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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:12 AM   #51
vastoholic
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Originally Posted by Beeplance View Post
People, ask yourself if the same scenario would have happened WITHOUT GUNS.

What would happen to America if there was NO GUNS? Can a person then take out a butcher knife on the streets, and slash 10, 30 people at one go without getting overwhelmed? Harpoon? sword? chainsaw? Baseball bat?

Yes they can. Skip to 4:00 mark. A guy with a butcher knife takes out about 3 or 4 cops armed with pistols and AK's before finally being gunned down.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eexGD...layer_embedded

Think of what this guy could have done to a crowd of unarmed citizens if he wanted. The weapon matters not if you have no means to protect yourselves otherwise.

Also I found this. Not sure how reliable it is.

http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/singapore

I can't even tell what the latest date of information is on this site so I'm not sure how much I believe it. But it appears that guns are 100% banned in Singapore (Correct me if that is not where you actually live). You just have high restrictions on ownership and licensing.
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Last edited by vastoholic; Feb 5, 2013 at 11:23 AM.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:33 AM   #52
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so then why do we constantly compare US stats to European stats when there isn't even a standard?
You probably didn't read all the way down to where it said ...

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... except in the case of homicide and the prison population, where the figures may be more readily comparable.
It's pretty easy to count and compare the number of dead bodies.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:34 AM   #53
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You probably didn't read all the way down where it said ...



It's pretty easy to count and compare the number of dead bodies.
Ok, sure. So we aren't going to compare robberies, break ins, and other crimes.

You're just going to look at bodies (~ 9,000) and say that the US is more violent?

You don't think there's something wrong with that?
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:38 AM   #54
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Ok, sure. So we aren't going to compare robberies, break ins, and other crimes.
They still compare those.



But in 2013 there will be a new report with a better method for comparing violent crime.

I'd wait for that and see what it says.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:40 AM   #55
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They still compare those.

but they shouldn't then, should they? If they report such crimes differently, it's no more fair to compare Europe to Europe than it is Europe to US.

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But in 2013 there will be a new report with a better method for comparing violent crime.

I'd wait for that and see what it says.
Hopefully. I'd like to see that actual stats.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:42 AM   #56
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The root of the problem is not guns, video games or death metal.


I don't think there is any single problem, but huge disparity between rich and poor, drug problems (both illegal and prescription) and other factors probably all play a part.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 11:45 AM   #57
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Hopefully. I'd like to see that actual stats.
I linked to the site.

I'm sure you could find plenty there.

If you actually wanted to find them.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 12:40 PM   #58
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I linked to the site.

I'm sure you could find plenty there.

If you actually wanted to find them.
Oh I thought you were saying a new study was coming out in 2013
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 01:05 PM   #59
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so then why do we constantly compare US stats to European stats when there isn't even a standard?
Maybe if the statistics in question aren't equivalent we shouldn't compare them. Feel free to call it out in future.

That's why people here are keen to compare homicide rates, as they are usually comparable.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 01:07 PM   #60
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Maybe if the statistics in question aren't equivalent we shouldn't compare them. Feel free to call it out in future.

That's why people here are keen to compare homicide rates, as they are usually comparable.
Sure, that's fine to compare homicide rates.

But then you have to sit back and take a look at the whole picture and wonder.

homicide rates in places like Washington D.C., Chicago, where they have stricter gun laws are high

but so are places like Louisiana where they aren't quite as strict

Then you have to look at culture, why do people in Japan line up to get aid, whereas in New Orleans they go bonkers and start stealing TVs and shooting each other?

Then if you look at the homicide rate compared to # of guns... well..
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 01:09 PM   #61
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Sure, that's fine to compare homicide rates.

But then you have to sit back and take a look at the whole picture and wonder.

homicide rates in places like Washington D.C., Chicago, where they have stricter gun laws are high

but so are places like Louisiana where they aren't quite as strict
Gun control without some ability to prevent guns moving across the border is hardly going to be particularly effective now is it .

You are acting like a broken record here.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 01:20 PM   #62
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Gun control without some ability to prevent guns moving across the border is hardly going to be particularly effective now is it .

You are acting like a broken record here.
You missed the point.

There are social and cultural differences in the way some Americans respond to problems, compared to the way others do
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 02:40 PM   #63
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You missed the point.

There are social and cultural differences in the way some Americans respond to problems, compared to the way others do
Name a few.

Please.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 02:46 PM   #64
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Name a few.

Please.
Katrina - looting and pillaging

Japan tsunami - orderly standing in line for supplies and help
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 02:51 PM   #65
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Millions of people own guns. Almost none of them are violent. Millions of people play video games. Almost none of them are violent.

There's no simple answer or easy scapegoat. Sorry, that's just how it is.

----------

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Originally Posted by eric/ View Post
Katrina - looting and pillaging

Japan tsunami - orderly standing in line for supplies and help
But there was looting in Japan:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...024644156.html

Supposedly the "no looting in Japan" meme was started by Fox News, with a supposedly racist hidden subtext, i.e., there was no looting in Japan because there are no blacks in Japan.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 02:51 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by eric/ View Post
Katrina - looting and pillaging

Japan tsunami - orderly standing in line for supplies and help

There was looting in Japan after the tsunami. Of course it wasn't the focus of the news with nuclear reactors near melt down. Also, incidents of looting would be less as entire towns were washed away and there was nothing to loot.

Last edited by rdowns; Feb 5, 2013 at 03:13 PM. Reason: typo
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:07 PM   #67
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I think you'd have a case if there weren't other First World countries (like Japan) that play video games, have violent (and more sexualized) media, having much lower per capita (and overall) shootings.
The flaw in that statement is in Japan and many other countries guns are highly restructured.

Homicides? It is across the board, with Japan very close to lowest to a few that are slightly higher then USA.

I believe when one compares "sexual openness" and homicides, the more open to sexual discussion and activities, the lower the homicide rate (no stats, just a crude hypothesis).
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:12 PM   #68
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But there was looting in Japan:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...024644156.html

Supposedly the "no looting in Japan" meme was started by Fox News, with a supposedly racist hidden subtext, i.e., there was no looting in Japan because there are no blacks in Japan.
Even in the US, in New Jersey.

And the looting wasn't even comparable to Katrina.

Or how about the LA riots? People just up and thought they could break in and steal stuff. They "earned it", etc...

Once again I'm drawn into a conversation over things that are quite obvious. Different cultures react differently to these types of events. Look at Haiti, compare that to, say New Jersey.

smh
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:19 PM   #69
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But there was looting in Japan:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...024644156.html

Supposedly the "no looting in Japan" meme was started by Fox News, with a supposedly racist hidden subtext, i.e., there was no looting in Japan because there are no blacks in Japan.
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Originally Posted by rdowns View Post
There was looting in Japan after the tsunami. Of course it wasn't the focus of the news with nuclear reactors near melt down. Also, incidents of looting would be less as entire towns were washed away and there was nothing to loot.

The report stated it was largely for necessities, food, water, clothing. In Japan, beer does not have the negative stigma as in US, and does provide calories and fluids.
Money can still be used to buy food, water, and other survival necessities.

It seems that statistically speaking, non-survival item looting did not occur after tsunami.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:20 PM   #70
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And the looting wasn't even comparable to Katrina.
By whose metric?

I do agree, though, that Americans respond to problems differently than the rest of the world. This is a foundation for an argument as to why we should limit the amount of firearms available to us, though. And I don't think that's the point you were trying to make.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:23 PM   #71
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There are tons of hits on looting in Japan after the tsunami. Oddly, the vast majority of sites asking why there is no looting in Japan are right leaning sites. Shocking.

Does stealing cash in japan not have the same negative stigma as in the US?

Quote:
From a website of Kyodo News, Japan’s version of CNN, headlined, in Japanese:

“In Miyagi, police report 40 robberies by those taking advantage of the earthquake.”

The text, translated, reads:

“According to police on the night of the 13th the morning of the 14, approximately 1 million yen in cash was taken from the Miyagi City Home Center. There were robberies at a convenience store and a food store, and robberies at approximately 40 other stores by those taking advantage of the earthquake amounting to 1.65 million yen.”

A City Home Center is a store like a Target. And, at 80 yen to the dollar, the loss isn’t great — $12,500 in cash; $20,000 in theft. In this one report. But here was some looting, and there is no reason to think there wasn’t a lot more.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:23 PM   #72
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I believe when one compares "sexual openness" and homicides, the more open to sexual discussion and activities
The Japanese have a very odd attitude to sex - probably more so than the Americans.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:26 PM   #73
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The Japanese have a very odd attitude to sex - probably more so than the Americans.
Have you watched any anime porn?

Talk about odd....

At least that what I've heard from the degenerates that have watched it.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:30 PM   #74
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Have you watched any anime porn?

Talk about odd....

At least that what I've heard from the degenerates that have watched it.

How ****ing depraved does one need to be to watch cartoon porn? And I'm 100% pro-porn.
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Old Feb 5, 2013, 03:31 PM   #75
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In Japan, beer does not have the negative stigma as in US.
Wait... beer has a negative stigma in the US?!
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