Is Apple locking out 3rd Party Developers with all their iAp...

MacBytes · Jul 8, 2003, 10:57 AM

Link: Is Apple locking out 3rd Party Developers with all their iApps?

Mr. Anderson · Jul 8, 2003, 11:02 AM

Although its true in some cases, there are so many apps that Apple can't get them all. This is all worry over the Premiere announcement. If the 3rd party providers come up with a good package, they won't have a threat.

I don't think Apple would be capable of making anything that could compete with Photoshop any time soon, anyway.

D

ennerseed · Jul 8, 2003, 11:57 AM

Is Apple using any connects to the OS that other companies are not able to get to? I personally don't know, but doubt it. Apple make VERY good apps. It seems more that other companies don't want to compete when the competition is hard. Apple has shown many time (especially the OS) that they will compete, almost no matter how much the odds are against them... What is wrong with everyone else?

ennerseed · Jul 8, 2003, 12:00 PM

a link back to MacBytes from the forums would be useful.

Rustus Maximus · Jul 8, 2003, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ennerseed
Is Apple using any connects to the OS that other companies are not able to get to? I personally don't know, but doubt it. Apple make VERY good apps. It seems more that other companies don't want to compete when the competition is hard. Apple has shown many time (especially the OS) that they will compete, almost no matter how much the odds are against them... What is wrong with everyone else?

This is exactly right. Microsoft simply won't (or can't) create a browser that is as fast or has the same functionality as Safari. Maybe they figure they've had enough problems with IE.

As for Adobe, they are simply closing an open wound in their product lineup. What Apple user is going to use Premier When Final Cut Pro is so much better? It has nothing to do with Adobe and Apple having an 'icy' relationship or not. Adobe should respond to this by going back to the drawing board, revamping their product according to what customers want, then going toe-to-toe with Apple for the customer's business.

Instead, they give up. That mindset is apparently how you start thinking when your company size reaches megalithic proportions. If that was the attitude they were taking with InDesign, Quark wouldn't have a thing to worry about. I wonder what they would do if Apple ever ported Final Cut Pro to Windoze?

Billicus · Jul 8, 2003, 02:04 PM

I think that Apple is indeed ousting a handful of developers, because who can resist the temptation of free or cheap software from Apple that does most if not all of what you're looking for a program to do. But Apple hasn't and never will oust all of the developers, because like you and me these developers are also loyal to the Macintosh platform and to Apple computers.

medea · Jul 8, 2003, 04:02 PM

woah wait a minute, the truth is Adobe quit production on Premiere because it can't compete with FCP, end of story, FCP is preffered in the field and outsells Premiere. If Apple brings out a program and no one can do one better than yeah those companies will opt out. But Adobe is going nowhere, mac users still need Pagemaker, Illustrator etc. It's basically a cop out really and no fault of Apple's.

giba · Jul 8, 2003, 04:03 PM

IMHO, most of the 3rd party apps Apple competes with are pretty pathetic to begin with (think IE), so Apple is simply trying to set a standard of how Mac apps should be. Unlike M$, Apple is not doing anything that stifles competition, but instead they encourage it. Better apps should emerge from such competition, but apparently some Mac developers are simply a bunch of sissies.

nuckinfutz · Jul 8, 2003, 05:56 PM

Lets see here. Apple competing with 3rd party ISV. So what?

Premiere is gone not because Apple competed with it. It's gone because Adobe wanted to put it on the "slow track".

Apple views Desktop DV Publishing as THE next big thing. That's why they've been shipping DVD Burners in computers for 3 years. That's why they purchased Astarted and Key Grip from Macromedia. They've never misled in their intentions. Adobe on the other hand expects for Apples best NLE product to be Premiere? Oh please.

Apple is "Damned if they do...damed if they don't" They were lambasted for being "late" on MP3. They relied on their Nemesis to develop their best Browser. If Apple doesn't remain agressive ..then this platform simply doesn't survive.

Computers are tools. When too many Politics enter the consumer loses despite what these mental midgets think. They'll be first to start writing "Apple is Dead" articles when the moments strikes. Don't listen ...as a Mac user you DESERVE the best apps you can buy. if they come from Apple then sobeit.

Rustus Maximus · Jul 8, 2003, 11:31 PM

Here, here! And many are already writing those Apple obit articles (yet again) because of Adobe's decision...

If I had a nickel for everytime they said Apple was gonna die...I'd be Bill Gates...

widesky · Jul 9, 2003, 07:02 AM

There is another issue here, which is how much access Apple gives developers to their applications. For example Word documents are readily interchangable with other apps cause Microsoft make the file format readily available to all. Clarisworks format is closely guarded by Apple which means you won't find anything other than Clarisworks that will deal with the format.

I understand that the current iApps are equally bad at this. Apple really needs to be open source with it's file formats, rather than guard them to lock out the opposition.

nuckinfutz · 09:51 AM

Quote:

For example Word documents are readily interchangable with other apps cause Microsoft make the file format readily available to all.

This is false. Competing Developers reverse engineer the .doc format but Microsoft doesn't give it away. If you think they do..then kindly point me to the SDK.

Quote:

I understand that the current iApps are equally bad at this. Apple really needs to be open source with it's file formats, rather than guard them to lock out the opposition

Hmmmm oh really?

Safari- Webcore SDK. AKA Safari SDK. You want to offer easy HTML rendering in your app. Heres the SDK for the Webcore Engine.

iMovie/iDVD- Both use Quicktime for Codecs. Nothing unaccessible for 3rd party developers hence the iMove and iDVD plugins and Themes.

iCal- Format is readily available on developer.apple.com.

Addressbook- Addressbook open Frameworks here 3rd party Devs already tying into to Addressbook

iTunes- MP3 and AAC. Nothing unacessable again.

iSync- Based on "Open" SyncML. Nothing unaccessable here.

iPhoto- You might have me here

Ok that's enough. As you can see above. Apple has been endorsing open standards as much as possible. Appleworks does contain it's own document format as Word does. However no one really needs to support it because Word is the king of the hill. Microsoft again does NOT give away .doc format. Clever developers are able to increase the odds that their Word Processor can translate to the Word format but Microsoft makes sure it's a moving target.

The Evils of the Word Document Format

Jul 8, 2003, 10:57 AM	#1
MacBytes macrumors bot Join Date: Jul 2003	Is Apple locking out 3rd Party Developers with all their iAp... Link: Is Apple locking out 3rd Party Developers with all their iApps?

Jul 8, 2003, 11:02 AM	#2
Mr. Anderson Demi-God (Moderator) Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Back in VA	Although its true in some cases, there are so many apps that Apple can't get them all. This is all worry over the Premiere announcement. If the 3rd party providers come up with a good package, they won't have a threat. I don't think Apple would be capable of making anything that could compete with Photoshop any time soon, anyway. D __________________ "Klaatu varada nikto!"

Jul 8, 2003, 11:57 AM	#3
ennerseed macrumors regular Join Date: Jan 2002	I mean really Is Apple using any connects to the OS that other companies are not able to get to? I personally don't know, but doubt it. Apple make VERY good apps. It seems more that other companies don't want to compete when the competition is hard. Apple has shown many time (especially the OS) that they will compete, almost no matter how much the odds are against them... What is wrong with everyone else? __________________ Times are hard for dreamers - Amelie

Jul 8, 2003, 12:00 PM	#4
ennerseed macrumors regular Join Date: Jan 2002	a link back to MacBytes from the forums would be useful. __________________ Times are hard for dreamers - Amelie

Jul 8, 2003, 02:04 PM	#6
Billicus macrumors 6502a Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Charles City, Iowa	I think that Apple is indeed ousting a handful of developers, because who can resist the temptation of free or cheap software from Apple that does most if not all of what you're looking for a program to do. But Apple hasn't and never will oust all of the developers, because like you and me these developers are also loyal to the Macintosh platform and to Apple computers. __________________ "...I know it's hard when you're up to your armpits in alligators to remember you came here to drain the swamp." - Ronald Reagan February 10, 1982

Jul 8, 2003, 04:02 PM	#7
medea macrumors 68030 Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Madison, Wi	woah wait a minute, the truth is Adobe quit production on Premiere because it can't compete with FCP, end of story, FCP is preffered in the field and outsells Premiere. If Apple brings out a program and no one can do one better than yeah those companies will opt out. But Adobe is going nowhere, mac users still need Pagemaker, Illustrator etc. It's basically a cop out really and no fault of Apple's. __________________ Winner Of The '04 Animated Avatar Contest Misanthrope's Creed: One's company, two's a crowd. Solipsist's Creed: Zero's company, one's a crowd.

Jul 8, 2003, 04:03 PM	#8
giba macrumors newbie Join Date: Jul 2003	IMHO, most of the 3rd party apps Apple competes with are pretty pathetic to begin with (think IE), so Apple is simply trying to set a standard of how Mac apps should be. Unlike M$, Apple is not doing anything that stifles competition, but instead they encourage it. Better apps should emerge from such competition, but apparently some Mac developers are simply a bunch of sissies.

Jul 8, 2003, 05:56 PM	#9
nuckinfutz macrumors 68000 Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Middle Earth	God...will the insanity ever end? Lets see here. Apple competing with 3rd party ISV. So what? Premiere is gone not because Apple competed with it. It's gone because Adobe wanted to put it on the "slow track". Apple views Desktop DV Publishing as THE next big thing. That's why they've been shipping DVD Burners in computers for 3 years. That's why they purchased Astarted and Key Grip from Macromedia. They've never misled in their intentions. Adobe on the other hand expects for Apples best NLE product to be Premiere? Oh please. Apple is "Damned if they do...damed if they don't" They were lambasted for being "late" on MP3. They relied on their Nemesis to develop their best Browser. If Apple doesn't remain agressive ..then this platform simply doesn't survive. Computers are tools. When too many Politics enter the consumer loses despite what these mental midgets think. They'll be first to start writing "Apple is Dead" articles when the moments strikes. Don't listen ...as a Mac user you DESERVE the best apps you can buy. if they come from Apple then sobeit.

Jul 8, 2003, 11:31 PM	#10
Rustus Maximus macrumors regular Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: The Future!	Here, here! And many are already writing those Apple obit articles (yet again) because of Adobe's decision... If I had a nickel for everytime they said Apple was gonna die...I'd be Bill Gates... __________________ "I'm packing your extra pair of shoes, and your angry eyes, just in case."

Jul 9, 2003, 07:02 AM	#11
widesky macrumors newbie Join Date: Feb 2003	There is another issue here, which is how much access Apple gives developers to their applications. For example Word documents are readily interchangable with other apps cause Microsoft make the file format readily available to all. Clarisworks format is closely guarded by Apple which means you won't find anything other than Clarisworks that will deal with the format. I understand that the current iApps are equally bad at this. Apple really needs to be open source with it's file formats, rather than guard them to lock out the opposition.

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