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Old Dec 13, 2013, 10:38 AM   #1
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New Cadillac ELR

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After driving it through the hills of California, the short answer is yes, but there's much more to the ELR. Is it enough to sway luxury shoppers to drop nearly $76,000 on it?

That's the question Cadillac worked hard on. On the technology side, the ELR begins with Volt drivetrain technology. That means there is decent power — 295 pound-feet of torque — in all situations, but it isn't a major improvement over the Volt, also from General Motors. In a Chevy alternative-fuel vehicle, it's more than you expect. Luxury buyers may want even more, however.

The chassis has been enhanced as well, and the terrific handling I liked so much about our long-term Volt is on display in the ELR. It carved corners on a twisty mountain drive with ease. The steering feels more precise than the Volt, and the large 20-inch tires gave excellent grip. The stability was impressive as huge gusts of wind buffeted the ELR throughout my drive.

The most notable change is to the suspension. The Volt didn't ride rough, but it certainly rocked and rattled more than you'd want in a luxury car. With a completely new front and rear suspension, the ELR goes over large road imperfections with more confidence and less feedback in the cabin.

Combine that improved ride with the exceptionally quiet cabin and in most driving situations the ELR feels like the upscale electric vehicle that Cadillac wants it to be.
usa today

In person the car is awesome. The ratio of the how big the tires are and the body looks like something I would have drawn when I was 12 yr old. So sexy, but $76K? Maybe a Porsche instead..
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Old Dec 13, 2013, 04:57 PM   #2
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The volt is junk, and they sell a few, so i'm sure there will be some people that will pay a lot more for pretty much the same junk with the cadillac name on it. It reminds me of the early 80's when they took a chevy cavalier and made it a cadillac cimarron. All junk, I will stick with my Honda's that are made in the USA.

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Old Dec 13, 2013, 05:18 PM   #3
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The volt is junk, and they sell a few, so i'm sure there will be some people that will pay a lot more for pretty much the same junk with the cadillac name on it. It reminds me of the early 80's when they took a chevy cavalier and made it a cadillac cimarron. All junk, I will stick with my Honda's that are made in the USA.

How is the Volt junk?

While I think the ELR is hugely overpriced, it's hardly a Cimarron like situation. Hell, the ELR is a coupe vs the Volt being a sedan. But, if you think it is then Toyota just slapped a Lexus badge on a Camry and called it the ES. Or the Land Cruiser and called it the LX….

The Volt/ELR is made in the USA too…
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Old Dec 13, 2013, 05:28 PM   #4
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How is the Volt junk?

While I think the ELR is hugely overpriced, it's hardly a Cimarron like situation. Hell, the ELR is a coupe vs the Volt being a sedan. But, if you think it is then Toyota just slapped a Lexus badge on a Camry and called it the ES. Or the Land Cruiser and called it the LX….

The Volt/ELR is made in the USA too…
I agree with your toyoya/lexus point, but, are you really gonna compare the gm stuff to the toyota stuff? c'mon, not even close, and wait till the Honda Accord plug-in comes out.


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Old Dec 13, 2013, 05:36 PM   #5
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I agree with your toyoya/lexus point, but, are you really gonna compare the gm stuff to the toyota stuff? c'mon, not ever close, and wait till the Honda Accord plug-in comes out.

Toyota's are boring as hell. Boring designs, boring to drive, etc. The Volt is a much better vehicle than the Prius, IMHO.

I follow the auto industry. I don't go on reputation, I actually drive them. I drove a Camry and its boring as crap to drive. Suspension is soft, steering is beyond numb, etc. They may be reliable, but they don't have much to go on after that. Honda's are fun to drive. My problem with them is they can be boring to look at( or hideous with the latest Acura's) and their engines produce no power below 5000 RPM.

My family has had no issues with our GM vehicles. 1996 Suburban, 2002 Suburban(currently at 100,000 miles), 2006 Equinox(traded in for the '13 at 120,000 miles), 2007 Saturn Aura(my personal car), and 2013 Equinox. No major issues with any of them.

Don't assume the Volt is junk simply because of GM's past. I believe the Volt is still at 90% satisfaction among owners.
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Old Dec 13, 2013, 06:03 PM   #6
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Toyota's are boring as hell. Boring designs, boring to drive, etc. The Volt is a much better vehicle than the Prius, IMHO.

I follow the auto industry. I don't go on reputation, I actually drive them. I drove a Camry and its boring as crap to drive. Suspension is soft, steering is beyond numb, etc. They may be reliable, but they don't have much to go on after that. Honda's are fun to drive. My problem with them is they can be boring to look at( or hideous with the latest Acura's) and their engines produce no power below 5000 RPM.

My family has had no issues with our GM vehicles. 1996 Suburban, 2002 Suburban(currently at 100,000 miles), 2006 Equinox(traded in for the '13 at 120,000 miles), 2007 Saturn Aura(my personal car), and 2013 Equinox. No major issues with any of them.

Don't assume the Volt is junk simply because of GM's past. I believe the Volt is still at 90% satisfaction among owners.
I agree the Acura styling is not good, a major change is needed. As for no power in a Honda below 5000 rpm, are you kidding? We have had many Honda's, currently a 2010 Acccord v-6, 2004 Accord v-6, and they fly off the line, drive on rails and will cruise at 130 all day. My toy is a 2006 s2000, there is not a funner car to drive, and yes you have to rev it for power, but thats what it's all about!

GM quality has improved a lot from the crap of the 80's and 90's. But for the money, I will buy Honda any day over them, you cannot beat Honda's resale either. I agree the camry is boring to drive and look at. I think all the Honda's look great, but I am a huge Honda fan.

GM has made a come back thanks to the bail out and are selling some cars. I don't think any of them look very good and no I have not driven any of them except a 2012 malibu rental car with 5000 miles on it, not impressed at all, and that thing is supposed to compete with an Accord, no comparison. As for any other new GM car I doubt I will ever drive them, unless its another rental, no reason to, I would never be in the market to buy one.
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Old Dec 13, 2013, 11:41 PM   #7
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Ugh, that Cadillac looks ugly.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 11:27 AM   #8
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Ugh, that Cadillac looks ugly.
Yep.
Think the Elantra Coupe looks better than that.

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Old Dec 14, 2013, 11:32 AM   #9
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It's ugly and way too expensive.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 01:23 PM   #10
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I agree the Acura styling is not good, a major change is needed. As for no power in a Honda below 5000 rpm, are you kidding? We have had many Honda's, currently a 2010 Acccord v-6, 2004 Accord v-6, and they fly off the line, drive on rails and will cruise at 130 all day. My toy is a 2006 s2000, there is not a funner car to drive, and yes you have to rev it for power, but thats what it's all about!
I don't think you've ever driven a car with actual horsepower then.

I had a rental accord awhile back, it was ok.

But drive my 2012 Corvette Grand Sport or my 600whp Marauder, thats some power

I had an 02 S2K actually, fun car. But lacking in the power department. My Grand Sport would EAT it.

Quote:
GM quality has improved a lot from the crap of the 80's and 90's. But for the money, I will buy Honda any day over them, you cannot beat Honda's resale either. I agree the camry is boring to drive and look at. I think all the Honda's look great, but I am a huge Honda fan.
I used to be a huge Honda fan as well, then I discovered the V8 engine.

My other issue with Honda is that they just aren't fun to drive, lightyears better than a Toyota, but still just a sewing machine. Point A to Point B kinda deal.

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GM has made a come back thanks to the bail out and are selling some cars. I don't think any of them look very good and no I have not driven any of them except a 2012 malibu rental car with 5000 miles on it, not impressed at all, and that thing is supposed to compete with an Accord, no comparison. As for any other new GM car I doubt I will ever drive them, unless its another rental, no reason to, I would never be in the market to buy one.
Try an Grand Sport Corvette or ZR1 Corvette, then you'll be in the market


But, I think this is a pretty good looking car, and for how cheap it is, not to bad of a price either if you enjoy feel good hippie products.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 01:42 PM   #11
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But, I think this is a pretty good looking car, and for how cheap it is, not to bad of a price either if you enjoy feel good hippie products.
Cheap? I would hardly qualify $76,000 for the ELR cheap. I think it is hugely overpriced and I hated Cadillac's old value pricing strategy. I would think $55,000-$60,000 would have been a better price. It would avoid the Tesla comparisons( hopefully) and better worth the price.

I think the ELR design wise is stunning. It has LED headlights standard, etc. While the guts of it is the same of the Volt, it is hardly the Cimarron like one member suggested.

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Though I do think it has one big execution mistake. It shouldn't have the same 1.4 liter gasoline generator as the Volt. IMHO, it should have used the 1.6T or even the 2.0T like the Fisker Karma uses. The 1.4 doesn't have the NVH qualities necessary for a luxury vehicle.

Other than that and the price, I think it is a good vehicle.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 02:02 PM   #12
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I agree the Acura styling is not good, a major change is needed. As for no power in a Honda below 5000 rpm, are you kidding? We have had many Honda's, currently a 2010 Acccord v-6, 2004 Accord v-6, and they fly off the line, drive on rails and will cruise at 130 all day. My toy is a 2006 s2000, there is not a funner car to drive, and yes you have to rev it for power, but thats what it's all about!
Of course I'm not kidding. I have driven my aunts Acura's. I used to work at a Chevy dealership as a lot attendant and the owner also had a Honda dealership in another location and I had to drive customers Honda's over to the dealership since the body work was done at the Chevy dealer.

My aunts 2008 Acura TL had I believe it was a 280 HP 3.5 liter V6. I would press the gas and it would go NO WHERE. It felt like it had a 180 HP 4 banger. Press it more and finally when it got to 5000 RPM and above, I would feel some pull and felt like a 280 HP V6. Same thing with the Civics, Accords, etc I would drive to the Honda dealership( which also required going on the highway and get to speed). My Saturn Aura has a 252 HP and 251 lb.ft. of torque 3.6 liter V6 and it makes its torque at 3200 RPM and you can feel the acceleration all the way to its 7000 RPM redline.

While I am sure the S2000 is a fun car to drive( unfortunately didn't get any S2000's to ferry over to the Honda dealer), as you stated you have to rev the crap out of it to get any power. While it is good for the track to make the power in the high end in the RPM range, it isn't good for street driving when you're staying in the low RPM range. And that is a negative to having a rev happy engine. It's cool to have a car that can rev to 8,000-9,000 RPM, but the consequence of that is not having a decent amount of low end power.


They drive nice and much better than Toyota's, but I'm not impressed with the engines.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 05:16 PM   #13
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Cheap? I would hardly qualify $76,000 for the ELR cheap. I think it is hugely overpriced and I hated Cadillac's old value pricing strategy. I would think $55,000-$60,000 would have been a better price. It would avoid the Tesla comparisons( hopefully) and better worth the price.

I think the ELR design wise is stunning. It has LED headlights standard, etc. While the guts of it is the same of the Volt, it is hardly the Cimarron like one member suggested.

Thumb resize.

Thumb resize.

Though I do think it has one big execution mistake. It shouldn't have the same 1.4 liter gasoline generator as the Volt. IMHO, it should have used the 1.6T or even the 2.0T like the Fisker Karma uses. The 1.4 doesn't have the NVH qualities necessary for a luxury vehicle.

Other than that and the price, I think it is a good vehicle.
Only someone with more money than sense will buy the ELR, it will be a bigger failure than the volt.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 05:36 PM   #14
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I don't think you've ever driven a car with actual horsepower then.

I had a rental accord awhile back, it was ok.

But drive my 2012 Corvette Grand Sport or my 600whp Marauder, thats some power

I had an 02 S2K actually, fun car. But lacking in the power department. My Grand Sport would EAT it.



I used to be a huge Honda fan as well, then I discovered the V8 engine.

My other issue with Honda is that they just aren't fun to drive, lightyears better than a Toyota, but still just a sewing machine. Point A to Point B kinda deal.



Try an Grand Sport Corvette or ZR1 Corvette, then you'll be in the market


But, I think this is a pretty good looking car, and for how cheap it is, not to bad of a price either if you enjoy feel good hippie products.
I have driven plenty of cars with hp. The s2000 does need to be reved and wound out, but thats what makes it fun, and remember its a 4 producing 24hp. It's a small sports car that handles like a go cart.

I'm not a vette fan, the ZR1 is fast but I would buy many other cars if I were in the market for that type of car. I have had several friends that have had lots of different vettes over the years and most of them rattled immensely. I could not deal with that. The new vette is nice, not sure if I like the exhaust note yet.[COLOR="#808080"]

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Old Dec 14, 2013, 05:48 PM   #15
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Of course I'm not kidding. I have driven my aunts Acura's. I used to work at a Chevy dealership as a lot attendant and the owner also had a Honda dealership in another location and I had to drive customers Honda's over to the dealership since the body work was done at the Chevy dealer.

My aunts 2008 Acura TL had I believe it was a 280 HP 3.5 liter V6. I would press the gas and it would go NO WHERE. It felt like it had a 180 HP 4 banger. Press it more and finally when it got to 5000 RPM and above, I would feel some pull and felt like a 280 HP V6. Same thing with the Civics, Accords, etc I would drive to the Honda dealership( which also required going on the highway and get to speed). My Saturn Aura has a 252 HP and 251 lb.ft. of torque 3.6 liter V6 and it makes its torque at 3200 RPM and you can feel the acceleration all the way to its 7000 RPM redline.

While I am sure the S2000 is a fun car to drive( unfortunately didn't get any S2000's to ferry over to the Honda dealer), as you stated you have to rev the crap out of it to get any power. While it is good for the track to make the power in the high end in the RPM range, it isn't good for street driving when you're staying in the low RPM range. And that is a negative to having a rev happy engine. It's cool to have a car that can rev to 8,000-9,000 RPM, but the consequence of that is not having a decent amount of low end power.


They drive nice and much better than Toyota's, but I'm not impressed with the engines.
If the TL went no where then you must not have floored it.

Or something was wrong with it.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 06:33 PM   #16
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Only someone with more money than sense will buy the ELR, it will be a bigger failure than the volt.
I don't believe GM is expecting to sell many ELR's. I think the more money than sense crowd is what GM is positioning the car for. It's just an image vehicle.

And the Volt is hardly a failure. It's the top selling plug in hybrid right now with it also outselling the Nissan Leaf currently( though it's a very close race with the Volt only having a 700 unit lead). It will take time for the market for these vehicles to mature. The first thing to do is get the price down to where a lot more consumers can afford them without the tax credit( because it will eventually run out). And then advertise on what they do. A few weeks ago, I read an article that a lot of people still don't know much about plug in and electric vehicles like the Leaf and Volt. I have still seen people say the Volt is junk because they only see the 40 mile electric range call it useless thinking it can only go 40 miles. They don't realize it has a gas generator to extend the range by another 300 miles.

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If the TL went no where then you must not have floored it.

Or something was wrong with it.
I floored it.... Still didn't feel anything until 5,000 RPM.

If something was wrong with it, then every other Honda I have driven had something wrong with it because they all have a similar behavior.

I'm not trying to say Honda's are crap. I know you're a fan of them and not trying to get you on the defensive on it. Honda's are very reliable cars and they are more fun to drive than Toyota's. I'm just not a fan of their engines. They don't have the low end power that I want.
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Old Dec 14, 2013, 11:34 PM   #17
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My TSX with a 200 HP 4 banger has plenty of power in the low RPMs. It's no slower than any other car I've driven with similar specs.

I got to drive an RL with a 300 HP V6 as a loaner for a couple days and that thing hauled ass. Handled like a boat, but it was a blast to drive as long as you were going in a straight line, and the interior can best be described as a La-Z-Boy on wheels. Certainly the most comfortable car I've driven.

All I hear is how greatly American cars have improved, and every time I'm stuck with one as a rental, I'm astonished at how crappy they still are. Cheap interiors, rough rides - and don't tell me "Well, it's a rental, people beat up on it!", I've had them with as few as 3,000 miles on them and they're bad.
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 04:32 AM   #18
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It's funny I say the same thing about Honda and Toyota, slabs of plastic not soft touch were it needs to be, unsupportive cheap feeling seats, vague shifters and lackluster steering.
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 08:17 AM   #19
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Cheap? I would hardly qualify $76,000 for the ELR cheap. I think it is hugely overpriced and I hated Cadillac's old value pricing strategy. I would think $55,000-$60,000 would have been a better price. It would avoid the Tesla comparisons( hopefully) and better worth the price.
I mean, 76K is a pretty low price for the type of person who would buy a feel good hippie caddi, for a little more you could have a Tesla.

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If the TL went no where then you must not have floored it.

Or something was wrong with it.
I think the same thing about Honda's engines. No low end torque.

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I floored it.... Still didn't feel anything until 5,000 RPM.

If something was wrong with it, then every other Honda I have driven had something wrong with it because they all have a similar behavior.

.
Every Honda V6 I've driven has the same issue of no low end torque, its simply they way Honda profiles their camshafts.

If you really want to launch a V6 Honda and assuming its an automagic, you gotta load the converter and launch around 4500RPM, or if its a stick, rev that bitch up to about 4500rpm and dump the clutch straight into 2nd gear.

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My TSX with a 200 HP 4 banger has plenty of power in the low RPMs. It's no slower than any other car I've driven with similar specs.
.
As someome whos rented an SI before, which is the same car. I can say that you really need to rev the **** out of that thing to make it go anywhere quickly.

You need a healthy dose, of a 6.2 Liter V8 engine.

Quote:
I got to drive an RL with a 300 HP V6 as a loaner for a couple days and that thing hauled ass. Handled like a boat, but it was a blast to drive as long as you were going in a straight line, and the interior can best be described as a La-Z-Boy on wheels. Certainly the most comfortable car I've driven.
RLs are very comfy, however they do not " haul ass.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I6EiNFiLhV0

That is what we call " Hauling ass ", my modified Grand Sport isn't much slower.

Try a Corvette, you'll never turn back

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All I hear is how greatly American cars have improved, and every time I'm stuck with one as a rental, I'm astonished at how crappy they still are. Cheap interiors, rough rides - and don't tell me "Well, it's a rental, people beat up on it!", I've had them with as few as 3,000 miles on them and they're bad.
Rentals are generally crap no matter what company they come from, Rentals are typically the worst that a car company has to offer. Most car companies don't even sell the rental models in the showroom.

I recently Rented a KIA something, that STILL had crank windows from a Rental place, I didn't even think they make cars with crank windows anymore.

Also, I would hardly call the interior on my Corvette to be crap ( this isnt mine, its snowing like a bitch out there, not taking it out lol )



Super crappy interior And its awful magnetic adjustable suspension has such an awful ride to!
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 08:23 AM   #20
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It's funny I say the same thing about Honda and Toyota, slabs of plastic not soft touch were it needs to be, unsupportive cheap feeling seats, vague shifters and lackluster steering.
I feel the same with Toyota's. Their interiors are cheap and dull to look at, their exterior design created the definition of vanilla, seats are unsupportive, suspension is soft and borders on floaty, shifting is lazy, and steering is numb. The only thing going for them is that they are reliable. With the exception of a few Lexus's and the FR-S, Toyota's are not for car guys. They are people who want a toaster on wheels.

Honda's are different. While their exterior designs are not very exciting ( not to mention the new Civic and Accord can hardly be called redesigns), interiors are decent and they drive fairly well with the exception of their engines. Would much sooner buy a Honda than a Toyota.

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I recently Rented a KIA something, that STILL had crank windows from a Rental place, I didn't even think they make cars with crank windows anymore.
There are people out there that still like crank windows so they don't have to deal with broken motors, etc.

Quote:
Also, I would hardly call the interior on my Corvette to be crap ( this isn't mine, its snowing like a bitch out there, not taking it out lol )

Image

Super crappy interior And its awful magnetic adjustable suspension has such an awful ride to!
It's dated and if you get the 3LT or lower, it's all fairly cheap plastic. Where 4LT and higher( GS I believe, Z06, etc) are leather wrapped. The Stingrays interior is much better.

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Old Dec 15, 2013, 08:38 AM   #21
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It's dated and if you get the 3LT or lower, it's all fairly cheap plastic. Where 4LT and higher( GS I believe, Z06, etc) are leather wrapped. The Stingrays interior is much better.

Thumb resize.
It is a little dated, and I have a 4LT Convertible, so its hardly a nasty interior, no rattles, very comfy, my model doesnt have cheap plastic. I plan to trade it in for a Stingray in a year or two, but I did blow a ton of mony on my Grand Sport, and don't see the point to upgrade this year.

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There are people out there that still like crank windows so they don't have to deal with broken motors, etc.
And we call them communists here in Americaland!

Ive NEVER had a power window failure personally. The only car I have with Crank windows is my 1969 Camaro Z28
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 10:32 AM   #22
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There are people out there that still like crank windows so they don't have to deal with broken motors, etc.



I prefer crank windows, manual shifters, solid axes etc. I want my car and dead simple as possible.
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 07:52 PM   #23
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I prefer crank windows, manual shifters, solid axes etc. I want my car and dead simple as possible.
Screw that.

Get AC, Power everything and comfy seats. new cars are very reliable
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Old Dec 15, 2013, 10:06 PM   #24
SkyBell
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Originally Posted by G51989 View Post
Screw that.

Get AC, Power everything and comfy seats. new cars are very reliable
Different strokes for different folks. I like having crank windows; power windows and their ridiculously jumpy button actions annoy me.

My 4-banger Ford Ranger isn't fast, doesn't handle well and is bare-bones basic. (rubber floors, vinyl seats, only AM/FM radio). But it hauls a small load or trailer, gets decent gas milage and is still fun to push hard for playtime.
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Old Dec 16, 2013, 01:46 AM   #25
MyMac1976
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My Wrangler has A/C I don't think I've used it in the 15years I've had it. Mines is luxury though it has carpet and I put it in, in the winter

Last edited by MyMac1976; Dec 16, 2013 at 06:05 AM.
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