Gonna grab a new book, have a few questions

[philos]

Since I got my iPhone I've really started to warm up to Apple (my only gripe has been no access to use their OS in self built computers, which stills blows...) and I really want to get either a macbook or a MBP. The only reason I'm considering the MBP is the multi touch trackpad, and the 2.5ghz processor with the extra 3MB of cache. But intuition tells me that the multi touch isn't that cool (I haven't tried it though so I haven't knocked it yet) and the processor won't really make a big difference in performance compared to the 2.4ghz processor in the MB. I'm a young college student, with a lil' bit of trendiness in me, so the MB seems more stylish in my eyes, which is actually kind of a big deal to me. So what do you think I should do? Am I missing anything that might sway me one way or the other?

Also, I plan on upgrading parts by myself once I get either book. What's weird is that there isn't an option to upgrade the macbook's HD to a 7200rpm drive... why is this? Does it not have a SATA capable mobo? And also, I see that all the RAM for the either books are all DDR2 667...is it possible to use DDR2 800? Any feed back will be much appreciated thx!

[dibara2003]

if the only reason you're considering a MBP is the touch pad, don't get it. save the money. it's also easier to upgrade a macbook

[durant0s]

Originally Posted by philos

(my only gripe has been no access to use their OS in self built computers, which stills blows...)

I agree 100% with this statement. Why not? It would be so easy, basically free money for apple.

[philos]

I think apple likes the club like feeling that users get by only being able to use mac software with it's uber sleek prods. Yea apple is cool I get the point but I do like to build computers and it's so irritating that I can't use an OS that happen to like a lot. Funny how people say Mac's don't get viruses, but I can assure all this is only because it's worthless to hack/invade/infect a system that has small market use. And this is because the OS is kept in a bottle. Anyways, the macbook is winning me over, I just wanna know if I can use DDR2800 with it, which I'm betting I can't...

Edit: Well with no way to get into bios, due to intel's extensible firmware interface that apple takes advantage of, I don't know how I could change the multiplier anyways...anyone, anywhere have a clue?

[clin86]

the multitouch trackpad is waay cool. i havent tried the new macbook pros but i have the macbook air and i think the 3 finger back swipe is the most convenient gesture ever. theres no need to scroll your mouse up to the back icon anymore. go for the macbook pro.

[kretzy]

I had a play with the multi-touch trackpad on an MBA in a store the other day and I wasn't that impressed. I think it still has a way to go to really useful. The 3 finger swipe was good, but things like zoom aren't really needed. I wouldn't get a MBP just for the trackpad.

The other thing with the MBP is that it's quite a bit bigger which isn't great if you're going to be taking it to classes. I'm a student as well and I find my 15'' PowerBook less than ideal - its heavy to carry around and rarely fits on the little desks you get in lecture theaters. I'll be getting a new BlackBook some time next week.

[jemeinc]

Apple is a Hardware company.. NOT a software company- letting people put OSX in any beige box would be the end of Apple as we know it.. We've been here too many times to drudge this up again so I'll just state that it's a bad idea when you look a little closer at Apple's business model.. They make their money on the hardware side- not software.. iTunes music store exists to sell iPods and OSX exists to sell Macs.. It works..

Anyway, getting back to your point, what will you be doing with the computer? If "trendidness" is what you're after you'd be hard pressed to find a cooler notebook than the Macbook Air.. That might not fit your needs though, it wouldn't fit mine.. I wouldn't pay extra for the multi touch track pad on the MBP, but that's just my opinion.. A Blackbook is a pretty cool little unit with some nice power behind it at a good price..

[bigbadnewill]

Originally Posted by jemeinc

Apple is a Hardware company.. NOT a software company

I personally think Apple is a software company...i mean OS X is arguably the best OS out there....for them to reach that status they must consider themselves a software company (as well as a hardware company). And i can see the OP's point about wanting OS X on other systems, but as mentioned, by limiting it to Apple products only, they ensure they sell more!

If OS X was available to all computers Apple would sell loads less computers cos there are many cheaper alternatives out there...they just don't run OS X.

[Luzzio]

Originally Posted by durant0s

I agree 100% with this statement. Why not? It would be so easy, basically free money for apple.

Piracy. Software can be easily pirated. Microsoft makes most of it's money from Windows via corporates, which are usually more law abiding when it comes to using licensed software compared to the average home user.

Apple's OSX isnt exactly the corporate standard.

Plus, it's also the hardware that gives the consumer the aesthetic 'Apple experience' in my opinion. I'm caressing my mb and ipod as I type this.

And you can't pirate aesthetic value.

[jemeinc]

Originally Posted by bigbadnewill

I personally think Apple is a software company...i mean OS X is arguably the best OS out there....for them to reach that status they must consider themselves a software company (as well as a hardware company). And i can see the OP's point about wanting OS X on other systems, but as mentioned, by limiting it to Apple products only, they ensure they sell more!

If OS X was available to all computers Apple would sell loads less computers cos there are many cheaper alternatives out there...they just don't run OS X.

Cool, hey I respect your opinion, but it's just a fact that Apple is a hardware company.. Always has been and hopefully always will be.. Right now they happen to be a hardware company with a great OS.. but that great operating system exists to sell more hardware.. Sure, they make a few bucks off of the software side of things, but hardware is their bread & butter.. If they allowed OS X to be installed in any computer why would you buy a Mac? You wouldn't.. Now you're a software company, working on peanuts instead of the nice margins you once had as a hardware company, you also now compete with giant of all giants in Microsoft (say what you want, but Apple & MS are not competitors- not anymore, that war ended a long time ago- MS won- Apple is MS largest customer at the moment, or was in the recent past).. Add to that the fact that most software companies don't make any money- I say most, there's always the exception to the rule, but most get swallowed up by the big boys in some corporate buy out as soon as they start to make a little noise.. Software biz is a jungle , and not for the timid or under funded ( not that Apple is under funded, but they acquired that large pot of cash they have now selling hardware- it would be different if they tried to make a bigger impact w/ their OS- anyone remember the "Cloning" experiment?) .. Sometimes companies just find their niche in the market and Apple seems to have fallen into theirs nicely.. Do I find it ironic that they seem to have more issues with their hardware than software? Well, yeah, but that doesn't change their business structure..

Add to all of this the fact that if they put OSX on every computer they're dealing with all of the driver issues and trying to make it work on every home built box under the sun and I doubt Apple will veer from this plan..

I've gone too far with this because I don't want to hi-jack the thread any more than it already has been.. My apologies to the OP.. When you get a chance check out Apples business structure a little closer, none of this is earth shattering news or information that Apple tries to hide.. Start another thread about it if you really want to get into it- I just don't want to take over this one..

[macenforcer]

Originally Posted by jemeinc

Apple is a Hardware company.. NOT a software company- letting people put OSX in any beige box would be the end of Apple as we know it.. We've been here too many times to drudge this up again so I'll just state that it's a bad idea when you look a little closer at Apple's business model.. They make their money on the hardware side- not software.. iTunes music store exists to sell iPods and OSX exists to sell Macs.. It works..

Anyway, getting back to your point, what will you be doing with the computer? If "trendidness" is what you're after you'd be hard pressed to find a cooler notebook than the Macbook Air.. That might not fit your needs though, it wouldn't fit mine.. I wouldn't pay extra for the multi touch track pad on the MBP, but that's just my opinion.. A Blackbook is a pretty cool little unit with some nice power behind it at a good price..

So what does that say about apple hardware then? The fact that apple would go out of business if they released the OS proves that their hardware basically sucks. I would much rather put osx on a thinkpad and be done with it all any day. But you are right. With apples business model they can continue to rip us off in the hardware dept. all day long and we have to bend over and take it. That said. Microsoft is rich. I believe if they did release the os and charged $399 for it it would be a big boom for the company. Nobody really cares for their old looking macbook pro anymore anyways except apple elitists. Just proves that apples hardware margins are astronomical.

[bigbadnewill]

Originally Posted by jemeinc

Cool, hey I respect your opinion, but it's just a fact that Apple is a hardware company.. Always has been and hopefully always will be.. Right now they happen to be a hardware company with a great OS.. but that great operating system exists to sell more hardware.. Sure, they make a few bucks off of the software side of things, but hardware is their bread & butter.. If they allowed OS X to be installed in any computer why would you buy a Mac? You wouldn't.. Now you're a software company, working on peanuts instead of the nice margins you once had as a hardware company, you also now compete with giant of all giants in Microsoft (say what you want, but Apple & MS are not competitors- not anymore, that war ended a long time ago- MS won- Apple is MS largest customer at the moment, or was in the recent past).. Add to that the fact that most software companies don't make any money- I say most, there's always the exception to the rule, but most get swallowed up by the big boys in some corporate buy out as soon as they start to make a little noise.. Software biz is a jungle , and not for the timid or under funded ( not that Apple is under funded, but they acquired that large pot of cash they have now selling hardware- it would be different if they tried to make a bigger impact w/ their OS- anyone remember the "Cloning" experiment?) .. Sometimes companies just find their niche in the market and Apple seems to have fallen into theirs nicely.. Do I find it ironic that they seem to have more issues with their hardware than software? Well, yeah, but that doesn't change their business structure..

Add to all of this the fact that if they put OSX on every computer they're dealing with all of the driver issues and trying to make it work on every home built box under the sun and I doubt Apple will veer from this plan..

I've gone too far with this because I don't want to hi-jack the thread any more than it already has been.. My apologies to the OP.. When you get a chance check out Apples business structure a little closer, none of this is earth shattering news or information that Apple tries to hide.. Start another thread about it if you really want to get into it- I just don't want to take over this one..

You make some very good points! And as for the drivers issues etc with installing OS X on random machines...i personally think thats one of the main reasons why it isn't available. I'm sure XP and Vista wouldn't crash AS much if there was only one configuration for your hardware!

Although i had my first clash of "It just works" this week when i tried connecting my new macbook to my wireless network. It appears that my iMac got jealous of sharing a network with another apple product and decided not to work...nice! Appears to have fixed itself now though i think!

Anyway, as you mentioned lets move along. My mississippi mud pie is begging me to eat it!

[philos]

Wow, I just got back from school and noticed this thread took an interesting tangent. I'm going to France this summer, which is the main reason I wanna get a book, so I'll be needing an optical drive (I don't wanna deal with trying to install a remote drive in a foreign land when I don't know how much access to desktops I'll have). So, macbook air is a no go. It's cool, but would suit me more if I was just going from school, home, coffee shops, etc.

The blackbook is awesome aesthetically, but I like the white macbook too, and my difference in taste for the two isn't enough to warrant the xtra $200 quid for the blackbook.

Jemeinc, you're right, Apple's main concern is to sell their hardware, but I think they've taken such a dominance in the mobile segment, ipod and iphone, that they can soon afford to branch their OS out and release to builders. One way or another that OS is coming out of it's cave, with the OSx86 project picking up speed it will give Apple something to think about.

I think your argument saying Apple is just a hardware company is pushing a few the wrong way, and I think it's just a misunderstanding of what you're saying, cause you're just trying to be adamant that this is Apple's main initiative. Let's face the fact, you can't use Apple software without hardware, therefore you buy expensive hardware first. So this qualifies Apple mainly as a hardware company.

Oh, and pirating isn't a big concern. These big companies lose the slightest of profit due to pirating. 99% of computer users are still computer illiterate enough to not take five minutes to learn how to use bit-torrent. I must know like five people outta hundreds that have the slightest clue about pirating, and none of them pirate OS's.

Anyways, this is a very interesting topic, I think I'm gonna go hawk for it in another section. For now, I'm going to the apple store in Sherman Oaks and play with these badboys and see who is victorious lol. Thx everyone for the input, lemme know if you think of something else. Adieu.

[drew0020]

I would not buy the Blackbook. It is defintely not worth the premium over the mid-teir white macbook unless you really love the color.