Register FAQ / Rules Forum Spy Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Go Back   MacRumors Forums > Mac Community > Community Discussion > Politics, Religion, Social Issues

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old May 16, 2013, 03:07 PM   #1
MacRumors
macrumors bot
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Tim Cook Defends Apple's Tax Record Ahead of Senate Committee Appearance [Updated]




Apple CEO Tim Cook, in a break from his predecessor, is giving a number of interviews to Washington press outlets ahead of his appearance in front of the Senate Permanent Subcommittee on Investigation next week.

Washington newspaper Politico spoke to Cook about Apple's offshore cash pile -- which the company has thus far refused to repatriate to the United States because of the significant tax burden that would result -- and Apple's political activities.
Quote:
"We don't have a large presence in Washington, as you probably know, but we care deeply about public policy and believe creative policy can be a huge catalyst for a better society and a stronger economy," Cook said in the interview.

He also defended his company's conduct. "I can tell you unequivocally Apple does not funnel its domestic profits overseas. We don't do that. We pay taxes on all the products we sell in the U.S., and we pay every dollar that we owe. And so I'd like to be really clear on that," Cook said.
Cook has agreed to appear in front of the subcommittee on Tuesday morning personally, instead of sending a more junior executive to testify in front of the committee. His predecessor as CEO, Steve Jobs, agreed to very few interviews and tended to stay out of politics entirely.

Apple recently borrowed $17 billion in a bond offering, in part to return cash to shareholders without bringing some of its $100 billion overseas cash pile to the United States. If it were to repatriate that cash to the U.S., it would need to pay a more than $13 billion tax bill.

Update: In an interview with The Washington Post, Cook says he plans to present specific proposals at the Senate hearing to overhaul the U.S. corporate tax system.
Quote:
"If you look at it today, to repatriate cash to the U.S., you need to pay 35 percent of that cash. And that is a very high number," Cook said in an interview Thursday. "We are not proposing that it be zero. I know many of our peers believe that. But I don't view that. But I think it has to be reasonable."
Cook also pointed out that if state and federal taxes are combined, Apple pays roughly $1 million per hour in taxes, possibly making Apple the largest corporate taxpayer in the country.

Note: Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the comment thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum. All MacRumors forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

Article Link: Tim Cook Defends Apple's Tax Record Ahead of Senate Committee Appearance [Updated]
MacRumors is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:11 PM   #2
Peace
macrumors P6
 
Peace's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Space--The ONLY Frontier
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
Peace is offline   14 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:11 PM   #3
k1121j
macrumors regular
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: North East USA
Go Timmy

Geez perhaps the US needs to rethink its own tax policy it just may bring jobs back to the USA
k1121j is offline   13 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:12 PM   #4
Four oF NINE
macrumors 6502a
 
Four oF NINE's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: Soviet Union
Let's have Apple factories in the US
Four oF NINE is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:20 PM   #5
Kaibelf
macrumors 6502a
 
Kaibelf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Chicago, IL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peace View Post
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
If they manufacture items abroad, ship them abroad, SELL them abroad, AND pay the local sales taxes in those countries, exactly why in the world does the US have a claim on that money? You're not supposed to be taxed twice on sales anywhere, and the US's tax and revenue issues don't preclude other countries' sovereignty.

What you're asking them to do is give away money that, frankly, the US has no right to have, and you want that to set an example? No.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Four oF NINE View Post
Let's have Apple factories in the US
Sure! As long as my phone isn't $1100 to make it happen with wages and union pressure. Or, you can have the regular, and the "Made in the USA" edition, and let people choose which one they will pay for. I personally wouldn't spend more than $50 more for a domestically-produced phone, as I already pay thousands of my dollars to an American carrier for the service anyway, and the last thing I need is to struggle financially so that someone who decided not to finish high school can get a second car and a more comfortable home than I have.
Kaibelf is offline   30 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:20 PM   #6
Small White Car
macrumors G3
 
Small White Car's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Washington DC
I've seen lots of accusations that Apple is doing terrible and illegal things but I've yet to see any proof.

The big big BIG difference between Apple and some of these other companies that send profits over-seas in convoluted cheat-schemes is that Apple is actually selling products in these other countries.

When an Apple store in Italy sells an iPhone to an Italian Apple then pays a tax to Italy for that. If that money stays in Italy, well, ok. There's nothing really wrong with that. Sure it would make me happy, as an American, for Apple to bring that money home and pay more taxes on it a second time, but what reason does Apple have to do that? I can't offer them a reason.

This is a far cry from someone making money in the U.S. and then sending the money to some secret bank account in another country to avoid taxes.

Should it turn out Apple is doing that, sure, grill them for it. But I've yet to see anyone offer any evidence for that whatsoever.
Small White Car is offline   23 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:22 PM   #7
chrmjenkins
macrumors 601
 
chrmjenkins's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: CA
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaibelf View Post
If they manufacture items abroad, ship them abroad, SELL them abroad, AND pay the local sales taxes in those countries, exactly why in the world does the US have a claim on that money? You're not supposed to be taxed twice on sales anywhere, and the US's tax and revenue issues don't preclude other countries' sovereignty.

What you're asking them to do is give away money that, frankly, the US has no right to have, and you want that to set an example? No.
The US gives a tax credit based on tax paid to foreign entities. And you're not being taxed by the US instead of that country. Both of those are nonsense talking points.

That doesn't change the fact that the US tax rate, at 35%, is among the highest for corporations among the world.

A fair proposal would be an international minimum tax, as has been proposed by Obama. Have some minimum rate around 15% where if the country of origin doesn't tax to that amount, the home nation immediately taxes those profits to that level. If the foreign nation taxes at at least that level, no US tax claim can be made. That incentives every nation to tax to at least the minimum (unless they want to be a race to the bottom tax haven) so that they maximize the taxes they can claim rather than the home nation.
__________________
Twitter: @anexanhume
chrmjenkins is offline   3 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:25 PM   #8
Bonte
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Bruges, Belgium
Apple earned it offshore
Apple payed offshore taxes
Apple holds the cash offshore

I don't see the problem, Apple would be taxed double and i would be taxed again via the dividend, there are limits to taxing.
__________________
Canterbury Tales comic
Bonte is offline   26 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:28 PM   #9
bacaramac
macrumors 65816
 
bacaramac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Would love to see something that moves all manufacturing back to US. Can't they write tax laws that make it a win win scenario? Not even gonna try to defend tax law because I only know how to use turbo tax. Haha
__________________
iMac 27" 3.06Ghz 2TB Time Capsule and AP Express Current Gen AppleTV x 3 iPhone 5s Space Gray 16Gb iPod Touch 4th Gen White iPad mini White/Silver 16GB WiFi
bacaramac is offline   0 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:30 PM   #10
Ryth
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peace View Post
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
It's a World Economy now. Not just the US.

Tim is exactly correct. They pay taxes on everything they SELL IN THE US.

Just like they pay taxes in other countries for whatever they SELL IN THOSE COUNTRIES.
Ryth is offline   16 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:32 PM   #11
mr.steevo
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Governments complaining about corporations taking advantage of tax laws makes no sense to me. This is like a homeowner complaining about their furnace when they have their windows wide open. Fix the problem?
mr.steevo is offline   8 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:34 PM   #12
CristobalHuet
macrumors 65816
 
CristobalHuet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Montreal
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peace View Post
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
Easy for you to say that when it's not your money. $13 billion is not chump change, not even for a company like Apple.
__________________
13" MacBook Air 2.13Ghz Core 2 Duo/4GB RAM/256GB SSD (2010) + 24" Apple LED Cinema Display
32GB iPhone 5, Black
64GB Wi-Fi iPad mini, Black
CristobalHuet is offline   18 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:37 PM   #13
Mr.damien
Guest
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonte View Post
Apple earned it offshore
Apple payed offshore taxes
Apple holds the cash offshore

I don't see the problem, Apple would be taxed double and i would be taxed again via the dividend, there are limits to taxing.
Read the news in europe and you will see that they pay almost no taxes "offshore" (just like all others like Google and Microsoft)

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by CristobalHuet View Post
Easy for you to say that when it's not your money. $13 billion is not chump change, not even for a company like Apple.
Sure, moreover when they give a lot more to shareholders ...
  0 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:38 PM   #14
Tankmaze
macrumors 65816
 
Tankmaze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonte View Post
Apple earned it offshore
Apple payed offshore taxes
Apple holds the cash offshore
yup, exactly what I was thinking.

edit : 35 percent of taxes to repatriate the money!! what the... i'm sure even for apple that is too much.
__________________
Check out our game Tank Maze

Last edited by Tankmaze; May 16, 2013 at 03:45 PM.
Tankmaze is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:40 PM   #15
mcrain
Banned
 
mcrain's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Illinois
Easy solution is to just impose the tax on the money held offshore and collect the $13 Billion dollars whether they repatriate the money or not.

(edit) A better solution would be to give a 1% discount on moneys repatriated and invested in the US.
mcrain is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:40 PM   #16
Ryth
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.damien View Post
Read the news in europe and you will see that they pay almost no taxes "offshore" (just like all others like Google and Microsoft)[COLOR="#808080"]
You should read the news also and get your facts straight. VAT is big in Europe. And Apple pays a ton of that.

It has not been suggested that any of their tax avoidance schemes are illegal.

All of the companies pay considerable amounts of other taxes in the UK, such as National Insurance, and raise large sums of VAT.
Ryth is offline   4 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:43 PM   #17
mdelvecchio
In Time-Out
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peace View Post
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
an example of what?

bring the money "back" -- the income was never in the US to begin, its profit from overseas products to overseas customers, where it was already taxed (overseas).
mdelvecchio is offline   8 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:44 PM   #18
Ryth
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdelvecchio View Post
an example of what?

bring the money "back" -- the income was never in the US to begin, its profit from overseas products to overseas customers, where it was already taxed (overseas).
Might as well give up...it's like trying to teach logic to a wall...they'll never get it. Some people think the USA is the center of the universe and deserve everything..even things that aren't theirs (like Apple's oversea's profits).
Ryth is offline   5 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:51 PM   #19
barkomatic
macrumors 68030
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Manhattan
As usual, threads like this seesaw between extreme views on this issue. Tim Cook said he was willing to repatriate the money back to the U.S. and pay taxes on it -- just not the exorbitant rate the government wants. Perhaps a more reasonable rate would work.
barkomatic is offline   2 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:55 PM   #20
lunaoso
macrumors 65816
 
lunaoso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: New England, USA
Wow! 1 mil and hour just in taxes? That's more then some people make in their entire lives!
lunaoso is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:57 PM   #21
danielwsmithee
macrumors 6502a
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by barkomatic View Post
As usual, threads like this seesaw between extreme views on this issue. Tim Cook said he was willing to repatriate the money back to the U.S. and pay taxes on it -- just not the exorbitant rate the government wants. Perhaps a more reasonable rate would work.
Apple and many other companies have been pushing this for while now, and it keeps getting blocked by our broken political system.
danielwsmithee is offline   1 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:58 PM   #22
Ryth
macrumors 65816
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by barkomatic View Post
As usual, threads like this seesaw between extreme views on this issue. Tim Cook said he was willing to repatriate the money back to the U.S. and pay taxes on it -- just not the exorbitant rate the government wants. Perhaps a more reasonable rate would work.
Apple shouldn't bring it back. The USA will just squander it and waste it.

Apple bar none can spend it's money better then the US Government.

Let Apple bring it back, but let them instead of paying the taxes on it, let Apple take that tax money that would have gone to the USA and spend it on projects in the USA to better peoples lives. But these projects would be overseen by APPLE, not some government agency.

With that money, could you imagine what Apple could do to benefit society.
Ryth is offline   9 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:58 PM   #23
OrangeSVTguy
macrumors 601
 
OrangeSVTguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Northeastern Ohio
Typical government wanting money they didn't earn and spending it faster than they can tax you to get it.
__________________
Browsing the forums from my Powerbook G4
OrangeSVTguy is offline   9 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 03:58 PM   #24
Rogifan
macrumors 604
 
Rogifan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peace View Post
Pay the 13 Billion and bring that money back to the United States. Become an example for other companies.
Why? To fund an inefficient government. No thanks.
__________________
"Liberals claim to want to give a hearing to other views, but then are shocked and offended to discover that there are other views." - William F. Buckley, Jr.
Rogifan is offline   13 Reply With Quote
Old May 16, 2013, 04:00 PM   #25
AppleScruff1
macrumors 603
 
AppleScruff1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryth View Post
Might as well give up...it's like trying to teach logic to a wall...they'll never get it. Some people think the USA is the center of the universe and deserve everything..even things that aren't theirs (like Apple's oversea's profits).
All American companies doing business overseas are subject to having their overseas profits taxed in the US if they bring the money home. This isn't a surprise to Apple, Google, Microsoft, etc. That's what the current tax laws state, it wasn't sprung upon anyone by surprise. It has nothing with the USA being the center of the universe. It's where you chose to base your business, you are subject to their laws. Nothing difficult about that logic at all. Apple isn't breaking any laws by keeping the money abroad. If they want to bring it home, they must abide by the current tax laws, plain and simple.
AppleScruff1 is offline   4 Reply With Quote


Reply
MacRumors Forums > Mac Community > Community Discussion > Politics, Religion, Social Issues

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:09 AM.

Mac Rumors | Mac | iPhone | iPhone Game Reviews | iPhone Apps

Mobile Version | Fixed | Fluid | Fluid HD
Copyright 2002-2013, MacRumors.com, LLC