter.
Lancaster Archery Supply.
Lanco Tactical
Leupold & Stevens Inc.
Lone Oak Retreivers.
Major League Bowhunter.
Masterpiece Outdoors, Inc.
Men in Treestands Productions.
Midwest Whitetail Adventures.
Mindful of Nature LLC.
Montana Mountain West Outfitters.
Montana Whitetails
Mountain Dog Chews.
Mountain Hollow Game Calls.
Muddy Outdoors
Muskie Moose, LLC.
NasHunt Outdoors
National Wild Turkey Federation.
Nature Blinds, LLC.
NasHunt Outdoors
National Rifle Association.
Northern Hideaway Outfitters.
Northern Outdoor Lodge.
Northern Wilderness Outfitters.
North Mountain Pepper Works.
O.F. Mossberg & Sons, Inc.
Old Goat Outdoors.
Open Season TV.
Outdoor Channel Outfitters.
Outdoor Edge Knives.
Outdoor Specialist Group.
Outdoorsnative.com
Ozonics Hunting
PA Federation of Sportsmen’s Clubs.
PA Taxidermist Association, Inc.
Pat Strawser Custom Calls.
Pennsylvania Trappers Assoc.
Perry’s No Peep Archery Sights.
Pipeline Ridge Hunting Preserve.
Predator Hunting Mounts.
Primal Urge Outdoors.
Primos Hunting Calls.
Proc’s Huntin Buddy.
PSE Archery
QDMA (PA Chapter).
Radical Hunter
Ranew’s Outdoor Equipment.
Red Star Arms.
Reflections Of The Wild.
Revolution Hunting
Rhino Outdoors
Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation.
Rougeaux Taxidermy
Rough Country Outfitters.
Ruger Firearms
Rydon Corporation
S & W Outfitter.
Savco LLC
Sean Mann Outdoors.
SecureIt Tactical
Shootingthex.com
SK Knives
Skull Shine
Smith and Wesson.
Southern Game Calls.
Southwest Outdoors / Cherry Creek Lodge.
Spook Span
SportEAR
Sportsmen of North America TV.
Starkey Hollow Whitetails.
State Line Bone Mine.
Staudt’s Gun Shop.
Stay Ready Inc.
Stokerized Stabilizers
Strother Archery
Summit County Outfitters.
Summit Treestands
Susquehanna River Waterfowlers Assoc.
Table Mountain Outfitters.
Team Overkill
Team Urban Nocks.
Ten Point Crossbows.
The Bear Whisperer.
The Outdoor Loop.
The Sportsman’s Shop.
The Warmbag
ThermaCell
Thompson Center Arms.
Timberline Outfitters
TNT Archery
Tough Country
Trijicon, Inc
Triple Mag TV.
Trop Gun Shop.
Turnbull Manufacturing
U Slide Bow Hunter.
Ultimate Camo
Umax Outdoors
Upper Canyon Outfitters.
Wallaston Lake Lodge.
Tex Mex Outdoors.
The Outdoors Channel.
The Warmbag
Watson Air Lock.
Watt’s Truck Center.
Whitetail Adrenanline
Whitetail Bosses
Whitetail Freaks
Whitetail Heaven Outdoors.
Whitewolfsurvivalsupply.com
Wilburn Outdoors / Millennium Tree Stands.
Wildlife Studios Premiere Taxidermy.
Wired Outdoors
Woodcock Limited of Pennsylvania.
X-Stand Treestands
Zink Calls
Zook Cabins

Speaker / Celebrites Pulled Out (37).
Abner Druckenmiller – Furtakers TV.
Angie & Scott Denny – THE LIFE at Table Mountain.
Blaine Anthony, The Bear Whisperer.
Bob Folkrod
Bob Mercier
Brad Farris – Primos.
Buck Buckannon
Chris Brackett
Eddie Salter
Fred Eichler – Fulldraw Outfitters.
Greg Zipadelli
Hal Shaffer
Jamie Gray
Jay Gregory
J Paul Jackson – Drakes Migration nation.
Jim and Eva Shockey.
Jimmy Primos – Primos.
Josh Miller – SportDOG.
Kevin Knighton
Kyle Wieter
Larry Weishuhn
Lee & Tiffany Lakosky “The Crush“.
Marc Anthony – Speaker / Pro Hunter.
Mark Night
Matt Morett
Max Row
Michael Lee
Mike Stroff – Savage Outdoors TV.
Montana Whitetails
Nicole Jones
Pat Reeves
Ralph & Vicki Cianciarulo – Archers Choice.
Sean Mann
Stan Potts
Bone Collector
Tom Dokken
Trent Cole
Woody Sullivan

Other Boycott Supporters (47).
Advantage Taxidermy Studio Inc.
American Tactical Imports.
Anything About Guns.
Backwoods Life
Bloodline With Alex Ruthledge.
Blue Rock Outfitters.
Bowfreakz.com
Bowhunting.com
Bowhunter Planet
Bowhunting Addiction TV.
Broken Arrow Wilderness.
Bowhunters TV
Chasing Trophy Whitetails.
Citizens for a Responsibly Armed Society.
Crossbow Nation
Dave’s House of Hair, Harrisburg PA.
Dead Dog Walkin’ TV.
Driven TV
Drop Zone TV.
Eddie Salter
Family Traditions TV.
Gene & Barry Wensel.
Haley Heath
Hank Parker
Hard Core Hunting TV.
Horton Crossbows
Hunt Wicked Close TV.
Idaho Center of Emergency Medical Training.
Just Kill’n Time TV.
Keystone Gun Sales.
Mark & Beau Rodgers – Real Deal Outdoors.
Mosquito Creek Outdoors, FL.
NebraskaOutfitter.com
Needleman & Pisano.
Off Grid Survival.
OrgaPro Ltd.
Racing To Hunt TV.
Roger Raglin
Shelly & Tara Seiler – Working for Whitetails TV.
Stanley Scruggs Hunting Products.
Team Bone Thugs.
The Banded Nation TV.
The Best Of The West TV.
The Fowl Life TV.
The Kronik Hunter and staff.
The Pennsylvania Crossbow Federation.
The Resistence TV.
Wyvern Creations

Last edited by glocke12; Jan 25, 2013 at 05:50 AM.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 05:51 AM   #2
niuniu
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Read: companies profit over the wants of a market segment.

Surprised the list wasn't longer.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 06:02 AM   #3
glocke12
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Originally Posted by niuniu View Post
Read: companies profit over the wants of a market segment.

Surprised the list wasn't longer.
You know, you can spin this any way that suits you. The bottom line is that the sporting community was outraged by Reeds actions and banded together to boycott this years show. There are simply no if's, ands, or buts.

There are companies that decided to boycott that will lose alot of business this year.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 06:14 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by glocke12 View Post
You know, you can spin this any way that suits you. The bottom line is that the sporting community was outraged by Reeds actions and banded together to boycott this years show. There are simply no if's, ands, or buts.

There are companies that decided to boycott that will lose alot of business this year.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 09:55 AM   #5
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Your likely wrong about those numbers.

Some that were planning to go to that show will likely be out hunting.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 09:58 AM   #6
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Live by the sword, die by the sword.

You really can't have it both ways.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:04 AM   #7
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Your likely wrong about those numbers.

Some that were planning to go to that show will likely be out hunting.
Good on them. Go put holes in things, maybe they can feel strong for a time.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:04 AM   #8
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Yawn.

All done for marketing. Their businesses are in grave danger if other gun shows decide to do this.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:06 AM   #9
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Yawn.

All done for marketing. Their businesses are in grave danger if other gun shows decide to do this.
quote of the truth. This is not about protesting but more about marketing.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:11 AM   #10
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Is this the part where I'm supposed to feel bad for them?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:25 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by prostuff1 View Post
Your likely wrong about those numbers.

Some that were planning to go to that show will likely be out hunting.
That's one of the biggest problems I have with the whole gun movement today. The NRA was founded as a resource for hunters but today it's sole purpose seems to further Rambo/conspiracy theorist types.

USA Today

Quote:
The number of hunters has slid from a peak of 19.1 million in 1975 to 12.5 million last year (2006), according to the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service.
So, obviously, a lot fewer people than you would like are out hunting. And, it's actually causing a problem, especially in broad sections of suburbia and exurban areas. Deer have become a pest species in many areas. Texas is overrun by feral pigs, but since they're so challenging to hunt the state has to hire hunters to kill them. All those suburban gun owners evidently can't be bothered to do something constructive with their guns.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 10:37 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by glocke12 View Post

2 Million Bullets.

Ambush Firearms

Apex Tactical

Atlantic Tactical

Bad Boy Inc.
Bad Dog Accessories.

Body Guard 360.

Cabela’s

Combative Edge

Cutting Edge Bullets.

Direct Action Tactical Firearms.

Domari Nolo Defense Consulting.
Dominance is Everything Hunting System.
Dominator 365

Fear No Evil.

Firearms Industry Consulting Group.

National Rifle Association.


Speaker / Celebrites Pulled Out (37).


Other Boycott Supporters (47).

American Tactical Imports.

Citizens for a Responsibly Armed Society.

Off Grid Survival.

Team Bone Thugs.
The Banded Nation TV.

The Resistence TV.
A few excerpts left to talk about.

So, from your point of view, Cabela's, a sporting goods store I am slightly familiar with, bravely pulled out, at a financial cost to themselves, in order to support the second amendment rights of X,Y, and Z "Tactical"?

An alternative explanation is that they were intimidated by the gun crazies and were afraid they would be boycotted or subjected to a smear campaign so they pulled out like everyone else.

So, remind me why X, Y, and Z "Tactical" are showing up at a hunting-oriented show to begin with? (And while you are at it, remind me how to use an AR-15 with the rapid fire stock to hunt.)

The fact is that these companies make a lot of money supporting the lunatic fringe and its fear of black UN helicopters.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:02 AM   #13
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That's one of the biggest problems I have with the whole gun movement today. The NRA was founded as a resource for hunters but today it's sole purpose seems to further Rambo/conspiracy theorist types.
From the NRA faq
Quote:
Dismayed by the lack of marksmanship shown by their troops, Union veterans Col. William C. Church and Gen. George Wingate formed the National Rifle Association in 1871. The primary goal of the association would be to "promote and encourage rifle shooting on a scientific basis," according to a magazine editorial written by Church.
Quote:
The NRA's interest in promoting the shooting sports among America's youth began in 1903 when NRA Secretary Albert S. Jones urged the establishment of rifle clubs at all major colleges, universities and military academies. By 1906, NRA's youth program was in full swing with more than 200 boys competing in matches at Sea Girt that summer.
Hunting was not a focus of theirs until after World War II
Quote:
After the war, the NRA concentrated its efforts on another much-needed arena for education and training: the hunting community. In 1949, the NRA, in conjunction with the state of New York, established the first hunter education program.
From a New York Times article

Quote:
Mr. Soar paused during his workout in Wingate Park the other day to talk about what he said was an irony: The city has a mayor who has made gun control a priority and has a park honoring the Brooklyn lawyer who wanted to “promote marksmanship.”
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:17 AM   #14
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From the NRA faq




Hunting was not a focus of theirs until after World War II


From a New York Times article
My bad, but it still doesn't address how the NRA is turning from a responsible lobby into one that seemingly ignores hunting while furthering rambo/conspiracy types.

As a matter of fact, hunting seems almost entirely absent from the current national debate and that only shows how strongly the NRA is pushing their own agenda at the expense of legitimate users.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:20 AM   #15
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My bad, but it still doesn't address how the NRA is turning from a responsible lobby into one that seemingly ignores hunting while furthering rambo/conspiracy types.

As a matter of fact, hunting seems almost entirely absent from the current national debate and that only shows how strongly the NRA is pushing their own agenda at the expense of legitimate users.
Well there isn't a whole lot of debate withdeer hunting, so what are they supposed to talk about in that respect?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:22 AM   #16
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and decided to NOT attend in support of the Second Amendment and their gun owning brethren.
Just a quick question, since this statement seems to imply that this was going against the second amendment, how is a private company deciding not to allow semi-auto weapons at their exhibit going against the second amendment that says that government can't ban weapons? Or are you suggesting that everyone should be required to display these kinds of weapons, in which case wouldn't that be big government interfering with private business?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:29 AM   #17
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how is a private company deciding not to allow semi-auto weapons at their exhibit going against the second amendment that says that government can't ban weapons?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:34 AM   #18
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Well there isn't a whole lot of debate withdeer hunting, so what are they supposed to talk about in that respect?
My point is that hunting has become almost a totally unimportant aspect of the gun debate. I think few Americans would argue that guns used for hunting are not important and necessary. It's much harder to argue the necessity of guns used to shoot at a target.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:34 AM   #19
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My bad, but it still doesn't address how the NRA is turning from a responsible lobby into one that seemingly ignores hunting while furthering rambo/conspiracy types.

As a matter of fact, hunting seems almost entirely absent from the current national debate and that only shows how strongly the NRA is pushing their own agenda at the expense of legitimate users.
No problem, I just wanted to clarify.

I do not agree with everything that the NRA says or does. The NRA still provides a lot of resources towards hunter safety and law enforcement instructor certification.

The only mention of hunting in the national debate, are those that are pushing the "you don't need an AR-15 to hunt." A lot of states do not even allow the .223 round be used for hunting, not to mention the limit on magazine capacity.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:38 AM   #20
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Just a quick question, since this statement seems to imply that this was going against the second amendment, how is a private company deciding not to allow semi-auto weapons at their exhibit going against the second amendment that says that government can't ban weapons? Or are you suggesting that everyone should be required to display these kinds of weapons, in which case wouldn't that be big government interfering with private business?
This.

I thought these gun types typically were free market guys, they have a problem with a private company putting rules on their own gun show? What happened to freedom guys? How dare we try to impose our will and force this helpless company to display assault style weapons?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:56 AM   #21
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My point is that hunting has become almost a totally unimportant aspect of the gun debate. I think few Americans would argue that guns used for hunting are not important and necessary. It's much harder to argue the necessity of guns used to shoot at a target.
The constitutional right to keep and bare arms was not instituted for hunting animals anyways. It is fairly clear that the right to bare arms was implemented so that normal people could form a militia if needed. The NRA has been a protector of this right, guns just happen to be useful for hunting as well.
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 11:58 AM   #22
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No problem, I just wanted to clarify.

I do not agree with everything that the NRA says or does. The NRA still provides a lot of resources towards hunter safety and law enforcement instructor certification.
They do, but, speaking for myself, I would prefer my local law enforcement get its instruction from an organization that doesn't have a political/economic agenda to promote the sales of weapons.

Quote:
The only mention of hunting in the national debate, are those that are pushing the "you don't need an AR-15 to hunt." A lot of states do not even allow the .223 round be used for hunting, not to mention the limit on magazine capacity.
I'm one of those "you don't need an AR-15 to hunt" types myself. Are we in agreement about that?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 12:09 PM   #23
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They do, but, speaking for myself, I would prefer my local law enforcement get its instruction from an organization that doesn't have a political/economic agenda to promote the sales of weapons.
They train the instructors, not the police force.


Quote:
I'm one of those "you don't need an AR-15 to hunt" types myself. Are we in agreement about that?
Based on what?
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 12:25 PM   #24
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My bad, but it still doesn't address how the NRA is turning from a responsible lobby into one that seemingly ignores hunting while furthering rambo/conspiracy types.

As a matter of fact, hunting seems almost entirely absent from the current national debate and that only shows how strongly the NRA is pushing their own agenda at the expense of legitimate users.
One theory - it promotes sales of new guns. Already sold guns have a long, long useful life so there's not much turnover generating new sales based on old guns being replaced.

http://www.marketplace.org/topics/bu...g-its-business
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Old Jan 25, 2013, 01:03 PM   #25
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They train the instructors, not the police force.
OK, speaking for myself, I would prefer my local law enforcement get its instruction from instructors trained by an organization that doesn't have a political/economic agenda to promote the sales of weapons.

Quote:

Based on what?
Apparently not.

Whether it is legal to hunt deer with .223 ammunition or not in some particular state doesn't concern me. Nobody needs an AR15 to hunt deer. Nobody needs a 30-round magazine to hunt deer. Maybe it would come in handy for someone licensed to exterminate wild boar, but, for normal hunting, nobody needs these weapons. Weapons should have a legitimate, legal purpose.
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