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Old Aug 8, 2003, 09:39 PM   #1
Rezet
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Is ZIP Really Dead?

You know, I bought myself a 750 Mbs zip drive for USB 2.0.
Sales person was implying that those are practically dead and that I should get those usb memory sticks.
Well, I went with zip, and I think it's a kick-ass thingy.
I mean it copies 7 Mbs in around 2-3 seconds. It seems to be quite reliable and one 750 disc is 10-15 bucks.

So, I was just wondering what you guys thinnk about those.
I just don't get why is it everyone thinks that cdrw that can die any second and are quite bulky are considered great competitors to zips.
Or DVD-RW that cost a bunch and take forever to burn while reliability is also questionable. Memory sticks dont seem to hold enough space and aren't cheap at all.

???
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 09:53 PM   #2
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i think ZIP is good, but dying. it just is. there's no explanation except for better technologies, and soon they will be obsolete.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 09:58 PM   #3
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Re: Is ZIP Really Dead?

Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
You know, I bought myself a 750 Mbs zip drive for USB 2.0.
Sales person was implying that those are practically dead and that I should get those usb memory sticks.
Well, I went with zip, and I think it's a kick-ass thingy.
I mean it copies 7 Mbs in around 2-3 seconds. It seems to be quite reliable and one 750 disc is 10-15 bucks.

So, I was just wondering what you guys thinnk about those.
I just don't get why is it everyone thinks that cdrw that can die any second and are quite bulky are considered great competitors to zips.
Or DVD-RW that cost a bunch and take forever to burn while reliability is also questionable. Memory sticks dont seem to hold enough space and aren't cheap at all.

???
You want to know why ZIP disks are dead? CD burning is faster, cheaper and easier. If you want to protect your data, buy a jewel case. ZIP disks have zero compatability with anything else besides themselves (and sometimes that isnt even true), while CD's have almost universal compatability.

Also, that price is atrocious! 15 dollars for one disk! I found, for $17.00, a 50 pack of Memorex, 48x CD-R media. (source) thats 35 GB of storage for the price of one, 750MB ZIP disk.

Now, I hope you see why ZIP really is dead.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 10:19 PM   #4
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Re: Re: Is ZIP Really Dead?

Quote:
Originally posted by G5orbust
You want to know why ZIP disks are dead? CD burning is faster, cheaper and easier. If you want to protect your data, buy a jewel case. ZIP disks have zero compatability with anything else besides themselves (and sometimes that isnt even true), while CD's have almost universal compatability.

Also, that price is atrocious! 15 dollars for one disk! I found, for $17.00, a 50 pack of Memorex, 48x CD-R media. (source) thats 35 GB of storage for the price of one, 750MB ZIP disk.

Now, I hope you see why ZIP really is dead.

Most of the things you stated aren't true.
First off, I think most agree that CDRWs aren't reliable. And your pack of CDRs arent re-recordable.
And please, FASTER? WHAT? Show me a CDRW that can copy 7 mbs in 2 seconds and we will talk.
And it's not that much easier dude, I burn cds and stuff and i encounter some sort of an error with it much more often than with any other recording device.
Plus cds are bulky. And I'm always afraid that I will scratch it so it won't work. Besides CDRWs are only 550mbs when formatted.
The big drawback of Zips is that you need a zip drive to the place you go to, but 750 drive is size of 2cds in jewel cases, so it's not a problem to grab it along if a person doesn't have a zip drive.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 10:45 PM   #5
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I have yet to burn a CD on a Mac, but I'll tell you one thing, burning a CD on a Windows computer is one of the most unreliable things you can do. I cannot tell you how many CDs I've wasted trying to burn a CD on both Windows ME (horrible, horrible OS) and Windows XP...it's a pure headache. I only have a Zip 100 (external USB) but it is fast, easy, and works perfectly every time.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 10:51 PM   #6
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hell, i think zips are dead as well. first of all 17 dollars is a little high in my opinion for a 50 pack of cd's. if you look in the right place you can get 50-100 free with rebates. 10-15 dollars for 1 750 disc is pricey in my opinion. and since it is still a disk like a floppy, it can get corrupted easily. i moved our whole newspaper department to cd's just because zips we clunky, you had to have this huge drive to carry around if you wanted to use it. and there are no hybrid discs. sure you can format a zip disc to pc, but it is slower transferring stuff on a mac vs a pc unless you have it formatted to the right format. i just feel you spent a lot of money for old technology, zips were never popular enough to replace floppies. but its your money and thats all that counts.

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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:06 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by iJon
hell, i think zips are dead as well. first of all 17 dollars is a little high in my opinion for a 50 pack of cd's. if you look in the right place you can get 50-100 free with rebates. 10-15 dollars for 1 750 disc is pricey in my opinion. and since it is still a disk like a floppy, it can get corrupted easily. i moved our whole newspaper department to cd's just because zips we clunky, you had to have this huge drive to carry around if you wanted to use it. and there are no hybrid discs. sure you can format a zip disc to pc, but it is slower transferring stuff on a mac vs a pc unless you have it formatted to the right format. i just feel you spent a lot of money for old technology, zips were never popular enough to replace floppies. but its your money and thats all that counts.

iJon
Well, iJon that all seems to be your bias. You don't give any specifcs on how is that cds are much better. CDRWs always die. I had 4 dead on me. And I'm greatful I had them backed up.
My friend also lost a cdrw with all his financial files. He backed it up, but most recent file changes were lost.
I'm not talking about CDRs. CDRs are one thing, CDRWs is another. On pcs, it's ridicuolus that you actualyl have to buy a program for like 80-100 bucks before you can burn cds normally.
And yes, old zips (100, 250) were slow and not very reliable.
But 750 are powered by usb 2.0 or firewire 400. they are probably 6 times faster than cdrws. I just dont really see what's better.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:14 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
Well, iJon that all seems to be your bias. You don't give any specifcs on how is that cds are much better. CDRWs always die. I had 4 dead on me. And I'm greatful I had them backed up.
My friend also lost a cdrw with all his financial files. He backed it up, but most recent file changes were lost.
I'm not talking about CDRs. CDRs are one thing, CDRWs is another. On pcs, it's ridicuolus that you actualyl have to buy a program for like 80-100 bucks before you can burn cds normally.
And yes, old zips (100, 250) were slow and not very reliable.
But 750 are powered by usb 2.0 or firewire 400. they are probably 6 times faster than cdrws. I just dont really see what's better.
hell, when i can buy 50-100 cdr's for free why do i need cd-rw's they are slow and a waste of time. i burn cds all the time for a single file without a flinch. on windows i never bought software to burn cd's on windows. xp comes with all that, just like mac os x. another thing about zips, if you come over to my house it useless. now if you have the cash to put a zip on every computer you use it on then be my guest. i would rather use the dirt cheap cds that i can buy by the bundles, and plus with my same drive i can burn dvd's, which cost about a couple of dollars for me, and they hold 4.7gb.

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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:25 PM   #9
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Even if I could get CD-Rs free, why in the world would I use one disc for one file that I will have to modify in 20 minutes?
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me. Besides, it's all talk. Let me see some offers where you get 50-100 discs for free.
And dvd-r? Please, that also isn't an option. First off, DVDRs cost a bundle. And it's rare I have to back up the whole 5 gig of data.
Second they take forever to burn. And using 4.5 gig disc if you have to back up 200 mbs file is also stupid.
And also, many many people do not have dvd-roms on their computers still. So unless you bought a computer within 2 years, you are just as screwed as as those with zips.
Besides, external Zip is very, very small, so i can take it with me - no problem.

As for windows burning, PLEASE! Not everyone has XP to begin with, nor does everyone has OSX. Second, WIndows burning is very crappy and only burns one way. There practically no custom burning allowed. IF I thought Windows xp built-in cd burning feature is good, i wouldnt get Roxio EZ cd creator.
(It's good if your computer comes with one of those, but some, like mine didn't)...
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:41 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
Even if I could get CD-Rs free, why in the world would I use one disc for one file that I will have to modify in 20 minutes?
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me. Besides, it's all talk. Let me see some offers where you get 50-100 discs for free.
And dvd-r? Please, that also isn't an option. First off, DVDRs cost a bundle. And it's rare I have to back up the whole 5 gig of data.
Second they take forever to burn. And using 4.5 gig disc if you have to back up 200 mbs file is also stupid.
And also, many many people do not have dvd-roms on their computers still. So unless you bought a computer within 2 years, you are just as screwed as as those with zips.
Besides, external Zip is very, very small, so i can take it with me - no problem.

As for windows burning, PLEASE! Not everyone has XP to begin with, nor does everyone has OSX. Second, WIndows burning is very crappy and only burns one way. There practically no custom burning allowed. IF I thought Windows xp built-in cd burning feature is good, i wouldnt get Roxio EZ cd creator.
(It's good if your computer comes with one of those, but some, like mine didn't)...
well i use the trash can to discard all my cd's. and about the free cd's, ill show you where. this sunday open up your paper and get the best buy, office max, office depot, circuit city, and all those others annd youll find some free ones in there somewhere, my mom has about 1000 cd's she has bought this year and recieved all her rebates, thats a thousand free cd's we have now. i know not everyone has os x or windows xp. but i bet you more people have xp and os x than 750mb zip drives. thats great if its portable, but you still gotta take it with you. if i burn a file on a cd i can take it to my buddies and he can look at it, i dont have to take anything to him besides a jewl case. and those zip drives are only good for data backup. with my cd burner i can burn sotware, games, data, music, movies, vcd's, mp3 cd's. its the standard. and i can go buy a single apple dvd for about a couple of bucks, or i can get 5 for even cheaper. by all means if you like your zip drive, congrats, i will throw a party for you. i just think cd's better, and i think most people would agree with me. thats why no one offers built in zip drives anymore. i would rather save my money and buy myself a nice little potable firewire hard drive.

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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:43 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by Rezet
This is ridiculous! I'll have a pile of useless CDRs that will rather confuse me, than help me.
Confused? Buy a Sharpe.


Anyway... no one is calling you an idiot or anything for buying a Zip drive... You asked people for their opinion of Zip and they gave it. No reason to be defensive.

lighten up.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:44 PM   #12
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My advice to you is enjoy your new Zip drive. I have used many zip and jazz drives and they have all been more than useful over the years. CDRs are good for some things, but for lots of quick files and data you need to change and move around on a regular basis, I don't see how CDs or DVDs could compete with that kind of ease of use. I for one am jealous
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:46 PM   #13
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dude, if you like it keep using it who cares about everyone else. I mean your a mac user, its not like your worried about being like everyone else already. This is probably one of those things you shoudl enjoy but not become a zealot about. I think they are fine, very similar to the ext. hard drive I use in many ways except the media is much more portable and easier to detach.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:48 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by iJon
well i use the trash can to discard all my cd's. and about the free cd's, ill show you where. this sunday open up your paper and get the best buy, office max, office depot, circuit city, and all those others annd youll find some free ones in there somewhere, my mom has about 1000 cd's she has bought this year and recieved all her rebates, thats a thousand free cd's we have now. i know not everyone has os x or windows xp. but i bet you more people have xp and os x than 750mb zip drives. thats great if its portable, but you still gotta take it with you. if i burn a file on a cd i can take it to my buddies and he can look at it, i dont have to take anything to him besides a jewl case. and those zip drives are only good for data backup. with my cd burner i can burn sotware, games, data, music, movies, vcd's, mp3 cd's. its the standard. and i can go buy a single apple dvd for about a couple of bucks, or i can get 5 for even cheaper. by all means if you like your zip drive, congrats, i will throw a party for you. i just think cd's better, and i think most people would agree with me. thats why no one offers built in zip drives anymore. i would rather save my money and buy myself a nice little potable firewire hard drive.

iJon

Well, We are talking about data backup man. I do have cd burners for music etc. It's not like I don't burn cds because of it.
Although I dont see any "free" cd-rs in the stores, it makes little difference for me, since i find idea of burning 1 file on a cd-r not very convinient. Hard drives is a no no for me because of network security thingy.... but still...
I think iJon, you never actually used or seen 750 zip in action. You are obviously making judgement about those from something you saw back 5 years ago.
Well iJon, I do appreciate your oprion. That was a fun little discussion, and thanx for coming.
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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:49 PM   #15
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I think the ZIP format is on it's last leg. I think the biggest detractors are cost and compatibility. I can burn data to a CD and give it to someone and they are set. If I dump something to a ZIP I have to make sure they have a ZIP and that our models of ZIPs are compatible. Or I have to let them borrow my ZIP drive and wait for them to return it. ZIPs were great when I was in college 'caue all of the campus PCs had zip drives built in. But since then I've haven't used my ZIP at all (that's over 2 years ago). I've burned hundreds of CDs over the past 4 years or so and only 1 has gone bad on me. As long as you don't buy crappy media you'll be fine. Of course you could have purchased a defective CD/batch of CD's but defects happen w/all products.

W/DVD burners working their way into the mainstream (and blu-ray dics on the horizon), USB "thumbdrives" and Firewire/USB HDDs getting cheapper the niche ZIP once filled is quickly closing. We used to use JAZ drives at work for xfering files but we recently switched to "pocket sized" external FW drives. $180 can get you an external FW ZIP 750 (w/o media) or a 20gig SmartDisk FW firelight HDD for the same price.


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Old Aug 8, 2003, 11:54 PM   #16
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fair enough, but yes i have used them. i used just about everything of that nature, ill sell them at work and ive played with them all, and not too many people are interested in them. thats great that you like it and in no way was i trying to put you down, just having a fun argument. i just dont see them having enough pro's to jusify a purchase, and many of my customers feel the same way with having a cd burner do what they need most.

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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:11 AM   #17
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I think zip drives still have some life left in them. I love using them for everyday file moving etc. Zip drives won't become obselete until the day when a burning a CDRW is even close to copying files to a zip, or until a new media is developed. USB "thumbdrives" aren't viable as they are too limited by their capacity. Next is firewire/USB2 drives. There are some small ones out there, but they're expensive. I think the next logical step is a VERY small portable HD. The size of a credit card and no more than 1/4" thick would be nice. The data is protected, the HD is portable and uses 1 cord, and can hold a lot. The capacity should be around 1 gig to keep the price and size down. Sell it for $75 and I would snap that up in a heartbeat. Until I can buy something like that, I'll stick with the quick transfer of files on my zip.
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:16 AM   #18
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I use Zip 100 disks all the time for school and I also have a USB bus-powered drive at home.

They seem perfectly acceptable for temporary storage. However, they have been dying ever since the first went on sale. There have been plenty of removable drive types available but the idea of using floppy disk-type technology is not that great an idea. I have seen many of these die, taking along someone's homework. "The Zip disk ate my homework!"

Your best bet is to copy your project from the Zip disk to the hard drive, work on it, and copy it back to the Zip disk when done. It will last longer that way. If you're really considering backing up data, I don't think they're reliable enough but you'll find that out soon enough.

Good luck!
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:23 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Peyote
I think zip drives still have some life left in them. I love using them for everyday file moving etc. Zip drives won't become obselete until the day when a burning a CDRW is even close to copying files to a zip, or until a new media is developed. USB "thumbdrives" aren't viable as they are too limited by their capacity. Next is firewire/USB2 drives. There are some small ones out there, but they're expensive. I think the next logical step is a VERY small portable HD. The size of a credit card and no more than 1/4" thick would be nice. The data is protected, the HD is portable and uses 1 cord, and can hold a lot. The capacity should be around 1 gig to keep the price and size down. Sell it for $75 and I would snap that up in a heartbeat. Until I can buy something like that, I'll stick with the quick transfer of files on my zip.

The SmartDisk Firewire HDD I mentioned are 3 1/4 inches x 5 inches x 3/4 inch, are bus powered (so only 1 cable needed), have 2 FW ports and a 20 gig version costs as much as a ZIP 750 drive (w/o media). And you can buy 1gig "thumbdrives."


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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:26 AM   #20
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ZIP was great when it was first introduced... but when the ZIP250 came out.. i brought one.. but no one support it much... these days, is all about those USB memory and CDRW/DVDRW...
who want to carry a ZIP disk around anymore? I haven't touch m y ZIP250 for X months... very dusty... but my 128MB USB memory stick.. is in my pocket everyday...
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:32 AM   #21
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I know that 100 Zips are not reliable. But 750 and even 250 is a whole different story. If you look at reviews at sites like amazon, circuit city, buy.com etc, most people give them perfect scores.
Thing about them is that they are easy to use. ME, my friend, my school and my work have them. And that is what i care about. I can transfer hundred megabytes files literally in seconds. Put the disc in my pocket and knowing that I can do it over and over again withiout worrying about losing information.
I do not exclude CD burning. If I know that a person that wants the file does not have a Zip drive or i'm simply concerned if I will ever get my Zip disc back, of course I'll just burn a cd for him.
CDRWs lag behind in just about everything comparing to Zip. While CDRs are great things and certainly very useful, having no option to rewrite the disc, bites in the ***.
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:47 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by Powerbook G5
I have yet to burn a CD on a Mac, but I'll tell you one thing, burning a CD on a Windows computer is one of the most unreliable things you can do. I cannot tell you how many CDs I've wasted trying to burn a CD on both Windows ME (horrible, horrible OS) and Windows XP...it's a pure headache. I only have a Zip 100 (external USB) but it is fast, easy, and works perfectly every time.
Then its probably your cd burner's fault...I have had an LG cd burner for about 3 years now and I have used it on 98SE, ME, and 2Kpro and I have probably burned 8 coasters. Not bad for 3 years....


Like I said if you are having such immense problems with cd burning it is probably the cd burner itself not the platform...
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:54 AM   #23
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You know what I just love?
Ohh man!
I love that this post is followed by this one:

http://forums.macrumors.com/showthre...threadid=32801

I'm so in love, I might as well get married to it...

UMM... what the hell am I talking about!!!???
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 12:56 AM   #24
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DVD drives have been out for at least 5 years...not 2.

I remember buying a P2 350 in 1998 with a 8x DVD drive.
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Old Aug 9, 2003, 02:42 AM   #25
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AAH. In 1998, P2 333MHZ (350 Mhz) was the top line of the PCs.
Which was over priced to hell. I don't remember seeing any DVD-ROMs back then. Even if they were there, I'm sure their cost wouldn't be very appealing for the consumers.
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