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Old Aug 8, 2013, 12:42 PM   #1
quagmire
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31 states give rapists parental rights

This is ridiculous. I can't believe 31 states give men who rape women parental rights to see their kid as result of the rape. If more women knew about this being legal in their state, would they decide to terminate the pregnancy even though they want the baby because they don't want to always face their attackers for the rest of their lives?

How do you think the kids will feel when they get to age to grasp it and find out/are told about it? They were born because their father raped their mother?

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/vi...ights.cnn.html
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 12:59 PM   #2
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I agree: this is mind-blowingly unjust.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 01:03 PM   #3
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SO as I understand it, it's not so much that rapists have been given rights, but more that as men they have rights and there isn't anything to stop them using those rights as a convicted rapist (in many states).

I think rape is so endemic that legislation should be pushed through quickly. Although I wouldn't like to see a complete barrier between the victim and rapist. I'd love to see rapists paying child support to the State who then pay it to the victim. If a payment is missed, the State bring the action and continue to pay the victim meanwhile without her knowing what's happening behind the scenes.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 01:34 PM   #4
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So I guess if you get pregnant as the result of rape you should of had an abortion. That would solve that problem.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 02:13 PM   #5
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So I guess if you get pregnant as the result of rape you should of had an abortion. That would solve that problem.
Not anymore, since a fair number of states are restricting abortion, even in causes of rape. One of the Dakotas had that law on the books while being challenged in the court; I believe Texas is the same way.

But even more to exacerbate the problem. Back in May of this year, a guy who was (statutory) raped by an older woman as a teenager (over a 3 year period) now owes child support, after the woman served her time in jail, and was reunited with her child after the State awarded custody of the child to the woman's sister.

So how much does the kid owe? $475/month and over $23,000 in back payments. All court ordered, BTW. Petitions to reverse this so far have gone unanswered.

http://livewirereview.com/pay-child-support/
http://www.sodahead.com/united-state...ibaf&q=&esrc=s
http://www.change.org/en-GB/petition...n-jeremy-steen

So it really makes you wonder how arse backwards these 31 states really are..

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Old Aug 8, 2013, 04:04 PM   #6
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a guy who was (statutory) raped by an older woman as a teenager (over a 3 year period) now owes child support,
So its not really rape is it?

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Originally Posted by edk99 View Post
So I guess if you get pregnant as the result of rape you should of had an abortion. That would solve that problem.
I think this has to be the encouraged outcome to be honest. Rape is often a he-said she-said crime so getting convictions is naturally going to be difficult.

That said it seems pretty dodgy for convicted (actual - not statutory) rapists to have father/motherhood rights.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 04:38 PM   #7
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So its not really rape is it?
The OP (and to an extent, the 31 states) never qualified or quantified what is meant by the term 'rape'. In this case, all would be included, especially statutory rape.

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I think this has to be the encouraged outcome to be honest. Rape is often a he-said she-said crime so getting convictions is naturally going to be difficult.

That said it seems pretty dodgy for convicted (actual - not statutory) rapists to have father/motherhood rights.
Again, see about the mother's rights in the case of statutory or any other rape where the aggressor is a woman and the victim is male. Should the woman get pregnant, apparently there is precedent that she could and may be granted parental rights, meaning child support payments for the victim.

Absolutely wrong in every sense.

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Old Aug 8, 2013, 07:57 PM   #8
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So its not really rape is it?
If the sexes were reversed, would you still debate it? Cases where the man is the older one seem to be judged differently. It's not a case of an 18 year old girl either. The one linked was well into adulthood.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 08:23 PM   #9
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So its not really rape is it?
It certainly is if the adult abuse their power over the teen for sexual favors. For instance a teacher could promise the student a good grade if they sleep with them.
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 08:28 PM   #10
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For a woman to get an abortion law exception for rape, does the offender have to be caught and convicted? What if he can't be found? What if he did rape her but gets off (pun not intended) on a technicality? What about if he appeals? What happens if that takes more than a few months and the pregnancy is now past the threshold at which there's broad agreement that late term abortions should be prohibited?
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 08:00 PM   #11
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So I guess if you get pregnant as the result of rape you should of had an abortion. That would solve that problem.
There is no excuse not to take Plan B after a rape unless you wanted to keep the child.
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 08:09 PM   #12
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I think if any one of us guys were raped, we would probably take a billion showers back to back. How can any man actually understand what it would be like to have their rapist's child growing inside them? Don't judge a women's choice to abort or not to, when you'll never be in that situation.
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 08:13 PM   #13
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So I guess if you get pregnant as the result of rape you should of had an abortion. That would solve that problem.
Pretty casual about a woman being raped, and then having to decide to abort.

And what if the woman has moral objections to abortion. What if she is so traumatized that making those kind of decisions are impossible for her.

Let me guess that you are a man...easy to be glib about those kind of decisions.
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 08:22 PM   #14
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Not anymore, since a fair number of states are restricting abortion, even in causes of rape. One of the Dakotas had that law on the books while being challenged in the court; I believe Texas is the same way.
The legislature in South Dakota passed a law restricting all abortions a few years back, but it never survived being referred to the voters in the general election. A special interest group then tried to pass a new version of it two years later which had rape, health of the mother and incest exceptions. It also failed by a wide margin.
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 08:51 PM   #15
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And what if the woman has moral objections to abortion. What if she is so traumatized that making those kind of decisions are impossible for her.
Why didn't this hypothetical woman take Plan B prior to getting pregnant after getting raped thus making the decision about abortion irrelevant?
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 10:49 PM   #16
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Why didn't this hypothetical woman take Plan B prior to getting pregnant after getting raped thus making the decision about abortion irrelevant?
Why should it be solely her responsibility to plan for getting raped, when it is the man's fault for doing the raping to begin with? You're pretty much talking about making it totally the woman's responsibility, when the man should have kept it in his pants to begin with and curbed his own inhibitions.

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Old Aug 13, 2013, 11:03 PM   #17
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Why didn't this hypothetical woman take Plan B prior to getting pregnant after getting raped thus making the decision about abortion irrelevant?
Many social conservatives still consider plan B a form of abortion. (even though it technically is not)
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:19 AM   #18
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Plan B technically falls in the "prevention" category. It can not do anything to an egg that is already fertilized, nor help or cause any abortion of an existing pregnancy. It's just prevents fertilization of any eggs that are not already fertilized.
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:28 AM   #19
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Plan B technically falls in the "prevention" category. It can not do anything to an egg that is already fertilized, nor help or cause any abortion of an existing pregnancy. It's just prevents fertilization of any eggs that are not already fertilized.
Yes, that's why I said "it technically is not". Unfortunately some people don't care about that little detail...heck, there are those who believe condoms are an affront to their god. But still, just because their beliefs keep them from terminating even in the early stage of pregnancy, that doesn't mean they should have to share custody with their attacker.
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:34 AM   #20
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Many social conservatives still consider plan B a form of abortion. (even though it technically is not)
Please provide me a link to the studies which indicate "many" conservatives consider plan B abortion.

Additionally if someone (wrongly) believes that plan B is an abortion than they are not going to get an abortion to being with.
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:46 AM   #21
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Please provide me a link to the studies which indicate "many" conservatives consider plan B abortion.

Additionally if someone (wrongly) believes that plan B is an abortion than they are not going to get an abortion to being with.
If someone, as you say, is getting Plan B to preemptively prevent a pregnancy from a rape, why doesn't the man preemptively get a vasectomy to prevent a pregnancy from happening? Or better yet, why didn't he take a magazine into the bathroom and do his duty there instead of attacking a woman and forcing an unwanted pregnancy on her?

Sounds to me like you don't want men to take responsibility for their actions. And that is a major problem in society today. Welcome to being the problem, and not the solution.

BL.
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:50 AM   #22
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If someone, as you say, is getting Plan B to preemptively prevent a pregnancy from a rape, why doesn't the man preemptively get a vasectomy to prevent a pregnancy from happening? Or better yet, why didn't he take a magazine into the bathroom and do his duty there instead of attacking a woman and forcing an unwanted pregnancy on her?

Sounds to me like you don't want men to take responsibility for their actions. And that is a major problem in society today. Welcome to being the problem, and not the solution.

BL.
Why didn't George Zimmerman preemptively get a gun to prevent that thug Trayvon Martin from bashing his head into a sidewalk???

Oh wait......

In life, **** happens that is outside of your control.

What does it have to do with responsibility? Did I say a rapist shouldn't go to prison?
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:56 AM   #23
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Parental rights as in paying child support, yes. Parental rights as in getting visitation or anything else, no.
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Old Aug 14, 2013, 12:56 AM   #24
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Why didn't George Zimmerman preemptively get a gun to prevent that thug Trayvon Martin from bashing his head into a sidewalk???

Oh wait......
This is so straw man someone may mistake this for the Scarecrow in the Wizard of Oz. If you are seriously equating the rape of a woman and an unwanted pregnancy to using a gun and killing someone, that is very very sick.

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In life, **** happens that is outside of your control.

What does it have to do with responsibility? Did I say a rapist shouldn't go to prison?
So a rape is outside of a woman's control? Wait! You're right! it is outside of a woman's control, because it is the man that is doing the raping! Control the man, and you control the rape! But go ahead, you keep leaving the responsibility completely up to the woman. Again, welcome to being the problem, and not the solution.

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Old Aug 14, 2013, 06:18 AM   #25
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There is no excuse not to take Plan B after a rape unless you wanted to keep the child.
Must be nice living in a black and white world while the rest of us live in a gray one.
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