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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:24 PM   #1
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France Asks EU to Examine Apple's Removal of AppGratis From the App Store




France will ask the European Commission for increased regulation following Apple's decision to remove AppGratis from the App Store for violating its developer guidelines, Reuters reports.
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During a visit to AppGratis publisher iMediapp, French junior minister for digital economy Fleur Pellerin called Apple's decision "extremely brutal and unilateral....

"This behaviour is not worthy of a company of this size," Pellerin said.

She added that certain Internet companies were guilty of "repeated abusive behaviour" and said she would ask the European Commission and EU member states to better regulate digital platforms, search engines and social media.
Apple has come under European Commission scrutiny in the past for its requirements around the pricing of ebooks, a subject that the United States is currently prosecuting Apple for as well.

Article Link: France Asks EU to Examine Apple's Removal of AppGratis From the App Store
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:25 PM   #2
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This should be interesting

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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:27 PM   #3
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Fleur Pellerin, junior minister of dark magic.. err, digital economy, sounds like a character from Harry Potter.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:30 PM   #4
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Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:30 PM   #5
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'Extremely brutal'? I feel like I have a different definition of brutal than he does.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:31 PM   #6
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Every tom and dick started deciding what Apple supposed to do
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:32 PM   #7
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Since when did the EU rule USA?
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:36 PM   #8
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I can see where they might be coming from, it is brutal for Apple to let developers build a business around an app only to have the rug pulled out from under them. Apple has to do a better job of stopping these apps before they gather a significant following.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:37 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by markfc View Post
Since when did the EU rule USA?
How ignorant of you sir...
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:38 PM   #10
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Says who....?
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:38 PM   #11
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I can promise you that Apple would decide to stop selling iPhones in France before they would give up their currated store.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:39 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstNTenderbit View Post
Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?
I agree in one respect, but in another respect you could turn around and say "Well Windows is Microsoft's operating system, they own it, they are free to stop any non-microsoft application working on it, or anything that competes with them".

Eventually a government (or more likely, the EU and US combined) will open an antitrust case (just as they did with Microsoft) and Apple will be forced to allow 3rd party app installations. Obviously Apple can do it in such a way that makes it more worthwhile for people to go via their appstore, but it wouldnt be at all surprising to see everyone+dog jump on the bandwagon and open a bunch of stores on the iPhone.

You cant have a huge marketshare and block competitors from releasing software for your product. Sure, if you're small enough, nobody will care, but sooner or later, someone will challenge it.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:40 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstNTenderbit View Post
Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?
Agreed.... I don't see anybody regulating the largest retailers and telling them they must carry merchandise from certain vendors. If AppGratis wants to continue their middle-man advertising/marketing business then maybe they should do it on another platform like Android.

Apple is hardly the only platform in town. Nobody forced Costco to carry Apple products when Costco decided that it simply was not profitable for them to waste the floor space on Apple. Apple has similarly decided it was not in their best interest to sell AppGratis on their App Store.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:42 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by markfc View Post
Since when did the EU rule USA?
Since when did a global company not have to heed to global laws?

Microsoft and Google both had antitrust suits opened by the EU. In Microsofts case they are required to provide a copy of all sourcecode for Windows to both the EU and US Govt.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by BC2009 View Post
Agreed.... I don't see anybody regulating the largest retailers and telling them they must carry merchandise from certain vendors. If AppGratis wants to continue their middle-man advertising/marketing business then maybe they should do it on another platform like Android.

Apple is hardly the only platform in town. Nobody forced Costco to carry Apple products when Costco decided that it simply was not profitable for them to waste the floor space on them.
It depends on the numbers (of which we will likely never know). If it works out that Apple has, for example 70% of the smartphone market, thats called a monopoly. At that point, governments can open a can of worms and demand they open things up to allow competition.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:42 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by rmwebs View Post
You cant have a huge marketshare and block competitors from releasing software for your product. Sure, if you're small enough, nobody will care, but sooner or later, someone will challenge it.
This is true, but Apple doesn't fit that definition. They don't even hold half the market which I'd call an extremely bare minimum for having this conversation.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:42 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by FirstNTenderbit View Post
Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?
Last time I checked, the Government has the right to regulate private businesses. Just because a company owns something doesn't mean they can do whatever they want if it harms the public interest. What's there to examine? To see if Apple is using ther extraordinary power in the App Store in any unfair or anti-competitive way (because competition helps the public, and is in the public interest.)
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:46 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstNTenderbit View Post
Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?
Last time I checked, Apple has to abide by the laws of each country and union it operates. Lucky us there is one thing called fair competition, that, at least, the EU cares about (or well... the EU citizens and anyone living in EU soil still benefits from and it's just money what rules laws).
Also, AppGratis is produced by a French company... hence it makes sense the company seeks for help at all levels and well... there are many, France and EU...

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Originally Posted by markfc View Post
Since when did the EU rule USA?
Maybe you would like to know that Apple operates under EU law when selling anything in the EU
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:47 PM   #18
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This is true, but Apple doesn't fit that definition. They don't even hold half the market which I'd call an extremely bare minimum for having this conversation.
Monopolies are not defined by market share but having a dominant influence on others. In the EU, this definition has applied to a company with as little as 39.7% marketshare.

It's incredibly easy for a company with large marketshare to be a monopoly, but large marketshare != monopoly. Also, they usually have to abuse this power in order for it to be regulated.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:49 PM   #19
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Agreed.... I don't see anybody regulating the largest retailers and telling them they must carry merchandise from certain vendors.
The key difference is that if one retailer doesn't have the product that you want then you can buy from a retailer that does.

Apple, on the other hand, actively prevents any other retailer from selling iOS apps.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:50 PM   #20
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Whenever I see the EU and Apple in a story I feel compelled to see if the source is The Onion.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:51 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by BC2009 View Post
Agreed.... I don't see anybody regulating the largest retailers and telling them they must carry merchandise from certain vendors. If AppGratis wants to continue their middle-man advertising/marketing business then maybe they should do it on another platform like Android.

Apple is hardly the only platform in town. Nobody forced Costco to carry Apple products when Costco decided that it simply was not profitable for them to waste the floor space on Apple. Apple has similarly decided it was not in their best interest to sell AppGratis on their App Store.
Retail stores don't have to carry items they they don't want to because those items can be sold at other retail stores. With the App Store, an ios app cannot be sold anywhere else. So if Apple can just determine arbitrarily what apps can and can't be sold, they can effectively destroy the software companies because there is no other market (IOS apps will only work on iOS, and can only be bought from the App Store.) That is extraordinary power, and frankly too much power. I don't get why some people can't see this.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:51 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by rmwebs View Post
I agree in one respect, but in another respect you could turn around and say "Well Windows is Microsoft's operating system, they own it, they are free to stop any non-microsoft application working on it, or anything that competes with them".

Eventually a government (or more likely, the EU and US combined) will open an antitrust case (just as they did with Microsoft) and Apple will be forced to allow 3rd party app installations. Obviously Apple can do it in such a way that makes it more worthwhile for people to go via their appstore, but it wouldnt be at all surprising to see everyone+dog jump on the bandwagon and open a bunch of stores on the iPhone.

You cant have a huge marketshare and block competitors from releasing software for your product. Sure, if you're small enough, nobody will care, but sooner or later, someone will challenge it.
youre terribly confused about these matters. it is not valid to compare what apple allows in its private & meta app store to microsoft stopping programs from running on your physical PC (which never happened, btw). remember: you can jailbreak and sideload, it's not illegal.

second, microsoft was sued for using its monopoly in one market (desktop OS) to gain in market (forcing OEMs to use IE or revoke their licenses, not allowing them to bundle Netscape), etc..

lastly, apple does not have the majority market share in mobile OS, let alone a monopoly. users have plenty of alternatives on the open market.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:52 PM   #23
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This could potentially have big consequences for the operation of the AppStore in the EU. If the EU decide that Apple acted anti-competitively they are basically challenging part of the terms and conditions for AppStore developers.

Lets see what happens...
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:53 PM   #24
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Apple don't make sideloading / jail break very easy...



Quote:
Originally Posted by mdelvecchio View Post
remember: you can jailbreak and sideload, it's not illegal.


Apple have to follow the laws in the countries / Jurisdiction they operate in.

It may be Apple's store but the above still applies. If some law is being suspected on being breached then an investigation is called for. I suspect this one won't go anywhere.


Quote:
Originally Posted by markfc View Post
Since when did the EU rule USA?

Quote:
Originally Posted by FirstNTenderbit View Post
Last time I checked, it was Apples' App Store. They own it, they curate it. What is there to examine?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Small White Car View Post
I can promise you that Apple would decide to stop selling iPhones in France before they would give up their currated store.
I doubt it. The EU / France is not an insignificant market.
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Last edited by Stella; Apr 11, 2013 at 04:59 PM.
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Old Apr 11, 2013, 04:56 PM   #25
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Apparently, Apple is now the EU's biggest cash-cow and ticket out of this economic depression.
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