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Old Aug 9, 2013, 03:53 PM   #1
jayeskreezy
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Which Small Camera to Get?

I'm thinking of getting a small camera to record small videos and my YouTube vids on my channel. Currently, I'm using my 16gb iphone 5, but I'm looking for something with more memory and that's dedicated strictly to video. I'd like to only use my phone as the phone. My old Kodak zi8 is too buggy and basically dead now.

I've narrowed it down to the 32gb 5th gen iPod Touch and the Hero 2 Go Pro. My budget is $250 or less.

Which one would you recommend and why? Thanks!
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 10:55 AM   #2
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Over 1000 views and not ONE suggestion? Cmon Macrumors members....
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 11:48 AM   #3
acearchie
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayeskreezy View Post
Over 1000 views and not ONE suggestion? Cmon Macrumors members....
I get a bit tired of people saying this. We all do this just to help out, we don't have to help you so don't get arsy when you don't get what you want!

Quote:
Originally Posted by jayeskreezy View Post
I'm thinking of getting a small camera to record small videos and my YouTube vids on my channel. Currently, I'm using my 16gb iphone 5, but I'm looking for something with more memory and that's dedicated strictly to video.

I've narrowed it down to the 32gb 5th gen iPod Touch and the Hero 2 Go Pro. My budget is $250 or less.

Which one would you recommend and why? Thanks!
In terms of what you posted,

Why do you need more memory?

Is there anything that's letting you down with the iPhone 5 or is it the fact that you want to have a dedicated camera?

What sort of things do you film?

The iPod touch is going to give you less quality than the iPhone 5 and you would be better off getting an actual camera rather than an iPod.

The GoPro is a great camera but it's predominantly a sports camera and unless you are filming action, outside, underwater you will find it far too wide and it has awful sound recording quality.
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 12:07 PM   #4
daybreak
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I always say before you decide what you would like do a bit of research and then ask.
The people on this forum will answer. It all depends on what you ask? also input can help.
Many come on forum ask question and then ride into the sunset.
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 12:31 PM   #5
jayeskreezy
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Originally Posted by daybreak View Post
I always say before you decide what you would like do a bit of research and then ask.
The people on this forum will answer. It all depends on what you ask? also input can help.
Many come on forum ask question and then ride into the sunset.
Well, your comment was pretty presumptuous but thank you for at least replying. First of all I've been a member of this forum for 8 years-more than probably half the members here. I'd hardly call that riding into the sunset.

Secondly, I NEVER ask ANY questions without doing extensive research (youtube, google, other forums, etc) or a search on Macrumors. I myself co-own a semi popular forum and I know the frustration of people who ask questions without searching first. This however is not one of those questions. I made it a point to let people know that I've narrowed my search down to 2 cameras. All I was asking for was an opinion on the two choices.

I'd appreciate if you weren't so presumptuous next time.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by acearchie View Post
I get a bit tired of people saying this. We all do this just to help out, we don't have to help you so don't get arsy when you don't get what you want!



In terms of what you posted,

Why do you need more memory?

Is there anything that's letting you down with the iPhone 5 or is it the fact that you want to have a dedicated camera?

What sort of things do you film?

The iPod touch is going to give you less quality than the iPhone 5 and you would be better off getting an actual camera rather than an iPod.

The GoPro is a great camera but it's predominantly a sports camera and unless you are filming action, outside, underwater you will find it far too wide and it has awful sound recording quality.
Nobody was getting arsy. I came to the forums because I'm having trouble making a decision and figured I'd get the opinions of others who have experience with these products and video recording. Back in the day this site was a place where people helped people without entitlement. Lately it seems as if it has been reduced to smart ass pompous members who barely help others out.

Quote:
Why do you need more memory?

Is there anything that's letting you down with the iPhone 5 or is it the fact that you want to have a dedicated camera?

What sort of things do you film?
I need more memory because I record a lot of videos and I prefer my phone to be a dedicated device. If I'm going to shoot a video in the water or during a busy action scene I'd rather not use my personal phone and risk it dropping or breaking for that. I have 2 youtube channels and one has 1300+ subs. It makes things more complicated to have to take vid off my phone.

I film everything from product reviews, to music videos, to short commercials and quick skits for my job. In short, I film nearly everything.

I'm not worried about sound as I have external mics. Thanks for your help.
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 01:47 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayeskreezy View Post
Back in the day this site was a place where people helped people without entitlement. Lately it seems as if it has been reduced to smart ass pompous members who barely help others out.
I'm not sure if you are trying to insult me or not? I do attempt to help others as much as I can as that is how I have learnt myself but from your second post it seems that you felt you were perhaps entitled to an answer.

I often thing that view counts don't really paint a true picture wither as many views can come from google searches as well as people that are interested in learning about the topic and not necessarily contributing.

Quote:
I need more memory because I record a lot of videos and I prefer my phone to be a dedicated device. If I'm going to shoot a video in the water or during a busy action scene I'd rather not use my personal phone and risk it dropping or breaking for that. I have 2 youtube channels and one has 1300+ subs. It makes things more complicated to have to take vid off my phone.

I film everything from product reviews, to music videos, to short commercials and quick skits for my job. In short, I film nearly everything.

I'm not worried about sound as I have external mics. Thanks for your help.
Do you care to share your channel so I can see the sort of environments you work in?

To further add, I think that a gopro is a bad idea as solely a main camera. It can be useful as a backup or crash cam but whilst it is often used as a buzz word it's not very useful for a variety of filming situations.

You mention that there is some filming for work involved. Is there any chance in increasing the budget you are working with especially if there is a chance of earning some money out of the videos?

If you are keen on increasing your subscriber base increasing the quality of production will help you out a lot and set you apart from other vloggers, reviewers and filmmakers.
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 02:32 PM   #7
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"Lately it seems as if it has been reduced to smart ass pompous members who barely help others out."

Sorry, Jayskreezy, but you sound like, if not the pompous smart ass, the overly sensitive one. After all, you're the one that asked for help, and with an initial question that lacked a careful explanation of your needs or why you had narrowed the choice to a "32gb 5th gen iPod Touch and the Hero 2 Go Pro."

Someone reading that would have had to wonder how anybody interested in finding a small camera would end up with those two choices and shrugged off replying.
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Old Aug 10, 2013, 06:18 PM   #8
daybreak
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If I remember correct your first post was :I'm Thinking". For all your informal information on making video's why would you want to go down the road of not using a small camcorder?
Yes I may have stepped on your toes with my reply as dont check members history of what they have done on the forum.
In the future any :Thinking" will stay in my head.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 01:18 AM   #9
jayeskreezy
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Originally Posted by daybreak View Post
If I remember correct your first post was :I'm Thinking". For all your informal information on making video's why would you want to go down the road of not using a small camcorder?
Yes I may have stepped on your toes with my reply as dont check members history of what they have done on the forum.
In the future any :Thinking" will stay in my head.
I have no idea what you're getting at in this post nor do I care to delve into it.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 01:34 AM   #10
jayeskreezy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by acearchie View Post
I'm not sure if you are trying to insult me or not? I do attempt to help others as much as I can as that is how I have learnt myself but from your second post it seems that you felt you were perhaps entitled to an answer.

I often thing that view counts don't really paint a true picture wither as many views can come from google searches as well as people that are interested in learning about the topic and not necessarily contributing.



Do you care to share your channel so I can see the sort of environments you work in?

To further add, I think that a gopro is a bad idea as solely a main camera. It can be useful as a backup or crash cam but whilst it is often used as a buzz word it's not very useful for a variety of filming situations.

You mention that there is some filming for work involved. Is there any chance in increasing the budget you are working with especially if there is a chance of earning some money out of the videos?

If you are keen on increasing your subscriber base increasing the quality of production will help you out a lot and set you apart from other vloggers, reviewers and filmmakers.
Thank you for actually being helpful in this post. I understand that some views come from external hits, but I doubt 1000 did. And no, I didn't feel entitled to an answer, but I thought I made the question as simple as possible. I have 2 choices-pick one and tell me why you think it's the best solution. This is a digital video forum. If I knew or a more helpful one I would've asked there instead.

In the past MR has been quite helpful, but it's obvious the DigiVid forum isn't quite what it used to be so in the future I will direct these questions elsewhere and look for a better forum to meet my needs in that area.


Anyway, with the harsh feedback I received so far from asking for camera advice I definitely don't feel comfortable sharing my channel. It was hard enough to get people to help answer this post. My content is product reviews and tutorials. Right now I have some of the best quality reviews with the type of reviews I do.

I work for a non-profit and my salary is donations based. There is no way at the moment to increase my budget above $250-$300. Tbh video is not my main gig and I'm not interested in strapping my family financially over a camera. I won't be making profit from these videos. My iphone 5 has been more than adequate thus far. I'm just looking for a dedicated device to do similar work.

Thanks for your reply. It was helpful. If you could PM me or reply about what type of situations a gopro is a bad idea then that'd be great. Thanks.

----------

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lou2 View Post
"Lately it seems as if it has been reduced to smart ass pompous members who barely help others out."

Sorry, Jayskreezy, but you sound like, if not the pompous smart ass, the overly sensitive one. After all, you're the one that asked for help, and with an initial question that lacked a careful explanation of your needs or why you had narrowed the choice to a "32gb 5th gen iPod Touch and the Hero 2 Go Pro."

Someone reading that would have had to wonder how anybody interested in finding a small camera would end up with those two choices and shrugged off replying.
So again....instead of being a pompous smart ass you could share how you came to that conclusion. If I knew that I doubt I'd be asking these questions. This is the type of arrogance I'm referring to. Instead of helping someone out who clearly is seeking assistance you come in this thread with absolutely nothing helpful to add.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 01:53 AM   #11
ChrisA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayeskreezy View Post
I'm thinking of getting a small camera to record small videos and my YouTube vids on my channel. Currently, I'm using my 16gb iphone 5, but I'm looking for something with more memory and that's dedicated strictly to video. I'd like to only use my phone as the phone. My old Kodak zi8 is too buggy and basically dead now.

I've narrowed it down to the 32gb 5th gen iPod Touch and the Hero 2 Go Pro. My budget is $250 or less.

Which one would you recommend and why? Thanks!
If you want to do video, buy a video camera. You can buy a low end camcorder from Sony that does 1080p and records to an SD card for under $200. These have MUCH better results than an iPhone. This class of camera can do almost 30 megabits per second. 28, I think. If you have enough light 28Mb/s looks very clean. And of course the lens is better then the phone's lens.

The other bad thing about iPhones is the limited memory. A "real" camera let's you use SD cards or CF cards so you have nearly unlimited memory.

But how will you record the audio? Built-in microphones never have good quality and of course they are not in the best location either. I just got a Conan VIXIA R400 for $211 (open box at Best Buy) and this camera has a microphone jack so the audio can be as good as you want.

You have a good enough budget but you need a tripod, lights and a mic in addition to the camera.

Last edited by ChrisA; Aug 11, 2013 at 01:58 AM.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 01:55 AM   #12
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I have a Panasonic Lumix which shoots great video, and is very small form factor too. Won't break the bank, and a new model has just been released. Leica lenses on both the old and new generation, and a good range of options also.

If you want something a little batter, you might want to consider a bridge camera....many available and too numerous to list here, but a trip to your local store will allow you to get hands on and see what feels right to you.

Budget is the key really I guess.
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Old Aug 11, 2013, 08:45 AM   #13
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Thanks ChrisA and Macman. I'm going to look into both of those options as they both sound like much better deals. I have a Rode Video mic and a few wireless mics for small things. I appreciate the help!!!
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 10:57 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by Macman45 View Post
I have a Panasonic Lumix which shoots great video, and is very small form factor too. Won't break the bank, and a new model has just been released. Leica lenses on both the old and new generation, and a good range of options also.

If you want something a little batter, you might want to consider a bridge camera....many available and too numerous to list here, but a trip to your local store will allow you to get hands on and see what feels right to you.

Budget is the key really I guess.

Yes, this is a good recommendation to go with a Panasonic Lumix. I have 3 of these and have used there from cut-a-way B roll cameras and in some cases have used these as primary cameras to video liver performances for bands that don't want to pay the $2500 per camera certain venues want to video, so we just do the whole thing on the down low with great results.

Go on Amazon and pick one up pretty cheap and video away
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Old Aug 12, 2013, 11:56 AM   #15
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Take a look at the Canon Vixia HFR400. I paid about $250 for it. It is the only low end HD camera that I found that has a mic input. Stay away from the lower end Sony cameras. Noisy (records the camera's gears) when recording with no mic input option on the camera. The Canon has little noise if using the internal mic, but tolerable. Mic input if prefer not to use the internal. I returned a Sony low end camera and went with the Canon.

----------

The Canon is a video camera, but takes stills as well. Just thought to add this to the mix to help out with your options.
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Old Aug 15, 2013, 01:00 AM   #16
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Take a look at the Canon Vixia HFR400. I paid about $250 for it. It is the only low end HD camera that I found that has a mic input. Stay away from the lower end Sony cameras. Noisy (records the camera's gears) when recording with no mic input option on the camera. The Canon has little noise if using the internal mic, but tolerable. Mic input if prefer not to use the internal. I returned a Sony low end camera and went with the Canon.

----------

The Canon is a video camera, but takes stills as well. Just thought to add this to the mix to help out with your options.
Thanks! I will continue to look. Our Canon point and shoot went out after about 4-5 years of use and my DH wants a point and shoot also. I have no interest whatsoever in photography, but we're leaning towards the Canon SX50 now or either the Rebel T3i refurbished. We hope with this we will both be able to get what we're looking for. We've seen the t3i's as low as $340 so we're ok with paying that amount.
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Old Aug 15, 2013, 04:15 AM   #17
orph
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i use a Dslr for video now and agen, magiclantern http://magiclantern.wikia.com/wiki/M..._Firmware_Wiki
is worth a look but if your not used to it might be best not to dive in. (i dont use it, yet at least )

Dslr's have no real auto focus for video, no relay good mic (so external audio may be advised, maybe a zoom H1) and can overheat.
camera shake can be a big problem if your hand held too (imge stabilization on some lenses will be herd in the recording if your getting audio from the camera)

might be worth looking at referb video cameras, in the uk you can get canon ones on ebay with a official warranty like this one Legria HF R37 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Canon-Legr...item4175d98c6e

relay worth looking at external audio or mic in and a mic.
and if your using an external audio device you will need to sync the audio in post.

a tripod might be worth garbing a monopod even.

what kind of thing are you shooting, do you need low light shooting or manual control?
will you need good audio or even just manual levels?
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Old Aug 15, 2013, 04:25 AM   #18
orph
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and it will relay help if we can see your video Chanel or even just something like your Chanel something with similar content.

there's no need to be shy here's one of mine https://www.youtube.com/user/SolidlightUK

it will relay help to have more details on what you shoot to know what to recommend.

a gopro is cool for sports diving and strapping on cars but maybe not so useful as a hand held camera for shooting a group of people. the Rebel T3i (canon 600D in hear in the UK) is fine and give the option of different lenses to expand in to but you will relay want external audio (no mic in i think) which will have to be synced etc and you may have heat problems in hot environments and the limit of 25 mins per video (or something like that) can be a pain. + no auto real auto focus when shooting video so hope your subjects dont move much (or you).

i shoot talks on my Dslr and it's embarrassing to have small cuts in video as the camera cuts out and i rush to hit the REC button to get the video to kick back in (and i shot 720p to skip the overheating and having to swap memory cards to much + all i need) i use a tripod and fixed video exposure.

Last edited by orph; Aug 15, 2013 at 04:47 AM.
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Old Aug 15, 2013, 08:09 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by loby View Post
Take a look at the Canon Vixia HFR400. I paid about $250 for it. It is the only low end HD camera that I found that has a mic input. Stay away from the lower end Sony cameras. Noisy (records the camera's gears)...
The ONLY features I want were
1) Microphone input with adjustable level and UV meter
2) OPTICAL image stabilization
3) Writes to SD card

The H400 had all of this and now Best Buy puts their open box inventory on-line. I hunted and found one for $211 in Hollywood, CA. The camera had never been powered on, the battery was still in the plastic sealed bag.

The picture is good if you have enough light and mostly work on a tripod.
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Old Aug 26, 2013, 07:42 PM   #20
jayeskreezy
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Originally Posted by orph View Post
i use a Dslr for video now and agen, magiclantern http://magiclantern.wikia.com/wiki/M..._Firmware_Wiki
is worth a look but if your not used to it might be best not to dive in. (i dont use it, yet at least )

Dslr's have no real auto focus for video, no relay good mic (so external audio may be advised, maybe a zoom H1) and can overheat.
camera shake can be a big problem if your hand held too (imge stabilization on some lenses will be herd in the recording if your getting audio from the camera)

might be worth looking at referb video cameras, in the uk you can get canon ones on ebay with a official warranty like this one Legria HF R37 http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Canon-Legr...item4175d98c6e

relay worth looking at external audio or mic in and a mic.
and if your using an external audio device you will need to sync the audio in post.

a tripod might be worth garbing a monopod even.

what kind of thing are you shooting, do you need low light shooting or manual control?
will you need good audio or even just manual levels?
Sorry for not replying sooner. I began doing lots more research online and found that since my DH also wants a point and shoot and has mentioned a DSLR before. We narrowed it down to the Canon SX50 and the T3i and decided to get a Canon T3i refurb. We've been waiting for a good deal and found one today. I'm still interested in the Hero 2 Gopro for quicker rugged shooting as well.

Thanks to everyone who helped me out. I'm not looking forward to the learning curve or the t3i, but I am looking forward to the new video opportunities.
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Old Aug 27, 2013, 06:29 AM   #21
orph
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well im happy you chose a camera id relay like to hear how it goes (pm me if you want).
the T3I (aka 600D in the uk, i like the uk names :P) is a fine camera, get used to manual focus (fixed unless you have golden hands for focus pulling) and think about getting a nice lens if you can, depending on what you need the basic 18-55 is lens is a tad soft and slow.

IS is vary nice but will be picked up on the internal mic

think about custom image styles i use Flaat_10 most the time,
http://www.similaar.com/foto/flaat-picture-styles/
comparison video

you will need something like mpeg streamclip http://www.squared5.com/ to convert your H264 files to prores (or other codec)

id recommend manual video exposure but thats up to you, at least use the exposure lock so it's not bouncing around all over the place and get the WB correct as it's vary compressed video your capturing there's not much latitude in post (both WB & exposure).

dont know where you live but if it's hot & you shoot outside you may need a shade for the T3i to keep the sun off or it may overheat.

the one big problem with Dslr's and video is there just not a good shape (and weight distribution) for handheld shooting, so just dont try unless you want your video to bounce round more than a bouncy thing, nothing says neat like a tripod shot video (or mono pod)
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Old Aug 27, 2013, 08:12 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by orph View Post
well im happy you chose a camera id relay like to hear how it goes (pm me if you want).
the T3I (aka 600D in the uk, i like the uk names :P) is a fine camera, get used to manual focus (fixed unless you have golden hands for focus pulling) and think about getting a nice lens if you can, depending on what you need the basic 18-55 is lens is a tad soft and slow.

IS is vary nice but will be picked up on the internal mic

think about custom image styles i use Flaat_10 most the time,
http://www.similaar.com/foto/flaat-picture-styles/
comparison video

you will need something like mpeg streamclip http://www.squared5.com/ to convert your H264 files to prores (or other codec)

id recommend manual video exposure but thats up to you, at least use the exposure lock so it's not bouncing around all over the place and get the WB correct as it's vary compressed video your capturing there's not much latitude in post (both WB & exposure).

dont know where you live but if it's hot & you shoot outside you may need a shade for the T3i to keep the sun off or it may overheat.

the one big problem with Dslr's and video is there just not a good shape (and weight distribution) for handheld shooting, so just dont try unless you want your video to bounce round more than a bouncy thing, nothing says neat like a tripod shot video (or mono pod)

Thanks! This is helpful. It should arrive Thursday. I have a tripod and monopod already, but where can I find this shade? And which lens would you recommend that's budget friendly. I've seen the Pancake 40mm recommended and another Sub $150 one by canon also recommended.

I know NOTHING about focusing and stuff like that so this will be a learning experience.
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Old Aug 27, 2013, 04:55 PM   #23
orph
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the heat issue relay depends on where you live and what you local climate is, iv only had problems when recording small public talks (may be up to 3 hours with 4/6 people talking) in summer when it's hot, relay hot.
iv heard of people shooting in hot sunny climates using shades ie an umbrella or holding some paper to block the sun light off the camera body, depends where you work & you will find out fast .

for len's that relay depends on what your shooting (you have not relay told us yet) and if your relay this new then might be best to wait a bit and not rush in as you may not get the best thing for you. (do you need zoom/fixed/lowlight/silent/is etc..) and relay think twice before you get a cheep lens (try them out if you can)

if you know nothing about focus i relay hope your ok...

Dslr's are not good for video as is they are a lot of work it's why i suggested a HD cam.
unless your willing to go let the camera auto focus during shooting (ie in the video) which means unless you cut it out it will look un-profesional.

when i shot video im static and so are my subjects or working on a single focus plane, so i have no problems but thats all planed in advance.

dont rush in to Flaat as it's for people who do lots of post work, if your new might be best not to rush in to it.

if you relay are new then you will need spare SD cards (video eats space) and battery's, do some practice runs and see how long you can shoot on you battery then get extras.

do lots of research, dont just take my word.

i record audio externally, people will live with bad video but will not live with bad audio.
if you want some one to watch your videos get good audio it is more important than the video.
(good example is youtube so many videos with video from captured from the screen but relay painful video, see how long you can watch it without turning it off)

ps you will need to buy an application to edit your video and audio which you will have to buy, expect editing video to be slow and take lots of storage space.
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Old Aug 27, 2013, 06:43 PM   #24
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Thanks! I will PM you in the future. I currently use FCP and imovie for quick scrappy projects. Some of the stuff is for my YouTube channel and it's product reviews mostly so it's almost always stationary. I'm looking to use this more for that and also in the future for some small video projects with my job. I don't get paid to do video for my job so it really is just something that's more of a hobby.

I'd like to make the best out of my camera use and get the most out of it, but I'm ok with not using rushing into things. I don't mind learning.
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