What country makes the most reliable cars?

[quagmire]

Originally Posted by Thomas Veil

For me that's a frustrating dichotomy. I'd love the MPG of a Japanese car, but without the boring styling. OTOH the Pontiac Solstice and the Chrysler 300 do it for me style-wise, but with mediocre mileage.

Sad truth is you might as well get the Solstice GXP( Sky Redline for me) over the regular one if you're concerned about fuel economy. 20/28 for the regular one with a stick. 22/31 GXP with a stick. It is using the 2007 EPA testing.

[SMM]

Originally Posted by FrankBlack

I have had excellent results with my Subaru's. Before I got into subes, I owned a Toyota Truck for ten years. The clutch wore out at about 60K, that's about it. Everything else was routine service. If I wanted another truck, I'd go with Toyota.

I've heard pro and con about the reliability of German cars. One of my co-workers has a Passat, about a year old. He likes the car, but he has had some serious issues, including the engine simply stopping at very bad times. In the case of Audi, I think the business with the bad ignition coils hurt them quite a bit.

Sorry GM fans, but I don't know anyone who has purchased a GM anything in the past ten years who has been happy with the purchase.

I bought a Passat wagon in 1998. The car had minor issues (not all doors would lock all of the time, etc). But, I generally loved the car. Then one day the oil light flashed on, off, on...at non-linear intervals. I pulled over and checked the oil. Fine - right were it should be. The deal told me to bring it in. By the time I drove the 5 miles, the light was constant. Bottomline: engineering flaw - there was a screen on the crankcase pick-up tube. It becomes clogged and starves the engine. The bill - over $6,500.00!

What really set me off was VW acting like this was somehow my fault. They acknowledged the problem. They asked if I received the letter they sent out. I actually had it in the glovebox. It basically said the problem was the light flashing and the cure was to use a different viscosity oil (which I did). They flat-out refused to help with the repair of my car. Eventually I donated it to charity.

I would never buy another VW again. Not because of the engineering error. I can understand that. If a company is making a solid effort to keep you as a long-time customer, reward them. If they act like they do not care, run like hell. This attitude usually servers me well.

[Abstract]

Originally Posted by quagmire

Didn't you read my other posts. Stop using the 80's. It is common knowledge that the Big 3 sucked back then.

Oh, and don't look at the 90's. In fact, lets just look at the past 2 years for long-term reliability records.

[pengu]

Originally Posted by SMM

I bought a Passat wagon in 1998. The car had minor issues (not all doors would lock all of the time, etc). But, I generally loved the car. Then one day the oil light flashed on, off, on...at non-linear intervals. I pulled over and checked the oil. Fine - right were it should be. The deal told me to bring it in. By the time I drove the 5 miles, the light was constant. Bottomline: engineering flaw - there was a screen on the crankcase pick-up tube. It becomes clogged and starves the engine. The bill - over $6,500.00!

What really set me off was VW acting like this was somehow my fault. They acknowledged the problem. They asked if I received the letter they sent out. I actually had it in the glovebox. It basically said the problem was the light flashing and the cure was to use a different viscosity oil (which I did). They flat-out refused to help with the repair of my car. Eventually I donated it to charity.

I would never buy another VW again. Not because of the engineering error. I can understand that. If a company is making a solid effort to keep you as a long-time customer, reward them. If they act like they do not care, run like hell. This attitude usually servers me well.

so you stopping buying a make of car because of a bad dealership service dept?

WOW.

[twoodcc]

I voted japan as well. Everyone in my family drives a toyota

[ErikCLDR]

Who ever was talking about ignition wire problems in Audis, it also occurred in VW's as well. My friends mom had a 2002 Passat Wagon 1.8t and had to have them replaced.

[ambience]

I'd actually like to see some evidence that modern (or even 10 year old) American cars are not reliable. I hate when people totally write off something without giving any evidence why. I voted American because I thought the poll has been unfair, but I will also mention that many Japanese vehicles are reliable. I can't figure out why anybody voted for Chinese cars, they are deathtraps.

[Father Jack]

My vote went to Germany ...... although it was a toss-up between Germany and Japan.

[walangij]

Originally Posted by ambience

I'd actually like to see some evidence that modern (or even 10 year old) American cars are not reliable. I hate when people totally write off something without giving any evidence why. I voted American because I thought the poll has been unfair, but I will also mention that many Japanese vehicles are reliable. I can't figure out why anybody voted for Chinese cars, they are deathtraps.

I think the bad rep of American cars is unfounded, my family has owned GM for a long long time, until recently switching to German/Japanese cars b/c our dealer was not very nice anymore. Our American cars rarely had uncommon problems. They all started to have major problems at around 180k but any car would.

I think that when people talk about "countries" in this poll they are talking about where the HQ of each company is located, otherwise we'd have a HUGE list of countries and no one would know which car comes from where. That being said, doesn't Toyota/Hyundai and other reliable car from Japan actually manufacture some cars in the States?

[cycocelica]

From people I know and my own family, German made cars are some of the worst. Plus when they break, its expensive. My dad has a Mercedes Benz, my sister a VW, and my friend a BMW. All have been in the shop multiple times, all costing an arm and a leg.

German made cars have been at the bottom of reliable list for years. One example.

[SMM]

Originally Posted by pengu

so you stopping buying a make of car because of a bad dealership service dept?

WOW.

WOW

You were inattentive to what I wrote. I said VW, as in the corporation, refused to help me. It was not the dealership. You probably need to read posts (at least) one more time than you do. Or, do you just skim them and not really read them?

[ErikCLDR]

Six of the "Most Reliable" are from General Motors (Charts) or Ford (Charts). Those are Ford's front-wheel-drive midsize sedans (Ford Fusion, Mercury Milan and Lincoln Zephyr), GM's new large non-luxury SUVs (Chevrolet Tahoe and GMC Yukon) and GM's Pontiac Vibe wagon. The Vibe is shares its basic shape and engineering with the Toyota Matrix, a nearly identical vehicle which also made the list.

No vehicles from DaimlerChrysler's (Charts) Chrysler Group made the "Most Reliable" list.

Only one European car, the Mini Cooper, made the "Most Reliable" list. Of the "Least Reliable" cars, 19 of the 45 are European models.

Twenty of the "Least Reliable" vehicles are domestic models and just five, all from Nissan, are Japanese.

The difference between the "Most Reliable" and "Least Reliable" is striking, the magazine said, citing a comparison of the Toyota Highlander Hybrid and Mercedes-Benz M-class SUVs.

The owner of the M-class is likely to experience 10 times as many problems as the owner the Highlander Hybrid, the magazine said.

Thats what CNN says Consumer Reports says. I don't really always trust CR, but anyways...

This also supports my theory of chrysler cars sucking and german cars being totally unreliable.

[Frisco]

What are people's experiences with Korean cars--Hyundai and Kia?

[pseudobrit]

Originally Posted by SMM

I would never buy another VW again. Not because of the engineering error. I can understand that. If a company is making a solid effort to keep you as a long-time customer, reward them. If they act like they do not care, run like hell. This attitude usually servers me well.

VWoA and, to a much greater extent, the VW dealers themselves are horrible.

It's a shame because VWAG do make a fine product which in most areas is engineered like a tank, but there are always problems with things (especially when you've got so many vendors supplying parts and systems) and in those cases a competent dealer network is essential.
If you can turn your own wrenches a little and have a decent independent mechanic or two, you're fine.

I wouldn't recommend buying a VW even though I would.

[ErikCLDR]

Originally Posted by Frisco

What are people's experiences with Korean cars--Hyundai and Kia?

A friend of my parents bought a Kia minivan that got crushed by a tree at an auto auction. The engine died while he was driving the crushed thing to his garage. He had it towed the dealer and they put in a new engine because of its 10 year/100,000 miles warranty even though the top of the car was demolished.

[Abstract]

Originally Posted by ErikCLDR

Thats what CNN says Consumer Reports says. I don't really always trust CR, but anyways...

This also supports my theory of chrysler cars sucking and german cars being totally unreliable.

That points out that 6 out of the X most reliable cars on the road are American (GM and Ford) cars, but 20 out of 45 of the LEAST reliable are American.

Europe: 1 car from Europe is on the Most Reliable list, but 19/45 cars are on the Least Reliable list.

So in total: American + European automakers make up 39/45 of the Least Reliable cars on the road.

Just 5 of the least reliable cars are Japanese, and they're all from Nissan. Toyota, Lexus, Honda, Acura, Subaru, and Mazda are all clear.

So I'm guessing that 1 Korean car made the "Least Reliable" list, since there is one opening left after accounting for American, European, and Japanese cars.


It's great that some American cars are on the list of Most Reliable cars, but the Japanese won this by a large amount, if you think about it.

Originally Posted by Frisco

What are people's experiences with Korean cars--Hyundai and Kia?

My Hyundai is excellent. 10/10 so far. There's a blindspot I don't like, but every single small car on the road has the same blindspot (although to what degree is variable based on design), so wateva.

[FrankBlack]

Originally Posted by SMM

I bought a Passat wagon in 1998. The car had minor issues (not all doors would lock all of the time, etc). But, I generally loved the car. Then one day the oil light flashed on, off, on...at non-linear intervals. I pulled over and checked the oil. Fine - right were it should be. The deal told me to bring it in. By the time I drove the 5 miles, the light was constant. Bottomline: engineering flaw - there was a screen on the crankcase pick-up tube. It becomes clogged and starves the engine. The bill - over $6,500.00!

What really set me off was VW acting like this was somehow my fault. They acknowledged the problem. They asked if I received the letter they sent out. I actually had it in the glovebox. It basically said the problem was the light flashing and the cure was to use a different viscosity oil (which I did). They flat-out refused to help with the repair of my car. Eventually I donated it to charity.

I would never buy another VW again. Not because of the engineering error. I can understand that. If a company is making a solid effort to keep you as a long-time customer, reward them. If they act like they do not care, run like hell. This attitude usually servers me well.

Car dealers come and go, like any other business. They also change ownerships. The dealers are the ones who meet the buying public head on.
I've had excellent luck with my Subaru dealer, (small, family owned and managed) but not all Sube dealers are the same.

A bad dealer experience can sour someone on a particular make of car for years. Car companies should be more tuned in to this than they are. I don't even think Toyota is as tuned in to the behavior of their dealers as they should be.

The first pickup truck I owned was a Dodge D-100, back in '86. The truck had some serious electrical system problems, and I was left stranded on two occassions. All of this was under warranty, but the dealer service department was like something out of bad movie. (i.e. "Well, that's your fault. We can't fit you in for two weeks, if then") I only kept that truck for two years, before moving on to Toyota, but the experience had soured me on Dodge for a long time.

Small victory: That dealer is long gone. The property was vacant for a few years, then it morphed into a Toyota dealer.

[AlexH]

Originally Posted by Mitthrawnuruodo

You can't really go wrong with a Toyota...

QFT.

[killr_b]

Huh. I voted for German b/c my friend never takes his BMW into the shop. And his boss hasn't had any probs with his Mercedes. But I have to service my Civic often. It still runs perfect, but has things go out a lot more. 165,000 miles. (not including oil changes, ect.)

Toyota makes great engines, but their designs suck. Why can't they make the cheap, reliable car look as good as an expensive car?

[SMM]

Originally Posted by FrankBlack

Car dealers come and go, like any other business. They also change ownerships. The dealers are the ones who meet the buying public head on.
I've had excellent luck with my Subaru dealer, (small, family owned and managed) but not all Sube dealers are the same.

A bad dealer experience can sour someone on a particular make of car for years. Car companies should be more tuned in to this than they are. I don't even think Toyota is as tuned in to the behavior of their dealers as they should be.

The first pickup truck I owned was a Dodge D-100, back in '86. The truck had some serious electrical system problems, and I was left stranded on two occassions. All of this was under warranty, but the dealer service department was like something out of bad movie. (i.e. "Well, that's your fault. We can't fit you in for two weeks, if then") I only kept that truck for two years, before moving on to Toyota, but the experience had soured me on Dodge for a long time.

Small victory: That dealer is long gone. The property was vacant for a few years, then it morphed into a Toyota dealer.

I would not burn VW for an issue pertaining to a particular dealership. As you say, dealers should be judged on their own merits. In my case, the dealership was sympathetic to my situation. It was VWoA who discarded me as someone they had little interest in keeping as a customer. It was VW who caused the problem with a serious design flaw. Rather than have everyone bring in the cars for an inexpensive corrective maintenance procedure, they chose to pocket their profits and lose the effected customers. Afterall, there are plenty more where they came from.

There was an easy, inexpensive fix to this. VW could have just come clean, fixed the problem, and they would have continued to retain my respect. Instead, they dropped to the bottom of barrel with me. If you are considering a VW, do a Google on the Passat oil sludge issue. You can find hundreds (even thousands) who lost a major investment. As you read their stories, ask yourself, "Is this the kind of company I want to buy a car from?"

[ryannel2003]

American quality is sure going up compared to 10 years ago. However, I rated Japan as number one (of course I did, I've got a Camry). The new Toyota's do not seem as solid as my 2000 LE, but Toyota has started to slow development of the new Highlander and Corolla's, and that should help out the quality. For me, the quality of the new Camry was disappointing. Compared to mine, it felt quite cheap and of lower quality. However, the new Highlander seems to be a much nicer vehicle than the model that it replaces. As for the Americans, my mom has an '05 GMC Yukon XL and it has been a very good vehicle. Never had any issues compared to the last two trucks she had. Her '01 Yukon XL blew a tranny at 36k, and her '99 Suburban blew one at 75k. My dad also has a new '07 Sierra 2500HD Crew Cab Diesel and it has been a good vehicle as well. Only has 14k and seems very solid. Grandpa drives an '06 Impala SS and it too is an excellent vehicle. Chevrolet did good with the new models, the older ones were much cheaper and didn't drive near as well. I find GM doing much better these days (can't say that about sales). The new Cadillac CTS finally has the interior to match the german's, and the new STS should do very well. As for Ford, I find their quality much worse than before. My aunt has an '04 Explorer XLS and it supposedly has a problem with the main rear oil seal. It only has 55k. Her older '00 Explorer XLS finally died at 190k, and she is actually getting it fixed. So for me it goes like this:

1. Toyota/Lexus
2. Honda/Acura
3. Hyundai (seem to be very good cars)
4. Nissan/Infiniti
5. Chevrolet

[Joshua8o8]

Originally Posted by Mitthrawnuruodo

You can't really go wrong with a Toyota...

Agree 100%

[yg17]

Originally Posted by Frisco

What are people's experiences with Korean cars--Hyundai and Kia?

The family has 3 of them and they're great cars. A bit dull IMO (I find most of the Asian cars to be a bit boring, unless we start talking 350Zs or S2000s or something along those lines, I can't think of a Korean or Japanese sedan I'd actually want to drive though. Reliable though) but good cars nonetheless. I have a Tiburon and it's not too terrible as far as dullness goes either. Definitely reliable though.


I do think that even though their reliability may be questionable, I'll go for a VW or Audi next. I enjoy driving, and would rather have a fun car that needs a repair every now and then than a boring car that runs great. Or maybe I'm just crazy. But I'm looking for a ~$30,000 sedan next year and nothing coming out of Japan thrills me, and I wouldn't touch an American car with a barge pole. And I can't say I trust Volvo and Saab too much with their ties to Ford and GM

[devman]

I voted Germany. BMW: I've had two 318s', two 320s', a 325, and two 530s'. Over that approx. 20 years, I've had one (yes, just one problem) and that was an electric window failing on a 325.