I'm thinking of moving to Windows: Shock Horror!

It's your choice to make...

Do what works best for you and skip all the fanboi nonsense. I run OSX and a virtual of Win 7. I am happy I have both as they each serve me well.

As for hardware, not particularly happy with the route Apple is going with their computers and yet I am sure plenty of people love their latest product line so again - we should get rid of brand loyalty and go for what works best for our needs.

FROFRO707 said:

I can't believe I'm saying this but after my first personal computer being a Mac and having had one for maybe six years, I'm contemplating leaving it all behind.

I'm on a Mac Mini, and love it to bits, but right now I can see more reasons to convert to the dark side...
First, I refuse to go any further than 10.8 because I'm scared it will slow my Mac down, and hate the look of Yosemite. I don't own any iOS devices and don't want my desktop looking like a tablet thank you very much. The longer I leave it the worse it'll get and I'll have to move forward at some point.
Second, I think price wise I can get more for my money with pc. Unless I pay more for a higher end Mac, I can pick up a cheaper more powerful pc.
Third, I'm not bound by pre-made machines and can customise how I want to match my needs/price bracket. If I need a bit more speed, just pick up a new motherboard and processor and I'm on my way pretty much.
Finally, I do like games. Unfortunately Mac can't quite give the that experience.
I will miss apps like pages, mail and calendar, but I think that the benefits of PC are far stronger.

I am still a firm believer in once you go mac never go back, and you hear very few stories of people moving from Windows to Mac, but I guess I'm doing the opposite somehow...

I don't quite know what I'm expecting by posting this, but as long as we all play nice I look forward to a discussion.

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Windows 8 is a horrible tablet hack phone frankenstein desktop monstrosity! Windows 10 is a little better, but not much. I beta tested Win8 several years ago and my final report pretty much stated if they release this product it will be the death of Microsoft. I was wrong, they are still kicking. Win10 has the HoloLens thing which, on the surface looks quite amazing. My girlfriend brought me back to reality, when she said, "When has Microsoft actually done anything properly?" It'll probably be a stuttering, seizure inducing, tripping over the dog, breaking your left leg kind of experience.

If you are really looking for something, try to stay Unix based, I recommend Ubuntu, it's pretty amazing ( I'm running two Ubuntu systems behind me right now ). Unix based systems keep you out of the world you've forgotten about, the world of the evil virus and virus protection programs interrupting your work/play flow endlessly AND you can get your extreme build on.

Good luck in whatever you choose. After all, the best tool for the job is my motto.

phrehdd said:

Do what works best for you and skip all the fanboi nonsense. I run OSX and a virtual of Win 7. I am happy I have both as they each serve me well.

As for hardware, not particularly happy with the route Apple is going with their computers and yet I am sure plenty of people love their latest product line so again - we should get rid of brand loyalty and go for what works best for our needs.

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I agree...

Do what is needed. There is no reason to be loyal to computer company if they are not providing the goods and services that you need. Remember: this is JUST a piece of metal or plastic...and a computer, nothing else...

Contrary to most viewpoints (especially on this forum), Windows 8 is not a bad OS and Windows 10 looks like a better product. OS X has suffered a major programming shift with Jony Ive as now the head, so (as normal in leadership shifts) it will take some time to iron things out and make things work.

Hardware is another story..inexpensive old (concept) technology in an extremely expensive computer does not cut it anymore. When "it just worked" was real, then it was worth spending the extra.

If people start leaving the Apple infrastructure and migrating to the Windows platform, then as normal business practice of "supply and demand" will hopefully cause Apple to invest more into their OS X instead of toys. This is what happen to Microsoft and it is now paying off for them...

So have I. I decided that Apple was not going to make the computer I wanted so I bought a Blackbook X and couldn't be happier. I still have my trusty iPad Air and 17" MBP, but I do not agree with the direction Cook is taking, so I jumped to Windows and am quite happy. No new Apple computers for me.

I too am afraid that I've bought my last Mac. Over the past 18 months or so I've been relying on my PC (I custom built it) for certain tasks because the bugs and performance isn't what it used to be.

I've been trying to start a podcast and was having all kinds of latency problems on my rMBP. I finally gave it a try on my PC and lo and behold all the many problems went away. I'm now recording my 10th episode without any problems.

I also built a Hackentosh and it performs much better than the genuine article! It's a shame really. Apple was the best when it came to performance and quality. Sad to say but not anymore.

rocknblogger said:

I too am afraid that I've bought my last Mac. Over the past 18 months or so I've been relying on my PC (I custom built it) for certain tasks because the bugs and performance isn't what it used to be.

I've been trying to start a podcast and was having all kinds of latency problems on my rMBP. I finally gave it a try on my PC and lo and behold all the many problems went away. I'm now recording my 10th episode without any problems.

I also built a Hackentosh and it performs much better than the genuine article! It's a shame really. Apple was the best when it came to performance and quality. Sad to say but not anymore.

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I am still using a Mac Mini "loaded" and will remain with it as long as I can. It is an older quad model. Apple simply gave the finger to those of us who really liked the Mini as more than an "intro to Apple" computer. If they don't come out with a quad again I will go the route of a PC (which I will build) that will also meet some of the standards found on TonyMac site.

I'll just say that its a shame that the nMP, comes with 2 vid cards and one drive only rather than also offering an option of one vid card and two drives which would have probably increased their market. I guess it didn't fit the Apple Market model that they took from Ford - you can have any colour you want as long as it is black.

After nine years of using OS X as a daily driver, I just recently bought a used HP EliteBook and am happily using Windows 7 nearly-full time. I love older iterations of OS X, especially the 10.4-10.6 era, but newer versions have put me off of it; it's still a decent OS I'm sure, but not for me.

Even more compelling for me to switch is Apple's hardware becoming increasingly sealed in hardware: I do not agree with their steeply increasing practice of "slimming down" their products to make them look pretty, while dropping features to accommodate these often oversimplified designs. Massive limitations on premium priced products? No thanks.

Though many here will tell you otherwise, Windows hasn't been nearly the nightmare many of us remember in the era of XP and previous versions. These days, it still has its little kinks that OS X has ironed out, but it excels far above it in other small functions. Not to mention the plethora of hardware and parts manufacturers that offer much more capable and cheaper options.

In smartphones, tablets and the like, trading function for physical exterior design doesn't have nearly the implications it does in full computers, and Apple needs to get this through their heads before I'll even consider buying another Mac for full OS computing.

I use both Windows and OS X. Both have their positives and negatives. I think the days of the religious wars of windows vs. OS X are over.

There are plenty of well built PCs, and Windows itself is very stable.

loby said:

Contrary to most viewpoints (especially on this forum), Windows 8 is not a bad OS and Windows 10 looks like a better product.

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Windows 8.0 was bad. Windows 8.1 patched up a lot of complaints, and it's honestly not much worse than Windows 7 at this point. Which means hopefully Windows 10 is even better.

Your reasons sound very logical and well thought out - if it works for you go for it. Agree with above, its more of a religion than anything else these days..

I have multiple of each and neither is problem free or perfect.

Windows (7 at least) is a mighty fine OS. I can't live without either, but if push came to shove I'd have to drop OSX since my work+tools are Windows only. Thankfully I don't have to make that decision since Macs can also run Windows.

I do get more and more tempted to go down the PC route once again. When my 27" iMac needed a new HDD I couldn't just go into Apple and buy a new one and have them install it, according to a salesperson. I had to do it myself which was costly (having to import tools from OWM) and risky. That put a serious dent in my desire to buy another Mac. And yet I bought a MBP recently, with its non-standard HDD and battery I can't just replace them either.

Hah, I'm turning myself off buying Apple again.

Use whatever works. I use both.

Dagless said:

And yet I bought a MBP recently, with its non-standard HDD and battery I can't just replace them either.

Hah, I'm turning myself off buying Apple again.

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Because you haven't done any research then you could change your hard drive with the OWC SSD for Mac Book Pro with Retina.

I've disliked the direction Apple has been going for quite some time. An OS X bug that Apple refused to fix was the final straw, and I recently bought the new Dell XPS 13.

The one tip I have is that you definitely get what you pay for. If you get a $400 laptop, you won't be happy with it, you'll curse Windows, and go buy a $2000 MBP (Praise Jobs). If you spend $1000 on a Windows laptop, you'll have a nice and surprisingly pleasant experience. Spend a little more for a touchscreen, and you'll wonder what in the world is wrong with Apple for not integrating touch with OS X.
Once you've converted to the "dark side", you'll rediscover things like "gaming" and "sin". You'll sink hours upon hours into games. You'll forget to shower. Your wife will take the kids and leave you. You'll get fired from your job. But hey, at least your guild still loves you!
I find that I tend to do more gaming on Windows, even though the games I play are cross-platform. Dunno why that is, but there's that too.

P.S. If you use Windows 8, download the Netflix app and "snap" the Netflix app to the side.. It's really handy.

P.P.S I still use Mavericks at work, and I really don't want to upgrade my work machine to Yosemite. I don't want to think about what will happen when I'm forced into updating it for xcode compatibility.

thejadedmonkey said:

I've disliked the direction Apple has been going for quite some time.

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I'm not hating apple, but I've not been jazzed up about where they've focused their attention and design. Some of the stuff in Yosemite is cool, like taking a phone call on my computer. Yosemite though has too many annoyances. The obsession with thinness, to the point where they roll out a brand new computer (rMB) that is no faster then a 4 year old MacBook Air.

Microsoft while not perfect has some pretty cool things going on, I like what I'm seeing with Windows 10, the Surface products, etc. Their phones have yet to really catch on here in the US, but I do like them.

Will I buy a Mac when the time comes around to replace my rMBP? I'm 80 percent sure I will. I'm leaning towards the riMac, since my SP3 fits my mobility needs.

satcomer said:

Because you haven't done any research then you could change your hard drive with the OWC SSD for Mac Book Pro with Retina.

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Non-standard therefore expensive. I did my research. And in 5 or so years time when Apple are using a different type completely will these drives still be available or even more costly? One has to wonder.
And then the battery. How do I replace that?

My 11 year old Powerbook still works due to replacing the battery and HDD. I wonder how long I'll get out of this current machine.

Dagless said:

My 11 year old Powerbook still works due to replacing the battery and HDD. I wonder how long I'll get out of this current machine.

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I think they're now considered disposable consumables, and you'll not be able to get battery replacements in the course of time.

Which is a problem IMHO we have to much e-waste as it is and computers have become powerful enough to last many years.

lowendlinux said:

Which is a problem IMHO we have to much e-waste as it is and computers have become powerful enough to last many years.

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Yup. As much as I really don't want to, Apple devices were great at lasting a long time but they don't seem to bother with that much now. I'd rather (like my old PB) pass devices down rather than binning them which isn't so great on the environment.

if you switch

why not rather switch to ubuntu 14 lts, everything just works out of the box, it's as easy as windows to install and it's free. pretty cool......

or you replace your HDD in your MacMini to a SSD and chek your Ram, i built in a fusion drive and Win also run's on the SSD, and it's fun to work with. be happy that you have a mac where you still can change drive and ram.

good luck

I'd have though that if you're concerned with your computer slowing down, you'd stay as far from Windows as possible.

Now, some thoughts on that:
- Windows 8 is horrendous; Windows 7 actually wasn't bad.

- I've had Yosemite for ages and its not slow at all. Like, not even a Wink. I don't like the design tweaks, but at least those differences are visual only. If I switched to Windows I'd have to contend w/ the whole bloated OS.

- Windows 7 will run perfectly well inside Parallels, Fusion, or VirtualBox. I've VirtualBox extensively and while it lacks fancy features it runs Windows like a top.

- Or, Dual-install them as Root OSs and enjoy them without any virtual ware hinderance.


I think, personally, if you go back to Windows you'll kick yourself in 6 months and wonder how you could be so dumb. But that's me; I had horrible experiences with Windows. That said, I also lament the absurd obsession Apple has had recently with "slim". I'd rather have an extra half-pound and two millimeters thickness than expansion or internal limitations simply for the sake of insane thinness. If I want something that sharp, I'll buy a Shun.

FROFRO707 said:

I can't believe I'm saying this but after my first personal computer being a Mac and having had one for maybe six years, I'm contemplating leaving it all behind.

I'm on a Mac Mini, and love it to bits, but right now I can see more reasons to convert to the dark side...
First, I refuse to go any further than 10.8 because I'm scared it will slow my Mac down, and hate the look of Yosemite. I don't own any iOS devices and don't want my desktop looking like a tablet thank you very much. The longer I leave it the worse it'll get and I'll have to move forward at some point.
Second, I think price wise I can get more for my money with pc. Unless I pay more for a higher end Mac, I can pick up a cheaper more powerful pc.
Third, I'm not bound by pre-made machines and can customise how I want to match my needs/price bracket. If I need a bit more speed, just pick up a new motherboard and processor and I'm on my way pretty much.
Finally, I do like games. Unfortunately Mac can't quite give the that experience.
I will miss apps like pages, mail and calendar, but I think that the benefits of PC are far stronger.

I am still a firm believer in once you go mac never go back, and you hear very few stories of people moving from Windows to Mac, but I guess I'm doing the opposite somehow...

I don't quite know what I'm expecting by posting this, but as long as we all play nice I look forward to a discussion.

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I would recommend going to Windows 7 while waiting on the release of Windows 10.

Melrose said:

- I've had Yosemite for ages and its not slow at all. Like, not even a Wink. I don't like the design tweaks, but at least those differences are visual only. If I switched to Windows I'd have to contend w/ the whole bloated OS.

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I have Yosemite since it came out on MBP (clean install), it's not that great, at least in my experience. I get graphical glitches, hangups and poor performance on i5 Quad Core with 8Gb of RAM...I also don't find Windows as bloated as it used to be, provided you use a Microsoft disc instead of an OEM disc.
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For the OP, no shock and no horror there. You're not alone and I bet more people are feeling the same way. I hate this path Apple is taking, soldering everything and going thinner and thinner. The way things are, if ANYTHING fails after the warranty, that basically means a getting new machine. It's ridiculous, we can't even upgrade the RAM or HDD/SSD!

I'm going back to Windows/PC soon, it's just a matter of how much more time can my iMac survive. I've been trying Windows 10 for quite some time and quite honestly I find it very good. It's clean, fast and performs very well (Cortana is great). Windows 10 will be out soon, so that's the version I'm going for.

I like gaming, but I was limited to the games available for Mac (I was never a fan of Bootcamp - booting from one side to the other all the time really got on my nerves - and a virtual machine eats too much performance for gaming). With Windows/PC, I'm going to do more gaming soon, sooo many good titles I haven't tried, I have a lot of catching to do haha

As for the machine, if I take the 1550€ for the high end 21.5" iMac and use them for a PC, I can build a machine A LOT more powerful...really A LOT more powerful! And with the advantage of being able to replace any faulty part or upgrade the machine according to my needs.

I won't lie, I will miss some things on OSX, but the way things are, I just can't buy another Mac...