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Old Jul 17, 2014, 12:33 PM   #1
bradl
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A Black Captain America

And why not?!? It worked in 'Blazing Saddles'! - Dave Chappelle, on being anointed Sheriff of Rottingham, in Robin Hood: Men in Tights

Straight off the heels of Thor, Marvel comes out with another blast.

http://www.npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/...aptain-america

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After Thor, Marvel Announces Big Change To Captain America
by Krishnadev Calamur
July 17, 201411:29 AM ET

Sam Wilson will carry Captain America's shield.

It's the second major announcement from comics publisher Marvel, which also said this week that the new Thor will be female.

Sam Wilson, as you might (or might not) know, is the Falcon, one of Captain America's major allies. (He was played by Anthony Mackie in Captain America: The Winter Soldier.) He also happens to be African-American, though he isn't the first black Captain America.

In the current comic, Steve Rogers, the Captain America, has lost the strength gained from being injected with super-soldier serum. This causes him to age 65 years instantly. (Cap has been around awhile. He fought Hitler during World War II.)

"Sam's not going to be Steve," writer Rick Remender said in a Marvel statement. "Steve can be very rigid. That can be kind of joyless at times, whereas Sam is absolutely not that."

News of Wilson taking over the mantle was announced Wednesday by Joe Queseda, Marvel's chief creative officer, on Comedy Central's The Colbert Report.

And if the thought of Rogers no longer being Captain America saddens you, don't worry. He'll stick around and serve as a strategic adviser to Wilson.

Besides, if there's one thing we know about comics, it's that nothing — not even death — is final.
So a Black Cap, a Black Nick Fury, a Black SpiderMan, and a Black Iron Man (though Iron Man has been around for a while). This has come a long way.

BL.
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Old Jul 17, 2014, 01:22 PM   #2
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I love that it's Sam taking up the mantle. This is the first time Steve's been able to hand pick his replacement, and who does he pick, the man he trusts the most.

I want a team up of Sam and Eli Badley (aka Patriot, the grandson of Isaiah Bradley).

I'm loving that Miles Moralez (Ultimate Spider-man) is in the mainstream universe at the moment.
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Old Jul 17, 2014, 05:48 PM   #3
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So Thor gets a sex change and Captain America gets a tan... yeah, seems like we live in a real age of mediocrity where a woman or person of colour super hero can't be a unique individual but needs to be on the cape tail of an already recognizable super hero. This is truly pathetic.

Next will be Rue Paul playing Wonder Woman who is undercover as the Hulk.

Again - all pathetic.
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Old Jul 17, 2014, 05:57 PM   #4
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So Thor gets a sex change and Captain America gets a tan... yeah, seems like we live in a real age of mediocrity where a woman or person of colour super hero can't be a unique individual but needs to be on the cape tail of an already recognizable super hero. This is truly pathetic.

Next will be Rue Paul playing Wonder Woman who is undercover as the Hulk.

Again - all pathetic.
Yet nothing to say about James Rhodes: Iron Man since 1985.

BL.
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Old Jul 17, 2014, 06:01 PM   #5
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Waiting for the Hulk to be pink colored.
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Old Jul 17, 2014, 06:04 PM   #6
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Waiting for the Hulk to be pink colored.
He was already gray.

BL.
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Old Jul 18, 2014, 07:04 AM   #7
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According to current population growth, a hispanic Captain america would be more appropriate.
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Old Jul 18, 2014, 02:05 PM   #8
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According to current population growth, a hispanic Captain america would be more appropriate.
They won't even need to change the costume for the latino Capt'n.
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Old Jul 18, 2014, 07:45 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrehdd View Post
So Thor gets a sex change and Captain America gets a tan... yeah, seems like we live in a real age of mediocrity where a woman or person of colour super hero can't be a unique individual but needs to be on the cape tail of an already recognizable super hero. This is truly pathetic.

Next will be Rue Paul playing Wonder Woman who is undercover as the Hulk.

Again - all pathetic.
1. Thor will remain a guy. The new woman, is wielding Mjølnir, her name/identity hasn't been revealed, but she is not the Odinsson.

2. Sam Wilson's been a hero in his own right for decades. On top of that, he's been Steve's closest friend and ally, so it's only logical that Steve would pick Sam as his replacement.

3. Can you be any more racist and misogynistic?
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Old Jul 18, 2014, 10:14 PM   #10
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Yet another retread from the House of Idea. Replacing an existing white male character with a female or ethnic version has been both DC and Marvel's go-to strategy for "innovating" for over 40 years now.

The worst part is that they're just diluting one of the best African-American superheroes ever created. Sam Wilson is a dynamic, compelling character as the Falcon. He doesn't need a stint as substitute Captain America to make him interesting.

It's a lame, tired ploy, and we all know it'll last a year before Steve's back in the suit.
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Old Jul 18, 2014, 11:51 PM   #11
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Yet another retread from the House of Idea. Replacing an existing white male character with a female or ethnic version has been both DC and Marvel's go-to strategy for "innovating" for over 40 years now.

The worst part is that they're just diluting one of the best African-American superheroes ever created. Sam Wilson is a dynamic, compelling character as the Falcon. He doesn't need a stint as substitute Captain America to make him interesting.

It's a lame, tired ploy, and we all know it'll last a year before Steve's back in the suit.
At this point it should be noted that there were 4 Captain Americas spanning a period of 40 years before Rogers was revived from suspended animation, the last of which who died with Rogers at his bedside.

BL.
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Old Jul 19, 2014, 04:14 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by skottichan View Post
1. Thor will remain a guy. The new woman, is wielding Mjølnir, her name/identity hasn't been revealed, but she is not the Odinsson.

2. Sam Wilson's been a hero in his own right for decades. On top of that, he's been Steve's closest friend and ally, so it's only logical that Steve would pick Sam as his replacement.

3. Can you be any more racist and misogynistic?
Sam Wilson should be Sam Wilson and not "Captain America." Let him stand on his own merits and be celebrated for that. To move him over to another character is to say he wasn't good enough.

As for your comment on racist and misgynistic - typical dolt offering from those that refuse to think and resort to such labels. Yawn.

Last edited by phrehdd; Jul 19, 2014 at 04:24 AM.
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Old Jul 19, 2014, 10:47 AM   #13
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At this point it should be noted that there were 4 Captain Americas spanning a period of 40 years before Rogers was revived from suspended animation, the last of which who died with Rogers at his bedside.

BL.
I'm not sure what you're saying here. Rogers was revived in 1963. What is this "40 years before" you're referring to? Do you mean 40 years AFTER he was revived?

----------

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Originally Posted by phrehdd View Post
Sam Wilson should be Sam Wilson and not "Captain America." Let him stand on his own merits and be celebrated for that. To move him over to another character is to say he wasn't good enough.
It's also implying that Captain America is BETTER than the Falcon. They're essentially saying that Sam has now "graduated" from being just the Falcon to the far more important role of Captain America. That story premise works when it's Dick Grayson taking over as Batman, but not here.
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Old Jul 24, 2014, 11:43 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phrehdd View Post
Sam Wilson should be Sam Wilson and not "Captain America." Let him stand on his own merits and be celebrated for that. To move him over to another character is to say he wasn't good enough.

As for your comment on racist and misgynistic - typical dolt offering from those that refuse to think and resort to such labels. Yawn.
Do you not understand how Legacies work in comics?

Or would you have been fine if it were a white guy replacing Thor and Cap? Y'know, like how Wally West replaced Barry Allen, Ted Kord replaced Dan Garrett, or Dick Grayson replacing Bruce Wayne, etc.

It only seems to be a "real age of mediocrity" when it's an LGBTQIA, minority or a woman that is the legacy character. Because I saw the same **** when Miles Morales became the new Ultimate Spidey, when Renee Montoya became the Question, and now with the new Thor and Cap. Where was all this rage when Bucky or John Walker became Cap?

We are underrepresented in comics, you can give up an occasional straight white cisgendered male.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 01:10 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skottichan View Post
1. Thor will remain a guy. The new woman, is wielding Mjølnir, her name/identity hasn't been revealed, but she is not the Odinsson.

2. Sam Wilson's been a hero in his own right for decades. On top of that, he's been Steve's closest friend and ally, so it's only logical that Steve would pick Sam as his replacement.

3. Can you be any more racist and misogynistic?
According to Marvel, she will be Thor. >_>;

“The inscription on Thor’s hammer reads ‘Whosoever holds this hammer, if HE be worthy, shall possess the power of Thor.’ Well it’s time to update that inscription,” said Marvel editor Wil Moss. “The new Thor continues Marvel’s proud tradition of strong female characters like Captain Marvel, Storm, Black Widow and more. And this new Thor isn’t a temporary female substitute – she’s now the one and only Thor, and she is worthy.”
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 05:16 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by skottichan View Post
Do you not understand how Legacies work in comics?

Or would you have been fine if it were a white guy replacing Thor and Cap? Y'know, like how Wally West replaced Barry Allen, Ted Kord replaced Dan Garrett, or Dick Grayson replacing Bruce Wayne, etc.

It only seems to be a "real age of mediocrity" when it's an LGBTQIA, minority or a woman that is the legacy character. Because I saw the same **** when Miles Morales became the new Ultimate Spidey, when Renee Montoya became the Question, and now with the new Thor and Cap. Where was all this rage when Bucky or John Walker became Cap?

We are underrepresented in comics, you can give up an occasional straight white cisgendered male.
I appreciate your POV. I would have hoped various "heroes" would stand on their own merit as often the person "behind the mask (or costume)" is what makes the hero. I am more forgiving of masked characters in the scenarios you mentioned than unmasked (such as Captain America). As well, Falcon and other characters that reflect people of colour or gender preferences are served better by being "strong enough" to not retire their original characters but stand stronger. This of course, is just an opinion.

Btw, I fully admit that I don't care for some directions that some comics have gone but then again, I fully plead mea culpa that I am not the most avid consumer of comics and perhaps most that are enjoy the progression of heroes and sidekick heroes stepping up to take over other characters.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 06:36 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Goff View Post
According to Marvel, she will be Thor. >_>;

“The inscription on Thor’s hammer reads ‘Whosoever holds this hammer, if HE be worthy, shall possess the power of Thor.’ Well it’s time to update that inscription,” said Marvel editor Wil Moss. “The new Thor continues Marvel’s proud tradition of strong female characters like Captain Marvel, Storm, Black Widow and more. And this new Thor isn’t a temporary female substitute – she’s now the one and only Thor, and she is worthy.”
I believe that's more of a "she's standing on her own as the only one wielding Mjølnir", instead of the usual She-<Hero> peripheral characters.

As Thor Odinsson is still around and will be her mentor/advisor.

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I appreciate your POV. I would have hoped various "heroes" would stand on their own merit as often the person "behind the mask (or costume)" is what makes the hero. I am more forgiving of masked characters in the scenarios you mentioned than unmasked (such as Captain America). As well, Falcon and other characters that reflect people of colour or gender preferences are served better by being "strong enough" to not retire their original characters but stand stronger. This of course, is just an opinion.

Btw, I fully admit that I don't care for some directions that some comics have gone but then again, I fully plead mea culpa that I am not the most avid consumer of comics and perhaps most that are enjoy the progression of heroes and sidekick heroes stepping up to take over other characters.
But at the same time, a character like Batman or Cap is more of an Ideal than a person, so it doesn't really matter who's in the suit.

As a gay woman who's been reading comics for over 20 years, it's discouraging when people immediately jump to the "mediocrity" or "PC gone wild" complaint/argument when a woman, LGBTQIA or POC (or any combination of the 3; see Renee Montoya/The Question). I'll be brutally honest, I'd love to see more original (or preexisting heroines) get more titles, but any kind of representation matters to those of us who don't have it. I mean Anthony Mackie (Falcon in Captain America 2) has been ecstatic over you kids of color coming up to him in homemade Falcon costumes (and now Cap costumes).

With that said, we are horrifically underrepresented not only in comics, but in the industry side as well. I can name all the women writers on one hand, and artists on the other, and it's not that we're not trying to get in. I've had a comic LEGEND tell me the only place for a woman in the industry is either "to get coffee, or under the drawing desk of a male artist".

So I freely admit, I was a bit bitey in my initial responses, but I have good reason to be.

Last edited by skottichan; Jul 25, 2014 at 06:45 PM.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 07:00 PM   #18
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Before reading all of the comments, I will have to admit, it just seemed dumb that they wouldn't just make new characters. I am a huge comic fan, and I am used to seeing the heros portrayed the way they were drew up originally. White. Although, I am not "white" myself, it kind of sounds old-fashioned and racist after reading these comments. Anyways, after really thinking about the topic, who really cares what race or nationality these characters are portrayed as? I mean, the only thing I have an issue with is when storylines change and do not match the originals. Come to think of it, what about an Indian woman as Batman. No, not Batwoman, but like an even more mysterious Batman. THAT would be Awesome!.... no this post is in no way sarcastic. I'm 100% serious.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 07:30 PM   #19
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I believe that's more of a "she's standing on her own as the only one wielding Mj�lnir", instead of the usual She-<Hero> peripheral characters.

As Thor Odinsson is still around and will be her mentor/advisor.



But at the same time, a character like Batman or Cap is more of an Ideal than a person, so it doesn't really matter who's in the suit.

As a gay woman who's been reading comics for over 20 years, it's discouraging when people immediately jump to the "mediocrity" or "PC gone wild" complaint/argument when a woman, LGBTQIA or POC (or any combination of the 3; see Renee Montoya/The Question). I'll be brutally honest, I'd love to see more original (or preexisting heroines) get more titles, but any kind of representation matters to those of us who don't have it. I mean Anthony Mackie (Falcon in Captain America 2) has been ecstatic over you kids of color coming up to him in homemade Falcon costumes (and now Cap costumes).

With that said, we are horrifically underrepresented not only in comics, but in the industry side as well. I can name all the women writers on one hand, and artists on the other, and it's not that we're not trying to get in. I've had a comic LEGEND tell me the only place for a woman in the industry is either "to get coffee, or under the drawing desk of a male artist".

So I freely admit, I was a bit bitey in my initial responses, but I have good reason to be.
I completely agree. America is a melting pot of all races. Hell, I'm I am a prime example. I'm a true mut. Kids all over look up to these heroes. Why not portray them in all lights. I really am a huge fan of the idea, because of your comments in particular. Thank you.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 07:32 PM   #20
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But... why are they taken proven leads for these series and changing them during the middle of their reboot cycle? Thor did complete a trilogy but still, it seems to me Marvel is just looking to generate early buzz for an additional $100-$200 million box office gross rather than making a creative decision.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 07:40 PM   #21
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But... why are they taken proven leads for these series and changing them during the middle of their reboot cycle? Thor did complete a trilogy but still, it seems to me Marvel is just looking to generate early buzz for an additional $100-$200 million box office gross rather than making a creative decision.
Umm.. what do movies have to do with this? Captain America started back in the WW2 days. That was nearly 70 years ago. You want to talk about reboots? As mentioned before, there were 4 different ones while Rogers was in suspended animation, one turned out to be a traitor, while one died of cancer/old age with Rogers at his bedside (going off of memory of Marvel's book of the Dead and Inactive).

Either way, Cap has gone through numerous reboots, none of which have anything to do with movies. Besides, who said that this couldn't be worked into their movies?

As far as creative decision, ponder this: The first Human Torch wasn't Johnny Storm, nor was he part of the Fantastic Four. Follow the Vision's storyline, and relate that to Storm, and then we can revisit creativity.

BL.
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Old Jul 25, 2014, 07:57 PM   #22
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As far as creative desicion, ponder this: The first Human Torch wasn't Johnny Storm, nor was he part of the Fantastic Four. Follow the Vision's storyline, and relate that to Storm, and then we can revisit creativity.

BL.

So true. You make a good point... To add a little, if I may, this is revolutionary in the comic industry. To change the ethnicity and sex of MAJOR comic heroes is entirely new and creative idea, in my eyes. As a country, and even as a human race, this could have a huge impact on the way EVERYONE treats eachother. I am only seeing this having an entirely positive effect on people. Bigots be warned.
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Old Jul 28, 2014, 08:41 PM   #23
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What's next they will make Robin a woman...wait.
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Old Jul 28, 2014, 11:31 PM   #24
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What's next they will make Robin a woman...wait.
Actually, I wish they would have developed Frankie Raye as the Human Torch, but that would have been a 4th reboot of the Torch.

But think about it.. Her and Firestar… rowr.

BL.
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Old Jul 30, 2014, 01:45 PM   #25
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What's next they will make Robin a woman...wait.
I miss Stephanie Brown


At least she's finally making a comeback in the New52, now we just need Cass Cain back.
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