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Old Jul 17, 2003, 11:53 PM   #1
Rezet
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Speed Difference. What do you think?

In your opinion, If we take 4 laptops. How do you think overall their speed and performance will be against each other?
In other words, In percents, how fast each computer will be comparing to a control one (you choose which one).

Example: ibook - 20% slower than 867 Mhz 12" Pbook.

900Mhz G3 14"1 iBook
867Mhz G4 12"1 Pbook
867Mhz G4 15"2 Pbook
1Ghz G4 15"2 Pbook

How would they stack against each other? Would 900Mhz ibook be far behind 867 15" Pbook?

I'm also interested how far G3 is behind G4.
How much faster 900Mhz G4 would be over 900Mhz G3?
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 12:07 AM   #2
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In heavy-duty stuff such as video editng (basically, anything optimized for AltiVec), here are my estimates:

The 900MHz iBook is the control, here.
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 40% faster
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 50% faster
1 GHz 15" TiBook: 55% faster

In more basic stuff such as Word and Safari, here are my estimates:

Again, with the 900 MHz iBook as the control:
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 5% slower
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 5% slower
1 Ghz 15" TiBook: 10% faster

These are estimates, to be sure. I've never done any measurements. They're actually not estimates, they're just wild guesses. I do know the 867MHz G4s are slower or even with the 900 MHz G3 in the second category, though.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 02:09 AM   #3
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I pretty much agree with your estimates for basic Word/Safari type tasks, but for altiVec tasks, I think the G4 has more of an impact. Something more like...

900Mhz iBook = control
867 12" AlBook: 400% faster
867 15" TiBook: 400% faster
1 Ghz Tibook: 500% faster

Benchmarks are available at
MacSpeedZone
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 02:45 AM   #4
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Re: Speed Difference. What do you think?

Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
I'm also interested how far G3 is behind G4.
How much faster 900Mhz G4 would be over 900Mhz G3?
that depends on what you're doing. On the internet, playing warcraft 3, using many common apps, the difference is zero. that's right, nothing. The G4 at the same clockspeed will not do one iota better.

But, if you're using apps that are altivec aware, such as photoshop, then the G4 will not only be faster, it will be MUCH faster.

In short, the G4 is only faster on certain tasks that take advantage of its architecture, but on those select tasks, it absolutely crushes the G3. So to determine if an ibook or powerbook is right for you, you really need to know what apps you will be using, and if they take advantage of altivec and the velocity engine on the G4.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 07:13 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by Noc
I pretty much agree with your estimates for basic Word/Safari type tasks, but for altiVec tasks, I think the G4 has more of an impact. Something more like...

900Mhz iBook = control
867 12" AlBook: 400% faster
867 15" TiBook: 400% faster
1 Ghz Tibook: 500% faster

Benchmarks are available at
MacSpeedZone
I disagree... the altivec makes a difference but not that much at the 12" PB level. The lack of L3 cache makes it about the same if not slower than a 900MHz G3.

The G3 is a superior chip than the G4 is some ways and the G4 has altivec which helps in some intensive tasks.

I'll will cite this example, a friend has a brand new 12" PB 867. I have a brand new 12" iBook 900. We both have 640MB of RAM.

With nothing but iTunes running, I ripped a CD faster than he did. I completed a list of simple photoshop actions faster (flip, resized, watermark, save and close). This shocked me.

The iBook was slightly faster in Safari and iChat felt a bit snappier.

I'd say that using the 12" AlBook as a control:
In Altivec operations:

900Mhz iBook is 5-10% faster
867Mhz TiBook is 30% faster
1Ghz TiBook is 40% faster

in Non Altivec Ops:
900Mhz iBook is 5% faster
867 TiBook 15 is 10% faster
1Ghz Tibook is 20% faster.

In a real world situations the 900MHz iBook is much faster than you'd expect.

Hope that helps

I wonder if we can get a few people to offer to benchmark their Macs and compare?


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Old Jul 18, 2003, 07:27 AM   #6
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>>867Mhz TiBook is 30% faster
1Ghz TiBook is 40% faster <<

One thing I kept noticing is that there isn't much difference between the 867 and 1 GHz TiBooks. I'm leaning toward a TiBook over an iBook on pure screen size. Any reason to select the 1GHz over the 867??

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Old Jul 18, 2003, 02:40 PM   #7
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Interesting.
How long can Ibook 900 run on one charge?
And How long can 15" Pbook run?
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 02:45 PM   #8
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Hmm, I just reviewed macspeedzone stats, and found it kind of surprising. 14"1 iBook really does beat 12" pbook in about half applications. If that source is reliable, then i guess, many people underestimate the power of ibook.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 02:56 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Noc
I pretty much agree with your estimates for basic Word/Safari type tasks, but for altiVec tasks, I think the G4 has more of an impact. Something more like...

900Mhz iBook = control
867 12" AlBook: 400% faster
867 15" TiBook: 400% faster
1 Ghz Tibook: 500% faster

Benchmarks are available at
MacSpeedZone
That's ludicrous. 400% faster? I'd say that an iBook is slower than a 12" PB because of the simple fact that even the OS itself is made to take advantage of Altivec, but c'mon, that's a very big number. For applications not involving video editing or PS work, I'd say that the iBook is very competitive.
Quote:
The 900MHz iBook is the control, here.
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 40% faster
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 50% faster
1 GHz 15" TiBook: 55% faster

In more basic stuff such as Word and Safari, here are my estimates:

Again, with the 900 MHz iBook as the control:
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 5% slower
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 5% slower
1 Ghz 15" TiBook: 10% faster

These are estimates, to be sure. I've never done any measurements. They're actually not estimates, they're just wild guesses.
Haha, yes they are wild guesses, but I think that they're probably very good "wild" guesses. More like educated guesses.

Here's what I think.

ALTIVEC RELATED TASKS (Photoshop, video stuff...)
900MHz iBook = Control
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 30% faster
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 40% faster
1 GHz 15" TiBook: 55% faster

For MS Word, emailing, etc...
900MHz iBook = Control
867 MHz 12" AlBook: 5% faster
867 MHz 15" TiBook: 10% faster
1 Ghz 15" TiBook: 20% faster
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Last edited by Abstract; Jul 18, 2003 at 03:00 PM.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 03:07 PM   #10
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I got a question. How much space does OS X takes up fully installed on HDD? Along with all the programs that come with it standard like iTunes, iMovie etc....
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 03:13 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
I got a question. How much space does OS X takes up fully installed on HDD? Along with all the programs that come with it standard like iTunes, iMovie etc....
With or without language, and printer support? There are several ways to install. The default is about 2.5 GB. And then you need to add upwards of 3 GB depending on how much RAM you have on a G4, or upwards of 9 GB if you max out the G5.

The swapfile space alone needs room to grow and match the existing RAM configuration, otherwise it slows down because of how swapfile space works.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 03:30 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by fjs08
One thing I kept noticing is that there isn't much difference between the 867 and 1 GHz TiBooks. I'm leaning toward a TiBook over an iBook on pure screen size. Any reason to select the 1GHz over the 867??
By itself, the difference in processor speed between the two models certainly doesn't justify the $600 price difference. But you do understand that the processor speed isn't the only difference between the 867MHz TiBook and the 1GHz TiBook, right? It's up to you to decide if the additional (or upgraded) features for the 1GHz TiBook are worth the price difference.

The easiest way to compare is to just go to the the on-line Apple Store and look at the specs for these models side-by-side. To put it in perspective, if you were to start with the 867MHz model and then customize it to add in all of the upgrades that you'd get standard with the 1GHz model (e.g. 512Mb RAM, 60Gb hard drive, SuperDrive and AirPort), you end up with a final cost very close to the base price for the latter.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 03:34 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by gopher
With or without language, and printer support? There are several ways to install. The default is about 2.5 GB. And then you need to add upwards of 3 GB depending on how much RAM you have on a G4, or upwards of 9 GB if you max out the G5.

The swapfile space alone needs room to grow and match the existing RAM configuration, otherwise it slows down because of how swapfile space works.

Well, Lets say I have 1Ghz G4 with 512Mbs of Ram.
If I install eveyrthing, Well language support - 2 langages im interested in and ofcourse printer suport.
How much space would I need just for system to function properly?
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 04:28 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Lyle
By itself, the difference in processor speed between the two models certainly doesn't justify the $600 price difference. But you do understand that the processor speed isn't the only difference between the 867MHz TiBook and the 1GHz TiBook, right? It's up to you to decide if the additional (or upgraded) features for the 1GHz TiBook are worth the price difference.

The easiest way to compare is to just go to the the on-line Apple Store and look at the specs for these models side-by-side. To put it in perspective, if you were to start with the 867MHz model and then customize it to add in all of the upgrades that you'd get standard with the 1GHz model (e.g. 512Mb RAM, 60Gb hard drive, SuperDrive and AirPort), you end up with a final cost very close to the base price for the latter.
Don't forger the video card, there is a huge differnce there. I'll say, go with the 1 Ghz. Ask owners of these machines what they think, most will tell you that it kicks ass!!!
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 05:06 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, Lets say I have 1Ghz G4 with 512Mbs of Ram.
If I install eveyrthing, Well language support - 2 langages im interested in and ofcourse printer suport.
How much space would I need just for system to function properly?
Then you need 4 GB of free hard disk or more space to install and not to let the free hard disk space get under 1.5 GB.
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 06:55 PM   #16
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I see everything here, but lets get some numbers... can anyone recomend some good software for benchmarks on the Mac? My 800Mhz would make the perfect sacrificial lamb...
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Old Jul 18, 2003, 07:44 PM   #17
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Question How about java development?

Hi.

I'm having sort of the same question - I'll buy either a 900Mhz ibook or a 867 TiBook in the next few days (I'm leaning towards the TiBook for the screen). Apart from browsing, email, etc. I'll use it for Java development - How much of a performance gain, if any, will I get from java apps in the TiBook? Is this one application in which the additional investment would be justified?

Thanks!!!
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