Go Back   MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:09 PM   #51
needfx
macrumors 68020
 
needfx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: macrumors apparently
www.msrumors.com

needfx is online now   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:15 PM   #52
CylonGlitch
macrumors 68030
 
CylonGlitch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: SoCal
Quote:
Originally Posted by macsrcool1234 View Post
Yeah because as we all know the MBA/MBP circuit boards are made of the same material as Cylon ships....give me a break
I confirm, this is true, they are!
__________________
Last edited by CylonGlitch : Tomorrow at 37:05 AM.
MRoogle
CylonGlitch is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:28 PM   #53
jamesryanbell
macrumors 68020
 
jamesryanbell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Popeye206 View Post
The Microsoft Product Manager for the Surface Pro must be crying to see his one sale torn apart!
lolling
__________________
iPhone 5S White/Silver 64GB AT&T
iPad Air White/Silver 16GB AT&T
MBA 11" / 27" ACD / ATV3
jamesryanbell is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:30 PM   #54
Mystic386
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Comparing an iPad teardown and this says a lot about the two companies. There is an elegance that permeates the iPad and apple products. The whole product is designed. MS have pulled together a bunch of parts and fitted it in the box.

Apple is open about what it does. A blind man can see what they do well. MS is completely oblivious to each aspect. The MS tablet looks like it was taken for a run through the mediocre forest and hit every tree on the way through.

Comparing to an Air - I have an Air. Excluding the factor of connecting to the Apple system. If I look at all the important factors the MS tablet would score very low. It doesn't do the job well.

Comparing to an iPad - my wife is about to buy our first tablet. She's looking at the iPad. Excluding the Apple system when we look at all the factors that are important to her this MS tablet again scores poorly.

Apple needs competition. Sadly I don't think MS is it or ever will be. They're just too ignorant of customer needs, too ignorant of where the competition are at and caught up in their own reality distortion field. They look like Detroit when the motor industry changed in front of their eyes.

When I look at this product I see PC production values of a decade ago.

Steve Jobs Quote - says it best.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mOgOP_aqqtg

"The only problem with Microsoft is they just have no taste, they have absolutely no taste. And what that means is, I don't mean that in a small way, I mean that in a big way. In a sense, that they don't think of original ideas and they don't bring much culture into their products...


I guess I'm saddened not by Microsofts success. I have no problem with their success. They've earned their success, for the most part. I have a problem with the fact that they just make really 3rd grade products."
Mystic386 is offline   6 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:34 PM   #55
olowott
macrumors 6502a
 
olowott's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Dundee, UK
Send a message via MSN to olowott
wow !!

naaaa no wow




its Microsoft , we should all understand
__________________
iPhone 5s 32gb SpaceGrey -- 2011 13" Macbook pr-- iPhone 4s 16gb -- iPAD 2 32gb
olowott is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:45 PM   #56
japasneezemonk
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Nomad
It must suck being iFixit, they can see the writing on the wall. Their days are numbered.
japasneezemonk is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:46 PM   #57
Smartass
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
who really cares?
Smartass is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 02:50 PM   #58
iThinkIt
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Florida, USA
Quote:
Originally Posted by camnchar View Post
"a metric duckload" is now my favorite phrase.
rotflol :d
iThinkIt is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:09 PM   #59
notjustjay
macrumors 603
 
notjustjay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canada, eh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mystic386 View Post
Comparing an iPad teardown and this says a lot about the two companies. There is an elegance that permeates the iPad and apple products. The whole product is designed. MS have pulled together a bunch of parts and fitted it in the box.

Apple is open about what it does. A blind man can see what they do well. MS is completely oblivious to each aspect. The MS tablet looks like it was taken for a run through the mediocre forest and hit every tree on the way through.
Err... what?

The teardown of an iPad 4:




The teardown of a MacBook Air (Which is sort of a fair comparison since the Surface Pro sort of competes with it):



And this is significantly different from the Surface, and much more elegant... how? Because Apple's logic board is smaller?
__________________
.
notjustjay is offline   7 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:19 PM   #60
blueroom
macrumors 603
 
blueroom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Toronto, Canada
I was surprised the Surface Pro didn't have a VGA port

Fans in a tablet = not ready for prime time.
__________________
My iOS devices are not jailbroken.
Bill
My Blog
blueroom is online now   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:21 PM   #61
lkrupp
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rogifan View Post
Will be waiting to see if MS gets dinged the same way Apple has in the past. Will Kyle Wiens pen a letter to Panos Panay whining about him not following Dieter Rams 10 principles for good design like he did with Jony Ive?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryth View Post
Of course they wont. Everyone will be going to this 'non-upgradable' design but only Apple will get the negative press about it.
Same thing will happen when the competition's ecosystems go to the curated software model like Apple's app store. That will be just fine by then. Apple leads the way. The competition snickers, laughs, points fingers, predicts doom and gloom, and then proceeds to follow suit a few years later when Apple's model rips them a new one. Lather, rinse, repeat.
lkrupp is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:26 PM   #62
applefan69
macrumors 6502
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by notjustjay View Post
Err... what?

The teardown of an iPad 4:

Image


The teardown of a MacBook Air (Which is sort of a fair comparison since the Surface Pro sort of competes with it):

Image

And this is significantly different from the Surface, and much more elegant... how? Because Apple's logic board is smaller?
Okay I'll bite since I saw what the person your quoting was talking about.

With Microsofts logic board it has an obvious grid pattern, and chips were simply stuck into that grid as saw necessary. I could be completely wrong, but it appears from my perspective like Microsoft put very little thought into designing the logic board so that space was used efficiently.

On the other hand, every time I see one of Apple's logic boards I am amazed by how cramped they make it, obviously without sacrificing functionality. Which gives off an impression of being highly engineered.

It really does not matter either way, but I think its a valid observation.
applefan69 is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:30 PM   #63
gotluck
macrumors 68040
 
gotluck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: East Central Florida
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueroom View Post
I was surprised the Surface Pro didn't have a VGA port

Fans in a tablet = not ready for prime time.
well, surface pro is more than a tablet.. I'm not buying one, but I'm glad they are pushing processing power.

I would love x86 in an iPad. Bring fans too, I don't care (of course we'd all rather they weren't necessary). I've never complained about my tech being to cool
__________________
iPad Air LTE 7.1.2 JB (T-Mobile) - GS 4 Google Edition 4.4.4 ART (AT&T) - Windows 7 PC's - iPhone 4 6.1 JB
gotluck is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:32 PM   #64
Battlefield Fan
Banned
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
lolz lolz lolz @ Micro$oft. Anyways we all know iFixit bashes new technology like this because it puts their parts business out of work. That's right iFixit, we don't need you.
Battlefield Fan is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:32 PM   #65
notjustjay
macrumors 603
 
notjustjay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Canada, eh?
Quote:
Originally Posted by applefan69 View Post
Okay I'll bite since I saw what the person your quoting was talking about.

With Microsofts logic board it has an obvious grid pattern, and chips were simply stuck into that grid as saw necessary. I could be completely wrong, but it appears from my perspective like Microsoft put very little thought into designing the logic board so that space was used efficiently.
OK, fair enough, but that doesn't really warrant the hyperbole that the rest of the post contained. I sensed a whole lot of confirmation bias going on.

However, the poster's observations -- "The whole product is designed. MS have pulled together a bunch of parts and fitted it in the box." would have fit very well if describing, say, the G5/Mac Pro tower compared to a typical generic beige box PC. Truly, those were just a bunch of parts fitted into a generic box, while Apple engineered every little thing about the G5/Pro tower.

But today's devices are all custom-designed, engineered for space with custom parts everywhere. And you're absolutely right, the Surface logic board could be cleaned up and made smaller, but that's just one part out of many.
__________________
.
notjustjay is offline   5 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:34 PM   #66
gotluck
macrumors 68040
 
gotluck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: East Central Florida
Quote:
Originally Posted by notjustjay View Post
But today's devices are all custom-designed, engineered for space with custom parts everywhere. And you're absolutely right, the Surface logic board could be cleaned up and made smaller, but that's just one part out of many.
It's funny how custom parts are construed as a good thing now. I would pay extra for standard, interchangeable parts
__________________
iPad Air LTE 7.1.2 JB (T-Mobile) - GS 4 Google Edition 4.4.4 ART (AT&T) - Windows 7 PC's - iPhone 4 6.1 JB
gotluck is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 03:36 PM   #67
rjohnstone
macrumors 68030
 
rjohnstone's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: PHX, AZ.
Quote:
Originally Posted by blueroom View Post
I was surprised the Surface Pro didn't have a VGA port

Fans in a tablet = not ready for prime time.
Considering the MacBook Air and the Surface pro both use an i5 CPU and BOTH have fans, the Air must not be ready for prime time either!

Seriously... stop comparing the Surface Pro to an ARM based tablet.
It's basically a touchscreen ultrabook with a detachable keyboard, not a tablet.

The Surface (RT) does not have any fans... feel better.
__________________
"You can't really dust for vomit" - Nigel Tuffnel
Some Apple *****, some Android ***** and some Windows based *****.
rjohnstone is offline   6 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 04:14 PM   #68
brand
macrumors 68040
 
brand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: 127.0.0.1
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmwebs View Post
they have warehouses full of them
How many metric duckload do you think that is?
brand is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 04:19 PM   #69
AppleScruff1
macrumors 604
 
AppleScruff1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Macrolido View Post
Looks awful even inside.
Which products do you think look nice inside?
AppleScruff1 is offline   5 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 04:30 PM   #70
GQB
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by coolbreeze View Post
I was planning on getting a 64gig from Staples for $825 and tossing in a 256gb mSATA, but after seeing that terrifying autopsy, I'm out.

And please, let's stop with the "lol, look at how hard it is to open - MSFT FAIL" as it's not like the iPad is any easier.
No, let's stop with the "lol, look how unservicable Apple products are"... its the way things are... get used to it.
GQB is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 04:40 PM   #71
Renzatic
macrumors 604
 
Renzatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Who puts the washers in the woods?
Quote:
Originally Posted by applefan69 View Post
Okay I'll bite since I saw what the person your quoting was talking about.

With Microsofts logic board it has an obvious grid pattern, and chips were simply stuck into that grid as saw necessary. I could be completely wrong, but it appears from my perspective like Microsoft put very little thought into designing the logic board so that space was used efficiently.
If I were to take a guess, I'd say the motherboard was made as large as it was so MS could spread all the components apart to even out heat distribution and cool the machine off with two smaller, quieter fans, rather than one large one.

A larger size doesn't necessarily mean it's badly designed. Microsoft isn't staffed with a bunch of idiots slapping together components just so they could rush it out the dark. There's always a reason for everything.
Renzatic is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 04:54 PM   #72
tbrinkma
macrumors 65832
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Quote:
Originally Posted by macnerd93 View Post
The circuit board looks so crude & poorly made in comparison to the MacBook Air/Pro.
Can't argue there. It looks very much like they just laid out components as if they were on individual circuit boards and then linked them together, rather than actually laying things out as a whole. If they'd done that, they probably could have fit another 2 hours worth of battery inside the thing.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mac21ND View Post
I always thought the pulsing sleep light was a little worrisome. Now I know why.
I've always referred to that as my MacBook 'snoring'. (That's the sign to let me know it's actually asleep.)

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by notjustjay View Post
Err... what?

The teardown of an iPad 4:

Image


The teardown of a MacBook Air (Which is sort of a fair comparison since the Surface Pro sort of competes with it):

Image

And this is significantly different from the Surface, and much more elegant... how? Because Apple's logic board is smaller?
Look at all the empty, wasted space on the Surface's logic board. Imagine condensing the logic board down so that empty space wasn't there, and being able to fill the resulting volume with additional battery.

That's likely why he called it 'crude'. Wasted space actually is a bad thing when you're trying to make a small device.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by gotluck View Post
It's funny how custom parts are construed as a good thing now. I would pay extra for standard, interchangeable parts
The Surface's board is still a custom part. It's just a custom part with a lot of wasted volume.

Sadly, in packages this size, standard, interchangeable parts are likely to remain a dream for a good long while. There simply isn't the necessary *room* to to fit arbitrary components into the space.
__________________
17" MBP (unibody), 2.66GHz i7, 8GB RAM, 750 GB HDD; iPhone 4s 64GB/Black
tbrinkma is online now   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 05:10 PM   #73
shurcooL
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by iRockApple View Post
personally I feel as thogh iFixit is becoming pointless. Devices these days (especially mobile devices like phones and tablets) are not made to allow the consumer to tinker with its' inards. They are becoming core and more complex and the average user should not even attempt to self fix one.
Exactly. iFixit should start disassembling desktop computers.

Just kidding.
shurcooL is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 05:32 PM   #74
Rogifan
macrumors G3
 
Rogifan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by rjohnstone View Post
Considering the MacBook Air and the Surface pro both use an i5 CPU and BOTH have fans, the Air must not be ready for prime time either!

Seriously... stop comparing the Surface Pro to an ARM based tablet.
It's basically a touchscreen ultrabook with a detachable keyboard, not a tablet.

The Surface (RT) does not have any fans... feel better.
Seems to me its Microsoft and MS fans who insist on calling the Surface a tablet and get offended when others refer to it as a laptop. I don't think of it as a tablet because a)awful battery life for a tablet, b)requires a fan and c)is rarely ever shown being used without the keyboard or in portrait orientation. To me it has all the trademarks of a laptop except the guts are behind the screen not the keyboard.
__________________
"I have a very optimistic view of individuals. As individuals, people are inherently good. I have a somewhat more pessimistic view of people in groups." -- Steve Jobs , Wired interview
Rogifan is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old Feb 13, 2013, 05:37 PM   #75
MartiNZ
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Auckland, New Zealand
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbrinkma View Post
I've always referred to that as my MacBook 'snoring'. (That's the sign to let me know it's actually asleep.)
Yep the lack of the light on more recent models makes them harder to trust, and OS X's sleep situation has been unreliable enough since they integrated hibernate, without my not being able to be sure. And indeed, it always was a comforting pulsating light, even if it could light up the whole room and stop me sleeping ><.

Pretty crazy how tight everything is in these machines now, but indeed Surface Pro is up against the MacBook Air or 13" rMBP ... which it beats the out of box supported resolution of on a smaller screen just btw. And it adds a touchscreen - if an MBP got that, it would probably be the better Windows machine, but until then, once you go touch you can't go back, and Windows 8 does a really good job of it.
MartiNZ is offline   0 Reply With Quote

Reply
MacRumors Forums > News and Article Discussion > MacRumors.com News Discussion

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Similar Threads
thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Microsoft Announces Surface 2 and Surface Pro 2 MacRumors MacRumors.com News Discussion 550 Oct 10, 2013 01:35 PM
Microsoft Slashes Price of Surface Pro Through August 29 Following Surface RT Price Cut MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 60 Aug 11, 2013 11:31 AM
iFixit Releases Tablet Repairability List, Puts Most Apple Tablets Near the Bottom MacRumors iOS Blog Discussion 45 Mar 19, 2013 08:05 PM
ifixit teardown of MS Surface maflynn Alternatives to iOS and iOS Devices 4 Feb 13, 2013 12:46 PM
iFixit tears down 13-inch Retina MacBook Pro, finds repairability progress being made Michaelgtrusa MacBook Pro 0 Oct 25, 2012 07:44 AM

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:43 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC