Will there be a new Mac Pro in 2015?

I'm not a designer but considering your first question:

"Will there be a new Mac Pro in 2015?"

I would answer that with a yes based on the MacRumors buyers guide and the coming of Thunderbolt 3 this year (it is rumored to be a significant improvement). I'd recommend to wait it out unless your current Mac Pro is falling apart which I highly doubt it is.

The only people who know the answer to this are Apple.

But I can give you a few things to think about.

Intel are reportedly slowing/halting production of the xeon v2's the current mac pro uses. Apple may, or may not have a deal with them, or a massive amount in their stock rooms.

I'm half expecting some sort of apple event out of schedule, they have the iWatch out *soon*, will that really just one day appear on their website or in stores? or will they wait until jun/jul or will there be a big announcement? you decide

macbook air 12" - kinda similar to the above

would be a good time to announce/refresh the mac pro?

But against this is thunderbolt 3 - it won't be out on xeon's until at least next year, it's only just making it to desktops/laptops this year. also the v3 xeon's arent much better than the v2's in servers so...

also have a browse through some of the other threads here

Nox

One would hope so, but who knows what Apple's plans are.

Some of what we know:

• They skipped a generation in 2012, but before that had been close to Intel's launch date of new hardware except in 2010 when it came 5 months later.
• They spent a lot of money making a custom production line in the US
• The 2013 model had huge demand compared to what they produced
• The Mac Pro has very low sales volume compared to other lines, but high profitability.
• The new platform for the CPUs were available in September 2014.
• The graphics card generation that succeeded the ones in the Mac Pro are already available - from both vendors.

I'd be surprised if they skipped Haswell/Xeon V3. Yeah it's not amazingly better, but it is still better and they will have to switch to that socket anyway so the production costs will be there eventually. The workstation/server market isn't fast paced like the consumer one though. Not a huge issue for Apple to be out of sync with Intel's release by a quarter, and that protects them from things like in 2012 when there were 3 month delays for everyone, or when there is huge demand for the higher-tier Xeons from big clients that they can't meet and other companies have to wait. Doubt Apple is going to go out of its way to secure Xeons like they did in 2008.

Highly doubtful they'll realease a new one given.

This is a very accurate assessment in my opinion...

Umbongo said:

I'd be surprised if they skipped Haswell/Xeon V3. Yeah it's not amazingly better, but it is still better and they will have to switch to that socket anyway so the production costs will be there eventually. The workstation/server market isn't fast paced like the consumer one though. Not a huge issue for Apple to be out of sync with Intel's release by a quarter, and that protects them from things like in 2012 when there were 3 month delays for everyone, or when there is huge demand for the higher-tier Xeons from big clients that they can't meet and other companies have to wait. Doubt Apple is going to go out of its way to secure Xeons like they did in 2008.

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Now...

Anto38x said:

I'm a traditional style graphic designer... my core apps would still be Adobe Photoshop, Adobe Illustrator, QuarkXpress 10.5 (soon to be 64bit QuarkXpress 2015). I use Final Cut Pro really for personal/home movie editing, nothing really commercial. I do alot of large format design... 10ft x 6ft corporate graphics artworks, so I do need a workhorse... but I'm not a 4K hogging Video/Animator .

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Given your workload... I don't think you're going to see any measurable improvement in performance by waiting for a Haswell refresh.

Consider...
CPU: Haswell's key benefit is primarily battery life. Performance benchmarks on desktop CPUs showed an average 3% improvement (with some benchmarks being worse on Haswell than Ivy).

GPU: The available AMD Tonga GPUs are very incremental improvements over those in the 2013 model and we won't see major improvements until AMD moves to 20nm with Caribbean Islands later this year.

SSD and I/O: There's no new SSD or I/O technology available now.

The best bang-for-the buck system for your workload is probably the 4 or 6-core system with as much RAM and SSD as you can afford (64GB and 1TB?). More than 6 cores will probably go under utilized, and the GPUs rarely come into effect with what you're doing.

There are some good deals to be had on refurbished 2013 models that will provide more value in your case than full-priced refreshed 2015 models.

No. The dual-core ARM replacement will not be ready until 2016.

Not sure why you want to upgrade... anything you buy is going to be slower than what you have now unless you spring for the top of the line 12-core again and even that would only be a marginal improvement.

I will also say that it makes no since to upgrade.
I would wait longer to see what is coming up down the road.

Your machine is super powerful and like mentioned before, you won't really see a difference.
I am a designer myself and I am wondering if you even utilize your machine to the fullest?
I have a 2.93 Ghz OctoCore and I never use any of the cpu at all..

austinpike said:

Not sure why you want to upgrade... anything you buy is going to be slower than what you have now unless you spring for the top of the line 12-core again and even that would only be a marginal improvement.

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This would be true only if his workload regularly saturates 12-cores which is unlikely if not impossible given his quoted software. For lightly threaded tasks or any workload using 6 physical cores or less, the current nMP Hex will be faster than the 2010 12-core. The SSD in the nMP is also likely to be significantly faster than his current SSD.

Anto38x said:

There's nothing wrong with my current machine...

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Then wait.

Anto38x said:

Hi there...

I currently have a MacPro 2010 (Mid 2010), 2 x 2.93 GHz 6-Core Intel Xeon with 64 GB 1333 MHz DDR3 ECC + 512GB SSD Drive with QTY 3 x 2TB internal drives.

I am looking to upgrade to the new cylindrical MacPro but I'm worried a refresh is very much around the corner. I usually invest in a new MacPro to last me for the next 4-5 years, so I don't want to jump in too soon this year if there's a strong chance that a new, improved version is just around the corner.

There's nothing wrong with my current machine... I'm running OSX Yosemite 10.10.1 and I'm using a ASUS Bluetooth 4.0 Dongle in conjunction with Continuity Activation Tool to get me all my Handoff/Continuity features.... so I'm right up to speed... but as a given I usually upgrade my machines every 5 years at the max to keep up with new technology etc...

I'm a traditional style graphic designer... my core apps would still be Adobe Photoshop, Adobe Illustrator, QuarkXpress 10.5 (soon to be 64bit QuarkXpress 2015). I use Final Cut Pro really for personal/home movie editing, nothing really commercial. I do alot of large format design... 10ft x 6ft corporate graphics artworks, so I do need a workhorse... but I'm not a 4K hogging Video/Animator .

Last time round I bought my MacPro at the very highest level I could go.... this time round... after some serious research, I realised I bought way over what I needed... so I'm hoping my new MacPro won't need to cost me as much. Any other similar designers out there willing to let me know what spec they went for... to be able to work effectively with similar apps to what I have.

Any comments or suggestions most welcome.


Regards,
Anthony

Irish MacUser & MacAddict

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For what you do, I doubt you'd see enough improvement in the current nMP to justify it. My friend down the hall is kicking himself because he gave up good single core performance in his last oMP when he got his new 12 core nMP.

However, I have some real doubts about Apple's trajectory towards offering anything that would suit you better in the future.

I'd say wait till a new machine is announced, and then hastily acquire a refurb, if it doesn't suit your needs.

VirtualRain said:

SSD and I/O: There's no new SSD or I/O technology available now.

The best bang-for-the buck system for your workload is probably the 4 or 6-core system with as much RAM and SSD as you can afford (64GB and 1TB?). More than 6 cores will probably go under utilized, and the GPUs rarely come into effect with what you're doing.

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Samsung announced their SM951 which should bring 1600 read/1300 write speeds. Not really new tech but improved. But the internal storage won't suddenly go up to 1TB standard and for large content, one would need to spend just as much for a external storage system that can keep up with it. Might be part of a future upgrade or it might not.

The best option I recall is the hex-core with the D500 GPUs, putting more money into the D700s if there are funds available. Storage you can attach, RAM is always user-upgradeable, and the processor scaling is sort of mediocre for the huge cost. But getting a pair of those top-end GPUs are a steal comparatively.

But his situation doesn't really warrant the setup since little if anything is GPU-accelerated or hitting the cores hard. I always felt the base nMP was subpar and itching for any upgrade in any part.

VirtualRain said:

This would be true only if his workload regularly saturates 12-cores which is unlikely if not impossible given his quoted software. For lightly threaded tasks or any workload using 6 physical cores or less, the current nMP Hex will be faster than the 2010 12-core. The SSD in the nMP is also likely to be significantly faster than his current SSD.

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He could always slap a PCIe SSD RAID in the thing, that would overcome the SATA II limitation, and disk performance would be roughly equivalent to the nMP.

Gildarts said:

I would answer that with a yes based on the MacRumors buyers guide and the coming of Thunderbolt 3 this year (it is rumored to be a significant improvement).

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Thunderbolt v3 likely isn't coming in 2015. TB v3 cranks the PCI-e links to v3. The majority of Intel's chipsets that will also crank that high aren't coming until next gen v6 ( 'Skylake' ) on desktop side. ( http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2014...olt-doubles-speeds-but-changes-the-connector/ )

Intel still hasn't fully rolled out v5 ( 'Broadwell' ) yet. There is much hand waving by Intel about how Skylake won't get bogged down in the process shrink, but it is doubtful that Intel is going to dramatically shrink the lifetime of the mainstream laptop/desktop products. The 2015 v6 products that volume roll out in 2015 are likely going to be in the Core M and lower range. Not anything in the realm the Mac Pro operates in.

For Mac Pro, the trio of TB controllers are hooked to the CPU package's PCIe lanes. Again, it will be more like Skylake era when the PCIe bandwidth goes up to v4. There isn't enough bandwidth to hook three x4 PCIe v3 controllers in a Mac Pro.

Right now Apple has three x4 v2 sharing the bandwidth of a x8 v3 (equiv of x16 v2). Apple could dump a TB controller ( maybe just 4 ports with TB and two with USB 3.0/3.1 all of USB type C socket like still 6 video out.) but not inline with they have done so far.


Most TB vendors are just finishing up rolling out TB v2 products. Throwing those products under the bus mid-late 2015 with a new version TB on a completely new socket is going to promote as many folks to leave as stay on the TB bandwagon. USB Type C socket isn't going to have significant momentum to ride until 2016. ( there will be a relatively small trickle of products this year ... USB initial adoption rates are almost always slower than the hype level they are talked about ).


TB's history

2011 Pragmatically locked down on Apple.
2012-2014 v1 (Intel had 2014 as volume target for v2 the '13Q4 appears of Apple systems notwithstanding )
2014-> probably 2016 v2 gives v2 a similar two year run.

Anto38x said:

Thank you all.... incredible comments, suggestions and information. I think based on these comments I will hold off for now... really I think I was just getting bored at that metallic tower box.. and looking for a new toy that I could justify buying since it was 5 years since my last splurge... but it would be an expense toy and one that would deliver the jump in speed and productivity that I would hope it would be... and that's based on the comments here and based on the many other replies from the same posting that I made on other MacPro thread/forums.

Thanks again guys for taking the time out to reply to my question... it's very much appreciated and valued!!


Regards,
Anthony

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Hi Anthony. Yep I think it's advisable to stick with your current classic Mac Pro for now. My design work also uses Adobe Photoshop, Illustrator, InDesign and After Effects video edits. I work with various design and motion graphics studios and there were times I need to edit graphics onsite using their Mac Pros in their offices. I had a chance to use the Adobe softwares on the new cylinder Mac Pro on one of my clients who had a new Mac Pro, an 8 core 3.0ghz with D500s. With Photoshop and illustrator I didn't see much noticeable speed gains on certain tasks I worked on in the new Mac Pro. I think it may also be the way the software was written and how it responds to hardware. I am currently using the same classic Mac Pro as yours.

As far as I know, Photoshop, Illustrator or InDesign are optimised to use only one GPU so with the new Mac Pro the 2nd GPU will be unused. And Illustrator GPU rendering is not supported in the New Mac Pro https://discussions.apple.com/thread/6505724
Actual hands on experiences on various machines and abundant reading helps in deciding on whether to invest in the long term from a business standpoint. I'll soon be using Premiere Pro for a new client and stumbled on this Adobe forum about problems in Premiere Pro CC video rendering having "horizontal line artifacts" in the new Mac Pro. https://forums.adobe.com/thread/1422947?start=480&tstart=0 With tight deadlines we can't afford to have delays that may disappoint clients.

The next revision of the Mac Pro won't have TB3. I think that's pretty much common knowledge. If the Xeon line stays on target with timing, Broadwell-EP comes late this year, with Skylake-EP in late 2016. That's if Broadwell-EP isn't delayed (Intel says it isn't, but who knows). That could mean a potential TB3 introduction in the nMP in early to mid 2017.

Apple won't wait that long to refresh the nMP. Next refresh is Haswell-EP, faster PCIe SSDs, refreshed GPUs, perhaps USB 3.1. Those are all out now.

MMcCraryNJ said:

The next revision of the Mac Pro won't have TB3. I think that's pretty much common knowledge. If the Xeon line stays on target with timing, Broadwell-EP comes late this year, with Skylake-EP in late 2016. That's if Broadwell-EP isn't delayed (Intel says it isn't, but who knows). That could mean a potential TB3 introduction in the nMP in early to mid 2017.

Apple won't wait that long to refresh the nMP. Next refresh is Haswell-EP, faster PCIe SSDs, refreshed GPUs, perhaps USB 3.1. Those are all out now.

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What's the source on the TB3 delay?

t0mat0 said:

What's the source on the TB3 delay?

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Never said TB3 was delayed at all. TB3 will be supported starting with the Skylake architecture. The first Skylake processors aren't expected to ship until late this year or early next year. Remember Intel's workstation roadmap, though, which is always behind the standard desktop parts by about a year. Haswell-EP *just* came out a couple of months ago. At the end of this year, Broadwell-EP should be out. At the end of 2016, Skylake-EP should be released. Then, just add Apple's standard 3-6 month delay on top of that, and you get early to mid 2017 for a possible introduction of TB3 into the Mac Pro.

As I said though, this is all assuming Intel's workstation/server roadmaps stay the same and aren't affected by the Broadwell delay one way or the other.

Hopefully we get a mac pro with displayport 1.3 and a displayport 1.3 only 5k cinema display

RoastingPig said:

Hopefully we get a mac pro with displayport 1.3 and a displayport 1.3 only 5k cinema display

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Agreed, that would be nice, but do any of the latest GPUs support it?

VirtualRain said:

Agreed, that would be nice, but do any of the latest GPUs support it?

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Next gen AMD chips will have support for DP1.3 and HDMI 2.0.

MMcCraryNJ said:

Never said TB3 was delayed at all. TB3 will be supported starting with the Skylake architecture. The first Skylake processors aren't expected to ship until late this year or early next year. Remember Intel's workstation roadmap, though, which is always behind the standard desktop parts by about a year. Haswell-EP *just* came out a couple of months ago. At the end of this year, Broadwell-EP should be out. At the end of 2016, Skylake-EP should be released. Then, just add Apple's standard 3-6 month delay on top of that, and you get early to mid 2017 for a possible introduction of TB3 into the Mac Pro.

As I said though, this is all assuming Intel's workstation/server roadmaps stay the same and aren't affected by the Broadwell delay one way or the other.

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But TB2 was done in the late 2013 Mac Pro -
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7603/mac-pro-review-late-2013/13

by integrating 3x Intel Falcon Ridge Thunderbolt 2 controllers (each driving 2 TB2 ports each).

Would't we just need Intel to release TB3 Alpine Ridge controllers?

t0mat0 said:

But TB2 was done in the late 2013 Mac Pro -
http://www.anandtech.com/show/7603/mac-pro-review-late-2013/13

by integrating 3x Intel Falcon Ridge Thunderbolt 2 controllers (each driving 2 TB2 ports each).

Would't we just need Intel to release TB3 Alpine Ridge controllers?

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i also have thought this