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Old Aug 16, 2013, 01:33 PM   #1
gsugolfer
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Gay Pentagon employees granted up to 10 days of leave to get married

http://news.yahoo.com/pentagon-exten...214430663.html

http://www.stripes.com/news/us/dod-a...uples-1.235284

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Troops stationed outside the United States will be allowed up to 10 days of uncharged leave for a same-sex wedding, per approval from their command. Troops inside the United States but stationed more than 100 miles from a state that allows gay marriage will have seven days. Servicemembers will be able to use the marriage leave time only once in their career.
Does anyone know if "uncharged leave" or "nonchargeable leave" (wording changes depending on the source) is paid? Or do they just mean it's unpaid leave that is not penalized?

I'll reserve an opinion until we can straighten that out.

EDIT: It's paid leave.

Last edited by gsugolfer; Aug 16, 2013 at 01:56 PM.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 01:52 PM   #2
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I think it's great. Who cares whether it's paid or not? You can't seriously tell me you think it's a good thing only if it's unpaid.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 01:52 PM   #3
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Gay and lesbian.

Homosexual is such an old-fashioned, pathological and stigmatising word. What's more, no one would use it to describe themselves these days.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 01:55 PM   #4
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I think it's great. Who cares whether it's paid or not? You can't seriously tell me you think it's a good thing unless only if it's unpaid.
I was just told that it means it's paid. I do think that's a bad thing, because government employees are taking pay cuts and furloughs all over the place. I don't think we should be spending additional money to pay people not to work in our current financial situation. I have no problem with unpaid leave being granted, because it's obviously something out of the person's control.

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Originally Posted by Blue Velvet View Post
Gay and lesbian.

Homosexual is such an old-fashioned, pathological and stigmatising word. What's more, no one would use it to describe themselves these days.
Changed it if it makes you feel better. I couldn't care less either way. Same thing.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 02:00 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
I was just told that it means it's paid. I do think that's a bad thing, because government employees are taking pay cuts and furloughs all over the place. I don't think we should be spending additional money to pay people not to work in our current financial situation. I have no problem with unpaid leave being granted, because it's obviously something out of the person's control.

When gay and lesbian couples can marry as easily as straight couples when deployed, then I'll pull my support for paid leave.

How does leave work for a straight person wanting to marry?
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 02:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
I was just told that it means it's paid. I do think that's a bad thing, because government employees are taking pay cuts and furloughs all over the place. I don't think we should be spending additional money to pay people not to work in our current financial situation. I have no problem with unpaid leave being granted, because it's obviously something out of the person's control.
Umm.. you do realize that vacation time is also paid, right? Do you think someone in the government taking paid vacation time is also bad because government employees are taking pay cuts and furloughs?

BL.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 02:01 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
Changed it if it makes you feel better. I couldn't care less either way.

Thanks, but that's fairly clear.

It's not about making me feel better. Call people what they wish to be called. People wouldn't use the word 'negro' these days. Kinda similar.

I'll leave you to get back to the topic.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 02:03 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by rdowns View Post
When gay and lesbian couples can marry as easily as straight couples when deployed, then I'll pull my support for paid leave.

How does leave work for a straight person wanting to marry?
They use leave time from their regularly accrued time. I'm not sure if you're being facetious or not, there.

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Umm.. you do realize that vacation time is also paid, right? Do you think someone in the government taking paid vacation time is also bad because government employees are taking pay cuts and furloughs?

BL.
No, but the above-mentioned employees are also granted the same leave time and are being given 7-10 additional days also. That is why it is of a higher cost, and is an irresponsible government move.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 02:16 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
No, but the above-mentioned employees are also granted the same leave time and are being given 7-10 additional days also. That is why it is of a higher cost, and is an irresponsible government move.
I don't believe it's irresponsible at all. I see that as a way to accommodate the likelihood of having to travel to another state to get married. Until same-sex marriage is legal and as accessible in all 50 states as opposite-sex marriage, then I have no problem with the additional paid time off for gays and lesbians to get married.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 04:26 PM   #10
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Originally Posted by Blue Velvet View Post
Gay and lesbian.

Homosexual is such an old-fashioned, pathological and stigmatising word. What's more, no one would use it to describe themselves these days.
I can't keep up. I used the the term gay and was corrected that I should be using homosexual.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 05:05 PM   #11
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I hope everyone gets to take this time off and use it to celebrate with the ones they love, and have a lasting memory of one of their most special days in ther lives. It sounds enirely reasonable to me.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 05:21 PM   #12
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Wow the military has come a long way. I remember when i was in the service they still had the "don't ask don't tell" policy.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 05:24 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Blue Velvet View Post
Gay and lesbian.

Homosexual is such an old-fashioned, pathological and stigmatising word. What's more, no one would use it to describe themselves these days.
Homosexual is stigmatized while gay and lesbian aren't?
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 05:26 PM   #14
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Homosexual is stigmatized while gay and lesbian aren't?
Thwt's not what BV said.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 05:27 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by rdowns View Post
When gay and lesbian couples can marry as easily as straight couples when deployed, then I'll pull my support for paid leave.

How does leave work for a straight person wanting to marry?
I am curious as well
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:01 PM   #16
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Curious about what? How vacations works for a straight person?

I can tell you. You use vacation days from your normal yearly allotment. That comes directly from a close friend recently married.

I'm not sure why anyone would expect it to be any different.

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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:36 PM   #17
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So wait, straight marriages need to use their vacation days while same-sex marriages get a separate 10 days apart from the vacation days?
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:38 PM   #18
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So wait, straight marriages need to use their vacation days while same-sex marriages get a separate 10 days apart from the vacation days?
In interest of full disclosure, the 10 days is only for those overseas, if I remember correctly. It's 7 days for those who are domestic.

But yes, that is correct.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:43 PM   #19
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In interest of full disclosure, the 10 days is only for those overseas, if I remember correctly. It's 7 days for those who are domestic.

But yes, that is correct.
Why not just have the same requirement of having to use vacation days? Are extra days a special treatment of catchup for previous inequality lol
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:44 PM   #20
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Obviously a much better solution would be to legalize gay marriage in every state. But unfortunately that's not going to happen any time soon.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 06:53 PM   #21
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To be able to compare correctly I'd need to know what the regulations for straight couples that cannot get married in every state are like.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 07:01 PM   #22
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Let's break this down with some numbers.

Let's say the federal employees taking advantage of this arrange earn an average of $50,000 per year. In this case, as taxpayers, we are paying roughly $1,400 to $2,000 per employee.

----------

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To be able to compare correctly I'd need to know what the regulations for straight couples that cannot get married in every state are like.
Please don't bring unnecessarily facetious comments into the thread. Keep it on track and respectable.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 07:09 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by dec.
To be able to compare correctly I'd need to know what the regulations for straight couples that cannot get married in every state are like.
It's odd how people's opinions change when the shoe is on the other foot isn't it?

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Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
Please don't bring unnecessarily facetious comments into the thread. Keep it on track and respectable.
That's very much on topic IMO. I can't remember you or others agitating much over the years that the cost of benefits for straight couples were unacceptable on grounds that gays weren't afforded the same rights. Happy to be proven wrong though...
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 07:14 PM   #24
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That's very much on topic IMO. I can't remember you or others agitating much over the years that the cost of benefits for straight couples were unacceptable on grounds that gays weren't afforded the same rights. Happy to be proven wrong though...
My issue lies only with the fiscal irresponsibility of the government in the way they are spending the tax money that I paid in. As I said earlier, if it was unpaid vacation, I'd be completely fine with it.

I did not take a government job (though I was offered one on two separate occasions), but I do have friends and family members who are dealing with furlough days this fiscal year. Apparently the government has additional funds to grant further vacation time to others, however. That is my main concern.
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Old Aug 16, 2013, 07:16 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsugolfer View Post
Let's break this down with some numbers.

Let's say the federal employees taking advantage of this arrange earn an average of $50,000 per year. In this case, as taxpayers, we are paying roughly $1,400 to $2,000 per employee.

----------



Please don't bring unnecessarily facetious comments into the thread. Keep it on track and respectable.
How many service men and women will be taking advantage of this every year? 100, 1000, 10,000? Without hard numbers, talking about money seems pointless.

He has a point, there would be no need for such a policy if all US states legalized gay marriage. How is that facetious?
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