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View Poll Results: Does the fingerprint scanner concern you?
Might reconsider 27 11.20%
Don't care 214 88.80%
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:28 PM   #1
Krov7
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Question If the iPhone 5S has a fingerprint scanner, I won't buy it. Anyone else?

With all the security concerns as of late, I would think twice about having the device I use most throughout my day having a fingerprint scanner. Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?

Even if the ip5s has a 70mp camera A9 chip and prints money, I won't be getting it if it includes a fingerprint scanner (the option to turn it off wouldn't negate the possibility it could get in the wrong hands).
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:28 PM   #2
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Good for you.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:30 PM   #3
atteligibility
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Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
Imagine what the implications of that could be?
Why don't you tell us? too tired today to imagine anything
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:30 PM   #4
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Stand your ground buddy!
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:31 PM   #5
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Good for you.
Thanks for contributing to the discussion /s
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:32 PM   #6
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This forum can be used as a case study in paranoia and misinformation. I'm blown away sometimes by the things I read on this forum where you would expect to find tech savvy users. Just wow!!!
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 03:34 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?
If you are over the age of 18, anyone that matters probably already has your fingerprints. And if they don't, it's because you have no reason to worry about them having your prints.

Still, a fingerprint scanner is HORRIBLE for personal security reasons. It takes little more than a piece of clear tape to defeat a fingerprint scanner, and they wouldn't even need to try to find your fingerprint on a can or whatever, since your phone has your prints literally covering it.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:03 PM   #8
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What kind of thread promises some super new secret about fingerprint scanners and then doesn't even say what the secret is?

Oh, right. This one.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:04 PM   #9
cynics
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You could probably just not use it. There has to be an alternative/back up way of unlocking the phone. You can probably just disable it.

I can't use my fingerprints on anything that's not authorized via certain government agencies (work, nothing cool). Unlikely it would be allowed on a phone even if its mine, Apple has a tendency of storing things. However I never heard of any problems arising when Android had a fingerprint scanner years ago.

Its always less secure to have two forms of entry anyway. And more then likely there will need to be a back up way of unlocking the phone so you're back to your standard PIN code.

I'm not upset or worried there MIGHT be a fingerprint scanner, I just feel that money could be spent on cooler more useful things on the phone.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:06 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
With all the security concerns as of late, I would think twice about having the device I use most throughout my day having a fingerprint scanner. Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?

Even if the ip5s has a 70mp camera A9 chip and prints money, I won't be getting it if it includes a fingerprint scanner (the option to turn it off wouldn't negate the possibility it could get in the wrong hands).
Remember it hardly matters. Apple & others are already tracking us.

The cats outta the bag, it's Too Late
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:14 PM   #11
Apple fanboy
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If they have the scanner, there will be an opt out option
After all what would happen if you lost your fingers like in that episode of Luther recently.

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Remember it hardly matters. Apple & others are already tracking us.

The cats outta the bag, it's Too Late
No they are just tracking you. I'm not a person of interest!
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:15 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalton63841 View Post
Still, a fingerprint scanner is HORRIBLE for personal security reasons.
Anyone with extremely sensitive info on their phones isn't going to use the fingerprint scanner. If someone is REALLY concerned about security, I'm sure they wouldn't be using a 4-digit pin either, they'd use a long passphrase instead.


A fingerprint scanner would be cool to quickly unlock my phone, instead of entering the pin each time. None of the people I try to keep out of my phone -- siblings, nosey roommates, etc -- are going to go through the trouble of taking my fingerprints and try to unlock the phone. Neither is joe schmoe the robber who just wants to flip it and make a quick buck
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:17 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
If the iPhone 5s has a fingerprint scanner, I won't buy it. Anyone else?
I don't care but there are, of course, others that do. Why does it matter? Do whatever works for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
With all the security concerns as of late, I would think twice about having the device I use most throughout my day having a fingerprint scanner. Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?
So do you wear gloves all the time? Do you constantly wipe your fingerprints off of everything you touch? Imagine what the implications of leaving your fingerprints everywhere could be!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalton63841 View Post
Still, a fingerprint scanner is HORRIBLE for personal security reasons.
Most passwords and PIN's that the average Joes out there use are as well.
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Old Jul 15, 2013, 05:29 PM   #14
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Well I'm not going to not buy it just because of a fingerprint scanner, but if that's the only upgrade the I probably won't buy it because I'm quite happy with my 4s. For my needs, Apple's current security options are sufficient. Now if the fingerprint scanner can be used for things other than just security I may be tempted.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 06:09 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
With all the security concerns as of late, I would think twice about having the device I use most throughout my day having a fingerprint scanner. Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?

Even if the ip5s has a 70mp camera A9 chip and prints money, I won't be getting it if it includes a fingerprint scanner (the option to turn it off wouldn't negate the possibility it could get in the wrong hands).
Give Apple a little more credit.

Apple will not store your fingerprint on the device, much less a server. Apple will use your fingerprint and other biometric data obtained from the sensor (such as skin density and vein patterns) in conjunction with information unique to your particular phone and/or iCloud account to create a password key -- the equivalent of a very, very, very long alphanumeric password.

Developers will not have direct, low-level access to the hardware to grab your fingerprint. However, developers should be able to call an Apple software routine that would generate a password key (I.e., a long number of 1s and 0s) based on the unique combination of your fingerprint, other biometric data, and the device hardware.

A fingerprint scanner, iOS keychain, and fingerprint functions for developers would:
  1. eliminate the long alphanumeric passwords currently required by government and corporate networks;

  2. provide secure authentication for mobile payments, including purchases from the Apple Store, as well as wireless payments made to vendors using near field communication or Bluetooth;

  3. simplify web login/password entry for the web, whereby a fingerprint scan would populate the user's login/password and personal information from a secure password store (IOS Keychain) in Safari;

  4. eliminate login/password entry for third-party iOS7 applications (e.g., your bank's IOS app), by allowing third-party developers to substitute fingerprints for passwords;

  5. provide seamless multi-user support, which would benefit home users, as well as corporations and governments, that share one device (e.g., iPad, future Macbooks) among multiple users.
A fingerprint sensor is key to (a) corporate and government customers and (b) mobile payments. Corporations and government agencies currently require 8-12 digit alphanumeric passwords to unlock a phone; a fingerprint reader would eliminate these passwords, if properly implemented. Mobile payments haven't taken off because of concerns over security; a fingerprint reader, or a pin combined with a fingerprint reader, would largely address those concerns.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalton63841 View Post
Still, a fingerprint scanner is HORRIBLE for personal security reasons. It takes little more than a piece of clear tape to defeat a fingerprint scanner, and they wouldn't even need to try to find your fingerprint on a can or whatever, since your phone has your prints literally covering it.
You've watched a few too many spy movies, or perhaps the episode of Mythbusters where they defeated 10-year-old fingerprint technology. The newest generations of fingerprint sensors detect and use additional biometric information, such as temperature, skin density, and vein patterns, to produce passwords that are the equivalent of alphanumeric passwords that are dozens of characters long.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 06:09 AM   #16
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Why did you not put, "YES! I will absolutely buy one!" in the poll choice? Just because you don't want to buy one doesn't mean other here won't. At least make a fair poll.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 06:22 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krov7 View Post
With all the security concerns as of late, I would think twice about having the device I use most throughout my day having a fingerprint scanner. Even if apple didn't sell/give away the information as they might be required to, there is always the possibility of exploits and 3rd parties gaining unauthorized access to your fingerprints. Imagine what the implications of that could be?

Even if the ip5s has a 70mp camera A9 chip and prints money, I won't be getting it if it includes a fingerprint scanner (the option to turn it off wouldn't negate the possibility it could get in the wrong hands).
If it does it won't store your fingerprint, just some pattern that is heavily encrypted and meaningless anyway, there is literally nothing of any official use that needs a finger print.

And if there was, AND there was an advantage to having a copy of yours they could just lift it from the glass you just drank some water from, or your car door, or the front and back of ANY phone you have touched!!

Paranoia to the extreme...
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 06:27 AM   #18
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 06:49 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KenAFSPC View Post
Apple will not store your fingerprint on the device, much less a server. Apple will use your fingerprint and other biometric data obtained from the sensor (such as skin density and vein patterns) in conjunction with information unique to your particular phone and/or iCloud account to create a password key -- the equivalent of a very, very, very long alphanumeric password.

Developers will not have direct, low-level access to the hardware to grab your fingerprint. However, developers should be able to call an Apple software routine that would generate a password key (I.e., a long number of 1s and 0s) based on the unique combination of your fingerprint, other biometric data, and the device hardware.
I did wonder about another security (or paranoia) concern - Apple could track who is using any such sensor-equipped iOS device. Even if they one-way hash any biometric data which they send to their servers (which would prevent anyone inferring the fingerprint etc. from the hash) they could still match that unique 'biometric fingerprint' against data from the phone (contacts, IMEI number, UDID, iCloud account) to get a real-life person <-> biometric fingerprint mapping.

If you then use another such iPhone, they can match the hash against what the previous one, and thus know you're using someone else's phone, so you're probably friends/family/colleagues; and build up a network of relationships like that.

Paranoia, of course - given there are other easier ways to build up this information (contacts lists, monitor emails sent, even social networks). But this method could catch people who otherwise are very selective and careful about their privacy. "Would Apple do this?" doesn't really matter - it's not as if they would have any choice in the matter. In these days of Prism etc. who knows?
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 07:18 AM   #20
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I'm not surprised with a certain level of paranoia when it comes to something as unique as a fingerprint. Would anyone here use their entire social security number as a password?

Criminals will always find ways to exploit things even if us honest folks can't think of an exploit.

I certainly wouldn't call this extreme paranoia. That's like thinking a utility van outside is the government spying on you.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 07:40 AM   #21
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I think a fingerprint scan in conjunction with a security token (a la RSA) would be ok in securing your device, if necessary. Of course, it will still have to connect to the outside world exposing it to any number of predators, so it will never be absolutely secure. The name of the game is being smart about what you do with and store on your mass produced, easily cracked mobile device.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 07:50 AM   #22
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I like the fingerprint scanner as a security feature. I guess I could see privacy freaks concern, but that seems a bit extreme to my view.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 07:56 AM   #23
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 08:17 AM   #24
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I think a fingerprint scanner would be a great addition. These security solutions are meant for casual security, or so common sense would tell us. They are meant for if someone wants to peek at your phone, or if you lose it, they are NOT meant if you are on the run seeking asylum somewhere and want to hide the contents of your phone.

Plus chances are your fingerprints are already out there in a law enforcement database, or will eventually be. Healthcare licenses, for example, all have to go through a background check which includes giving up your fingerprints.
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Old Jul 16, 2013, 08:17 AM   #25
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FingerPrint reader or not, I'm buying. If the fingerPrint reader works, than that's a plus. If not, there is always the second layer of security.

Love these paranoid threads. The government already has your ID/listening to your phone calls or reading your email. I hope you are not signed up to any of the phone carriers, or use Facebook, nor emails, etc, etc. Government has you from birth to death, so stop worrying about it.
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