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Old Sep 5, 2013, 01:01 PM   #1
xShane
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Immigrant fights to become California Lawyer

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A majority of California Supreme Court justices appeared reluctant Wednesday to grant a law license to Sergio Garcia, who graduated law school and passed the state's bar exam but has been living illegally in the United States for 20 years.
http://news.yahoo.com/immigrant-figh...081031894.html

I think this is a very interesting situation. The man came here as a child, worked hard, and followed the true American Dream. Isn't this exactly what the American Dream is all about? He worked his a*s off, working in the fields and at a local grocery store to pursue his dream and education. He passed the California BAR on his first try.

I'd like to hear the thoughts of the MacRumor's community and your reasons for or against him getting his license to practice law.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 01:42 PM   #2
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I think exemptions should be given for illegals who came here as a child and has shown to be a productive and law abiding person within American society. Even though this case is slightly differ cause he went back to Mexico at 9 and came back at 17, most others have not. So why pay for any illegal's education from our taxes just to make it impossible to use the education? (Talking about public schooling)
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 01:59 PM   #3
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You will never convince me that he did not know he was living in the US illegally.

Let him use his degree AFTER he goes through the process of becoming a US citizen.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:05 PM   #4
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You will never convince me that he did not know he was living in the US illegally.

Let him use his degree AFTER he goes through the process of becoming a US citizen.

He has been going through the process, but it takes so freaking long that he'll probably have a thousand diplomas and 10 great grandkids before they get back to him.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:16 PM   #5
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To grant him a license to practice law would be a violation of federal law and an insult to the profession.

He knew he was in the country illegally, did nothing about it, and now wants to circumvent the laws he proposes to uphold???

His hypocrisy is more relevant than his GPA.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:20 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xShane View Post
http://news.yahoo.com/immigrant-figh...081031894.html

I think this is a very interesting situation. The man came here as a child, worked hard, and followed the true American Dream. Isn't this exactly what the American Dream is all about? He worked his a*s off, working in the fields and at a local grocery store to pursue his dream and education. He passed the California BAR on his first try.

I'd like to hear the thoughts of the MacRumor's community and your reasons for or against him getting his license to practice law.
Your title is misleading. An immigrant is someone who came to this country through the legal channels and became a permanent resident and either has a green card or when through the process to become a US citizen.

The person you are talking about is here illegally. It does not matter if he came here 20 years ago or yesterday the fact of the matter is as of right this second he is here illegally and therefore should not be able to be a licensed lawyer.

Go through the process to be here legally and then you can be a lawyer.

Last edited by edk99; Sep 5, 2013 at 02:28 PM.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:29 PM   #7
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The funny thing is that if our current laws were around, and enforced, in the earlier parts of our country's time? Google would likely not be here. Apple might not be here. Microsoft probable would, though.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:37 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aspasia View Post
To grant him a license to practice law would be a violation of federal law and an insult to the profession.

He knew he was in the country illegally, did nothing about it, and now wants to circumvent the laws he proposes to uphold???

His hypocrisy is more relevant than his GPA.
Agreed

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Originally Posted by prostuff1 View Post
Let him use his degree AFTER he goes through the process of becoming a US citizen.
Agreed. He should not be allowed to practice law until he is here legally.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 02:52 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by prostuff1 View Post
You will never convince me that he did not know he was living in the US illegally.

Let him use his degree AFTER he goes through the process of becoming a US citizen.
I agree with this

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Originally Posted by LIVEFRMNYC View Post
He has been going through the process, but it takes so freaking long that he'll probably have a thousand diplomas and 10 great grandkids before they get back to him.
and this.
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Old Sep 5, 2013, 08:11 PM   #10
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I don't think that you should be able to practice law until you are here legally, but I also think that it should be much easier to get here legally especially for people like this who were brought to the US as children.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 12:16 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xShane View Post
http://news.yahoo.com/immigrant-figh...081031894.html

I think this is a very interesting situation. The man came here as a child, worked hard, and followed the true American Dream. Isn't this exactly what the American Dream is all about? He worked his a*s off, working in the fields and at a local grocery store to pursue his dream and education. He passed the California BAR on his first try.

I'd like to hear the thoughts of the MacRumor's community and your reasons for or against him getting his license to practice law.
The only thing 'interesting' about this situation is why hasn't he been deported yet.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 12:49 AM   #12
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Immigrants don't have to fight to become lawyers, they just have to go to law school and pass the BAR.

Illegals on the other hand.. How the hell do you get through the enrollment process without a social security number? Or was that forged too?

I'm going to guess he didn't pay high international tuition rates, then again its California so I'm not sure why I would be surprised.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:04 AM   #13
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Originally Posted by ThisIsNotMe View Post
The only thing 'interesting' about this situation is why hasn't he been deported yet.
Per the article linked in the OP, Garcia applied for citizenship in 1994, sponsored by his father, who is now an American citizenship and has notified immigration officials of his prolonged presence in the U.S.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:15 AM   #14
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If a special case were made for him all the people who were on the other side of the table from him would be able to claim that he had no right to practice law in the us and the case would be dismissed. I'm all for amnesty of minors and at the age of 17 he was a minor when he returned to the us, but to be granted a professional license seems to be stretching it.

He lived for a time in the town I live in and his case has received a lot of attention. Most Californians are extremely pragmatic about the undocumented. To deport them all would destroy the us and especially the Californian economy. The only way forward is amnesty and a more flexible ag worker policy.

The longer the us waits, the more intractable the problem will become.

For all you who claim your ancestors came here 'legally' and especially for those who arrived here prior to WWII, can you show me proof that they are were and are legal? I'll bet a good many arrived here without such distinction.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:31 AM   #15
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Seems like a lawyer should know the laws of land and comply with them 100%.

Furthermore, we should not have an immigration policy that rewards certain demographics because of their proximity to the United States. We should have one standard for legal immigration that applies to all potential immigrants equally.

I applaud his hard work, but the law is the law. If he gets a pass what does it say about the credibility of the law profession in that state.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 10:11 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Zombie Acorn View Post
I'm going to guess he didn't pay high international tuition rates, then again its California so I'm not sure why I would be surprised.
Those higher tuition rates are to make up for the fact that international students haven't been paying taxes in the US, most illegal immigrants do, and they pay more than legal residents making the same amount as they can't get tax refunds for overpaying. So assuming he didn't pay the international rate that shouldn't be a problem.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 11:25 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by mrkramer View Post
Those higher tuition rates are to make up for the fact that international students haven't been paying taxes in the US, most illegal immigrants do, and they pay more than legal residents making the same amount as they can't get tax refunds for overpaying. So assuming he didn't pay the international rate that shouldn't be a problem.
They could avoid this whole fiasco by not working illegally in a country that they are illegally occupying. About like the druggy who calls in the police because their heroin stash got stolen.

As someone who went through the hurdles of immigration I detest those who work under the table even more than I did before. Especially after speaking with others who have waited much longer and had much more paperwork to file than myself who are waiting in line patiently.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 11:38 AM   #18
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Per the article linked in the OP, Garcia applied for citizenship in 1994, sponsored by his father, who is now an American citizenship and has notified immigration officials of his prolonged presence in the U.S.
I haven't gone through the process myself, so I could be wrong - but I don't think it takes 20 years to become a legal immigrant. Sounds like a follow-up phone call might have been in order...many years ago.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 12:53 PM   #19
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He has been going through the process, but it takes so freaking long that he'll probably have a thousand diplomas and 10 great grandkids before they get back to him.
My wife and many of our friends naturalized. They went through the process and followed all the rules. They worried and fussed and eventually persevered. I don't see why he or any other person (with limited exceptions) here illegally should get a free pass.

----------

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I haven't gone through the process myself, so I could be wrong - but I don't think it takes 20 years to become a legal immigrant. Sounds like a follow-up phone call might have been in order...many years ago.
It took my wife about three and a half years. Some of our friends took 4 to 7 years.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:01 PM   #20
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Seems like a lawyer should know the laws of land and comply with them 100%.
I'm taking this as a statement of an ideal..."in the perfect world" statement.

I know a lot of lawyers who have smoked some dope, done a little coke, exceeded the speed limit, and committed other illegal acts.

I'm guessing that you're not suggesting that any lawyer busted for speeding, an illegal act, should be disbarred, or be denied admission to the bar.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:40 PM   #21
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I'm guessing that you're not suggesting that any lawyer busted for speeding, an illegal act, should be disbarred, or be denied admission to the bar.
Why not? I'm a licensed engineer, if I'm incarcerated my license gets revoked. You can also have your application denied if you have a felony conviction. A law license shouldn't be any different.

Speeding is a traffic violation, not a criminal violation. Let's compare apples to apples, shall we?
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 01:51 PM   #22
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Illegals on the other hand.. How the hell do you get through the enrollment process without a social security number? Or was that forged too?
I am curious about this as well. How did he fill out the paperwork to apply for admissions.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 02:03 PM   #23
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Why not? I'm a licensed engineer, if I'm incarcerated my license gets revoked. You can also have your application denied if you have a felony conviction. A law license shouldn't be any different.

Speeding is a traffic violation, not a criminal violation. Let's compare apples to apples, shall we?
Although I didn't make it clear (thus appearing no to be an apple), but in Mass (and Conn, as well as other states), speeding in excess of 90 mph is a criminal offense.

And in the future I shall endeavor, under all circumstances, to be clear that I am comparing apples to apples. I shall, indeed!
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 02:16 PM   #24
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My wife and many of our friends naturalized. They went through the process and followed all the rules. They worried and fussed and eventually persevered. I don't see why he or any other person (with limited exceptions) here illegally should get a free pass.[COLOR="#808080"]

It took my wife about three and a half years. Some of our friends took 4 to 7 years.

Well it took my step father(not by marriage) who is Guyeneese and been in NewYork since 10 years old decades to become a citizen. He just became a citizen about 3 years ago and he is in his mid 50s. He has been trying for as long as I known him which was when I was around 12yrs old, I'm in my mid 30s now. He's never been arrested and has always owned a legit business that he paid taxes on.

Don't know the details of why it took so long for him, his brothers, and many other people I knew from differ countries so long. But I sure did hear the complaints.
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Old Sep 6, 2013, 02:53 PM   #25
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Well it took my step father(not by marriage) who is Guyeneese and been in NewYork since 10 years old decades to become a citizen. He just became a citizen about 3 years ago and he is in his mid 50s. He has been trying for as long as I known him which was when I was around 12yrs old, I'm in my mid 30s now. He's never been arrested and has always owned a legit business that he paid taxes on.

Don't know the details of why it took so long for him, his brothers, and many other people I knew from differ countries so long. But I sure did hear the complaints.
There's a difference between becoming a citizen (which does take longer) and becoming a legal resident (which can happen rather quickly by comparison).

I have no problem with awarding professional licenses to non-citizen legal residents.
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