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Old Apr 23, 2013, 05:57 PM   #1
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Tim Cook on Mobile Payments: 'It's In Its Infancy'




Tim Cook was asked during today's earnings call about his feelings regarding the mobile payments market. While he didn't address the topic directly, he did note that the mobile payments were "just getting started" and still "in its infancy."

In a different part of the call, Cook said Apple would continue to augment the existing "iTunes ecosystem with new services and make existing ones even better."

There have been persistent rumors for several product cycles that the iPhone would gain some sort of mobile payments system, perhaps through near field communications (NFC). Passbook, the system that Apple released last year to make it more convenient for customers using gift card or ticketing apps, could be a precursor to a larger mobile payments play by the company.

Apple already has a mobile payments system of sorts, allowing Apple Retail Store customers to self-checkout with the Apple Store app. The company has hundreds of millions of credit card numbers stored in its iTunes system, providing a natural groundwork for a possible future payments system.

Article Link: Tim Cook on Mobile Payments: 'It's In Its Infancy'
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:03 PM   #2
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Apple should create a bank

They then should f over visa and MasterCard with their own payment system
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:04 PM   #3
bedifferent
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Tim Cook has been making a lot of statements recently. I'm a bit surprised with this announcement, given that Apple was (rumored) to be releasing NFC but backed out when credit companies refused their terms in taking a percentage of NFC sales.

NFC has been around for a long time in Japan, E.U., etc. and is used for more than payments. Infiniti is releasing all new vehicles lines this summer, and NFC will be implemented as an option for locking/unlocking doors, drivers' settings, etc. It's more secure than "blink" systems. Dateline (and other security experts) have shown it is easy to steal credit card data from "blink" cards. Readers are available online for ~$100, place one in a carry wallet and wave it near someone's purse or wallet. Copy that data onto something as simple as a hotel key, make a purchase (in one case, a couple thousand dollar purchases) and no one checked to verify the card. NFC is much more secure with a short transmit range.

NFC might be "in its infancy" in North America, but it has been around for a long time in many countries.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:05 PM   #4
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Basically everything Cook said today was 'not yet but eyes still peeled'
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:07 PM   #5
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NFC basically confirmed for iPhone 6 or 7.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:08 PM   #6
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In other words, let's milk it all we can before we introduce yet another upgrade to all existing owners!
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:20 PM   #7
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Go Giants!

Will be checking in to AT&T Park using Passbook tomorrow afternoon.

NFC SchmeNFC.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:22 PM   #8
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No, mobile payment is alive and well on other operating systems and in other countries. Apple is again behind.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:23 PM   #9
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As it stands Passbook is somewhat of a failure with extremely limited support.

The sooner mobile payments becomes mature the better. Without NFC I can't see how things can progress much on the iPhone.

Android has / will have Mastercard support with NFC.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:23 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bedifferent View Post
Tim Cook has been making a lot of statements recently. I'm a bit surprised with this announcement, given that Apple was (rumored) to be releasing NFC but backed out when credit companies refused their terms in taking a percentage of NFC sales.

NFC has been around for a long time in Japan, E.U., etc. and is used for more than payments. Infiniti is releasing all new vehicles lines this summer, and NFC will be implemented as an option for locking/unlocking doors, drivers' settings, etc. It's more secure than "blink" systems. Dateline (and other security experts) have shown it is easy to steal credit card data from "blink" cards. Readers are available online for ~$100, place one in a carry wallet and wave it near someone's purse or wallet. Copy that data onto something as simple as a hotel key, make a purchase (in one case, a couple thousand dollar purchases) and no one checked to verify the card. NFC is much more secure with a short transmit range.

NFC might be "in its infancy" in North America, but it has been around for a long time in many countries.

I do believe the article was talking about 'mobile payments' not NFC in general. A product could use NFC to do some of the things you mentioned, yet not be used for mobile purchases.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:31 PM   #11
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And what exactly is wrong with just paying for things with cash?
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:34 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by bungiefan89 View Post
And what exactly is wrong with just paying for things with cash?
I thought I was the only one who still carries, and uses, cash.

But, then again, I still wear a watch...so I'm a complete troglodyte.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:35 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Radio View Post
Apple should create a bank

They then should f over visa and MasterCard with their own payment system
Apple should just buy the Federal Reserve and print their own iMoney
and f over Americans more than Bernanke is. Magic.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:36 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by bungiefan89 View Post
And what exactly is wrong with just paying for things with cash?
Time, convenience ... Nothing wrong to pay with coins; please use the other line
Just take public transportation: with NFC more efficient on- and off boarding .
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:37 PM   #15
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nfc & fingerprint scan

we're talking about a whole new level of security issues where your stolen iphone will be escorted by your severed thumb or index finger
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:37 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by bedifferent View Post
Tim Cook has been making a lot of statements recently. I'm a bit surprised with this announcement, given that Apple was (rumored) to be releasing NFC but backed out when credit companies refused their terms in taking a percentage of NFC sales.

NFC has been around for a long time in Japan, E.U., etc. and is used for more than payments. Infiniti is releasing all new vehicles lines this summer, and NFC will be implemented as an option for locking/unlocking doors, drivers' settings, etc. It's more secure than "blink" systems. Dateline (and other security experts) have shown it is easy to steal credit card data from "blink" cards. Readers are available online for ~$100, place one in a carry wallet and wave it near someone's purse or wallet. Copy that data onto something as simple as a hotel key, make a purchase (in one case, a couple thousand dollar purchases) and no one checked to verify the card. NFC is much more secure with a short transmit range.

NFC might be "in its infancy" in North America, but it has been around for a long time in many countries.
For it to work well, every store in the USA would have to invest/buy/change their payment terminals to NFC, so yes, the mobile payments are "just getting started."

Not to say worldwide, most countries don't even know about it, and no, I'm not going to buy an Infinity just because it has NFC, out of the top 50 cars manufacturers only one is starting to use it, so yes, it still "in its infancy."

So if Apple decides not to use a product (NFC) that will only serve less then 1% of their customer that's fine by me..
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:44 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by bedifferent View Post
NFC might be "in its infancy" in North America, but it has been around for a long time in many countries.
But if you take a look at Apple's track record with serivces outside the US... maybe 'infancy' is a suitable term after all, lol.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:44 PM   #18
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Originally Posted by nikicampos View Post
For it to work well, every store in the USA would have to invest/buy/change their payment terminals to NFC, so yes, the mobile payments are "just getting started."

Not to say worldwide, most countries don't even know about it, and no, I'm not going to buy an Infinity just because it has NFC, out of the top 50 cars manufacturers only one is starting to use it, so yes, it still "in its infancy."

So if Apple decides not to use a product (NFC) that will only serve less then 1% of their customer that's fine by me..
Other uses for NFC than just payment options...
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 06:59 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by nikicampos View Post
For it to work well, every store in the USA would have to invest/buy/change their payment terminals to NFC, so yes, the mobile payments are "just getting started."

Not to say worldwide, most countries don't even know about it, and no, I'm not going to buy an Infinity just because it has NFC, out of the top 50 cars manufacturers only one is starting to use it, so yes, it still "in its infancy."

So if Apple decides not to use a product (NFC) that will only serve less then 1% of their customer that's fine by me..
Why do you believe it to be such a low percentage? I'm genuinely curious.

M.C. and Visa were about to deploy NFC pay systems before the iPhone 5 release. As some stated, it isn't much money to invest in systems given the RoI once those systems are deployed with millions using that specific tech. Last year, MasterCard exec Ed McLaughlin made comments that hinted in the next iPhone utilizing NFC.

Will the iPhone 5 Have NFC? MasterCard Exec Hints at an Answer

Quote:
"I don't know of a handset manufacturer that isn't in process of making sure their stuff is PayPass ready," McLaughlin said. When asked if that included Apple, he stumbled: "Um, there are...like I say, [I don't know of] any handset maker out there. Now, when we have discussions with our partners, and they ask us not to disclose them, we don't."
From my understanding through my friends in Cupertino, a few iPhone 5 prototypes had NFC. However, talks between credit companies fell flat when Apple demanded a percentage of all NFC transactions. Passbook was set to implement NFC. Sadly, Apple released a non-NFC device (it wasn't due to a lack of tech or room for transmitters in the current iPhone 5 since prototypes with NFC tech were slightly modified for use).

As for Infiniti using NFC, certainly it is not the only reason for purchasing a vehicle. I merely stated the tech has progressed enough outside North America that car manufacturers are investing in it. Tech in vehicles is rather inexpensive comparatively. I have an Infiniti and I am interested in the investments and changes a successful company such as Nissan/Infiniti makes in their product line.

Lastly, MasterCard has recently proposed using phones to pay for transportation:

MasterCard - NFC invades Mobile World Congress

Quote:
MasterCard's new proposal would allow bus and train riders to use their smartphones to pay for their fare using a bar code printed at the bus top. The thought is that riders would do this while waiting for the next transport, then get on the vehicle, bump a sensor, and enjoy (or depending on the city, not enjoy) their ride.
NFC seeps into bloodstream of Mobile World Congress

Quote:
BARCELONA, Spain--NFC (near field communication) technology has been around for some time now, but as of yet it's failed to hit a level of ubiquity in our devices that would galvanize more businesses to adopt it. That, however, is changing fast.
Very interesting article, I highly recommend reading it.
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Last edited by bedifferent; Apr 23, 2013 at 10:07 PM.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 07:41 PM   #20
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I use a plastic card to pay for nearly everything I purchase. Should I take out my iPhone or my plastic card which is accepted in more places than mobile payments? Hmmm...
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 07:44 PM   #21
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Smartphones were in their infancy too when the iPhone came out.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 07:46 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by chadley_chad View Post
In other words, let's milk it all we can before we introduce yet another upgrade to all existing owners!
Yeah, pretty much. I am surprised he actually can live with himself, from a moral perspective. Spewing out borderline lies and ******** year after year, when most people know their goal is just to milk money.

But I guess it's pretty easy for him, after all.
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 07:52 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by Stella View Post
As it stands Passbook is somewhat of a failure with extremely limited support.

The sooner mobile payments becomes mature the better. Without NFC I can't see how things can progress much on the iPhone.

Android has / will have Mastercard support with NFC.
Not exactly Apple's fault here. The economy sucks. The retailers don't want to invest in new scanner technology to support either Passbook (reading barcodes on screens) or NFC readers. We can only hope this will get better with time, but it may only happen in smaller companies / new locations.

How many registers does Walmart or Target have? How many actual scanners? Tens of thousands each chain. Where is the technical support to back them, connect that data to their databases, etc? For both of these technologies, it is an uphill battle in the US.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by SchneiderMan View Post
I use a plastic card to pay for nearly everything I purchase. Should I take out my iPhone or my plastic card which is accepted in more places than mobile payments? Hmmm...
Food for thought...

Assuming every place even takes plastic. Taco Bell only started in 2006, other chains around then too. Isn't that the appeal for NFC, the small transactions too?
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Old Apr 23, 2013, 08:05 PM   #24
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No, mobile payment is alive and well on other operating systems and in other countries. Apple is again behind.
That's right. NFC payments alive and well, and certainly NOT in it's infancy here in Australia. Paywave and Tap & Go from Visa and Mastercard available almost everywhere at major retailers, supermarkets and petrol (gas) stations.

Apple need to get with the times.

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Old Apr 23, 2013, 08:13 PM   #25
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While Tim never really has anything that insightful to say at least he is not an embarrassment to apple, which is what Phil Schiller is when he open his trap.
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