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Old Oct 5, 2013, 08:09 AM   #1
macdud
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2013 iMac: Faster PCIe Flash Storage ?

"iMac continues to be the example that proves how beautiful, fast and fun a desktop computer can be," said Philip Schiller, Apple's senior vice president of Worldwide Marketing. "Inside its ultra-thin aluminum enclosure, the new iMac has the latest Intel processors, faster graphics, next generation 802.11ac Wi-Fi and faster PCIe flash storage."

I can't seem to find any info on this faster PCIe flash storage?? anyone knows any details on this?
is it a leap similar to the macbook air & new mac pro PCIe flash storage?
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 09:39 AM   #2
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...
I can't seem to find any info on this faster PCIe flash storage?? anyone knows any details on this?
is it a leap similar to the macbook air & new mac pro PCIe flash storage?
Yes, it is the same leap.
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 10:41 AM   #3
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My new System Report shows PCI still instead of ePCI, do they need to update the system report software?
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 10:48 AM   #4
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My new System Report shows PCI still instead of ePCI, do they need to update the system report software?
I don't think it really matters. Remember prior to this year the SSDs were SATA devices.
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 10:58 AM   #5
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yea my late 2013 MBA also says PCI in system report but the tab says "SATA/SATA Express" so i wouldn't worry about it..


on a related note i found this teardown of the 2013 iMacs:


http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iMac+...Mac%20Teardown


http://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/iMac+...Mac%20Teardown
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 11:17 AM   #6
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My new System Report shows PCI still instead of ePCI, do they need to update the system report software?
What mac do you have?
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 11:22 AM   #7
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What mac do you have?
2013 i7 3.5
1TB Fusion

All the reviews talk about the improved Fusion performance as a result of the ePCI... I am supposed to have that. I figure it is a data table look-up that has not been updated.
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Old Oct 5, 2013, 01:30 PM   #8
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Yes you have..a better speed than last year fusion thanks to the 128 GB PCIe like in the MBA and NOT like MAC PRO...the MAC PRO will have PCIe with over 1 GB reads and write
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 03:09 AM   #9
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When choosing the option on an iMac for flash storage only (e.g. say 250 GB) is this PCIe flash or regular SSD?

What is meant by PCIe ? What is the difference between PCIe and regular SSD?
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 03:47 AM   #10
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When choosing the option on an iMac for flash storage only (e.g. say 250 GB) is this PCIe flash or regular SSD?

What is meant by PCIe ? What is the difference between PCIe and regular SSD?
Apple no longer offers the standard SATA3 SSDs in all their Macs, except the non retina 13" MBP and Mac Minis. All their Macs have PCIe-based SSDs.

A regular SATA3 SSD (like the Samung 840 Pro) has average read/write speeds of around 500-540 MB/s. A PCIe SSD found in every new Macs, except the two mentioned above, is capable of speeds averaging those in my screenshot attached.

To see how fast it stars up, you can see it here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/oqc4q8j3rfgdc1q/IMG_2903.MOV

This is a video of my iMac starting up, PCIe SSD.

Pardon my dog barking in the background.

Immediately after logging in, you can start opening apps instantly. There is no delay, unlike normal rotational drives.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Screen Shot 2013-11-17 at 17.28.35.png
Views:	20
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ID:	447730  
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 09:55 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by yjchua95 View Post
Apple no longer offers the standard SATA3 SSDs in all their Macs, except the non retina 13" MBP and Mac Minis. All their Macs have PCIe-based SSDs.

A regular SATA3 SSD (like the Samung 840 Pro) has average read/write speeds of around 500-540 MB/s. A PCIe SSD found in every new Macs, except the two mentioned above, is capable of speeds averaging those in my screenshot attached.

To see how fast it stars up, you can see it here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/oqc4q8j3rfgdc1q/IMG_2903.MOV

This is a video of my iMac starting up, PCIe SSD.

Pardon my dog barking in the background.

Immediately after logging in, you can start opening apps instantly. There is no delay, unlike normal rotational drives.
Thanks.

Does PCIe-based SSD have any performance degradation issues over time? In other words, are TRIM or garbage collection controllers needed? Do you still need to leave a certain percentage of free storage space on the drive for optimum performance?
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 10:04 AM   #12
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Thanks.

Does PCIe-based SSD have any performance degradation issues over time? In other words, are TRIM or garbage collection controllers needed? Do you still need to leave a certain percentage of free storage space on the drive for optimum performance?
OS X needs a certain amount of free space on the system disk for best performance. And as for TRIM, for drives supplied by Apple TRIM is enabled if needed.
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 07:42 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Thunderbird View Post
Thanks.

Does PCIe-based SSD have any performance degradation issues over time? In other words, are TRIM or garbage collection controllers needed? Do you still need to leave a certain percentage of free storage space on the drive for optimum performance?
Every SSD in the world will have performance degradations over time. But it'll take around 7-8 years before the first signs of degradation starts showing up in a Samsung 840 Pro. Apple's PCIe SSDs are mostly built by Samsung too, but are tougher and last longer.

TRIM is enabled by default for Apple SSDs.
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 07:59 PM   #14
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Every SSD in the world will have performance degradations over time. But it'll take around 7-8 years before the first signs of degradation starts showing up in a Samsung 840 Pro. Apple's PCIe SSDs are mostly built by Samsung too, but are tougher and last longer.

TRIM is enabled by default for Apple SSDs.
It depends on the read/write amount. An SSD can fail as early as 3 months or last a lifetime.

the 840 is TLC based... it will last 29 years with 30GB/day + write amplification of 3 ( 890 TB R/W incl. WAF3 ) or 250 years for a 10GB / day.

There will be no performance degradation however, you will witness re-allocated sectors and uncorrectable errors just before SSD failure.
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Old Nov 17, 2013, 08:43 PM   #15
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It depends on the read/write amount. An SSD can fail as early as 3 months or last a lifetime.

the 840 is TLC based... it will last 29 years with 30GB/day + write amplification of 3 ( 890 TB R/W incl. WAF3 ) or 250 years for a 10GB / day.

There will be no performance degradation however, you will witness re-allocated sectors and uncorrectable errors just before SSD failure.
The 840 Evo is TLC and the 840 Pro is MLC.

Yes, it all depends on the read/writes per day. But the 7-8 year lifespan is just an estimate for typical medium-heavy workloads.

I'll post daily read/writes at the end of the day for my iMac (usage: iTunes, Pages, Safari and FlightGear)
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Old Nov 18, 2013, 05:23 AM   #16
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After a boot time of 8 hours and 45 minutes on my iMac, here's the read/write stats:
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Name:	Screen Shot 2013-11-18 at 19.22.43.png
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Size:	180.3 KB
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Old Nov 18, 2013, 08:59 PM   #17
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I just got a 2013 Haswell 27" iMac with the 1TB mechanical drive. I plan to open it up and put a PCIe SSD inside it, does anyone sell a compatible drive for it yet? I checked OWC and don't see one listed.
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Old Nov 18, 2013, 10:03 PM   #18
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I just got a 2013 Haswell 27" iMac with the 1TB mechanical drive. I plan to open it up and put a PCIe SSD inside it, does anyone sell a compatible drive for it yet? I checked OWC and don't see one listed.
No, nothing legitimate. I am sure something's on eBay, but I'd stay away.
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Old Nov 18, 2013, 10:34 PM   #19
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No, nothing legitimate. I am sure something's on eBay, but I'd stay away.
Thanks. I'm going to grab an i7 4770 from MicroCenter and a Samsung Evo 500GB SSD and remove the mechanical inside and upgrade the processor on this one. Just need to order the foam strips and the micro-pizza cutter thing from iFixit first.
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Old Nov 19, 2013, 12:17 AM   #20
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Thanks. I'm going to grab an i7 4770 from MicroCenter and a Samsung Evo 500GB SSD and remove the mechanical inside and upgrade the processor on this one. Just need to order the foam strips and the micro-pizza cutter thing from iFixit first.
Brave soul! Even though I could, I wouldn't open my new iMac before it's out of warranty.
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Old Nov 19, 2013, 12:59 AM   #21
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Thanks. I'm going to grab an i7 4770 from MicroCenter and a Samsung Evo 500GB SSD and remove the mechanical inside and upgrade the processor on this one. Just need to order the foam strips and the micro-pizza cutter thing from iFixit first.
Isn't the CPU soldered ? I might be mistaken but that's what I thought.
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Old Nov 19, 2013, 03:00 AM   #22
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Isn't the CPU soldered ? I might be mistaken but that's what I thought.
Only in the 21.5"

EDIT: Although both Ivy Bridge and Haswell iMacs share the same design, the 21.5" Ivy Bridge model's CPU is not soldered to the board. Unfortunately, it's soldered in the Haswell.

The 27" CPUs in both Ivy and Haswell are not soldered though.
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